Kelly the Dog Posted August 5, 2009 Posted August 5, 2009 Uh, sure...absolutely, in fact. How 'bout we both accept the story in it's entirety? I could have just as easily highlighted it this way, to the same effect... "The Lions, Rams, Seahawks, Bengals, Raiders and Jaguars could all use a guy with Peters' ability to man the premier spot along the offensive line for the next six years... "Perhaps the reason more teams weren't involved is because they had some of the same concerns the Bills had in regards to Peters. The Bills have had Peters on their roster for the past five seasons and yet they could not compel themselves to offer him the $10 million a year he was seeking. He had begun to show too many of the bad habits that caused a 340-pound athlete running a 4.8 40-yard dash out of college to go undrafted. That made such a sizable investment too much to stomach....On his way towards becoming the next great one he grew unhappy with his compensation because he was underpaid for his production based upon his 2007 season and the Bills were paying a couple of inferior linemen more. But two wrongs don't make a right and Peters was out of touch the entire offseason. He reported to Buffalo out of shape, overweight, disinterested and it showed in his lackluster performance. That made the Bills particularly uneasy to make him the highest paid player at his position. Personally, I would have made him play out his contract in western New York, but the Bills didn't want to go through last year all over again and began to entertain trade offers." I don't accept the theory in its entirety at all. I think a lot of it is true, and some of it is untrue, and some of it is just conjecture and POV where I can see both sides. I'm just glad to hear that you believe that Peters was never asking for 11-12-13 million and the Bills were never offering him 10 million a year and he just turned it down because he didn't want to be here.
BillsVet Posted August 5, 2009 Posted August 5, 2009 With apologies to The Senator and at the risk of repeating myself, Peters was in no way responsible for picking up Elam on that safety blitz against the Jets. GO BILLS!!! No, but the anti-Peters crowd sought any way to marginalize someone they hated ad nauseam. Nevermind they did not see the EZ angle, nor comprehend that 340# LT's don't normally block 190# CB's who run 4.5 40s. It's typical "I hate this guy because he left my team-itis." And the fact that, as people here seem to keep forgetting, THE BILLS OFFERED TO MAKE HIM THE HIGHEST-PAID PLAYER IN FRANCHISE HISTORY, despite all of these supposed "issues." Bills fans are the epitome of "sour grapes." Define "highest paid player in franchise history." Russell's statement is one with plenty of wiggle-room. It could have been a 6yr 50M contract. Heck, it coulda been 50M and no guaranteed money. Fans forget that the contract terms don't equate to guaranteed dollars in the NFL. NC's deal in SF is widely talked about as being 8 yrs and 80M, when in reality it's a 7 yr 64M contract.
The Senator Posted August 5, 2009 Posted August 5, 2009 I don't accept the theory in its entirety at all. I think a lot of it is true, and some of it is untrue, and some of it is just conjecture and POV where I can see both sides. I'm just glad to hear that you believe that Peters was never asking for 11-12-13 million and the Bills were never offering him 10 million a year and he just turned it down because he didn't want to be here. Funny, I don't remember saying anything even close to any of that - link please? But I really don't care where FatBoy wants to be to give his half-assed effort this year - Philadelphia or wherever - as long as it's not here! The Bills are on the cusp of something great, and they don't need any disinterested, half-hearted, half-witted, injury-prone profit monger on the roster as they being this season's March to Miami... 19 and 0 baby!!! GO BILLSSS!!!! PosLUSZny!!!!!
ThereIsNoDog Posted August 5, 2009 Author Posted August 5, 2009 I'm willing to believe that the Bills offered him slightly more than Evans got (4 years, $37.25M with $18.25M in guarantees) because they didn't like how things went down last year, and maybe more stuff that we never heard about. The thing is, we'll never know for sure.
billybob Posted August 5, 2009 Posted August 5, 2009 I'm not so sure about that 'earned the respect around the league' thing, but Peters' stupidity and questionable work ethic certainly have raised some eyebrows... "The Lions, Rams, Seahawks, Bengals, Raiders and Jaguars could all use a guy with Peters' ability to man the premier spot along the offensive line for the next six years... "Perhaps the reason more teams weren't involved is because they had some of the same concerns the Bills had in regards to Peters. The Bills have had Peters on their roster for the past five seasons and yet they could not compel themselves to offer him the $10 million a year he was seeking. He had begun to show too many of the bad habits that caused a 340-pound athlete running a 4.8 40-yard dash out of college to go undrafted. That made such a sizable investment too much to stomach....On his way towards becoming the next great one he grew unhappy with his compensation because he was underpaid for his production based upon his 2007 season and the Bills were paying a couple of inferior linemen more. But two wrongs don't make a right and Peters was out of touch the entire offseason. He reported to Buffalo out of shape, overweight, disinterested and it showed in his lackluster performance. That made the Bills particularly uneasy to make him the highest paid player at his position. Personally, I would have made him play out his contract in western New York, but the Bills didn't want to go through last year all over again and began to entertain trade offers." Ross Tucker SI/CNN 4/22/2009 link As for the Pro Bowl thing, we all know Pro Bowl voting is a freaking joke. A guy who led the NFL among blind-side tackles in sacks-allowed getting voted to the Pro Bowl??? Right. The reason Peters was undrafted was that he was considered to be too big to be a TE his college position and had never played OT - this combined with his low test scores on the wonderlic made teams leery. As for Peters personality- you might find this interesting- Peters ended college around 317lbs- now he had the option of dropping weight to make himself more attractive as a TE or gaining weight to better fit as a OT- In an interview he basically said he looked at what TEs make and what OTs make and it was a simple descision. As for talent I wouldn't say Peters is the best but I'd put him in the top 5 and I think anyone who would say he's not in the top ten just has an axe to grind- the biggest concern for Peters is injuries he's playing at 350+ by the way he is not overly fat- still there comes a point when even adding muscle starts to increase the risk of injury- if I were the Bills this would have been a bigger concern than the size of the contract or personality issues- large explosive men with lower body injuries issues is a bad combination.
Dan Posted August 5, 2009 Posted August 5, 2009 The reason Peters was undrafted was that he was considered to be too big to be a TE his college position and had never played OT - this combined with his low test scores on the wonderlic made teams leery. As for Peters personality- you might find this interesting- Peters ended college around 317lbs- now he had the option of dropping weight to make himself more attractive as a TE or gaining weight to better fit as a OT- In an interview he basically said he looked at what TEs make and what OTs make and it was a simple descision. As for talent I wouldn't say Peters is the best but I'd put him in the top 5 and I think anyone who would say he's not in the top ten just has an axe to grind- the biggest concern for Peters is injuries he's playing at 350+ by the way he is not overly fat- still there comes a point when even adding muscle starts to increase the risk of injury- if I were the Bills this would have been a bigger concern than the size of the contract or personality issues- large explosive men with lower body injuries issues is a bad combination. Actually, the biggest issue for me was his attitude. He clearly busted his butt to learn the OT position. And as your post illustrates, he was motivated by a big paycheck. However, the list is a long one of players that are motivated solely by money that once they get their big contract, their play declines considerably. So, for me, I was more than concerned that given his attitude and apparent contentment with slacking off last year when he wasn't paid; what assurance did the team have that he would once again apply himself with the same drive and dedication to improvement that he had prior to getting the big paycheck? It is entirely possible that he showed his true colors during the holdout and subsequent 2008 season. I guess we'll know in a few months.
DazedandConfused Posted August 6, 2009 Posted August 6, 2009 Funny, I don't remember saying anything even close to any of that - link please? But I really don't care where FatBoy wants to be to give his half-assed effort this year - Philadelphia or wherever - as long as it's not here! The Bills are on the cusp of something great, and they don't need any disinterested, half-hearted, half-witted, injury-prone profit monger on the roster as they being this season's March to Miami... 19 and 0 baby!!! GO BILLSSS!!!! PosLUSZny!!!!! I also do not remember any article making a credible claim that the Bills offered him $10 mill a year. However, it would be incorrect to claim the Bills stance was to offer him nothing and I do remember talk of them having serious negotiations with Peters and though the Bills never appeared near to offering him the 10 he wanted (and eventually got from Philly) they were pretty clearly ready to drop some serious change on Peters. Do you agree they appeared ready to give a significant (but not nearly the astronomical amount he wanted) cash on Peters. If so this would not seem to be consistent with the view he is a worthless sack of crap. How do you feel about this? Why do you think your conclusions diverge so wildly from the Bills who knew him best? Another thing I think we can agree upon even taking your extreme views of Peters into account is that his agent Parker did a pretty amazing job representing his client. In fact, the more you diss Peters, then the more I think you got to tip your hat to Parker. Think about it. If you are correct that Peters is such a sack of excrement, then this shows an even greater nod that must be given to Parker as he held out his client to get such a huge deal. In fact, even if one takes the stance that an agent should be about more than the money, then by taking the stance Parker had him take he got his new deal when if he really sucked as you say Peters is doomed to fail in this league. If Parker made the same assessment you made then it mean kudos for Parker who forced the Bills to trade him to big bucks he would never be in a position to get a great deal since sooner or later the world would realize the same thing you do and about Peters sucking. Another point we should agree on is that the Pro Bowl is more of a beauty contest than a true assessment of skills. The fact that Peters won this popularity contest twice in a row does lend credence to the claim he is widely thought to be a great player. I think on the face of it we all should agree that: 1. The Bills coaches and FO thought pretty highly of him as a player or they never would even have offered him likely the largest contract ever given a Bill even though it fell short of his goal of $10 million. 2. Parker did an amazing job getting this sack of excrement a huge deal. 3, His being voted to the Pro Bowl represents a pretty wide finding by the coaches, the fans, and his fellow players that would constitute pretty wide acceptance of a conclusion he is a stud (even though you and I may not agree with their conclusion.
The Senator Posted August 6, 2009 Posted August 6, 2009 I also do not remember any.... . . ...conclusion. The conclusion is that Fat Boy - who was under contract, well-paid, and expected to perform - quit on his Buffalo Bills teammates before last season started. His selfishness and apathy hindered the installation of Schonert's offensive scheme in training camp and preseason, and his half-assed effort when he finally did show up (a day before he was to begin forfeiting his game checks, I believe) left Edwards and Losman vulnerable to sacks and to injury, and forced the coaching staff and his fellow Bills players to make roster adjustments to compensate for his absence and then for his lack of conditioning and preparation. I'm a Bills fan - Peters plays for Philadelphia (if his quad heals, and if he feels like it). I don't root for the Eagles. I don't like the Eagles. I don't care how the Eagles or their players perform, save for how it might affect the Bills in a given week, and I don't give a crap about what kind of great job you think Eugene Parker did either. In fact, I'm glad the Eagles wasted so much money on a fat, stupid, injury-prone, lazy POS like PayMe Peters. If you're such a fan of them, go get yourself some Eagles tickets... 19 and 0 baby!!! GO BILLSSS!!!! REVERSE THE CURSE!!!!!
Mickey Posted August 6, 2009 Posted August 6, 2009 his development is coming along? he's a backup tackle subbing for a injured player.... I've been at a few camps, and yes Bell is a good project, but thats it. this guy is NO where ready to play against a lineman even of schobel's caliber on a regular basis. At least Walker and Butler are able to lock up equally guys like schobel and kelsay. But Bell got blown around bye Ellis on one move and got swung under by Denney (i think) on another. He had a hard time locking onto and containing any of the bills' better DEs in 1 on 1 drills (a few times with denney and kelsay). I'm not saying he's bad by any means, or that he was horrible in 11 on 11. He looked very solid and impressive against 2nd string guys, but he is not ready for starting duty, at least from what I could see in a few practices. I'm not trying to rain on anyone's parade, but he is very raw still. Butler is certainly better. I'm just confused why Chambers isn't the starting RT tonight. that really shocks me. He is a pretty stable, albeit not a flashy, tackle. You and your fancy "facts" and "logic". Go away, we don't need your kind around here.
ThereIsNoDog Posted August 6, 2009 Author Posted August 6, 2009 You and your fancy "facts" and "logic". Go away, we don't need your kind around here. Where did you see any "facts" and "logic?"
Thurman#1 Posted August 6, 2009 Posted August 6, 2009 Very true. Bell is committed to making the most out of the opportunity the Bills have handed him and becoming the best football player he can be; Peters is a fat stupid lazy schitt who admitted he dogged it last season 'cause he was pissed about his contract, then - after getting his $60M contract/$24M guarantee - on the first day of camp, tweaked his quad running from the bedroom to the breakfast table. Yup. Peters is healthy again and one of the 2 or 3 best LTs in the league, and Bell is a second-stringer. You're right, Senator, no comparison.
Thurman#1 Posted August 6, 2009 Posted August 6, 2009 http://www.philadelphiaeagles.com/news/Sto...?story_id=17673 What Jason Peters actually said: "I was thinking about it sometimes. If you get beat on a play and you think about your contract. It doesn't affect me that much. I thought about it some early in the year but later on in the year it wasn't a big deal." What the Senator understood that to mean: [Peters] admitted he dogged it last season 'cause he was pissed about his contract ... To quote Sesame Street: "One of these things is not like the others, One of these things just doesn't belong, Can you tell which thing is not like the others By the time I finish my song?" The Senator needs work on his paraphrasing skills. Back to 6th Grade!!
The Senator Posted August 6, 2009 Posted August 6, 2009 Yup. Peters is healthy again and one of the 2 or 3 best LTs in the league, and Bell is a second-stringer. You're right, Senator, no comparison. You sleepin' with FatBoy or something? Eagles | Several players miss morning practice Wednesday Wed, 05 Aug 2009 11:15:03 -0700 "Philadelphia Eagles head coach Andy Reid said TE Cornelius Ingram (knee), DE Victor Abiamiri (pectoral), OT Shawn Andrews (back), CB Ellis Hobbs (stinger), DT Trevor Laws (hamstring), OT Jason Peters (quadriceps) and TE Matt Schobel (undisclosed) did not participate in morning practice Wednesday, Aug. 5." link Why don't you wait for FatBoy to at least play a down before you send him back to the ProBowl?
ans4e64 Posted August 6, 2009 Posted August 6, 2009 Yup. Peters is healthy again and one of the 2 or 3 best LTs in the league, and Bell is a second-stringer. You're right, Senator, no comparison. In deciding how they are different, you are comparing them. You can compare anyone, I can't stand when people say things like "don't you dare compare Trent Edwards to Joe Montana"... why?
BuffaloBill Posted August 6, 2009 Posted August 6, 2009 his development is coming along? he's a backup tackle subbing for a injured player.... I'm just confused why Chambers isn't the starting RT tonight. that really shocks me. He is a pretty stable, albeit not a flashy, tackle. They may want to give Bell reps to prep him and bring him along a little faster. Chambers has game experience.
Thurman#1 Posted August 6, 2009 Posted August 6, 2009 I'm not so sure about that 'earned the respect around the league' thing, but Peters' stupidity and questionable work ethic certainly have raised some eyebrows... "The Lions, Rams, Seahawks, Bengals, Raiders and Jaguars could all use a guy with Peters' ability to man the premier spot along the offensive line for the next six years... "Perhaps the reason more teams weren't involved is because they had some of the same concerns the Bills had in regards to Peters. The Bills have had Peters on their roster for the past five seasons and yet they could not compel themselves to offer him the $10 million a year he was seeking. He had begun to show too many of the bad habits that caused a 340-pound athlete running a 4.8 40-yard dash out of college to go undrafted. That made such a sizable investment too much to stomach....On his way towards becoming the next great one he grew unhappy with his compensation because he was underpaid for his production based upon his 2007 season and the Bills were paying a couple of inferior linemen more. But two wrongs don't make a right and Peters was out of touch the entire offseason. He reported to Buffalo out of shape, overweight, disinterested and it showed in his lackluster performance. That made the Bills particularly uneasy to make him the highest paid player at his position. Personally, I would have made him play out his contract in western New York, but the Bills didn't want to go through last year all over again and began to entertain trade offers." Ross Tucker SI/CNN 4/22/2009 link As for the Pro Bowl thing, we all know Pro Bowl voting is a freaking joke. A guy who led the NFL among blind-side tackles in sacks-allowed getting voted to the Pro Bowl??? Right. Yeah, the Pro Bowl is a joke. Why the nuns team down my street could whip either Pro Bowl squad nine out of ten times. Again, the folks who voted for Peters were the PLAYERS, not the fans. The guys who had played against him or were on teams with guys who had played against him. How is it a stretch that Peters made the Pro Bowl? He was the second-best run-blocker at LT, the second-best run blocker of any offensive lineman in football, actually. (footballoutsiders.com). Yeah, he looked pretty ragged the first half of the year, but he still managed to be a superb run blocker and have a very very fine last half of the season generally. And yup, Ross Tucker doesn't like Peters. That's well-established. I even agree with his last bit. If you aren't going to pay hin, I would have made him play out his contract too. If we had been willing to do that, I think we would have gotten him to sign by now, at a discount. But, hey, instead he is going to training camp with the Eagles. The Eagles have had an excellent O-line for years now, they're much better than we are at finding good talent on the O-line, that's been proven again and again for a bit better than a decade now. And Peters is a guy who, when he has gone to training camp, has been a world-beater.
Thurman#1 Posted August 6, 2009 Posted August 6, 2009 No. The only way us fans are going to have a really good idea how much Bell improves is to see him play. He does not need to play in games to improve, and while I hope he explodes into a starting tackle soon, it might not happen very soon. Butler is good with lots of playing time, and Walker is a big strong veteran with lots of playing time and I don't see Bell jumping either on the depth chart in the short run. I'm still hoping that Bell can be our future LT and am excited to hear more about him and see him play when he gets a chance, but I also know that is far from a sure thing, and given his current experience, he can improve a great deal in practice without playing before getting his shot if Walker and Butler are healthy. Yup, I think you hit the nail square on the head here. We can hope that he improves, but he's not there yet. Still, it's great to see him doing well in practice.
The Senator Posted August 6, 2009 Posted August 6, 2009 http://www.philadelphiaeagles.com/news/Sto...?story_id=17673 What Jason Peters actually said: "I was thinking about it sometimes. If you get beat on a play and you think about your contract. It doesn't affect me that much. I thought about it some early in the year but later on in the year it wasn't a big deal." What Jason Peters actually said and meant: "I was thinking about it sometimes. If you get beat on a play and you think about your contract. It doesn't affect me that much if our QB gets killed or if I lead the NFL in sacks-allowed - everyone that doesn't play against me is voting me to the Pro Bowl anyway. I thought about it some early in the year but later on in the year it wasn't a big deal - I figured, WTF? I'll just skip the last two games like I did last season, and I'll be outa here by summer!" You think when Evans drops a pass, he thinks about his contract? No, he's probably thinking, "if only that a-hole Peters woulda showed up in shape and ready for football, maybe Trent would have better protection." When Edwards gets sacked, he's thinking, "I'm not making enough money? No, he's probably thinking, "if only that a-hole Peters woulda showed up in shape and ready for football, maybe he wouldn't whigg on so many blocks." "If you get beat on a play and you think about your contract" isn't letting your contract affect your play??? Wake up and smell the coffee, man.
Thurman#1 Posted August 6, 2009 Posted August 6, 2009 (if his quad heals, Ha ha ha ha ha. Typical. Peters has been back at practice for days now. But this is positive news about Jason Peters, so no matter how often he sees it, it will not penetrate the Senator's anti-Peters mental bunker. Funny stuff.
Thurman#1 Posted August 6, 2009 Posted August 6, 2009 You sleepin' with FatBoy or something? Eagles | Several players miss morning practice Wednesday Wed, 05 Aug 2009 11:15:03 -0700 "Philadelphia Eagles head coach Andy Reid said TE Cornelius Ingram (knee), DE Victor Abiamiri (pectoral), OT Shawn Andrews (back), CB Ellis Hobbs (stinger), DT Trevor Laws (hamstring), OT Jason Peters (quadriceps) and TE Matt Schobel (undisclosed) did not participate in morning practice Wednesday, Aug. 5." link Why don't you wait for FatBoy to at least play a down before you send him back to the ProBowl? No, I'm not sleeping with him. Never was interested. Not my type. But it seems more and more likely as the volume of your venom increases that he at some point broke your heart. Did he just stop calling? Hope you can get over it at some point. ""It felt good to get back out there with my teammates and get some reps," Peters said." On the 3rd.
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