ans4e64 Posted August 5, 2009 Posted August 5, 2009 I've been at a few camps, and yes Bell is a good project, but thats it. this guy is NO where ready to play against a lineman even of schobel's caliber on a regular basis. At least Walker and Butler are able to lock up equally guys like schobel and kelsay. But Bell got blown around bye Ellis on one move and got swung under by Denney (i think) on another. He had a hard time locking onto and containing any of the bills' better DEs in 1 on 1 drills (a few times with denney and kelsay). I'm not saying he's bad by any means, or that he was horrible in 11 on 11. He looked very solid and impressive against 2nd string guys, but he is not ready for starting duty, at least from what I could see in a few practices. I'm not trying to rain on anyone's parade, but he is very raw still. Butler is certainly better. I'm just confused why Chambers isn't the starting RT tonight. that really shocks me. He is a pretty stable, albeit not a flashy, tackle. I agree. I've been to 3 so far and he's very inconsistent. You can see the talent and potential is there, but on one play he'll look like an all-pro and the next he'll look like he's standing still. Playing him right now would be a huge liability for Trent and the offense because on any given play you have no idea what he's going to do. I have no confidence in him right now. Not ready for full time duty yet, but he is very promising. I saw Jermaine McGhee walk around Bell like he was Lawrence Taylor. I'm excited he's getting the opportunity at more reps vs. tougher guys. It's the only way he's going to get better. I still hope he doesn't touch the field this season, but I'm hoping next year he will be ready.
Big Turk Posted August 5, 2009 Posted August 5, 2009 Is anyone else really nervous about Bell. Don't get me wrong I like him but it is too much too soon. Are we so desperate that we just want Bell to be what he could be down the road right away. Are we rushing Bell because we are having some remorse about Walker and Butler. Do we feel that Walker is too slow and that Butler might be too injury prone/slow? Is Bell really that much better than Walker or Butler as presently constituted? I dunno...the coaches seem to think this kid could be really really good with some playing time and some work...he apparently has all the needed attributes to be a very good tackle...
TDRupp Posted August 5, 2009 Posted August 5, 2009 Is anyone else really nervous about Bell. Don't get me wrong I like him but it is too much too soon. Are we so desperate that we just want Bell to be what he could be down the road right away. Are we rushing Bell because we are having some remorse about Walker and Butler. Do we feel that Walker is too slow and that Butler might be too injury prone/slow? Is Bell really that much better than Walker or Butler as presently constituted? Practice? We're talking practice, man! Don't worry. It is practice. If he is not as good as Chambers he won't be the number 3 OT. Plain and simple. Now, if you want to worry why we have big question marks at the starting OT positions, then feel free. I am worried. Personally, I love what the interior is going to be like, I am just scared as hell that Edwards will be blind and front sided early and often. But, Bell taking first string ROT or LOT reps in practice. No problem. Let's see what he is made of. It is practice!
John from Riverside Posted August 5, 2009 Posted August 5, 2009 The only way Bell is going to improve is to actually play him...... This OT stuff will work itself out......what I am waiting to see is if Bell steps up his game come gametime. Some players dial it up a notch when the bullets start flying for real.....some go into a shell or fall apart. I want to see if Bell is a player or a turtle
HurlyBurly51 Posted August 5, 2009 Posted August 5, 2009 The only way Bell is going to improve is to actually play him...... This OT stuff will work itself out......what I am waiting to see is if Bell steps up his game come gametime. Some players dial it up a notch when the bullets start flying for real.....some go into a shell or fall apart. I want to see if Bell is a player or a turtle He looked pretty good last preseason to my eyes, so I'm expecting him to take it up a notch this year. He definitely did not go into a shell.
Chandler#81 Posted August 5, 2009 Posted August 5, 2009 Great stuff! Thanks for the camp reports. They beat the he!! out of 'journalists' reports.. Anybody concerned that Levitre isn't an overwhelming presence, ala Wood? I'm 'hearing' alot of superlatives regarding Wood -including from Stroud on a daily basis. Levitre? not so much...
cmjoyce113 Posted August 5, 2009 Posted August 5, 2009 I was at camp last night and Bell struggled with the outside blitz pick up. One guy behind me complained Edwards held the ball to long but it was less than two seconds and he would have been killed. This kid is not close to ready to start at either Tackle position.
ThereIsNoDog Posted August 5, 2009 Author Posted August 5, 2009 I was at camp last night and Bell struggled with the outside blitz pick up. One guy behind me complained Edwards held the ball to long but it was less than two seconds and he would have been killed. This kid is not close to ready to start at either Tackle position. Peters struggled with blitz pickups last year. Remember the Jets game?
JStranger76 Posted August 5, 2009 Posted August 5, 2009 The main reason for this is because Chambers has been working at G during this training camp, which IMO is a bad idea anyways. Now that the rookies have nailed down the starting spots at G, I'd like to see Chambers moved back out to tackle and have McKinney as the swing guard.
ans4e64 Posted August 5, 2009 Posted August 5, 2009 Peters struggled with blitz pickups last year. Remember the Jets game? What does that have to do with Bell?
ans4e64 Posted August 5, 2009 Posted August 5, 2009 The main reason for this is because Chambers has been working at G during this training camp, which IMO is a bad idea anyways. Now that the rookies have nailed down the starting spots at G, I'd like to see Chambers moved back out to tackle and have McKinney as the swing guard. Chambers is back at LT with the 2nd team.
K-9 Posted August 5, 2009 Posted August 5, 2009 Peters struggled with blitz pickups last year. Remember the Jets game? With apologies to The Senator and at the risk of repeating myself, Peters was in no way responsible for picking up Elam on that safety blitz against the Jets. GO BILLS!!!
ThereIsNoDog Posted August 5, 2009 Author Posted August 5, 2009 What does that have to do with Bell? I don't know. Maybe that Bell isn't a 5th year NFL player who has been starting for 3-1/2 years and been selected to multiple Pro Bowls? Basically he needs more experience. By playing. And that's a problem I have with Jauron and co. They are too cautious when it comes to playing younger players.
ThereIsNoDog Posted August 5, 2009 Author Posted August 5, 2009 With apologies to The Senator and at the risk of repeating myself, Peters was in no way responsible for picking up Elam on that safety blitz against the Jets. What was he responsible for then? Blocking air?
DazedandConfused Posted August 5, 2009 Posted August 5, 2009 What was he responsible for then? Blocking air? It depends. The center has the responsibility for reading the likely blitz routes and calling the blocking scheme on each play and the QB bears ultimate responsibility for the play call being appropriate to his read of how this play matches up with the likely implementation of the opponents D scheme. I do not know which specific play you are referencing, but Fowler could have easily called for a package which gave Peters the direct responsibility for LDE (and if we are confident in the abilities of the LT to also have chip block duty on a safety coming around the end though I doubt Peters or any LTs in this league will be so dominant against even an average LDE that they could pull off this double duty). If the base blocking scheme is the usual standard, responsibility for a rushing safety would either be on a blitz pick-up by the RB, or we would depend on the QB and the WR on that side to recognize the pass rush and expect both to make a hot read and the QB will hit the WR doing a slant into the now unoccupied medium zone the safety is leaving unguarded with his blitz. If we have called a run, the RB now must try to avoid the onrushing safety and if he does he has a lot of grass in front of him to run on. The bottomline is that Peters easily could have had no responsibility for a safety coming around his end and the Bills will depend on the RB and the QB to make the right reads to exploit this rush. Thats this fans unknowledgable sense of this -play.
ThereIsNoDog Posted August 5, 2009 Author Posted August 5, 2009 It depends. The center has the responsibility for reading the likely blitz routes and calling the blocking scheme on each play and the QB bears ultimate responsibility for the play call being appropriate to his read of how this play matches up with the likely implementation of the opponents D scheme. I do not know which specific play you are referencing, but Fowler could have easily called for a package which gave Peters the direct responsibility for LDE (and if we are confident in the abilities of the LT to also have chip block duty on a safety coming around the end though I doubt Peters or any LTs in this league will be so dominant against even an average LDE that they could pull off this double duty). If the base blocking scheme is the usual standard, responsibility for a rushing safety would either be on a blitz pick-up by the RB, or we would depend on the QB and the WR on that side to recognize the pass rush and expect both to make a hot read and the QB will hit the WR doing a slant into the now unoccupied medium zone the safety is leaving unguarded with his blitz. If we have called a run, the RB now must try to avoid the onrushing safety and if he does he has a lot of grass in front of him to run on. The bottomline is that Peters easily could have had no responsibility for a safety coming around his end and the Bills will depend on the RB and the QB to make the right reads to exploit this rush. Thats this fans unknowledgable sense of this -play. Okay then. Shouldn't a good LT be able to block Elam, even just a little (maybe another second-worth, which would have been enough)? Much less "the best LT in football?"
K-9 Posted August 5, 2009 Posted August 5, 2009 What was he responsible for then? Blocking air? He was responsbible for tightening his gap relative to Dockery to account for the OLB blitz that the Jets showed pre-snap. He accounted for his responsibility. Secondly, and this is something that can only be seen from the endzone tapes, is that there was an approximately five yard gap between Elam, who had a moving start, and Peters at the snap. For Peters to even get close to him was a pretty good effort. But sometimes you have to tip your hat to the other team on a well executed play. The Jets, by showing LB blitz while disguising Elam pre-snap, did a good job. Thirdly, the man responsible for making the proper read on the play was Losman who, as the QB, should have made his safety read first. He didn't. Things aren't always as they appear on the TV screen. GO BILLS!!!
Magox Posted August 5, 2009 Posted August 5, 2009 I dunno...the coaches seem to think this kid could be really really good with some playing time and some work...he apparently has all the needed attributes to be a very good tackle... I would of had my doubts if they thought he could be really good, but if the coaches think he can be really really good, then that's good enough for me.
Kelly the Dog Posted August 5, 2009 Posted August 5, 2009 It depends. The center has the responsibility for reading the likely blitz routes and calling the blocking scheme on each play and the QB bears ultimate responsibility for the play call being appropriate to his read of how this play matches up with the likely implementation of the opponents D scheme. I do not know which specific play you are referencing, but Fowler could have easily called for a package which gave Peters the direct responsibility for LDE (and if we are confident in the abilities of the LT to also have chip block duty on a safety coming around the end though I doubt Peters or any LTs in this league will be so dominant against even an average LDE that they could pull off this double duty). If the base blocking scheme is the usual standard, responsibility for a rushing safety would either be on a blitz pick-up by the RB, or we would depend on the QB and the WR on that side to recognize the pass rush and expect both to make a hot read and the QB will hit the WR doing a slant into the now unoccupied medium zone the safety is leaving unguarded with his blitz. If we have called a run, the RB now must try to avoid the onrushing safety and if he does he has a lot of grass in front of him to run on. The bottomline is that Peters easily could have had no responsibility for a safety coming around his end and the Bills will depend on the RB and the QB to make the right reads to exploit this rush. Thats this fans unknowledgable sense of this -play. There was a LB right in front of Peters as well as a DE right in front of the LG. Plus the safety creeping up on the outside. We don't know the blocking assignment as you say, but Peters was clearly looking at the man directly in front of him, a blitzing LB who did indeed rush, on the inside of the blitzing S. To me it looks like he took a step or hesitated to see if Dockery was going to come over and block the LB, which he did. By the time that Peters saw the rushing S he was slow in his backpedal to get him. It could have just as easily been Dockery's misread as Peters, we just don't know. There were two extra Jets to contend with.
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