The players have proved they have the talent...

[C.Biscuit97]

IMHO, this season, the players have proved they have the talent to play against anybody in this league. They had the Patriots beat, the handed the Bucs thier ass, and they hung with one of the most high power offenses in the NFL for 3 1/2 quarters.

 

The problem is the play not to lose coaching mentality which Dick Jauron has instilled in this organization. The gutless coaching is hard to stomach after a while and it has clearly rubbed off on the coordinators and to some extent, the players.

 

On a positive note, I don't think they need to blow up this team and rebuild again. I think they have a lot of the player talent in place, they just need the front office and coaching talent to match.

 

Yeah, I can't believe Jauron fumbled against NE and refused to throw the ball down field. What an idiot!

[C.Biscuit97]

Ask yourself this question: What would be this team's record if we had Mike Tomlin & his staff, Fisher and his staff or Belichek and his staff? Are you trying to tell me that we don't have the talent to be even a fringe playoff team with a better coaching staff?

 

Yes, this team has problems but so does every team in the NFL. Great coaches hide those weaknesses and build on their strengths. Our coach decides to put square pegs in round holes and drafts DBs only to have them play 20 yards back from the LOS in a Tampa 2 prevent....

 

 

All those guys you named have veteran and besides Collins, good QBs. All of them except Belichick (who Jauron beat until McKelvin stepped up) also have losing records.

[Heels20X6]

All those guys you named have veteran and besides Collins, good QBs. All of them except Belichick (who Jauron beat until McKelvin stepped up) also have losing records.

 

Their losses are also against teams with winning records so I guess they're just like Jauron....

[DrDawkinstein]

Yeah, I can't believe Jauron fumbled against NE and refused to throw the ball down field. What an idiot!

 

While I agree that ultimately the players need to execute. it is Jauron's ob to make sure they do execute.

 

it was Jauron's job to grab McKelvin before the kick off and tell him "if you want to return this kick, fine. but hold onto it at all costs. if you dont, dont bother coming back to the sideline"

 

and it's Jauron's job to coach Edwards to a point where he is confident throwing the ball to a spot.

[C.Biscuit97]

While I agree that ultimately the players need to execute. it is Jauron's ob to make sure they do execute.

 

it was Jauron's job to grab McKelvin before the kick off and tell him "if you want to return this kick, fine. but hold onto it at all costs. if you dont, dont bother coming back to the sideline"

 

and it's Jauron's job to coach Edwards to a point where he is confident throwing the ball to a spot.

 

I normally agree with you but you really think McKelvin needs to be told not to fumble. And Edwards is coming off 2 good games & threw the ball well down the field against TB. You can only do so much from the sideline.

[Heels20X6]

I normally agree with you but you really think McKelvin needs to be told not to fumble. And Edwards is coming off 2 good games & threw the ball well down the field against TB. You can only do so much from the sideline.

 

I think Edwards is good but far from great in the first two games. As some have pointed out, he needs to anticipate where his receivers are going and get the ball there. He needs to trust his receivers more too. He relies too much on the checkdown and the stationary pass 5-8 yards down the field.

 

He needs to work on:

 

a) accuracy on his deep ball

 

b) hitting his receivers in stride

 

c) working the deeper portion of the field (reliance on just deep balls right now...he needs to get the ball 15-20 yards down)

[DrDawkinstein]

I normally agree with you but you really think McKelvin needs to be told not to fumble. And Edwards is coming off 2 good games & threw the ball well down the field against TB. You can only do so much from the sideline.

 

yes, REGARDLESS of who the return man is, a pro-active involved coach makes it a point to make sure the returner knows that the team doesnt care if he only brings it out to the 5 yard line as long as he holds onto the ball. dont try to do too much, just hold onto the ball, is exactly what he should have been told.

 

at that point of the game, the ONLY thing that puts us in a position to lose is giving them the ball back. the entire team should have been made aware of this. you can say they "should know it" but it needs to be re-addressed so they stay focused on the important things.

 

instead, McKelvin went out and tried to make a big play and be the hero, even though we didnt NEED him to be a hero. we just needed him to hold onto the ball. this was obviously not reinforced. id like to think that a coach like Gruden would have told him so, or at least would have had April tell him...

 

 

i agree with you on the Edwards point that he has proven that he can/will throw the ball downfield. but again, an active, involved coach knows how to help get his players out of mental funks.

[C.Biscuit97]

yes, REGARDLESS of who the return man is, a pro-active involved coach makes it a point to make sure the returner knows that the team doesnt care if he only brings it out to the 5 yard line as long as he holds onto the ball. dont try to do too much, just hold onto the ball, is exactly what he should have been told.

 

at that point of the game, the ONLY thing that puts us in a position to lose is giving them the ball back. the entire team should have been made aware of this. you can say they "should know it" but it needs to be re-addressed so they stay focused on the important things.

 

instead, McKelvin went out and tried to make a big play and be the hero, even though we didnt NEED him to be a hero. we just needed him to hold onto the ball. this was obviously not reinforced. id like to think that a coach like Gruden would have told him so, or at least would have had April tell him...

 

 

i agree with you on the Edwards point that he has proven that he can/will throw the ball downfield. but again, an active, involved coach knows how to help get his players out of mental funks.

 

 

I don't know man. you're kinda of stretching it with the McKelvin point. He alone screwed up plain and simple.

[DrDawkinstein]

I don't know man. you're kinda of stretching it with the McKelvin point. He alone screwed up plain and simple.

 

yeah, its a little bit of a stretch. but im only using this one case as an example of what Jauron SHOULD be doing while he is standing on the sidelines doing nothing.

 

WOULD it have prevented McKelvin from fumbling? maybe, maybe not

 

COULD it have prevented McKelvin from fumbling? yes, it could have.

[The Big Cat]

Jauron has made ONE bad call so far this year: the decision to not go for it on fourth yesterday.

 

But you're all treating it as if that one call, gone the other way, WOULD have won us the game, when up to that point, the offense was SO pedestrian and SO out of sync, that while I concede it was a completely GUTLESS call, it was definitely the RIGHT one to make.

 

We had a center so off his game he couldn't complete a shotgun snap, a quarterback running for his life, a tight end with the dropsies, and you guys make it all sound like taking a risk IN SAINTS TERRITORY with EIGHT MINUTES TO GO behind a defense that was tired, yes, but at the very least AFFECTIVE was a no brainer.

 

But yeah, keep insulting me and others who take a wide view of the game, and by all means DON'T provide a list of this "supreme" talent we all-of-a-sudden have.

[MRW]

Jauron has made ONE bad call so far this year: the decision to not go for it on fourth yesterday.

In my opinion that 4th and 1 call is distracting attention away from another 4th down call that was even worse, 4th and 4 at the Saints' 40 with the game tied. After electing to punt the ball away, did the Bills even sniff the Saints' side of the field again? Gutless. I think that attitude permeates the entire team. Make the safe play, it's better to lose bit by bit than all at once, etc.

 

What I don't get is Jauron will go for it on 4th down on his own side of the field one week, then faced with a team the next week where it's imperative to keep the ball and momentum, he punts away. It's like he's consulting a magic 8-ball.

[The Big Cat]

In my opinion that 4th and 1 call is distracting attention away from another 4th down call that was even worse, 4th and 4 at the Saints' 40 with the game tied. After electing to punt the ball away, did the Bills even sniff the Saints' side of the field again? Gutless. I think that attitude permeates the entire team. Make the safe play, it's better to lose bit by bit than all at once, etc.

 

What I don't get is Jauron will go for it on 4th down on his own side of the field one week, then faced with a team the next week where it's imperative to keep the ball and momentum, he punts away. It's like he's consulting a magic 8-ball.

 

Yesterday's game was nothing like the first two weeks. Our offensive line proved incapable of ANYTHING and that means not going for it on fourth down, regardless of who's coaching.

[DrDawkinstein]

Jauron has made ONE bad call so far this year: the decision to not go for it on fourth yesterday.

 

But you're all treating it as if that one call, gone the other way, WOULD have won us the game, when up to that point, the offense was SO pedestrian and SO out of sync, that while I concede it was a completely GUTLESS call, it was definitely the RIGHT one to make.

 

We had a center so off his game he couldn't complete a shotgun snap, a quarterback running for his life, a tight end with the dropsies, and you guys make it all sound like taking a risk IN SAINTS TERRITORY with EIGHT MINUTES TO GO behind a defense that was tired, yes, but at the very least AFFECTIVE was a no brainer.

 

But yeah, keep insulting me and others who take a wide view of the game, and by all means DON'T provide a list of this "supreme" talent we all-of-a-sudden have.

 

im not saying we have SUPREME talent. but we have as much talent as other teams that look much better and more organized than we do. i understand that we are a YOUNG team, and this plays a major role in the mistakes we are seeing from them.

 

but then, that is EXACTLY WHY we need a strong Head Coach. to be able to make up for the mistakes the youngin's are going to make.

 

this team, in this modern league, CAN go out and beat any team on any given Sunday. the difference is the coaching.

 

if you swap coaches from the opener and give us Belichick and the Pats* Jauron, we win that game 35-10.

 

"good enough" player talent is here. now we need a good coach.

[MRW]

Yesterday's game was nothing like the first two weeks. Our offensive line proved incapable of ANYTHING and that means not going for it on fourth down, regardless of who's coaching.

Sorry, disagree completely. Going up against a team like the Saints you have to take some chances. The philosophy you're espousing here is quintessential Jauron-ball; the end result is you play so scared of your deficiencies that you never make a play to win the game. Smart coaching is knowing when to take risks, and Jauron had two golden chances and whiffed.

[The Big Cat]

im not saying we have SUPREME talent. but we have as much talent as other teams that look much better and more organized than we do. i understand that we are a YOUNG team, and this plays a major role in the mistakes we are seeing from them.

 

but then, that is EXACTLY WHY we need a strong Head Coach. to be able to make up for the mistakes the youngin's are going to make.

 

this team, in this modern league, CAN go out and beat any team on any given Sunday. the difference is the coaching.

 

if you swap coaches from the opener and give us Belichick and the Pats* Jauron, we win that game 35-10.

 

"good enough" player talent is here. now we need a good coach.

 

I'm resistant to complying with the prospect of getting a new coach (as if I had a say in the matter) because of how big of a RESET we underwent in 2006. Obviously the roster is much younger now, but it begs the question, how many of Jauron's guys stay, and wouldn't the volume of players kept/discarded under a new regime settle this dispute once and for all?

[The Big Cat]

Sorry, disagree completely. Going up against a team like the Saints you have to take some chances. The philosophy you're espousing here is quintessential Jauron-ball; the end result is you play so scared of your deficiencies that you never make a play to win the game. Smart coaching is knowing when to take risks, and Jauron had two golden chances and whiffed.

 

In all seriousness, I trust the coaching staff AT LARGE has a better understanding of which players are getting it done and which one's aren't. If in fact we had a high volume of players consistently coming up short in their play to play duties, then I stand by what I say about avoiding "risks."

[DrDawkinstein]

I'm resistant to complying with the prospect of getting a new coach (as if I had a say in the matter) because of how big of a RESET we underwent in 2006. Obviously the roster is much younger now, but it begs the question, how many of Jauron's guys stay, and wouldn't the volume of players kept/discarded under a new regime settle this dispute once and for all?

 

I am (sorry, WAS) equally as resistant at the end of last year for the same exact reasons. i thought this team could come together with a little help in the draft and FA and some continuity. I was all for holding out and letting Jauron get one more chance at bringing this team together (ask 1billsfan, he knows how against getting rid of the coaching staff I was)

 

but it is OBVIOUS at this point that our weakest link is the Head Coach.

 

im not for blowing it all up. to answer your questions with my opinion, i would like to keep all of our Coordinators and simply replace the Head Coach.

 

Gruden has already run our defense and I don't really care what he does with the offense as far as scheme goes.

[The Big Cat]

I am (sorry, WAS) equally as resistant at the end of last year for the same exact reasons. i thought this team could come together with a little help in the draft and FA and some continuity. I was all for holding out and letting Jauron get one more chance at bringing this team together (ask 1billsfan, he knows how against getting rid of the coaching staff I was)

 

but it is OBVIOUS at this point that our weakest link is the Head Coach.

 

im not for blowing it all up. to answer your questions with my opinion, i would like to keep all of our Coordinators and simply replace the Head Coach.

 

Gruden has already run our defense and I don't really care what he does with the offense as far as scheme goes.

 

So you don't think a new coach would just clean house again?

[DrDawkinstein]

So you don't think a new coach would just clean house again?

 

maybe, probably, but thats why i said "to answer your question with my opinion". meaning, i wouldnt want them to.

 

i dont think they would clean house player-wise, since Russ and Co. are in charge of personnel. Im sure the coach would have some say, but I think there is enough young talent on this team to make the Bills an attractive place for an experienced coach to come to.

 

in my little fantasy, the Bills fire DJ and bring in Gruden and Ralph/Russ and Co. tell him he keeps all of the Coordinators. i dont know. but at this point, with Head Coach being our biggest liability, something has to be done.

[The Big Cat]

maybe, probably, but thats why i said "to answer your question with my opinion". meaning, i wouldnt want them to.

 

i dont think they would clean house player-wise, since Russ and Co. are in charge of personnel. Im sure the coach would have some say, but I think there is enough young talent on this team to make the Bills an attractive place for an experienced coach to come to.

 

in my little fantasy, the Bills fire DJ and bring in Gruden and Ralph/Russ and Co. tell him he keeps all of the Coordinators. i dont know. but at this point, with Head Coach being our biggest liability, something has to be done.

 

What's the obsession with Gruden? Hasn't it been well documented by now that his Super Bowl success was due, in large part, to Tony Dungy, and that his arrogance often causes friction amongst players and coaches?

 

I don't get it.