seq004 Posted November 8, 2004 Posted November 8, 2004 I was blasted last week for having the nerve to say why not make Bannan become an offensive player if he's not playing defense and you would have thought I was trying to clear OJ of double murder. For those out there and you know who you are bite me!
buffalo mike Posted November 8, 2004 Posted November 8, 2004 I was blasted last week for having the nerve to say why not make Bannan become an offensive player if he's not playing defense and you would have thought I was trying to clear OJ of double murder. For those out there and you know who you are bite me! 108518[/snapback] You gotta like it. What an athlete.
MDH Posted November 8, 2004 Posted November 8, 2004 My interpretation of that wasn’t that Bannon was going to switch over and become an offensive lineman, but that the packages he is involved in are a permanent part of the offense.
/dev/null Posted November 8, 2004 Posted November 8, 2004 you would have thought I was trying to clear OJ of double murder 108518[/snapback] if the offensive scheme fits you must acquit
SF Bills Fan Posted November 8, 2004 Posted November 8, 2004 I met Bannan at the Bills bar here in San Francisco last year. Big guy, really cool. We had a drink of Crown (his call). Said he really like playing in Buffalo. Hope this works out for him. Shows some serious versatility.
Fake-Fat Sunny Posted November 9, 2004 Posted November 9, 2004 I remember being one of those who said that the idea of moving Bannan to the offense this year was a bad idea so I'm not sure if I am one of those you considered those comments as blasting you. Well, here goes again because even despite the continued winderfuk success with the Jumbo Package in the red zone, I think going to Bannan as a full time offensive player this year would be a bad idea which: 1. would involve a huge distraction which is unlikely to pay many benefits to the team this year. 2. the distraction would be from a much better idea for improving LG play as we forced by the Sullivan and Pacillo failures to reach down for the unlikely possibility that a UDFA Ravens PS player would make the full jump to quality NFL stsrting LG for the Bills. The idea of moving Tucker from back-up center where he is at least a season OL player who is trained to understand all the OL positions simply hands down makes far more sense than expecting/demanding a defensive player to learn the whole playbook and master the position in 8 games. I'd rather JMac worry about dealing with the impacts of the potential loss of a starter like MW than spend his time power-schooling Bannan who obviously has his hands full learning the limited redzone playbook. 3, Even in terms of the back-up position, while I am not surprised at all that Leonard Smith could not make the jump from UDFA/PS player for another squad to adequate full time starter for the Bills, I think pegging him as a back-up makes far more sense. Clearly he was unproductive as a rezone LG, but he actually turned in a fair to middlin performance taking on the virtually impossible jump he was making from his duty last year to the demands of being a starter. He was the starter in a sack-free game earlier this season and the starter for WMs first 100 yard game. Bannan replaced him in the Jumbo Package last week, but it was Smith who did the bulk of the LG work in another sack free game in which WM went over 100 yards. The idea of having JMac work to power train him and him work to make a huge transition in a short time to merely sit on the bench seems like a misallocation of time. 4. I even think the days and use of the Jumbo Package may be limited. The great redzone success of this group has had the unfortunate side effect that there is now tape showing just about everything they do and any new surprises which has been part of that success will need to be developed. You can see that it is hitting the limits of its learning as it actually cost us a shot at 4 points Sunday as the OC sent in two play calls on the same play, but the Jumbo personnel was not trained in the second play. When the Jumbo failed to lead the way into the endzone on the first try, Bledsoe considered overiding the mismatch by getting the proper personnel in but there was not time with no TOs and a running clock. Some whine that Jim Kelly would have simply run a play and scored with a frelance run or pass but this dream ignores the fact that this is not your Mom'd NFL and our oversystematized playbook does not allow for having much chance for success with throwing even a quick pass the blockers have never run before (particularly when a sack losing yardage intio a wind which already cost the Jets a chip shot FG) or audibling to one of the limited number of run plays the Jumbo knows when failing to reach the endzone again might allow the clock to run out costing the Bills a full seven. Making the swich next year might be a possibility and deserves the discussion that MM says that they are giving it. However, this is is a discussion which quickly ends if PW does not take a reasonable FA offer (he bid up his value after tackling Curtis Martin for a safety Sunday) or its time to say goodbye to Sam Adams (who seems to have another year left in my book). Edwards has developed into an outstanding back-up and no one beyond the coaches knows about Anderson yet, but if Phat Pat goes then Bannan will not flip. In fact I think the idea of discussing a Bannan move next year is probably designed more as a leverage item in PW negotiations than a definite idea for the team. So this is one voice that even after a wnderful performance by Bannan opposes the idea of flipping him this year and probably next though we will see what reality makes us do.
Tom Posted November 9, 2004 Posted November 9, 2004 So this is one voice that even after a wnderful performance by Bannan opposes the idea of flipping him this year and probably next though we will see what reality makes us do. Wow..... It must be too early for me. All those words are bouncing around in my head
Fake-Fat Sunny Posted November 9, 2004 Posted November 9, 2004 Wow..... It must be too early for me. All those words are bouncing around in my head 109105[/snapback] You're right medication made this a sleepless night for me and it made me forget to go to the Cliffnotes for a long diatribe. Cliffnotes begin: Hi Cliffnotes end
CoachChuckDickerson Posted November 9, 2004 Posted November 9, 2004 I met Bannan at the Bills bar here in San Francisco last year. Big guy, really cool. We had a drink of Crown (his call). Said he really like playing in Buffalo. Hope this works out for him. Shows some serious versatility. 108606[/snapback]
TigerJ Posted November 9, 2004 Posted November 9, 2004 I did not dismiss the idea. I think he needs an off seasonand training campbefore he can be full time on the Oline, butI like that kind of out-of-the-box thinking. It's easier to find a backup DT than a starting guard. He never would be anything more than a backup at DT on a decent line.
stevewin Posted November 9, 2004 Posted November 9, 2004 My interpretation of that wasn’t that Bannon was going to switch over and become an offensive lineman, but that the packages he is involved in are a permanent part of the offense. 108569[/snapback] I agree - as has been posted there is a huge difference between Bannen going in as an OL and having a very specific run blocking assignment for a very specific play or limited set of plays vs. having to learn all the blocking schemes and the entire playbook PLUS be able to pass block. Simply not going to happen this year - though that is not to say it is not in the long term plan. On a related note, I'm wondering if they are planning on doing some twists on the Jumbo package where instead of running the same play when it is in there, to mix it up with a play action or even do it at other points in the game when it is not red zone or even not obvious short yardage.
seq004 Posted November 9, 2004 Author Posted November 9, 2004 I remember being one of those who said that the idea of moving Bannan to the offense this year was a bad idea so I'm not sure if I am one of those you considered those comments as blasting you. Well, here goes again because even despite the continued winderfuk success with the Jumbo Package in the red zone, I think going to Bannan as a full time offensive player this year would be a bad idea which: 1. would involve a huge distraction which is unlikely to pay many benefits to the team this year. 2. the distraction would be from a much better idea for improving LG play as we forced by the Sullivan and Pacillo failures to reach down for the unlikely possibility that a UDFA Ravens PS player would make the full jump to quality NFL stsrting LG for the Bills. The idea of moving Tucker from back-up center where he is at least a season OL player who is trained to understand all the OL positions simply hands down makes far more sense than expecting/demanding a defensive player to learn the whole playbook and master the position in 8 games. I'd rather JMac worry about dealing with the impacts of the potential loss of a starter like MW than spend his time power-schooling Bannan who obviously has his hands full learning the limited redzone playbook. 3, Even in terms of the back-up position, while I am not surprised at all that Leonard Smith could not make the jump from UDFA/PS player for another squad to adequate full time starter for the Bills, I think pegging him as a back-up makes far more sense. Clearly he was unproductive as a rezone LG, but he actually turned in a fair to middlin performance taking on the virtually impossible jump he was making from his duty last year to the demands of being a starter. He was the starter in a sack-free game earlier this season and the starter for WMs first 100 yard game. Bannan replaced him in the Jumbo Package last week, but it was Smith who did the bulk of the LG work in another sack free game in which WM went over 100 yards. The idea of having JMac work to power train him and him work to make a huge transition in a short time to merely sit on the bench seems like a misallocation of time. 4. I even think the days and use of the Jumbo Package may be limited. The great redzone success of this group has had the unfortunate side effect that there is now tape showing just about everything they do and any new surprises which has been part of that success will need to be developed. You can see that it is hitting the limits of its learning as it actually cost us a shot at 4 points Sunday as the OC sent in two play calls on the same play, but the Jumbo personnel was not trained in the second play. When the Jumbo failed to lead the way into the endzone on the first try, Bledsoe considered overiding the mismatch by getting the proper personnel in but there was not time with no TOs and a running clock. Some whine that Jim Kelly would have simply run a play and scored with a frelance run or pass but this dream ignores the fact that this is not your Mom'd NFL and our oversystematized playbook does not allow for having much chance for success with throwing even a quick pass the blockers have never run before (particularly when a sack losing yardage intio a wind which already cost the Jets a chip shot FG) or audibling to one of the limited number of run plays the Jumbo knows when failing to reach the endzone again might allow the clock to run out costing the Bills a full seven. Making the swich next year might be a possibility and deserves the discussion that MM says that they are giving it. However, this is is a discussion which quickly ends if PW does not take a reasonable FA offer (he bid up his value after tackling Curtis Martin for a safety Sunday) or its time to say goodbye to Sam Adams (who seems to have another year left in my book). Edwards has developed into an outstanding back-up and no one beyond the coaches knows about Anderson yet, but if Phat Pat goes then Bannan will not flip. In fact I think the idea of discussing a Bannan move next year is probably designed more as a leverage item in PW negotiations than a definite idea for the team. So this is one voice that even after a wnderful performance by Bannan opposes the idea of flipping him this year and probably next though we will see what reality makes us do. 109103[/snapback] Wow, apparently MM disagreed. I said it before and I'll say it again. Just because other teams are now aware that we are using Bannan at LG doesn't mean they can stop him from blowing open holes.
jarthur31 Posted November 9, 2004 Posted November 9, 2004 I was blasted last week for having the nerve to say why not make Bannan become an offensive player if he's not playing defense and you would have thought I was trying to clear OJ of double murder. For those out there and you know who you are bite me! 108518[/snapback] Don't take offense. A lot of posters here are really clueless about football and think they know it all. Most are very intelligent and don't bite you in the ass for posting something a little non conventional. Just take it in stride man. The smart ones are humble while the clueless are the most arrogant.
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