The Poojer Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 no punishment was enough for this prick , but at least he got what was available 150 years for you, motherf***er
PromoTheRobot Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 I hope they send him to "Pound-You-In-The-A**" prison. But he'l probably be sent to some minimum security country club. PTR
BuffaloBill Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 you beat me to the post ..... what a story .. it will be the stuff of b-school case studies for years to come. It is hard to believe that the scheme could be so massive and have gone on for this long. I also find it amazing that when all is said and done his wife will still be left with $2.5MM while "poor" by her lofty standards - better than some investors who lost everything with Madoff.
stuckincincy Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 I hope they send him to "Pound-You-In-The-A**" prison. But he'l probably be sent to some minimum security country club. PTR Right. My town is dripping with with people that commit horrible...repeated assaults. Put their victims into a lifetime of disability and pain. They usually still roam the streets. After 20 or so arrests or so, they might spend a few days in the clink. Maybe. But they of course were victims themselves, according to liberals...never at fault. Prejudice, bad childhood, Republicans, drugs and alcohol, abusive parental figures, sexual dysfunction, addictive personality disorder, you name it.
DrDawkinstein Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 Right. My town is dripping with with people that commit horrible...repeated assaults. Put their victims into a lifetime of disability and pain. They usually still roam the streets. After 20 or so arrests or so, they might spend a few days in the clink. Maybe. But they of course were victims themselves, according to liberals...never at fault. Prejudice, bad childhood, Republicans, drugs and alcohol, abusive parental figures, sexual dysfunction, addictive personality disorder, you name it. was he a friend of yours?
Mark Vader Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 This is awesome news. Still, it does'nt take away all the pain and suffering this man inflicted on so many people, who will probably never get any of their money back.
Chef Jim Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 you beat me to the post ..... what a story .. it will be the stuff of b-school case studies for years to come. It is hard to believe that the scheme could be so massive and have gone on for this long. I also find it amazing that when all is said and done his wife will still be left with $2.5MM while "poor" by her lofty standards - better than some investors who lost everything with Madoff. One word: GREED. If you think about it it's very easy to believe. And I'm not talking about him. I'm talking about the people that fell for his scheme.
Buftex Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 Right. My town is dripping with with people that commit horrible...repeated assaults. Put their victims into a lifetime of disability and pain. They usually still roam the streets. After 20 or so arrests or so, they might spend a few days in the clink. Maybe. But they of course were victims themselves, according to liberals...never at fault. Prejudice, bad childhood, Republicans, drugs and alcohol, abusive parental figures, sexual dysfunction, addictive personality disorder, you name it. So, you think Madoff should have gotten another chance?
John from Riverside Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 Could somebody explain this so that someone like me can understand what he did? Is it like the movie boiler room?
bills_fan Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 Could somebody explain this so that someone like me can understand what he did? Is it like the movie boiler room? Simple version... Madoff claimed he was investing money for clients. Madoff earned about 10% a year for his clients, good year or bad, didn't matter. Madoff was one of the founders and former chair of NASDAQ, had an impeccable rep. Turns out, Madoff only recycled the money, never invested it. He used new money to pay off old dets, had to keep getting new (and more) money into the scheme. Once too many clients asked for their moeny back (because of the market crash last fall), the game was up.
KD in CA Posted June 29, 2009 Author Posted June 29, 2009 Could somebody explain this so that someone like me can understand what he did? I hate to use Wikipedia as a source --particulary in this example given the laughable defense of the social security scheme, but the first few paragraphs give a basic overview of a Ponzie scheme. In short, he wasn't investing the money in anything that generated the signficiant returns he was claiming (and of course he was skimming billions for himself). But he fooled people into thinking he was by printing phony account statements and paying out high returns to some investors with the principle from newer investors. Is it like the movie boiler room? No. IIRC they were manipulating stock prices by creating false demand.
DC Tom Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 Could somebody explain this so that someone like me can understand what he did? Is it like the movie boiler room? Basically...Social Security.
DC Tom Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 "Here the message must be sent that Mr. Madoff’s crimes were extraordinarily evil..." Pol Pot was evil. Hitler was evil. Radical Hutus were evil. Richard Ramirez and John Wayne Gacy were evil. Madoff is just a money-grubbing crook.
DrDawkinstein Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 "Here the message must be sent that Mr. Madoff’s crimes were extraordinarily evil..." Pol Pot was evil. Hitler was evil. Radical Hutus were evil. Richard Ramirez and John Wayne Gacy were evil. Madoff is just a money-grubbing crook. i would say that ruining the last years of thousand's of people's lives and destroying everything they have worked hard for is pretty evil. bankrupting retiries and leaving them with no money to take care of themselves so now they have to become a burden on their family is pretty evil. it's schitty if you do it once or twice, its evil when you knowingly put a plan in action to take advantage of as many people as possible and wipe them out. has there been worse? sure. but so what?
Chef Jim Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 i would say that ruining the last years of thousand's of people's lives and destroying everything they have worked hard for is pretty evil. bankrupting retiries and leaving them with no money to take care of themselves so now they have to become a burden on their family is pretty evil. it's schitty if you do it once or twice, its evil when you knowingly put a plan in action to take advantage of as many people as possible and wipe them out. has there been worse? sure. but so what? Their greed is what's evil. He tapped into that. They were fools and I don't really feel all that sorry for them. He's still a bastard but they didn't have to invest with him.
BuffaloBill Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 One word: GREED. If you think about it it's very easy to believe. And I'm not talking about him. I'm talking about the people that fell for his scheme. Chef my point was not so much about greed as it was about scale - while it is my understanding that the forensic accounting and research continues - at times Madoff literally had 100's of billions of dollars tied up in his massive fraud. There is some speculation that it may have even gone to a trillion + at its height. It is staggering to think that on a global scale given all of the regulatory agencies that are supposed to prevent simple fraud, much less fraud at this scale, that his ponzi empire was not uncovered sooner. This went on for decades. It is also hard to believe that someone on the inside did not whistleblow sooner. This is an interesting story not so much because it was Robin Hood stealing from the rich to give to the poor. It was the rich stealing from everbody including the already massively rich - some of whom you would think were more astute about the posibility of fraud. The old adage that seems to apply is "that if it looks too good to be true it probably is." His returns were far too golden for far too long - you would have thought somebody would have seen this much sooner.
Chef Jim Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 Chef my point was not so much about greed as it was about scale - while it is my understanding that the forensic accounting and research continues - at times Madoff literally had 100's of billions of dollars tied up in his massive fraud. There is some speculation that it may have even gone to a trillion + at its height. It is staggering to think that on a global scale given all of the regulatory agencies that are supposed to prevent simple fraud, much less fraud at this scale, that his ponzi empire was not uncovered sooner. This went on for decades. It is also hard to believe that someone on the inside did not whistleblow sooner. This is an interesting story not so much because it was Robin Hood stealing from the rich to give to the poor. It was the rich stealing from everbody including the already massively rich - some of whom you would think were more astute about the posibility of fraud. The old adage that seems to apply is "that if it looks too good to be true it probably is." His returns were far too golden for far too long - you would have thought somebody would have seen this much sooner. There are all sorts of regulations to prevent this. As a matter of fact the SEC was made aware of it some time ago. That's why I love the fact that everyone says we need more regulations. Well if the government wasn't so lazy and did their job enforcing the rules that are already on the books a lot of this stuff would be caught. It's like CA communities making smoking on the beach illegal because of all the butts littering the beach (yes that was the rationale), well you dipshiits, littering is already illegal. Fuggin' politicians.
HopsGuy Posted June 29, 2009 Posted June 29, 2009 One word: GREED. If you think about it it's very easy to believe. And I'm not talking about him. I'm talking about the people that fell for his scheme. While I agree with you that the investors bear some responsibility for their losses, I think ENVY is actually a bigger factor than greed. Many of his new investors came by client referral. Those clients were envious of their friends making a great "secure" return of 10% while their stuff was probably only returning 5-7%. Maybe 50-50 GREED/ENVY. Quick story - I was at a Panthers tailgate and someone was telling me about a guy there that was making 10% PER MONTH on his $100k investment with a FOREX trading firm. 6 months in and all 6 months $10k was hitting his bank account. The guy telling us about it (not the investor) asked me and my business partner, "You guys are in the business, what do you think of this." My partner said, "I know what Hops thinks." Everyone turns to me and I say, "It's a scam. It's called a Ponzi scheme." This was about a week before Madoff. Two months later, the jig was up and the firm was caught. Not by the CTFC, but by early redemptions. I'm afraid to ask the guy about the thing. The Madoff case was fraud. The SEC should have caught it earlier with Harry Markopolos basically bird-dogging the thing for them. New regulations won't prevent it any more than laws against burglary will stop breaking and entering. Bad people will do bad things. Oh yeah, and DC Tom is 110% correct. The SS system is most definitely a Ponzi scheme. And the redemptions are coming.
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