Peter Posted September 14, 2009 Posted September 14, 2009 Didn't Mario also engage in other aspects of the game, like checking for example? Wayne was simply outstanding, but he was allowed to hide and stay away from much physical action. I think Mario was a more complete hockey player, but Gretzky had the better career, to be sure. I would take Mario in his prime over any other hockey player in his prime -- including Gretzky.
Tcali Posted September 16, 2009 Posted September 16, 2009 Tiger Woods. Minnesota Fats...Earl Anthony..Kobioshi
Tcali Posted September 16, 2009 Posted September 16, 2009 I'll throw a few more names out there for consideration.. Richard Petty, Pele, Michael Phelps & Phil Taylor (Ok, darts isn't really a sport.. but, he is pretty damned dominant at it.) Mark spitz was as dominant as Phelps. Pele----bingo I think you may have one there--but real soccer fans may correct me Phil taylor..LOLOLOL..thats even less of a sport than golf---altho Tiger is absolutely dominant at that 'skill'. Jack mighta given him a run for his money if they were in the same era.
Justice Posted September 16, 2009 Posted September 16, 2009 I've got to chime in on this Gretzky vs Lemieux debate. I respect Lemieux's game, he was physical, strong, had touch, and was an excellent shooter. He was a great finisher when he had a break-away, even scoring with guys draped all over him,. Just amazing. Gretzky wasn't the biggest, the fastest, nor the most physical player in the league, quite the contrary, I must say, but he dominated the game with his mind. I've never seen anyone play the game with Gretz' vision and foresight. He is by far the game's greatest passer. He elevated the level of play of all that played with him. Gretzky has more assists then anyone else has in combined points. All this and he still leads the NHL in goals scored in a season as well as the NHL's all-time leading goal scorer, ever. Gretzky was also the game's greatest ambassador, promoting the sport all over the place, such as SNL, various Late Night shows and so on and so forth. When he retired as a player, no one filled the void and the game still suffers today because of it. Overall, the edge has to go to Gretzky, IMHO. The game is still looking for the "Next One".
R. Rich Posted September 16, 2009 Posted September 16, 2009 Minnesota Fats... Puh leaze! The guy was a good sideshow, but not even close to being one of the best pool players. Willie Mosconi, who coached the late actors Jackie Gleason and Paul Newman and even performed some of the trick shots seen in the movie The Hustler (my all time favorite film), had no peer when it came to pool. Now, as for Jordan being unquestionably the best........nah. We used to have some really good debates on that when I was in the Air Force. I would always come back to a couple points: Point 1: Game 6 of the NBA Finals, Kareem is out injured, and rookie poing guard Magic Johnson steps in to score 42 points, grab 15 boards, and dish out 7 assists in the win. As great a player as Jordan was, I don't think he could do the same. Now here's the kicker... Point 2: When Jordan's Chicago Bulls met Magic Johnson's LA Lakers in the NBA Finals, look @ both teams. If you switched superstars (put Jordan on the Lakers and put Magic on the Bulls), which team has the better shot of reaching the Finals that year? Is Jordan going to lead Mychal Thompson, Sedale Threatt and company to a Western Conference title? Doubtful. Is Magic going to be able to take a very talented Bulls team to the Eastern Conference title? There's a good chance of it. The difference being that while Jordan was an incredibly tough matchup individually, I don't believe he was as good as Magic in two areas you want your star player to be great in: 1. Getting guys to "step up" their game 2. Being versatile enough to play a variety of positions Jordan could defend very well (his help defense was phenomenal) and could dish off when he needed to, but mostly those assists were due to him drawing defenders to him and hitting wide open spot shooters (Paxson, Kerr, etc.). Magic could find the open man IN TRANSITION like no player before or since. He also could score like Jordan (as evident by his Game 6 heroics as a rookie), but chose to be the guy who leads the fast breaks, dishing off to open guys or not so open guys (uncanny court vision!), and be the catalyst for the team. "Showtime" didn't start for the Lakers 'til Magic wanted it to, and when he was ready to go, the whole team followed. For all this and more, Magic Johnson is still the best basketball player of all time in my opinion. Not that Jordan is a slouch; hardly. Here's my all time starting 5: G Magic Johnson G Michael Jordan F Larry Bird F Julius Erving C Bill Russell
WellDressed Posted September 17, 2009 Posted September 17, 2009 Wayne Gretzky says hi. And then there's Eldrick.... wopps..should read in reverse order somedays.
Tcali Posted September 17, 2009 Posted September 17, 2009 And then there's Eldrick.... wopps..should read in reverse order somedays. sports....--unless you wanna include willie moscone and kobioshi
Alaska Darin Posted September 18, 2009 Posted September 18, 2009 I watched it and the whole time I was thinking: "Shut the !@#$ up Mike, while most of the world still thinks you're a good guy." He came off as a complete douchehamster.
Alaska Darin Posted September 18, 2009 Posted September 18, 2009 Point 2: When Jordan's Chicago Bulls met Magic Johnson's LA Lakers in the NBA Finals, look @ both teams. If you switched superstars (put Jordan on the Lakers and put Magic on the Bulls), which team has the better shot of reaching the Finals that year? Is Jordan going to lead Mychal Thompson, Sedale Threatt and company to a Western Conference title? That would have been hard given Threatt wasn't on that team. But Worthy, Perkins, Scott, A.C. Green, and Vlade were and most were at the peak of their skills. Just about anyone could have replaced Magic and gotten them into the Finals from the West because they only team they had to beat was the perpetually underachieving Trailblazers in the conference finals.
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