ans4e64 Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 Well, that would have been a better reply. But the problem is that Wood and Levitre are strictly interior guys, and if Butler struggles at RT, the Bills would want to move him inside, back to RG. That would leave 2 interior positions for the rookies. And since the Bills love Hangman and he's a proven veteran, they're not going to start a rookie over him (at least not this year) at center. So that leaves just LG. And since Levitre is being groomed for that position and Wood is being groomed at RG, moving Wood to a new position wouldn't make the most sense. That's not to say they wouldn't consider it and that it wouldn't work. First of all, Hangman is not a proven veteran. Second, if Butler goes back to RG, Wood will no longer need to be "groomed" for the RG position, since we already have a pretty good one, and young one, there. Unless you want to have our 1st roud pick sitting on the bench for the next 5+ years, which makes no sense to me. If Butler moves to RG, Wood will be moved somewhere else. If Hangartner proves to be good, Wood can take over for Levitre at LG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 They also didn't adjust their draft board when it became clear that signing Peters was not something they'd do. Link please. Just because we didn't draft a LT doesn't mean that we didn't adjust our draft board. Maybe they take Oher at 28 if he's there. Perhaps we had higher rated players available, or weren't as high on certain prospects. Or perhaps they are high on someone like D. Bell and are planning on having Walker man the LT spot for a season until Bell is ready to take over. Of course, that wouldn't fit in your little "everything the Bills FO does is wrong" crusade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VOR Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 First of all, Hangman is not a proven veteran. Second, if Butler goes back to RG, Wood will no longer need to be "groomed" for the RG position, since we already have a pretty good one, and young one, there. Unless you want to have our 1st roud pick sitting on the bench for the next 5+ years, which makes no sense to me. If Butler moves to RG, Wood will be moved somewhere else. If Hangartner proves to be good, Wood can take over for Levitre at LG. Hangman is a proven veteran. And certainly more proven than a rookie. And I was going by the premise that Butler proves to be unable to handle RT during the season, which is too far along to move Wood to LG. It wouldn't be ideal, to be sure, to have a 1st rounder sit on the bench, but neither is having Butler fail at RT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ans4e64 Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 Hangman is a proven veteran. And certainly more proven than a rookie. And I was going by the premise that Butler proves to be unable to handle RT during the season, which is too far along to move Wood to LG. It wouldn't be ideal, to be sure, to have a 1st rounder sit on the bench, but neither is having Butler fail at RT. Hopefully they'll know sooner rather than later about Butler. The question with him is the speed rush. It shouldn't take longer than one practice to see whether or not he can hold his own (although we don't exactly have the quality rushers we're going to face during the season). I think he's either got the feet or he doesn't, and hopefully, they'll find out pretty soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VOR Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 Hopefully they'll know sooner rather than later about Butler. The question with him is the speed rush. It shouldn't take longer than one practice to see whether or not he can hold his own (although we don't exactly have the quality rushers we're going to face during the season). I think he's either got the feet or he doesn't, and hopefully, they'll find out pretty soon. I agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 Link please. Just because we didn't draft a LT doesn't mean that we didn't adjust our draft board. Maybe they take Oher at 28 if he's there. Perhaps we had higher rated players available, or weren't as high on certain prospects. Or perhaps they are high on someone like D. Bell and are planning on having Walker man the LT spot for a season until Bell is ready to take over. Of course, that wouldn't fit in your little "everything the Bills FO does is wrong" crusade. Bills Draft board BTW, your praise for this highly successful front office is lovely. I can't understand it, but it is admirable. The plan to make Walker a LT after 8 seasons in the league never having played the position is nice. I don't think it'll work, but hey, they remained true to their draft board. When this team makes the playoffs in a division with Parcells, Belichick, and the Jets' money, I'll stop "crusading." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flbillsfan#1 Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 Bills Draft board BTW, your praise for this highly successful front office is lovely. I can't understand it, but it is admirable. The plan to make Walker a LT after 8 seasons in the league never having played the position is nice. I don't think it'll work, but hey, they remained true to their draft board. When this team makes the playoffs in a division with Parcells, Belichick, and the Jets' money, I'll stop "crusading." Mike Mayock a very credible analyst, projected the Bills to take Oher if he was there at 28. He wasn't, so the Bills selected the best OL player available to them, Eric Wood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Trooth Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 As for Butler, playing RT in the ACC is a far cry from lining up in the NFL. This does not qualify him for the position in the pros, nor is it certain he'll even be the starter. Uh, dude... does playing RT in the ACC plus three years playing RG in the pros qualify him? You think the coaches have made a huge mistake? No one know's how he will pan out until he has a few games under his belt. But to suggest his service at RT at ACC doesn't qualify him to play RT in the NFL without even giving consideration to his yeoman work at RG is bull sh--. Hell, even Jerry Ostroski did a somewhat decent job at RT after playing RG... and he had no where close to the athletic ability that Butler has. Butler was a high school hoop star and has quick feet for his size. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ans4e64 Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 Uh, dude... does playing RT in the ACC plus three years playing RG in the pros qualify him? You think the coaches have made a huge mistake? No one know's how he will pan out until he has a few games under his belt. But to suggest his service at RT at ACC doesn't qualify him to play RT in the NFL without even giving consideration to his yeoman work at RG is bull sh--. Hell, even Jerry Ostroski did a somewhat decent job at RT after playing RG... and he had no where close to the athletic ability that Butler has. Butler was a high school hoop star and has quick feet for his size. Are you kidding me? Here is his scouting report when we drafted him, the reason he had to move into guard: SUMMARY Butler was a tough player to evaluate, because despite being stiff and lacking quick feet, he has good balance and can stay on his feet and maintain blocks out in space much better than most limited athletes. He has the height and long arms teams like, and when he becomes more consistent punching the defense end, he will be a good pass protector in the NFL. He will always have trouble handling the explosive speed rusher, but better hand use will help him improve in all other areas. He is an effective positional run blocker, who can seal his man off from the play along the line of scrimmage, and can get through to block effectively on the second level. Overall, even though he is not a good athlete, he will remind folks of the Eagles' Jon Runyan on film. He really looks and plays a lot like Runyan did when he came out of Michigan. Butler is going to enter the NFL expected to be a backup by most, but by his second or third season, he will become a solid starting tackle who does a solid job, but is not dominant. His combination of height, long arms, toughness, competitiveness and efficiency gives him the best chance at becoming a starting NFL right tackle. STRONG POINTS Butler is a tall tackle, with the long arms to be very effective in pass protection when he punches the defensive end and gets arm-extension. He can seal the end inside on outside runs, and can drive a defender down the line of scrimmage on down/side blocks. He is surprisingly quick getting through the line of scrimmage to the second level, seal blocks the linebacker, and can stay on and maintain his blocks in space better than expected. He can make the mini-pull around the tight end to chip block the force linebacker out of the play. WEAKNESSES Butler is a limited athlete, who lacks the foot quickness to slide out fast enough to protect the edge from explosive speed rushers. Additionally, he struggles to change directions and slide back inside quick enough to cut off the quick inside pass-rush move. He is stiff in the hips, and cannot bend his knees to run block with leverage, which hinders his ability to get movement on run blocks. He needs to greatly improve his footwork. He has a bad habit of picking up his left foot and putting it back down in the exact same spot right after the snap, and this false step slows him down to where he cannot get out to protect the corner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flbillsfan#1 Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 Are you kidding me? Here is his scouting report when we drafted him, the reason he had to move into guard: Did you read the part that said ...............but by his 2nd or 3rd season he will become a SOLID STARTING TACKLE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merlin Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 ... Walker at LT is what scares the crap out of me. He might be OK on running plays, but I can't see how he will hold up against speed rushers. Actually, if you believe the OL coach, it's just the opposite. In a recent interview, Sean Kuegler (sp?) said Walker is a very good pass blocker, but needs some work in the running game. GO BILLS! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vincec Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 No, because when trying to put the best 5 guys on the field, having Kirk Chambers, Jeff Hangartner, and Andy Levitre starting over Eric Wood doesn't make sense. How do you know? Neither one of them has played a down in the NFL or even preseason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 Uh, dude... does playing RT in the ACC plus three years playing RG in the pros qualify him? You think the coaches have made a huge mistake? No one know's how he will pan out until he has a few games under his belt. But to suggest his service at RT at ACC doesn't qualify him to play RT in the NFL without even giving consideration to his yeoman work at RG is bull sh--. Hell, even Jerry Ostroski did a somewhat decent job at RT after playing RG... and he had no where close to the athletic ability that Butler has. Butler was a high school hoop star and has quick feet for his size. Most college teams play the 4-3 defense where the RT is going to match up with the LDE. While Virginia is a 3-4 defense, I'm not convinced that playing at the college level means a seamless transition to the NFL for Butler. It's been three years, and those DE's in the college game aren't the same caliber. Furthermore, he'll find himself handling those rush OLB's from NYJ, NE, and MIA six times next season. That in an of itself could pose matchup problems. I've just never heard a college OT move to OG in the pros and then become an OT again. Butler's also been banged up a little each season. I'm not saying he can't play guard, but it's the foot speed I'm most concerned about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DIE HARD 1967 Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 If Walker starts and plays well at LT he will most certainly be in for an increase in pay. I learned that from Jason Peters Bet you Walker has already discussed this with his agent, lets hope Walker show up for training camp next year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lori Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 I've just never heard a college OT move to OG in the pros and then become an OT again. Probably already been mentioned, but Jon Ogden played LG in his rookie year with the Ravens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ans4e64 Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 Did you read the part that said ...............but by his 2nd or 3rd season he will become a SOLID STARTING TACKLE Not the point of my post. But don't let reading comprehension stop you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ans4e64 Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 How do you know? Neither one of them has played a down in the NFL or even preseason. Oh, Jesus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flbillsfan#1 Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 Not the point of my post. But don't let reading comprehension stop you. I KNOW it wasn't the point in your post. You CHERRY PICKED the part you wanted to in order to refute another poster while IGNORING the FACT that the scouting report said he would be a solid STARTING Tackle by his 2nd or 3rd year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 Bills Draft board BTW, your praise for this highly successful front office is lovely. I can't understand it, but it is admirable. The plan to make Walker a LT after 8 seasons in the league never having played the position is nice. I don't think it'll work, but hey, they remained true to their draft board. When this team makes the playoffs in a division with Parcells, Belichick, and the Jets' money, I'll stop "crusading." Got it. So we should have reached for an OT at #11, or reached at #28 for an OT. I guess you would have then had more ammo to trash the FO. Regardless of the situation, its a win-win for you, because you can trash the front office for something. Just because you don't see the plan doesn't mean the FO doesn't have one. Again, what if the plan is to move Langston to LT for a season until Bell gets ready? If one of your deemed "good" teams made this same move, you'd be praising them for "having a future plan and not having to reach in the draft to fill a need." But since its the Bills, that automatically means the move is bad and sucks, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ans4e64 Posted July 15, 2009 Share Posted July 15, 2009 I KNOW it wasn't the point in your post. You CHERRY PICKED the part you wanted to in order to refute another poster while IGNORING the FACT that the scouting report said he would be a solid STARTING Tackle by his 2nd or 3rd year. Holy crap. There really needs to be a screening process on this site to weed out the mentally challenged people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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