toddgurley Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 Got this from my buddy Tijo (screen name) who is a Bills fan and I just wanted to know your take on it. Considering we have some "pass rush issues" to say the least, it could be an option- Cut coming in Denver? "Some players take to a new defensive scheme with ease while others struggle. As the Denver Broncos transition to a 3-4 scheme for the 2009 season, one player who has not been able to find a niche is the team's first round pick from 2007, Jarvis Moss. Moss is a natural defensive end in a 4-3 scheme, but has been working at outside linebacker this offseason. According to Scout.com, he'll need to make a solid impression during training camp or he could face being cut". "With the uncertaincy of Schobel's foot problem and the lack of production from Kelsay and Denney and he can be a very good 4-3 DE. We also have no Idea what we will get out of Ellis yet. Also with Moss we could make Maybin a SLB over Ellison very easily". According to TIJO My Take Moss is 6'6 265lbs age 24 college:Florida Picked in 1st rd 17th overall in the 2007 draft Pre-draft measureables Ht Wt 40-yard dash Vert Broad jump Bench Press 6-6½ 250 lb 4.70 30½ in. 10'00" 16 Last Years Stats (2008): 12 games 12 tackles 2.5 sacks 2007 stats: played in 6 games 12 tackles 1.0 sacks before breaking shin Career: 24 Tackles 3.5 Sacks So he has a good solid frame and was a beast in college (I know it does'nt mean anything at pro level) Remember when he blocked a PAT vs South Carolina to keep the score 16-10 SC, and then later in the 4th he blocked the game winning FG attempt and Florida won 17-16 mostly because of Moss. It sounds like he is being cut because of the scheme not lack of talent, although who really knows. Maybe a change of scenery is what he needs, and you can never have too many solid back ups. and I have read that the Bills will use Maybin at outside LB on 3rd down pass rush situations
The Dean Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 There was a rumor the Broncos were shopping Moss a while ago, and it was discussed here. If they can pick him up for nothing (in trade) maybe they bring him in for a look-see. I'd be for it.
VJ91 Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 ...Moss is 6'6 265lbs age 24 college: Florida Picked in 1st rd 17th overall in the 2007 draft... In the words of the immortal Vince Lombardi, "What the hell is goin' on out there.".....in Denver?? They are about to give up on the 17th overall pick in the '07 draft because of their defensive "scheme"?? Fine by me. I just hope the Bills can get him into OBD for a look before another team signs him up!
toddgurley Posted June 29, 2009 Author Posted June 29, 2009 There was a rumor the Broncos were shopping Moss a while ago, and it was discussed here. If they can pick him up for nothing (in trade) maybe they bring him in for a look-see. I'd be for it. ok, i did a jarvis moss search on this site to try and make sure this was not posted already. So sorry if we talked about trading for him, but in this case, he would be cut. so we could get him for nothing (other than the contract he would sign)
ans4e64 Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 I highly doubt the Broncos would cut a 1st round pick outright after just two seasons. If they REALLY wanted to get rid of him that bad, I'm sure they could get at least something decent back in a trade. How can you only give a few months to a 1st round pick to adjust to a defense he's never played before cutting him? That is ridiculous.
San Jose Bills Fan Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 I highly doubt the Broncos would cut a 1st round pick outright after just two seasons. If they REALLY wanted to get rid of him that bad, I'm sure they could get at least something decent back in a trade. How can you only give a few months to a 1st round pick to adjust to a defense he's never played before cutting him? That is ridiculous. Once again, the report was that Denver shopped him for a 7th round pick and there were no takers. This was reported by Alex Marvez of FOXSports.com.
Fingon Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 The Bills need to go to a 3-4 Defense already. That would be very stupid.
Fingon Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 Why? Lets see: 1. None of our personnel fit the 3-4 defense 2. Our defense is already good, and getting better 3. It's becoming harder and harder to find the talent to run a 3-4 defense. 4. There are less competitors for the top 4-3 talent.
toddgurley Posted June 29, 2009 Author Posted June 29, 2009 Why? well we lack the personal currently. We can barely find enough "good" lbs to fit the 4-3-scheme, let alone the 3-4. Possible in the future, but only if we have the players which we dont currently
manbeast Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 Got this from my buddy Tijo (screen name) who is a Bills fan and I just wanted to know your take on it. Considering we have some "pass rush issues" to say the least, it could be an option- Cut coming in Denver? "Some players take to a new defensive scheme with ease while others struggle. As the Denver Broncos transition to a 3-4 scheme for the 2009 season, one player who has not been able to find a niche is the team's first round pick from 2007, Jarvis Moss. Moss is a natural defensive end in a 4-3 scheme, but has been working at outside linebacker this offseason. According to Scout.com, he'll need to make a solid impression during training camp or he could face being cut". "With the uncertaincy of Schobel's foot problem and the lack of production from Kelsay and Denney and he can be a very good 4-3 DE. We also have no Idea what we will get out of Ellis yet. Also with Moss we could make Maybin a SLB over Ellison very easily". According to TIJO My Take Moss is 6'6 265lbs age 24 college:Florida Picked in 1st rd 17th overall in the 2007 draft Pre-draft measureables Ht Wt 40-yard dash Vert Broad jump Bench Press 6-6½ 250 lb 4.70 30½ in. 10'00" 16 Last Years Stats (2008): 12 games 12 tackles 2.5 sacks 2007 stats: played in 6 games 12 tackles 1.0 sacks before breaking shin Career: 24 Tackles 3.5 Sacks So he has a good solid frame and was a beast in college (I know it does'nt mean anything at pro level) Remember when he blocked a PAT vs South Carolina to keep the score 16-10 SC, and then later in the 4th he blocked the game winning FG attempt and Florida won 17-16 mostly because of Moss. It sounds like he is being cut because of the scheme not lack of talent, although who really knows. Maybe a change of scenery is what he needs, and you can never have too many solid back ups. and I have read that the Bills will use Maybin at outside LB on 3rd down pass rush situations Our linebackers are not supposed to way 250 pounds not in our scheme when will you people figure this out
manbeast Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 I highly doubt the Broncos would cut a 1st round pick outright after just two seasons. If they REALLY wanted to get rid of him that bad, I'm sure they could get at least something decent back in a trade. How can you only give a few months to a 1st round pick to adjust to a defense he's never played before cutting him? That is ridiculous. How could you trade Jay Cutler Enough said
ans4e64 Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 Lets see: 1. None of our personnel fit the 3-4 defense 2. Our defense is already good, and getting better 3. It's becoming harder and harder to find the talent to run a 3-4 defense. 4. There are less competitors for the top 4-3 talent. well we lack the personal currently. We can barely find enough "good" lbs to fit the 4-3-scheme, let alone the 3-4. Possible in the future, but only if we have the players which we dont currently Why not OLB - Maybin, ILB Posluszny, ILB Kawika Mitchell, OLB Aaron Schobel?
Fingon Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 Why not OLB - Maybin, ILB Posluszny, ILB Kawika Mitchell, OLB Aaron Schobel? Or, you know, we could stick with the alignment that is already good. Why would we reinvent a defense that stands a good shot of being top 10?
ans4e64 Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 Or, you know, we could stick with the alignment that is already good. Why would we reinvent a defense that stands a good shot of being top 10? I'm not saying I think we should switch, just pointing out that we may have more of the personnel to do so than you think.
Fingon Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 I'm not saying I think we should switch, just pointing out that we may have more of the personnel to do so than you think. I don't believe any of those guys have played in a 3-4 before. No one has any idea how they would transition. Not to mention Stroud couldn't play NT, and Williams and Johnson would have to play DE.
ans4e64 Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 I don't believe any of those guys have played in a 3-4 before. No one has any idea how they would transition. Not to mention Stroud couldn't play NT, and Williams and Johnson would have to play DE. Neither has anyone from the Packers defense, the Chiefs defense, or any other defense that is switching over for the first time. You gotta start somewhere.
John from Riverside Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 Lets see: 1. None of our personnel fit the 3-4 defense 2. Our defense is already good, and getting better 3. It's becoming harder and harder to find the talent to run a 3-4 defense. 4. There are less competitors for the top 4-3 talent. I could actually see that happening if the team falls on its face this year and there is a coaching staff overall..... BUT At this point Fingon is right.....it wouldn't make sense to change a scheme when our players are being incorporated into the 4-3 cover 2 Interesting of note regarding our pick Bird.......there was an analysis of him earlier last year that he would be PERFECT in a cover 2 defense
billsfan89 Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 GET THIS GUY. I rarely look at big name guys and say bring them in. My typical thought process when a big name is released is get him, than I take a look at why he was released and if he is that much better than what the Bills already have. Usually I back off the big names because in actuality they are not really much of an upgrade over what we have. But this guy is a young guy with potential who is being released by a team who is overly committed to a system they just aren't ready to implement effectively. I wouldn't bring him in as a starter by any means. But we are lacking depth at defensive end (I mean quality depth, Ryan Denny and Chris Ellis don't inspire confidence off the bench). Maybin is good depth but he can't be counted on to step in full time. If we added Moss I think that he can be a answer long term for replacing Schobel and give us depth in the short term. Its a great move give Denver a 7th round choice and bring this guy in. A young player with a lot of potential who was released or being traded for no real reason. Another thought on Denver is that they are acting like the Jets when they brought in Mangini and were force feeding a 3-4 defense on a team that was built to run the 4-3. The Jets were a team that had small Middle linebackers and no big nose tackles as well as small defensive ends. Yet they wanted to be a 3-4 team at any cost. The Broncos are doing a half assed job of converting to a 3-4. They had 3 picks in the first two rounds and only spent one of those on the front seven.
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