Billy in 4C Posted August 26, 2009 Posted August 26, 2009 Except that other guy had a 2 cent brain who only looked for the long ball whereas the current one has poise Poise? You're right - he looks pretty composed dumping the ball off 3 yards down the field
GG Posted August 26, 2009 Posted August 26, 2009 Except that other guy had a 2 cent brain who only looked for the long ball whereas the current one has poise Yeah, but the other one was a spoiled kid from California, and this one .... oh never mind.
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted August 26, 2009 Posted August 26, 2009 How about the fact he plays on one of the worst teams in the league To me the biggest 'Edwards' issue is the Bill Walsh endorsement. Take that away and he's another Joe average dud in a long line of "mediocre at best" QB's. But Walsh endorsed him as a heluva a quarterback which has us all yearning to believe there is something there. Maybe it's one of those deals where he has the technical capability, but just can't will the team win. Ever notice how mad Brady gets when he is not winning, Kelly used to as well, Manning is all over his guys when they blow an assignment or a route. We need to TE to get pissed this year if we lose, not just drone on about how well the other team played and all the wonderful learning opportunities that their slightly different defensive scheme has brought. I am tired of the amicable shrug of the shoulder and mild disappointment after a loss. I want to see a fired up QB getting in his o-lines' jocks when they miss blocks and blast receivers during the game for not coming back to the ball or running a route properly. I don't need to see the guy win every game, but I do need to see the guy pissed he's not winning and try to stoke the fire a little bit to get it done. If we go through another season and we get the same shrug of the shoulders, roll of the eyes and "disappointment but learning opportunity" game summaries, then let him to back his bags and go play somewhere else and the bills can lure Brett Favre out of retirement for the 4th or 5th time. BTW It's not that Lee isn't good enough, is just seems he is not attacking the ball. Watch TO go after a pass and the contrast is clear. Fitzgerald is ridiculous the way he attacks the ball. Lee can be fix that pretty easily if he wants to win. It's not about his skills which seem like they could be elite receiver material.
reddogblitz Posted August 26, 2009 Posted August 26, 2009 To me the biggest 'Edwards' issue is the Bill Walsh endorsement. Take that away and he's another Joe average dud in a long line of "mediocre at best" QB's. But Walsh endorsed him as a heluva a quarterback which has us all yearning to believe there is something there. I don't think the Bill Walsh endorsement amounts to very much and never have. Read Marv's book. The year "the Genuis" picked Joe Montana, he really wanted Steve Fuller and was going to pick him as the 29th player taken in the 1979 draft. But Marv drafted him ahead of Bill and Bill had to take someone else and that was Joe Montana. This tells me that "the Genuis" thought Stever Fuller would be a better NFL QB than Joe Montana. Wrong there. Maybe wrong about Edwards too? Certainly possible. Of course Steve did win a gold record and platinum video for his performance in the Super Bowl Shuffle. So maybe Bill wasn't totally off. I could see Trent rapping or singing.
Guest dog14787 Posted August 26, 2009 Posted August 26, 2009 To me the biggest 'Edwards' issue is the Bill Walsh endorsement. Take that away and he's another Joe average dud in a long line of "mediocre at best" QB's. But Walsh endorsed him as a heluva a quarterback which has us all yearning to believe there is something there. Maybe it's one of those deals where he has the technical capability, but just can't will the team win. Ever notice how mad Brady gets when he is not winning, Kelly used to as well, Manning is all over his guys when they blow an assignment or a route. We need to TE to get pissed this year if we lose, not just drone on about how well the other team played and all the wonderful learning opportunities that their slightly different defensive scheme has brought. I am tired of the amicable shrug of the shoulder and mild disappointment after a loss. I want to see a fired up QB getting in his o-lines' jocks when they miss blocks and blast receivers during the game for not coming back to the ball or running a route properly. I don't need to see the guy win every game, but I do need to see the guy pissed he's not winning and try to stoke the fire a little bit to get it done. If we go through another season and we get the same shrug of the shoulders, roll of the eyes and "disappointment but learning opportunity" game summaries, then let him to back his bags and go play somewhere else and the bills can lure Brett Favre out of retirement for the 4th or 5th time. BTW It's not that Lee isn't good enough, is just seems he is not attacking the ball. Watch TO go after a pass and the contrast is clear. Fitzgerald is ridiculous the way he attacks the ball. Lee can be fix that pretty easily if he wants to win. It's not about his skills which seem like they could be elite receiver material. With all due respect the thought of Bill Walsh's endorsement never even crosses my mind unless brought up in discussion and I'm sure most folks will say the same thing. My defense of TE is based on his talent, intelligence and leadership abilities and the sub par supporting cast around him including the coaching staff.
davefan66 Posted August 26, 2009 Posted August 26, 2009 This tells me that "the Genuis" thought Stever Fuller would be a better NFL QB than Joe Montana. Wrong there. Maybe wrong about Edwards too? Certainly possible. Yeah, but Fuller did not have Walsh as his coach. Not taking away from Montana, but maybe Fuller would have been better under the tutelage of Walsh. As far as I'm concerned Trent's problem is coaching and supporting cast.. If you took TE and put him in Aikmen's place in the early 90's Cowboys and I bet he'd do just about as good. Emmitt, Irvin, the OL, and that coaching staff and Trent would look MUCH better. Toss in a good defense, and a lot of "bust" NFL QB's could flourish in that system.
evilcape Posted August 26, 2009 Posted August 26, 2009 whats with the lame jim rome type posts? r u one of jim romes 'clones'? how does anybody actualy like that man? regards, the guy who hates jim rome
DIE HARD 1967 Posted August 26, 2009 Posted August 26, 2009 Just tell me why so many fans made excuses for J.P. Losman for 4 years and anyone who questioned his ability got trashed BIG TIME!!!! I find it strange that so many fans Trashed Trent Edwards after 2 seasons. It was the LOVE for the rocket arm that saved Losman from the local BASHOMANIA
JohninMinn. Posted August 26, 2009 Posted August 26, 2009 How come nobody mentions how fragile Trentative is? He wont last. 6 games with the rookie personnel around him.
Thoner7 Posted August 26, 2009 Posted August 26, 2009 I know "Trentative Checkwards" has playing poorly. Ill be the first to admit it. But you can only hate on Trent if you think other QBs could be successful in the same situation. Jay Cutler, Brady Quinn, Tyler Thigpen, they all would suck with our OL play, our running game, and our offensive play calling and design. Peyton Manning, IMO, is the only QB in the NFL who could play great if he was on our team in 2010. That leaves 31 other QBs who would be less than average. So while yes I agree 100% Trent has been terrible ever since week 6 of last season (minus KC) I just cannot point the finger at him before first pointing at the OL play and coaching. PS Our game plan crushed vrs KC, why give up on it? (I knwo KC sucked but our play design and play calls were great in that game and that created the success, not KCs terrible D)
Flbillsfan#1 Posted August 26, 2009 Posted August 26, 2009 Just tell me why so many fans made excuses for J.P. Losman for 4 years and anyone who questioned his ability got trashed BIG TIME!!!! I find it strange that so many fans Trashed Trent Edwards after 2 seasons. It was the LOVE for the rocket arm that saved Losman from the local BASHOMANIA I didn't know JP was saved from the BASHOMANIA.
Flbillsfan#1 Posted August 26, 2009 Posted August 26, 2009 Dog, we should have known this was going to be a BS thread just based on the fact that Alphadawg started it. His posts are always...well laughable. Guess what nubs - no QB is a good QB with a bad o-line. Just look what happened to "the greatest offense ever" when the Giants d-line put Brady on his a$$ consistently. This isn't even a legitimate debate. Also, Lee Evans is not the awesome receiver you guys want him to be. It isn't an issue of stats - it is an issue of Lee can't beat double coverage and Josh Reed/all other Bills receivers before TO can't beat single coverage = no place to throw the ball = checkdown/sack. It's not even close to the most complicated dynamic to understand in football but if you can't grasp this relatively simple idea then you are in fact hopeless and shouldn't voice your opinion unless you don't mind being flagrantly and consistently rebuked. The problem is, as I have stated frequently, the Bills ARE NOT GOOD. We don't have competitive talent, therefore no QB, coach, punt returner, janitorial engineer or paraplegic genius is going to change that. Just let it sink in. We aren't good. Sometimes the truth hurts. Trent Edwards would likely dominate the Earth sitting behind the Patriots line. But it really is pretty absurd to expect him to throw the ball deep down the field into blanketing coverage to receivers who lack the size and physical ability to go up and force the issue against defensive backs in the two-three seconds per play he has to make a decision. Having T.O. in the mix changes everything. All of a sudden, you can't double team Lee Evans, and Lee *is* good enough to make you pay for single coverage. All of a sudden we have a guy who can go over the middle to catch passes and make you pay for blitzing. The entire dynamic of the Bills offense changes with T.O. in the game. Our o-line is suspect still, but in any game where they can provide at least adequate protection, you have to think most teams are going to have problems matching up. If you can't watch Trent play and see his obviously superior vision and poise, and see that he makes the *best* decisions possible a vast majority of the time, then why even bother trying to articulate a meaningful criticism of his play? You may think Lee can't beat double coverage. I think Trent can't beat double coverage because he can't throw the ball where Lee can make a play on it with two guys all over him.
Ray Posted August 27, 2009 Posted August 27, 2009 Few points about Trent 1) It is preseason people...we looked great last year against the SB champion Pittsburgh Steelers where Trent marched the offense up and down the field against their D....how did that do for us and for them last year? 2) Many times in preseason offenses work on things they may never do in the regular season and goals of the teams are different. If this was regular season TO would have played. 3) I completely agree if Trent plays in the regular season like he did last game it is obvious he is a goner...evry objective observer agrees. 4) Who cares if he checks down and they make positive yardage and 1st downs.....that is the whole point of the game. If he "checked down" to the open flank in the flat on the play he fumbled that would have been much better than losing a fumble looking to get the ball downfield like he was. Remember the interception was throwing the ball downfield. hrow the ball to the open receiver...we do have talented enough guys who can take a 5 yd toss and make it a 20 yd gain. There are times he will need to throw deep in a game but this constant bickering about "check-downs" takes on a life of its own. 5) Bottom line, if he plays horrible or only mediocre then he is gone. And keep in mind this is the preseason where they may use 5-10% of their playbook.....do you think they are giving BB and the Pats extra tape to study?
Flbillsfan#1 Posted August 27, 2009 Posted August 27, 2009 Sucks bad enough to have a winning record, imagine that, despite the lack of having a decent group of WR's no TE to speak and an inexperienced OC. ignorant post, and that's a fact While Trent does have a winning record, it is against the WORST Teams in the league. How many games has Trent won against teams with winning records?
Hanoverbills Posted August 27, 2009 Posted August 27, 2009 This one's easy: 1. The preseason doesn't count for sh--. 2. He has a winning record as a starter on a team that has a losing record without him. Why do we need to make excuses? 3. The difference this year is going to be TO, who, if you haven't noticed, has missed the last two games. Yes he has a winning record. But the teams he beat have a loosing record. He started 9 games in 2007 and the teams he started againts had a combine win and lost record of 64 W and 80 L . And in 2008, he started againts 14 teams that had a combine win and lost record of 96 W and 128 L. He should have winning record as a starter. And games that Edwards didn"t start in 2007 had a combine win and lost record of 64 W and 44 L, that was 7 games. In 2008 the games that Edwards didn't start, the teams had a combine win and lost record of 20 W and 12 L. He didn't finish three games in 2008 and we lost all those games and everyone of those teams had a winning record. Maybe thats why we have a loosing record without him.
Hanoverbills Posted August 27, 2009 Posted August 27, 2009 Let me know when Trent matches JP's mediocre stats from 2006. So far he has sucked bad enough not to even be better statistically than Losman (who set the bar pretty low himself). Maybe the WRs lack of stats are due to poor quarterbacking. Check Evans' stats from 2006. Looks like a good WR when his QB is not in constant checkdown mode. And We had a tougher schedule in 2006 than we had the last two years. Last year we had one of the easiest schedules in the NFL .
Alphadawg7 Posted August 27, 2009 Author Posted August 27, 2009 What difference? They both suck. Are you referring to Turk's "World's Slowest No Huddle" Offense? Yeah, our starters are lighting it up under that! I think a majority of people here fell in love with Trent Edwards simply because he was NOT JP Losman. I think there were only a few of us last year who felt NEITHER QB was the long term answer for the Bills. I'd love to be proved wrong by Trentative... EXACTLY
Alphadawg7 Posted August 27, 2009 Author Posted August 27, 2009 I don't need to...with our flimsy O-line in combination with Trent's need to hold onto the ball until the exact moment a receiver is wide open, I'm sure he'll be run into the ground plenty enough by the defensive ends of every team the Bills face this year. Some of us aren't "running Trent into the ground" but unobjectively trying to point out areas of his game that he needs serious improvement in. You're such an unabashed homer, you've already finished his bust for Canton. I believe Trent's got a lot to work on his game. He hasn't shown any improvements from the problems he had last season so far in the preseason and that's why I, and many others, are concerned about his game.
Alphadawg7 Posted August 27, 2009 Author Posted August 27, 2009 To me the biggest 'Edwards' issue is the Bill Walsh endorsement. Take that away and he's another Joe average dud in a long line of "mediocre at best" QB's. But Walsh endorsed him as a heluva a quarterback which has us all yearning to believe there is something there. Glad you mentioned that... The Bill Walsh endorsement frequently gets thrown in as if Walsh was never wrong. He once called JJ Stokes the next Jerry Rice. What exactly did he do other than have a journeyman WR career? Bill Walsh is a legend and one of the best ever, but it doesnt mean he was never wrong. People act like Christ himself came down and endorsed Trent. The fact remains, Trent was AVERAGE in college, has only ONE 300 yard game since HIGH SCHOOL, and has never lived up to his potential in college or the NFL yet... FYI: Bill Walsh also very high on Rick Mirer and Jim Drunkenmiller...you casual fans probably dont even know who Jim Drunkenmiller is and may not even remember Rick Mirer, thats how off he was on them amongst many others. And I mean no disrespect to Walsh, he was amazing, but no one is always right.
Alphadawg7 Posted August 27, 2009 Author Posted August 27, 2009 While Trent does have a winning record, it is against the WORST Teams in the league. How many games has Trent won against teams with winning records? Nice... I also find it hilarious that his so called winning record is barely over .500 (I think by just one game in fact) which is never going to equal a playoff berth in the AFC and yet these people hold it up as if he has some kind of great record. The truth about his so called record is that a lot of those wins came inspite or Trents struggles. He didnt win those games, our team won them for him. The reality is this: Trent has lost us more games than he has won for us. And thats just fact... Hope a switch goes off this year, I really do, but he is showing a lot of the same flaws still he has always had...
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