don_of_manhattan Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 Here is my opinion, based on being a Bills fan for over 40 years, growing up in Buffalo and watching and listening to Ralph Wilson all those years: Either you, Mr. Brinkworth and/or your "highly reliable" DWI attoney are full of sh..! Ralph Wilson is not negotiating with Industry of California, Tom Golisano, Jim Kelly or Skooby. The man is 91 freakin' years old. He has told us his plan flat out, and that is to own the Bills until he dies. Then his heirs will sell the team to whoever they want to. End of story. I believe the guy. You can believe whatever you want. It seems insane for the guy to wait until this point in his long life to screw the fans behind their backs and sell the team out of town while he's still breathing. That's my story, and I'm sticking with it until someone proves otherwise. His story makes sense to me. Selling the team to interests who want to move to LA makes much more financial sense than selling to a group trying to stay in Buffalo - the price tag goes waaaay up and what you can be certain of is that he is looking out for the financial future of his family. With the possibility that the salary cap could go away, Buffalo looks even less attractive. Wilson is the main owner screaming about the how the league's finances are changing and is trying to position his family properly. One can argue that he is doing best by Bills fans by staying here while he is alive, but one has to ask, how long can he continue to ignore the financial reality for his family. A billion dollar sale versus a five/six hundred million dollar sale is quite a difference.
Boolay Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 Let me preface this by saying that, admittedly, this information has roughly 4 layers of hearsay to it. Let me also preface this by saying that I am repeating what I heard verbatim, and, based on my knowledge of at least some of the people involved in this communication, I think this narrative has sufficient reliability to be posted on a message board, if not the New York Times. Anyway, I was in court yesterday, where I work, when the conversation turned to Eric Moulds and his pending legal matter. The conversation then segued into the current state of the Bills. A prominent and seemingly very straightforward DWI defense attorney that I know said he had had a conversation with one of the Brinkworths, who I believe are prominent developers in the community. One of the Brinkworths told him (the attorney) that he had spoke with Golisano about the possibility of purchasing the Bills. Golisano said that he HAS approached Wilson about putting a group together, but Wilson completely froze him out. Wilson supposedly said that he was already negotiating with a group called "Industry of California" about the prospective sale, (and presumable relocation) of the franchise. I understand that this post may be met with skepticism. However, it's my opinion that the circumstances of this information ARE reliable, in that every link of the communication is with people who really would have access to this information. In other words, there is no "my cousin has a friend who is a bartender that poured Jim Kelly a drink...)... that kind of thing. I post this knowing that I may open myself up to flaming, but with two objectives. One, I know that as a diehard, I would want one of you to post this info if it was at your disposal, and then it would be up to each individual poster to decide whether or not the post was credible. More importantly, I'm hoping that the Tim Graham's of this board would further investigate to see the validity of this info. Pro Football Teams that have tried and failed in LA.... RIP Los Angeles Dons Los Angeles Rams Los Angeles Chargers Los Angeles Raiders Los Angeles Bulldogs Hollywood Bears Southern California Sun Los Angeles Express Los Angeles Xtreme
EasternOHBillsFan Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 I came across a really great story from comments on the new ESPN film "The Band that Wouldn't Die", about the Colts leaving Baltimore: "I was at the first home opener the Ravens played against Oakland in '96. Before the game, the Marching Colts, with Johnny Unitas out in front, played the Colt fight song one last time. I remember the man next to me in the stands. He looked like he must have worked at Seagirt %u2013 six-four, two fourty, big arms, thick neck %u2013 imposing. He's mouthing the words to the song, tears literally streaming down his cheeks. I still get choked up thinking about it. That was what the Colts, the Marching Colts and football meant to Baltimore." http://www.baltimoresun.com/entertainment/...0,6371092.story I don't want to be part of a huge fan base who has to go through that, and never gets a team in replacement. I don't want to have to choose another team.
SectionC3 Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 I take offense at your statement. I worked my *ss off to get through law school and spend every day I work in the legal profession wresting with what is the RIGHT thing to do. I work nights, I work early mornings and I work weekends to try and do what's RIGHT, and most attorneys I know do the same thing. There are certainly some bad apples out there, but most attorneys absolutely do not fit the arrogant, over-opinionated mold in which you try to place them. The reality is, they're worried about their clients and trying to do their best so that the person or people they passionately represent don't get the short end of the stick. I can't speak to the average "size" of an attorney's "junk," but, based on your "9 out of 10" statement, you seem to be have some experience in that area. How exactly is it that you are so well informed on that issue? Just like it is with cops, everyone (or many people) complain about attorneys until they need one--i.e., until they get the DWI they need to beat or get reduced, or until they get into the accident that prevents them from working. #1: Don't believe attorneys. Use them for what their worth when there's **** on your stick, but remember they are arrogant, over-opinionated, and 9 times out of 10, have less than average sized peepees. Attorneys, are more less the problem with our country. #2: How do you (or the arrogant lawyer) know that it's not California Industries of California Ave, Orchard Park, NY... perhaps it's New york Central Mutual? #3: As long as Jamestown homeboy Roger Goodbar is manning the controls of the NFL, I don't see the team moving. Unless, of course, he still has family in the area that he wants whacked. #4: What to do about Jacksonville?
Offside Number 76 Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 Let me preface this by saying that, admittedly, this information has roughly 4 layers of hearsay to it. Let me also preface this by saying that I am repeating what I heard verbatim, and, based on my knowledge of at least some of the people involved in this communication, I think this narrative has sufficient reliability to be posted on a message board, if not the New York Times. Anyway, I was in court yesterday, where I work, when the conversation turned to Eric Moulds and his pending legal matter. The conversation then segued into the current state of the Bills. A prominent and seemingly very straightforward DWI defense attorney that I know said he had had a conversation with one of the Brinkworths, who I believe are prominent developers in the community. One of the Brinkworths told him (the attorney) that he had spoke with Golisano about the possibility of purchasing the Bills. Golisano said that he HAS approached Wilson about putting a group together, but Wilson completely froze him out. Wilson supposedly said that he was already negotiating with a group called "Industry of California" about the prospective sale, (and presumable relocation) of the franchise. I understand that this post may be met with skepticism. However, it's my opinion that the circumstances of this information ARE reliable, in that every link of the communication is with people who really would have access to this information. In other words, there is no "my cousin has a friend who is a bartender that poured Jim Kelly a drink...)... that kind of thing. I post this knowing that I may open myself up to flaming, but with two objectives. One, I know that as a diehard, I would want one of you to post this info if it was at your disposal, and then it would be up to each individual poster to decide whether or not the post was credible. More importantly, I'm hoping that the Tim Graham's of this board would further investigate to see the validity of this info. 1. I believe that you had, or heard, the conversation that you relate. 2. There is no such thing as a "prominent ... DWI attorney." 3. The Brinkworths are not prominent developers and have not been for a long time, but certainly they are connected. 4. City of Industry, California has had the stadium plan for quite a while now. The article you posted mentions six teams that the city plans to talk to. (No word from the teams as to whether they want to talk to the city.) 5. Wilson has said that he will not sell the team, and he's said that directly. I know, businesspeople are not always to be believed, but this isn't quadruple hearsay. Hey, I hope this gets investigated, too, and if it's true, I hope we learn about it sooner rather than later. But I suspect that the DWI attorney probably was not correctly informed.
bartshan-83 Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 Hmmm, someone living in Delaware calling someone gay. Ironic. Easy, guy...just busting your balls. Don't hate on the First State. Come down, I'll buy you a beer.
GripnRip Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 Here's a free tip: Don't preface your post by saying "i know this is hearsay etc, etc.." and then spend the rest of your day trying to convince people its NOT hearsay....let people take it for what it's worth(which, by your own admission, is not a whole lot).
JohnC Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 Here is my opinion, based on being a Bills fan for over 40 years, growing up in Buffalo and watching and listening to Ralph Wilson all those years: Either you, Mr. Brinkworth and/or your "highly reliable" DWI attoney are full of sh..! Ralph Wilson is not negotiating with Industry of California, Tom Golisano, Jim Kelly or Skooby. The man is 91 freakin' years old. He has told us his plan flat out, and that is to own the Bills until he dies. Then his heirs will sell the team to whoever they want to. End of story. I believe the guy. You can believe whatever you want. It seems insane for the guy to wait until this point in his long life to screw the fans behind their backs and sell the team out of town while he's still breathing. That's my story, and I'm sticking with it until someone proves otherwise. You made a mistake in stating that the team will be sold to whomever the heirs want the estate to go to? That is incorrect. The team will be sold to the highest bidders. It is as simple as that. If the highest bidder is in Toronto; the team will be relocated to Toronto. If the highest bidder is Ed Roskie of LA ; the team will be moved to LA. The executor of the will is obligated to abide by the will. The will clearly states that the team will be sold to the highest bidder. Sentiment is not an issue. Getting maximum dollars for one's asset is the only issue. In life and death Ralph is Ralph. There should be no surprise.
KD in CA Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 Try reading again... the frightening part is that Wilson supposedly shut Golisano out of the bidding entirely... as if the writing is already on the wall. So....business owner X, in the process of 'shutting out' a bid from businessman Y, tells businessman Y not only his plans to sell the business to business man Z, but reveal Z's identity?? Yeah, that's plausible. Did Ralph also post it on Facebook?
Buffalonian-at-Heart Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 Easy, guy...just busting your balls. Don't hate on the First State. Come down, I'll buy you a beer. "Come down"? Please tell me that wasn't a Freudian slip, you really have me worried.
Buffalonian-at-Heart Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 Here's a free tip: Don't preface your post by saying "i know this is hearsay etc, etc.." and then spend the rest of your day trying to convince people its NOT hearsay....let people take it for what it's worth(which, by your own admission, is not a whole lot). Exactly! Someone with the profile name Nostradamus should never start his topic with Quadruple hearsay... but reliable
JohnC Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 So....business owner X, in the process of 'shutting out' a bid from businessman Y, tells businessman Y not only his plans to sell the business to business man Z, but reveal Z's identity?? Yeah, that's plausible. Did Ralph also post it on Facebook? Golisano is not shut out of any bidding process after Ralph's death. However, Mr. G and Jim Kelly were both told to mind their own business in their efforts to buy the team from Ralph while he is alive. If Golisano or the imagined Kelly group out bid others for the team when it is auctioned off after the owner's death they will get the franchise. Whether the team ends in Toronto, LA, western NY is not a concern to the present owner. The team goes to the HIGHEST bidder. It is as simple as that. It is my opinion that the best positioned bidder is the Rogers group. By playing games in Toronto there will be no expensive relocation fee going to the league because they can reasonably argue that by playing games in Toronto they are part of the same market.
KD in CA Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 Golisano is not shut out of any bidding process after Ralph's death. However, Mr. G and Jim Kelly were both told to mind their own business in their efforts to buy the team from Ralph while he is alilve. If Golisano or the imagined Kelly group out bid others for the team when it is auctioned off after the owner's death they will get the franchise. Whether the team ends in Toronto, LA, western NY is not a concern to the present owner. The team goes to the HIGHEST bidder. It is as simple as that. It is my opinion that the best positioned bidder is the Rogers group. By playing games in Toronto there will be no expensive relocation fee going to the league because they can reasonably argue that by playing games in Toronto they are part of the same market. Which is even more reason the original thread premise is nonsense. But what I was addressing is the assertion that Wilson is negotiating to sell to the LA group and told Golisano so, which is completely illogical.
JohnC Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 Which is even more reason the original thread premise is nonsense. But what I was addressing is the assertion that Wilson is negotiating to sell to the LA group and told Golisano so, which is completely illogical. I agree with your position that Wilson is not negotiating with anyone while he is alive. He doesn't need to. Not too long ago, Jim Kelly was on WGR55 radio. He was asked about his "supposed" group interested in buying the team. Kelly told the radio host that Mr. Wilson made it very clear to him that he didn't appreciate any discusion of him selling the team while he was alive. Kelly stated that Mr. Wilson expressed his irritation of the topic and that the owner felt it was disrespectful to him. Kelly then curtly said to the radio host that he wouldn't say anything more about the topic. The owner has stated what he is going to do. He will continue to own the team while he is alive. When he passes the team is auctioned off to the highest bidder, as clearly stated in his will.
DallasBillsFan1 Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 Let me preface this by saying that, admittedly, this information has roughly 4 layers of hearsay to it. Let me also preface this by saying that I am repeating what I heard verbatim, and, based on my knowledge of at least some of the people involved in this communication, I think this narrative has sufficient reliability to be posted on a message board, if not the New York Times. Anyway, I was in court yesterday, where I work, when the conversation turned to Eric Moulds and his pending legal matter. The conversation then segued into the current state of the Bills. A prominent and seemingly very straightforward DWI defense attorney that I know said he had had a conversation with one of the Brinkworths, who I believe are prominent developers in the community. One of the Brinkworths told him (the attorney) that he had spoke with Golisano about the possibility of purchasing the Bills. Golisano said that he HAS approached Wilson about putting a group together, but Wilson completely froze him out. Wilson supposedly said that he was already negotiating with a group called "Industry of California" about the prospective sale, (and presumable relocation) of the franchise. I understand that this post may be met with skepticism. However, it's my opinion that the circumstances of this information ARE reliable, in that every link of the communication is with people who really would have access to this information. In other words, there is no "my cousin has a friend who is a bartender that poured Jim Kelly a drink...)... that kind of thing. I post this knowing that I may open myself up to flaming, but with two objectives. One, I know that as a diehard, I would want one of you to post this info if it was at your disposal, and then it would be up to each individual poster to decide whether or not the post was credible. More importantly, I'm hoping that the Tim Graham's of this board would further investigate to see the validity of this info. There is a CITY OF INDUSTRY, which is a "suburb" of L.A. Doubt there is any group called Industry of California.
Doc Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 It's Ralph's team and he can keep it until he dies. He owes nothing to anyone, much to the opinion/dismay of many. And moving the team to Toronto would incur a massive relocation fee since it's outside the U.S. and well outside of the 75 mile radius. The Toronto group could argue all they want, but the NFL owners will demand their money.
truth on hold Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 can they just move the whole city of Buffalo to LA?
Alphadawg7 Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 check this out... http://losangeles.bizjournals.com/losangel...05/daily22.html Did anyone even bother to read this article? It was from October 7th and it claims one of these 6 teams will be playing in Los Angeles, and the Bills are one of those 6...so clearly, there has been discussion between Buffalo and them otherwise they wouldnt have them on the list. The news article alone adds some validity to the OP statement. But hardly anyone even replied to the post about the news article...
Fan in San Diego Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 The executor of the will is obligated to abide by the will. The will clearly states that the team will be sold to the highest bidder. Sentiment is not an issue. Getting maximum dollars for one's asset is the only issue. In life and death Ralph is Ralph. There should be no surprise. Wow you read the will? I say put the team up for auction on Ebay !
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