Lv-Bills Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 I think the main point wingt98, is that change should do us good this year, what we had wasn't working so at least the FO did something to fix it, and that is why we're excited, we want to see what they can do!!! This is more acceptable than reading post after post from wallers that KNOW that they are Big, Tough, Nasty, Intelligent, Finishers, Road Graders, Filthy, Sick, Phat, Man Whores, etc.... Here's hoping they mature quick, and Eric Wood sure looks like he should be good,......but you never know. No one does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan89 Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 I haven't posted often. Rarely actually in the last year or so. I've been mostly a lurker and i do very much appreciate the info and insight a lot of you veteran posters have provided. But it surprises me how much some of you have such little faith in our new O-line. Yes we have two rookies and a new center. In my opinion what separates them from most other NFL O-linemen is that our new guys are INTELLIGENT to the max. Also they are MEAN as hell. Our three guys are finishers. They are known for FINISHING their blocks and Relishing it. This is the kind of mentality we've been missing for too long. I miss the days of Wolford, Ritcher and Hull. Give our new guys a chance. It's not like we just drafted two StayPuff Pillsbury guys. Woody and Andy are finishers. That's what they love and that's what makes them Tick. Handy won't be a Hull or even come close but he's smart and tough is a good upgrade over Fowler and Preston. Our O-line honestly has the potential to be quite a good one. I don't know about you guys but i'm Very excited to see how they progress over the season. To you guys this may not count for much, but I coached 0-linemen in HS. (Yes i know it's nothing at all like the NFL). We had a line with average physical talent but very intelligent. We succeeded. Now our Bill's O-line is Intelligent AND has the physical tools and talent to become dominant. IMO our only question marks for the future are LW and Butler. They are serviceable. They will get the job done until we upgrade there. The board was getting a little slow so i figured i'de put in my 2 cents. Plus i think the O-line is generally always under appreciated (in any team). Post your comments if you wish. Well I have consistently posted how not only are Levitre-Hangartner-Wood as a young line for the future but you could throw in Butler to that mix as well. I think that once Peters was traded (Which you could debate the merits of the trade) they decided to build a line with a young core that could play with each other for a long time. With Peters gone they viewed Butler and Hangartner as the young guys than they drafted Wood and Levitre to add to the mix. This line has 4 young offensive lineman who are smart with a big upside who could gel into a unit for a long time to come. If they paly with each other for 2 years all of them will still be under 30 this line can be good although they are going to have growing pains this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilsner Posted July 30, 2009 Author Share Posted July 30, 2009 Ummmmm, yeah ok. And these same HIGHLY.....and let me say it again.....HIGHLY regarded scouts said about Tony Mandarich, and all of the other guys they whiffed on too. Don't give me the highly regarded scouts crap......these are the same highly regarded scouts that also praised Mike Williams, Ryan Leaf, etc. That crap easily works both way. Again though, as an aside, I don't not like this line at all, but some of you crack me up. Both of those guys have just as good a chance at busting as players as they do working out at this point. No one knows. No one at all likes how inexperienced this line is and how out of position they are. BUT did we have any decent LONG term alternatives for success? We'll see how this goes. We have to start somewhere. Bringing in veteran help in the past has not worked out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilsner Posted July 30, 2009 Author Share Posted July 30, 2009 No one at all likes how inexperienced this line is and how out of position they are. BUT did we have any decent LONG term alternatives for success? We'll see how this goes. We have to start somewhere. Bringing in veteran help in the past has not worked out. Ok. They are not necessarily "out of position". i spoke too hastily on that aspect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsWatch Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 I'd like to see the Bills bring in another position coach just to teach guards, a coach with lots of league experience playing in NFL. I think it would help get Wood and Levitre up to NFL speed more quickly. I think Butler's main issue has been keeping healthy NOT that he is out of position. He played RT in college including a number of bowl games but last year he kept getting dinged. Hopefully they can sign him to an extension before end of year and cost skyrockets. Maybe between Langston, Butler and Chambers they can keep a consistent enough line to keep Edwards on feet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chandler#81 Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Why? It is much easier to play guard as a rookie than it is tackle. IMHO these guys are both upgrades over the players they are replacing, as Butler is better suited to be a tackle. Hangartner is a huge upgrade over Fowler/Preston. He is also a backup in name only. Carolina was a dominant running team, and he played a big part last year. He has started exactly half of the games he has played in(27 out of 54). It is so ridiculous to keep hearing that "we have a backup at center", like that means anything. Michael Turner was a "backup" in San Diego to LT, and he did pretty well the first chance he got to start didn't he? It would be like comparing a guy who is rich and has 5 cars to a normal guy that has only 1 car and saying the normal guys car must be better than the rich guys 5th car because it is his backup car. It makes no sense. Carolina was a much better running team than we were last year, and Hangartner played a majority of the season as a starter on that line. You aren't gonna have that kind of running game if your center sucks... Whats next, someone trying to say Steve Young sucked because he was a backup to Joe Montana? I was thinking more along the lines of Thurman keeping Barry on the OSU sideline, before winning the Heisman.. Good post Matter! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffaloaggie Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Great, but no one even knows if they are good guards. THEY HAVEN'T PLAYED A DOWN IN THE NFL YET. And I don't care who Hangartner is, he was a backup. Period. The only thing that is fact about this line, is that two rookies, a backup, and two guys out of position will make up the Buffalo Bills starting line. Scary. As a note though.....I'm not a line hater at all............I just crack up when people on here talk like they KNOW these guys are good already.....and have no idea. If you'd do some research on Hangartner, you'd see that he was an asset to the Panthers. They had the luxury of having Ryan Kalil at Center and Hangartner to back him up. Here is a quote from an article about Hangartner leaving for Buffalo: While serving as mainly a reserve behind starter Ryan Kalil last season, the players, coaches, and fans alike still remained well aware of the asset Geoff was for the team. In fact, left tackle Jordan Gross was even quoted as saying to the front office "I told Marty to get busy. We need to sign Hangartner, make sure he's staying too." I'm sure that was posted when we first signed him on a thread, but apparently you like to put labels on players, so I had to post it again. I think we can consider Hangartner is a proven commodity. As far as Wood and Levitre go, you're absolutely right, we have no idea how they'll perform. They have potential, and that's all you can say about them until the games begin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ans4e64 Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 I haven't and won't B word about the line yet, however, it cracks me up when people tell me Eric Wood and Andy are finishers. They're mean. They are tough as nails. Intelligent. LOL. I'm not hating the line, and I'm not loving it. However, the things some of you write about these unproven guys is hilarious. No one has any idea how good ANY OF THE THREE are yet. We'll find out soon enough. Ummmmm, yeah ok. And these same HIGHLY.....and let me say it again.....HIGHLY regarded scouts said about Tony Mandarich, and all of the other guys they whiffed on too. Don't give me the highly regarded scouts crap......these are the same highly regarded scouts that also praised Mike Williams, Ryan Leaf, etc. That crap easily works both way. Again though, as an aside, I don't not like this line at all, but some of you crack me up. Both of those guys have just as good a chance at busting as players as they do working out at this point. No one knows. Do you realize that nobody is saying they are great players, without any doubt? Scouts, and us, are regurgitating the facts, which are: they finish blocks, they have a mean streak, they're tough, and they're intelligent. That has nothing to do with ability. It is black and white and easy to see. You either see them finish their blocks on film or you don't. They either have a mean streak or they don't, and they're either intelligent or they're not. None of that is a projection. It's the truth. Based on all of those FACTS, many of us make the hypothesis that in turn, they will be good football players in the NFL. What is so hard about that to understand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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