Dante Posted August 19, 2009 Posted August 19, 2009 I didn't read all the posts but if this was mentioned pardon me.... # 9 pick Ragi DL 28.5 million 18 guaranteed #13pick Orakpo DE 20 mill with 12.1 guaranteed I don't see what the hold up is. His value is between THESE 2 picks, not what Crabtree is going to make. His value has been set. It is between 20 mill and 28 mill. The more this drags out I blame Maybin for not firing his agent and going with somebody else. Another case of a player getting bad advice from a wannabe high roller agent . What continually frustrates me is the most important thing that any pay should be based on is performance. Shouldn't be based on what others have got because there is no history to base it on Especially when you are talking these kinda bucks. What other business can afford to pay these kind of wages blindly? A league that charged $200 a year to watch on tv that what kind. Fuggin guys should get league minimum for a year until they prove what they can do. Ridiculous. Their lucky they have the privilege of having the opportunity to play in a elite professional league.
RyanC883 Posted August 19, 2009 Posted August 19, 2009 What continually frustrates me is the most important thing that any pay should be based on is performance. Shouldn't be based on what others have got because there is no history to base it on Especially when you are talking these kinda bucks. What other business can afford to pay these kind of wages blindly? A league that charged $200 a year to watch on tv that what kind. Fuggin guys should get league minimum for a year until they prove what they can do. Ridiculous. Their lucky they have the privilege of having the opportunity to play in a elite professional league. Good call. I hope the Bills don't give in. This kid has great potential both ways. Could be a pro-bowler, but given the fact he only started one college season in a fantastic defensive system at PSU, he could be a major flop.
Coach55 Posted August 19, 2009 Posted August 19, 2009 Other than Maybin, the only two remaining players are Andre Smith and Crabtree. At this point, Maybin should have all the data points necessary to sign considering Raji was at 9 (5y/28.5mm) and Orakpo at 13 (5y/20mm) are comparable positions. His contract should come in at 5y/24.5mm. The fact that he is waiting for Crabtree is rediculous. Crabtree has all-star agent Eugene Parker who ruins players reputations as he lacks capable negotiating skills.
angrygnome Posted August 19, 2009 Posted August 19, 2009 The fact that they seem to be waiting for another player to hopefully blow up the slotting raises a serious red flag in my book. There's not much to say that hasn't already been written in this thread, but I agree 100% with the idea of telling him that even if Crabtree's signing does raise what he could get, we are paying him in the range we are offering. The Bills have a good history of getting top picks in camp very quickly, so I believe this is all on Maybin, who perhaps is getting bad advice. IMHO, if doesn't play in at least one preseason game then I really wouldn't care to have him at all. I know, eventually he will sign, but if we actually told him to f off, I wouldn't even care. 1 great 1st round pick in Wood + one completely lost first round pick in Maybin pretty much equals a first round bust in my book, and I am used to that. Tell him the deal is 5-25-14, you have until one week before the last preseason game to sign it. If not, please don't call unless your offer is 50% less than this. And leave it at that.
K Gun Special Posted August 19, 2009 Posted August 19, 2009 I didn't read all the posts but if this was mentioned pardon me.... # 9 pick Ragi DL 28.5 million 18 guaranteed #13pick Orakpo DE 20 mill with 12.1 guaranteed I don't see what the hold up is. His value is between THESE 2 picks, not what Crabtree is going to make. His value has been set. It is between 20 mill and 28 mill. The more this drags out I blame Maybin for not firing his agent and going with somebody else. Another case of a player getting bad advice from a wannabe high roller agent . A well thought out reasonable post. Thank you for making my head stop hurting. COrrect me if im wrong but doesnt Maybin have the same agent as Crabtree?? aaaan YAHTZEEE theres your problem. It has to be hard for a 20 yr old kid to buck his agent whos telling him to holdout for millions more dollars hes being told hes worth.
BillsGuyInMalta Posted August 19, 2009 Posted August 19, 2009 I hope you are right but I have to say, I find your reliance on tingly feelings more than a little creepy. And I find your lack of faith in my tingly feelings disturbing.
Mickey Posted August 19, 2009 Posted August 19, 2009 being a penn state fan...this is killing me. i am getting to damn frusterated with maybin and his prick of an agent. "Maybin’s value should fall somewhere between the respective five-year contracts signed by Raji ($28.5 million, with just under $18 million guaranteed) and Orakpo ($20 million, with $12.1 million guaranteed)." give the sumbitch 5 years - $24 million, $15 mill guarenteed. was that hard to figure out? i hope crabtree gets his legs snapped off by tko in practice, once the pu$$y signs and reports, and he never sees the playing field. It takes two not to tango
Mickey Posted August 19, 2009 Posted August 19, 2009 If the Bills are offering more money than Moreno got, they're "offering 11th pick money." Maybin and his agent are clearly angling for what Crabtree is looking for, and it's not even debatable at this point, since Arrington has come out and said that Crabtree is holding things up (...on their end). The Bills have no reason to want to see what Crabtree signs for, both because of the (lost) time it will take for that to happen plus the (out of proportion/slot) money he'll get. "Clearly" my ass. We have no idea what offers have been made and rejected nor what counteroffers have been made and rejected. I know it is frustrating but imagining what positions the parties have taken and then attacking them for what you imagine they are doing makes little sense. For once, the team and the player are keeping it all behind closed doors which is the way it ought to be done. I am impressed that there hasn't been a leak to the press, Tim G. had a source he recently reported clammed up on him. Sucks for us and for Tim but I think its the best way for both sides to handle this situation.
mrags Posted August 19, 2009 Posted August 19, 2009 That is exactly what should be done and the process should have either already begun or it should begin VERY soon. The only thing I would add is that the Bills should break with tradition and announce their offer and the decreasing terms publicly. They should explain their position and allow their fans to understand. They should invite Maybin to state his position as well. This would squelch any complaints because any position Maybin might have would be clearly seen as ridiculous as he tried to tie himself to an injured but top flight talent. This strategy would put more pressure on Maybin as other teams would see him for what he is, and be less likely to draft him next year. He could get the number 11 money he deserves this year or sit for a year and get the number 42 money he would deserve by then. If the Bills are currently offering him #15 money, they would be rightly seen as the villian. Of course, they are not so this won't happen. Going public forces Maybin's hand. I love this idea Crayonz
Fixxxer Posted August 19, 2009 Posted August 19, 2009 More food for thought. The rookie contracts for last year's Number One picks: 9. Keith Rivers LB Cincinnati Signed 6 years, $23 million ($15.6M guaranteed) 10. Jerod Mayo LB New England Signed 5 years, $18.9 million ($13.8M guaranteed) 11. Leodis McKelvin CB Buffalo Signed 5 years, $19.4 million ($12.6M guaranteed) Oh, those Bills, such lowballers with 1st round picks. I would punch Maybin in the face..........................................................and run very, very fast afterwards.
Mickey Posted August 19, 2009 Posted August 19, 2009 And I find your lack of faith in my tingly feelings disturbing. It is not lack of faith but an overabundance of creepiness which concerns me. From where exactly, I am afraid to ask, do these tingles originate? I am thinking of buying some UPS stock, do a bro a solid and take a look at that and let me know if you get a tingle.
ThereIsNoDog Posted August 19, 2009 Posted August 19, 2009 "Clearly" my ass. We have no idea what offers have been made and rejected nor what counteroffers have been made and rejected. I know it is frustrating but imagining what positions the parties have taken and then attacking them for what you imagine they are doing makes little sense. For once, the team and the player are keeping it all behind closed doors which is the way it ought to be done. I am impressed that there hasn't been a leak to the press, Tim G. had a source he recently reported clammed up on him. Sucks for us and for Tim but I think its the best way for both sides to handle this situation. Yes, clearly your ass. The Bills haven't had problems anywhere near this bad signing, oh, every OTHER draft pick since the advent of free agency. They know what Moreno, the guy picked after him, got and they know what Raji, the guy picked 2 spots before him, got. Maybin's camp is the only one talking about how Crabtree is holding things up. It's not a hard concept to grasp.
Ramius Posted August 19, 2009 Posted August 19, 2009 "Clearly" my ass. We have no idea what offers have been made and rejected nor what counteroffers have been made and rejected. I know it is frustrating but imagining what positions the parties have taken and then attacking them for what you imagine they are doing makes little sense. For once, the team and the player are keeping it all behind closed doors which is the way it ought to be done. I am impressed that there hasn't been a leak to the press, Tim G. had a source he recently reported clammed up on him. Sucks for us and for Tim but I think its the best way for both sides to handle this situation. Bogus. This is all on Maybin. The Bills have had little problems signing the #8, #12, and #11 picks in recent years to appropriately slotted contracts. Why all of a sudden this year would they change their tactic and decide to lowball Maybin? The simplest and most likely explanation here is that the Bills have offered an appropriately slotted #11 contract (based on Moreno and Raji), and Maybin is simply being a greedy prick who wants more money than his slotting.
The Senator Posted August 19, 2009 Posted August 19, 2009 It is not lack of faith but an overabundance of creepiness which concerns me. From where exactly, I am afraid to ask, do these tingles originate? I am thinking of buying some UPS stock, do a bro a solid and take a look at that and let me know if you get a tingle. BGIOP's tingles are none of Mrs. Cravitz's business!
Kipers Hair Posted August 19, 2009 Posted August 19, 2009 Ugh...our franchise seems like a joke sometimes. While I agree witht he statement - this is not one of those times our franchise is to blame. I think this is more driven by dollar signs the agent has painted - if Crabtree wins his posiiton - Maybin will get another couple of million out of the system. It's a million dolar gamble and I do not blame the Bills for holding fast....
Mickey Posted August 19, 2009 Posted August 19, 2009 I love this idea Crayonz Yeah, because negotiating publicly always works. Why get a deal done behind closed doors when you can drag the fans and the press into it all so that everyone will either hate the front office or hate Maybin? Why not blast Maybin publicly thereby making damn sure he leaves the team for a friendlier, classier operation when that first contract expires? There is a reason teams do not do this, ever. Either the people who actually do this for a living know better or some reactionary, anonymous moron who calls himself a crayon eater knows better. Hmmm...which side to choose?
thebandit27 Posted August 19, 2009 Posted August 19, 2009 Call it a rant if you want, but I have to say that this situation dragging on and on finally has me exasperated. I'm not like a lot of posters on here--angry and scorned--but rather disappointed in the team and the player. Both sides are wrong. If either side wanted this deal done badly enough they could have it done today. This whole thing is truly ridiculous. The team is talking as though they've moved on (From the AP piece: "If the guy's not on the roster, you don't have plans for him," Jauron said. "We'd love to get him in as soon as we can. I know they're working at it, and I know our people are certainly working at it. I hope it happens fast."), which I can sort of understand but completely loathe at the same time. If the player is being unreasonable in his demands, the team has to move on, but it's completely pathetic that a team could apparently want & need a player badly enough to select him with their No. 1 draft pick and then utterly fail in their attempts to get him into camp. The worst part about this situation, for me, is that both sides dragged the holdout to a point where the team potentially signing the player becomes a poor investment. It's a no-win situation, and I think it stinks. I think the player and his agent are selfish, I think the team and the organization are clueless, and I think the rest of the league is laughing heartily. Obviously, it's not going to deter me from cheering for the team, and for Maybin if he eventually signs, but I can tell you that my expectations for the player and the team's improved pass rush have dropped significantly. It's the fault of both sides, and it would be appropriate for all involved parties to get what they deserve for this fiasco: Buffalo doesn't sign him and loses a draft pick, and Maybin goes back into the draft and loses a ton of money. Ok, I'm done.
The Dean Posted August 19, 2009 Author Posted August 19, 2009 Bogus. This is all on Maybin. The Bills have had little problems signing the #8, #12, and #11 picks in recent years to appropriately slotted contracts. Why all of a sudden this year would they change their tactic and decide to lowball Maybin? The simplest and most likely explanation here is that the Bills have offered an appropriately slotted #11 contract (based on Moreno and Raji), and Maybin is simply being a greedy prick who wants more money than his slotting. Well, I wouldn't completely put it past the Bills to low-ball the offer (that is, take the extreme low end of the possible slotted range) in this instance. Remember, it was Maybin's camp that said they wouldn't wait for Crabtree. But if the Bills are stuck on $24/$14 guaranteed (which is the extreme low end on the slotted salary structure for that spot) the Maybin camp figures it has to wait for Crabtree. Now, I'm not suggesting that is true, either. I'm simply saying we don't really know the facts here, and I wouldn't put it past the Bills to try to get out of this as cheaply as possible. From my point of view, if I'm Maybin (or any highly prized athlete) and my agent can't get this done in this time frame (but manages to get a deal done for Michaek Vick in the meantime), I switch agents. I go to a well known, first class alternative agent, and tell him, "get this done by the end of the week". But that's easy for me to say.
wonderbread Posted August 19, 2009 Posted August 19, 2009 I really don't think you can pin this on the franchise. sometimes perception is reality.
nucci Posted August 19, 2009 Posted August 19, 2009 Call it a rant if you want, but I have to say that this situation dragging on and on finally has me exasperated. I'm not like a lot of posters on here--angry and scorned--but rather disappointed in the team and the player. Both sides are wrong. If either side wanted this deal done badly enough they could have it done today. This whole thing is truly ridiculous. The team is talking as though they've moved on (From the AP piece: "If the guy's not on the roster, you don't have plans for him," Jauron said. "We'd love to get him in as soon as we can. I know they're working at it, and I know our people are certainly working at it. I hope it happens fast."), which I can sort of understand but completely loathe at the same time. If the player is being unreasonable in his demands, the team has to move on, but it's completely pathetic that a team could apparently want & need a player badly enough to select him with their No. 1 draft pick and then utterly fail in their attempts to get him into camp. The worst part about this situation, for me, is that both sides dragged the holdout to a point where the team potentially signing the player becomes a poor investment. It's a no-win situation, and I think it stinks. I think the player and his agent are selfish, I think the team and the organization are clueless, and I think the rest of the league is laughing heartily. Obviously, it's not going to deter me from cheering for the team, and for Maybin if he eventually signs, but I can tell you that my expectations for the player and the team's improved pass rush have dropped significantly. It's the fault of both sides, and it would be appropriate for all involved parties to get what they deserver for this fiasco: Buffalo doesn't sign him and loses a draft pick, and Maybin goes back into the draft and loses a ton of money. Ok, I'm done. I doubt any team really cares about Maybin not being signed at this point. I'm sure they have their own issues. You make it sound like this is the 1st holdout in league history.
Recommended Posts