SCOTUS Rules in Favor of New Haven Firefighters

[BillsNYC]

http://www.forbes.com/2009/06/29/new-haven...l-equality.html

 

I actually like this article, he's right. If minorities are failing the test, then you invest in teaching them to pass the test. You don't just elevate them over more qualified non-minorities.

 

Big win for the Constitution today, and a big loss for our future new Justice.

[KD in CA]

Obviously the correct ruling, but IMO the highlight of the article, and the thing that will continue to be ignored, is this:

 

It also brought the nation closer to an important day of reckoning. When blacks and Hispanics flunk examinations, the cause is less likely to be discrimination than the appalling educational conditions to which most economically disadvantaged black and Hispanic children are consigned. "Affirmative action" programs that leap-frog less-qualified minorities over more-qualified non-minorities sweep those systemic problems under the carpet. As such, race-based affirmative action programs perpetuate fraud upon the very groups they are designed to help. The fact that few minorities passed the examination should be a call for remedial action--not to throw out the test but to equip more minorities to pass it.

 

US cities will continue to spend more per pupil on education than almost anywhere in the world and still produce generations of functional illiterates (most of them minorities) and yet our leaders will refuse to call those responsible onto the carpet.

[BillsNYC]

Obviously the correct ruling, but IMO the highlight of the article, and the thing that will continue to be ignored, is this:

 

 

 

US cities will continue to spend more per pupil on education than almost anywhere in the world and still produce generations of functional illiterates (most of them minorities) and yet our leaders will refuse to call those responsible onto the carpet.

 

My nephew is 18, white, and attended public schools in a rough part of Staten Island. I read a letter he recently wrote and thought it was written by a 6 year old, and he's a high school graduate who had an 80 average his senior year!

[/dev/null]

Obviously the correct ruling, but IMO the highlight of the article, and the thing that will continue to be ignored, is this:

 

 

 

US cities will continue to spend more per pupil on education than almost anywhere in the world and still produce generations of functional illiterates (most of them minorities) and yet our leaders will refuse to call those responsible onto the carpet.

 

There was a time when reading wasn't just for f_gs. And neither was writing. People wrote books and movies. Movies with stories, that made you care about whose ass it was...and why it was farting.

[Ramius]

Obviously the correct ruling, but IMO the highlight of the article, and the thing that will continue to be ignored, is this:

 

 

 

US cities will continue to spend more per pupil on education than almost anywhere in the world and still produce generations of functional illiterates (most of them minorities) and yet our leaders will refuse to call those responsible onto the carpet.

 

Well said.

 

Sadly, American society has degraded to the point where if jr can't succeed (no matter what race, creed, religion), people expect the standards to lowered to jr's level of incompetence instead of making jr work harder to rise up to the minimums.

[Keukasmallies]

KD in CT, share with us who is responsible.... Is it parents, teachers, administrators, taxpayers, legislators, neighbors, TV producers, cigarette advertisers, video game manufacturers, students themselves, social workers, priests and other clerics, siblings....who is responsible?

[/dev/null]

KD in CT, share with us who is responsible.... Is it parents, teachers, administrators, taxpayers, legislators, neighbors, TV producers, cigarette advertisers, video game manufacturers, students themselves, social workers, priests and other clerics, siblings....who is responsible?

 

Not everybody gets a trophy

[finknottle]

KD in CT, share with us who is responsible.... Is it parents, teachers, administrators, taxpayers, legislators, neighbors, TV producers, cigarette advertisers, video game manufacturers, students themselves, social workers, priests and other clerics, siblings....who is responsible?

 

Didn't you get the memo? Bush.

[Chef Jim]

KD in CT, share with us who is responsible.... Is it parents, teachers, administrators, taxpayers, legislators, neighbors, TV producers, cigarette advertisers, video game manufacturers, students themselves, social workers, priests and other clerics, siblings....who is responsible?

 

The parents.

[Alaska Darin]

I love the fact that the court was split along political lines again. Nice work liberals - way to stick to your bankrupt principles.

[Chef Jim]

Can someone explain reverse discrimination to me?

 

I've never understood that phrase. It's discrimination either way.

[blzrul]

http://www.forbes.com/2009/06/29/new-haven...l-equality.html

 

I actually like this article, he's right. If minorities are failing the test, then you invest in teaching them to pass the test. You don't just elevate them over more qualified non-minorities.

 

Big win for the Constitution today, and a big loss for our future new Justice.

Absolutely. Back "in the day" when women in the fire service were rare, I prepared for the test a YEAR in advance through a special program the City put together with the local YMCA. It was a KILLER program to get us in the best physical shape possible. It was aimed at minorities, but there were white guys in the class too.

 

When the day came to take the test, a lot of the firemen administering it laughed when we came in but they weren't laughing when we left. I think they were in shock that this 5'1" woman could actually shoulder a length of hose, run up three stair landings, back down AND drag a 150 lb dummy 50 feet (while being timed). In full turnout gear, I might add.

[Alaska Darin]

Can someone explain reverse discrimination to me?

 

I've never understood that phrase. It's discrimination either way.

There is no such thing as "reverse discrimination". That is one that pisses me off to no end. It implies that only white people can discriminate. We actually had a discussion about it at one of those military social actions exercises and you wouldn't believe how many people subscribe to the concept.

[Alaska Darin]

Absolutely. Back "in the day" when women in the fire service were rare, I prepared for the test a YEAR in advance through a special program the City put together with the local YMCA. It was a KILLER program to get us in the best physical shape possible. It was aimed at minorities, but there were white guys in the class too.

 

When the day came to take the test, a lot of the firemen administering it laughed when we came in but they weren't laughing when we left. I think they were in shock that this 5'1" woman could actually shoulder a length of hose, run up three stair landings, back down AND drag a 150 lb dummy 50 feet (while being timed). In full turnout gear, I might add.

Do you think you could have stayed in that kind of condition for an entire career? I don't mean that accusingly, but stuff like that is a total lifestyle change and I think most people would have a hard time maintaining that level.

 

There was a woman Army Major who wanted to prove that women could make it in Special Forces back when I was in. She prepared for a long time and barely made the minimum requirement (men's minimum - there was no female requirement at the time). She wrote a lengthy article about why SF should remain a "men's only club". She underwent a complete attitude adjustment/eye opening lifestyle change in a matter of weeks.

[Chef Jim]

There is no such thing as "reverse discrimination". That is one that pisses me off to no end. It implies that only white people can discriminate. We actually had a discussion about it at one of those military social actions exercises and you wouldn't believe how many people subscribe to the concept.

 

I can understand how people would subscribe to that stupid line of thought but when a world class news organization uses it in one of its articles.........oh wait, never mind.

[ExiledInIllinois]

Well said.

 

Sadly, American society has degraded to the point where if jr can't succeed (no matter what race, creed, religion), people expect the standards to lowered to jr's level of incompetence instead of making jr work harder to rise up to the minimums.

 

Not just Jr. In general that is EVERYTHING about American society. It isn't cool to have standards. Do what you want, when you want, and how you want.

[Steely Dan]

Well said.

 

Sadly, American society has degraded to the point where if jr can't succeed (no matter what race, creed, religion), people expect the standards to lowered to jr's level of incompetence instead of making jr work harder to rise up to the minimums.

 

What he said!

 

KD in CT, share with us who is responsible.... Is it parents, teachers, administrators, taxpayers, legislators, neighbors, TV producers, cigarette advertisers, video game manufacturers, students themselves, social workers, priests and other clerics, siblings....who is responsible?

 

 

The parents.

 

What he said too!

 

When I was student teaching the kids had to take their report cards home and have the parents sign it. The parents could leave comments on the report card. More than a few came back with the comment; "Why aren't you making sure jr.'s getting his homework done?"

 

 

Absolutely. Back "in the day" when women in the fire service were rare, I prepared for the test a YEAR in advance through a special program the City put together with the local YMCA. It was a KILLER program to get us in the best physical shape possible. It was aimed at minorities, but there were white guys in the class too.

 

When the day came to take the test, a lot of the firemen administering it laughed when we came in but they weren't laughing when we left. I think they were in shock that this 5'1" woman could actually shoulder a length of hose, run up three stair landings, back down AND drag a 150 lb dummy 50 feet (while being timed). In full turnout gear, I might add.

 

You go girl!!!

[Keukasmallies]

As a high school principal, I used to marvel at the non-English speaking families that moved into the district then enjoyed one or more of their children succeeding as valedictorian, honor student, etc. three or four years later. Sure looked like parental influence to me....

[IDBillzFan]

Lowering standards accomplishes nothing.

I disagree. Lowering standards is the ultimate vote-getter. It accomplishes a lot...for the candidates.

[blzrul]

Do you think you could have stayed in that kind of condition for an entire career? I don't mean that accusingly, but stuff like that is a total lifestyle change and I think most people would have a hard time maintaining that level.

 

There was a woman Army Major who wanted to prove that women could make it in Special Forces back when I was in. She prepared for a long time and barely made the minimum requirement (men's minimum - there was no female requirement at the time). She wrote a lengthy article about why SF should remain a "men's only club". She underwent a complete attitude adjustment/eye opening lifestyle change in a matter of weeks.

I have no idea.

 

It's interesting that you focus on women and don't mentioned all those big-bellied MALE cops and, in may cases, firefighters that far outnumber the women.

 

But, not surprising.