Steely Dan Posted June 30, 2009 Posted June 30, 2009 If we believe the Jauron apologists, all the problems and mistakes were made by the players. Some of the same problems seemed to occur on a regular basis (i.e. play execution). Yet, the same players continued to play and start. How were the players held accountable for their screw ups? A stern talking? No gold stars? If real accountability existed, I didn't recognize it, and it surely didn't seem to make a difference. I had no idea that you were privy to team meetings. Sorry.
Cynical Posted June 30, 2009 Posted June 30, 2009 I have seen them play with what appeared to be intensity, and I have seen them play otherwise. For the most part, I think their effort is better than their record. Most of the time I see them playing "soft" I attribute it to a very passive scheme. But none of us really know how "hard" they are playing. Only they know. Don't get me wrong, I am not saying they do not try their "best". They do. However, if their "best" comes up short, the attitude seems to be "so what". They tried their hardest, they wish they could have done better, and obviously they had hoped it would have led to a win, but in the end, it didn't. As Kelly said, he would walk into that locker room on a Monday, and he could not tell if the team had won or lost based on the mood in the locker room. That's not a talent problem. That's a "I could not give a rat's azz" problem.
C.Biscuit97 Posted June 30, 2009 Posted June 30, 2009 Don't get me wrong, I am not saying they do not try their "best". They do. However, if their "best" comes up short, the attitude seems to be "so what". They tried their hardest, they wish they could have done better, and obviously they had hoped it would have led to a win, but in the end, it didn't. As Kelly said, he would walk into that locker room on a Monday, and he could not tell if the team had won or lost based on the mood in the locker room. That's not a talent problem. That's a "I could not give a rat's azz" problem. I love Kelly but he is hardly the voice of reason about being a professional. If those guys could have laid off the booze and other stuff for a week, there may be a championship in Buffalo. I'll admit that this team does seem to have too many nice guys. However in the last couple of years, we have brought in players to change that mentality: Stroud, Mitchell, TO, Wood. But to answer the original question, please see the Denver game, 5 out of the first 6 games, the Redskins and Cowboys games from last year.
The Big Cat Posted June 30, 2009 Posted June 30, 2009 Don't get me wrong, I am not saying they do not try their "best". They do. However, if their "best" comes up short, the attitude seems to be "so what". They tried their hardest, they wish they could have done better, and obviously they had hoped it would have led to a win, but in the end, it didn't. As Kelly said, he would walk into that locker room on a Monday, and he could not tell if the team had won or lost based on the mood in the locker room. That's not a talent problem. That's a "I could not give a rat's azz" problem. Wow, big surprise. Look who came storming into another anti-Jauron thread. So, if I'm getting this right, nobody's held responsible for their mistakes because Jim Kelly doesn't think they dwell in the past with enough passion?
The Big Cat Posted June 30, 2009 Posted June 30, 2009 I love Kelly but he is hardly the voice of reason about being a professional. If those guys could have laid off the booze and other stuff for a week, there may would be a championship in Buffalo. I'll admit that this team does seem to have too many nice guys. However in the last couple of years, we have brought in players to change that mentality: Stroud, Mitchell, TO, Wood, and McKelvin. But to answer the original question, please see the Denver game, 5 out of the first 6 games, the Redskins and Cowboys games from last year.
Cynical Posted June 30, 2009 Posted June 30, 2009 I love Kelly but he is hardly the voice of reason about being a professional. If those guys could have laid off the booze and other stuff for a week, there may be a championship in Buffalo. This is relevant to the discussion in what way? Should I include Thurman Thomas as one of "those guys" because he made a similar comment about the team last year? What's with the attack on his character when you yourself, in the next paragraph, admit there is a problem? I'll admit that this team does seem to have too many nice guys. However in the last couple of years, we have brought in players to change that mentality: Stroud, Mitchell, TO, Wood. Stroud and Mitchell joined the team last year, and the change seemed minimal at best (from an accountability stand point). Wood is a rookie. I do not care how "nasty" (there's an overused word) he is, expecting a rookie to come in and automatically assume a leadership role is not a sign of a "good thing". That practically admits there is a huge leadership void in the locker room. TO is the best shot at leadership. Whether he does it in private or in public, he will call players and/or coaches out.
crazyDingo Posted June 30, 2009 Posted June 30, 2009 Ahaha! Fricken Google: "Did you mean: dick jauron universally loved " IN YOUR FACE, Bing!
The Big Cat Posted June 30, 2009 Posted June 30, 2009 This is relevant to the discussion in what way? Should I include Thurman Thomas as one of "those guys" because he made a similar comment about the team last year? What's with the attack on his character when you yourself, in the next paragraph, admit there is a problem? Stroud and Mitchell joined the team last year, and the change seemed minimal at best (from an accountability stand point). Wood is a rookie. I do not care how "nasty" (there's an overused word) he is, expecting a rookie to come in and automatically assume a leadership role is not a sign of a "good thing". That practically admits there is a huge leadership void in the locker room. TO is the best shot at leadership. Whether he does it in private or in public, he will call players and/or coaches out. YOu keep talking about accountability like it's some sort of metric. Stroud and Mitchell did nothing? Our defense didn't go from 31 to 14?
mrags Posted June 30, 2009 Posted June 30, 2009 I love Kelly but he is hardly the voice of reason about being a professional. If those guys could have laid off the booze and other stuff for a week, there may be a championship in Buffalo. True story!!! Even Cornelius Bennett provided this same information in an interview before he went to the Super Bowl as a Falcon. I thank the team for all of those years regardless of winning or not, but they werent exactly good ole church going boys at the time. At the same time Im not sure if this hasnt been the entire change around the NFL. It seems like the youth of the NFL is starting to care less and less about the game and more about their money, stats, endorsements. And with the Big Money NFL it is allowed. You have owners like Daniel Snyder and Jerry Jones giving away the keys to their franchises to win Super Bowls. Thats great when your talking about great players, but when average players like Bernard Berrian are making over $40M there are issues. This ties into any Peters thread you read on this board or anywhere else. The guy had nothing. He wouldnt have ever gotten a shot if it wasnt for the Bills and he sits out on the only team that believed in him. If the Bills hadnt picked him up do you really think he would be in the league now? Unfortunately this may all be part of the demise of the NFL. Your average every day fan is getting tossed out on their asses. They cant afford to go to games anymore in the big market stadiums like Wash, Dal, NYJ, NYG because of seat liscenses. On top of that when we watch at home we have to hear complaints from greedy players wanting raises on contracts that they have previously signed. I understand the whole "NFL teams dont have to honor their contracts why should the players" arguement, but when the player is already making 30 million and wants 60 that is just rediculous. These big time players now days will make more in a year than most of us will make in a lifetime. The UFL is actually coming in at a perfect time. With a capless year and more and more whinning 300lb babies complaining about money the UFL might be a nice change of pace for true football fans to watch games with the true athletes. The ones that love the game and would play for next to nothing just to continue to play. Im dont with my rant now that I've gotten completely off topic. Im just saying that Jim is right, unfortunately if you asked any other player in Jims era what they thought of the game now, they would most likely say the same thing. No Heart!!!
DrFishfinder Posted June 30, 2009 Author Posted June 30, 2009 Can you provide specific proof of a subjective statement like that about any team or coach? It seems obvious to me, but I don't expect it to be proven, either as a positive or a negative. It's like asking us to prove that ice cream is good. Well....if someone makes that statement, then they ought to some sort of basis for that. I'm open to feedback.
Peter Griffin Posted June 30, 2009 Posted June 30, 2009 I've read a number of posts that contain words to the effect of, "The players play hard for Dick Jauron". Can those of you who believe that provide specific proof or examples to back that up? I would be interested to see some tangible information. There are plenty of players who've played hard for Jauron over the years: Jabari Greer Anthony Hargrove Jim Leonard The list goes on and on............
TheChimp Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 There are plenty of players who've played hard for Jauron over the years: Jabari Greer Anthony Hargrove Jim Leonard The list goes on and on............ Well said.
todd Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 Maybe you should google Jeff Garcia's wife....... Yeah, I heard he's cute.
Mr. WEO Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 And you know this, how? Dick Jauron and "TurK" Schonert are still coaching the Bills. Need any more proof?
Kultarr Posted July 2, 2009 Posted July 2, 2009 I'll admit that this team does seem to have too many nice guys. However in the last couple of years, we have brought in players to change that mentality: Stroud, Mitchell, TO, Wood. Did you really mention Terrell Owens in a list of players that the Bills brought in to improve team chemistry? BTW, the names on your list do very little to nothing to support your point, IMHO.
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