Trade Whitner while we still can

[billsfreak]

Is that supposed to be a joke? If so then congratulations...you are officially the least funny member of TSW.

I was beginning to wonder if that was really their last name, because there wasn't any humor in that remark at all.

[GR8PRKN]

It shouldn't suprise anyone that Lori and the Dean would talk like Dick Jauron, considering their names are Lori and Dean Jauron. Keep up the insightful posting, you guys are the best! And keep buying those season tickets so everyone else has to pay $75 dollars a ticket to watch a 7-9 team.

 

75 is a bargain.... Quit crying and cough up some cash and get a set.............. of tickets, support the Bills!! I live in FL and have season tickets and make it to almost all of the games!!

[Lurker]

You are QUICK

And YOU should be thankful she doesn't just delete your drivel and do the board a big favor...

[KD in CA]

And YOU should be thankful she doesn't just delete your drivel and do the board a big favor...

 

Let's hope his luck is about to run out.

[Bill from NYC]

Too bad that this thread went down the tubes. I wouldn't expect everyone to be receptive to trading Whitner. I wouldn't trade him either were it up to me unless I had a good offer, and a plan which isn't founded on building a football team around the secondary.

 

That said, there isn't a whole lot to talk about in early July, and there could have been some decent discussion.

[WVUFootball29]

Too bad that this thread went down the tubes. I wouldn't expect everyone to be receptive to trading Whitner. I wouldn't trade him either were it up to me unless I had a good offer, and a plan which isn't founded on building a football team around the secondary.

 

That said, there isn't a whole lot to talk about in early July, and there could have been some decent discussion.

 

Decent discussion went out the window a long time on this board.

[Dan]

Too bad that this thread went down the tubes. I wouldn't expect everyone to be receptive to trading Whitner. I wouldn't trade him either were it up to me unless I had a good offer, and a plan which isn't founded on building a football team around the secondary.

 

That said, there isn't a whole lot to talk about in early July, and there could have been some decent discussion.

This thread has definitely gone down a bad path. But you gotta admit, its kinda fun to read. It's almost like looking at monkeys in the zoo, you just can't believe some of the stupid crap they do (or say, in this case).

 

However, given the premise of the thread, I knew it was doomed from the first post. Seriously, there's no way you trade Whitner. I don't think anyone was glad we drafted him initially. To this day, I'd guess about 50% of the people here still wouldn't draft him. None the less, he has become a solid player that's a leader on the team. No, he's not one of the top 2 or 3 safeties in the league. But, by no means does that mean he should be traded either.

 

I would say that Whitner's biggest problem (for some people) is that too many people play fantasy football. All they know are certain stats that get them points. Whitner doesn't average a couple of interceptions a game, so they never see his name pop up on their FF sheets, ergo he must suck. Put Whitner on a team with a decent pass rush and decent HC; and watch his FF numbers improve.

 

The entire argument over Whitner s indicative of most Bills' fans short sightedness which probably stems from watching a team lose as much as we have over the last decade. But, everyone is always ready to trash everyone for the next big thing. The optimism around JP was huge. Why? He wasn't Bledsoe. I remember at the time, we would win 2-3 more games just because Bledsoe wasn't back there. Trent is great. Why? Because he isn't JP. I said it day one, my biggest worry over starting Trent 3 years ago was that it would set our team back 3 years. Well, here we are. Same with our new center. He's great. Why? Because he's not Fowler.

 

And I could go on for almost every roster spot for years. But, the fact of the matter is this: not all the Bills players are bad or need to be cut just because they don't make the highlight reel. No team has a probowler at every position. It may be difficult to spot the nuances of each player's play, but educated observers do. And just because there may have been better or good players drafted after the Bills selected someone, that doesn't mean the player can't become good. I was equally shocked and dismayed at the selection of Whitner; however, it's nice to see that he's become a good, solid player that's a leader on the team.

 

(This post is not entirely directed at you Bill, justs the first half)

[Bill from NYC]

This thread has definitely gone down a bad path. But you gotta admit, its kinda fun to read. It's almost like looking at monkeys in the zoo, you just can't believe some of the stupid crap they do (or say, in this case).

 

However, given the premise of the thread, I knew it was doomed from the first post. Seriously, there's no way you trade Whitner. I don't think anyone was glad we drafted him initially. To this day, I'd guess about 50% of the people here still wouldn't draft him. None the less, he has become a solid player that's a leader on the team. No, he's not one of the top 2 or 3 safeties in the league. But, by no means does that mean he should be traded either.

 

I would say that Whitner's biggest problem (for some people) is that too many people play fantasy football. All they know are certain stats that get them points. Whitner doesn't average a couple of interceptions a game, so they never see his name pop up on their FF sheets, ergo he must suck. Put Whitner on a team with a decent pass rush and decent HC; and watch his FF numbers improve.

 

The entire argument over Whitner s indicative of most Bills' fans short sightedness which probably stems from watching a team lose as much as we have over the last decade. But, everyone is always ready to trash everyone for the next big thing. The optimism around JP was huge. Why? He wasn't Bledsoe. I remember at the time, we would win 2-3 more games just because Bledsoe wasn't back there. Trent is great. Why? Because he isn't JP. I said it day one, my biggest worry over starting Trent 3 years ago was that it would set our team back 3 years. Well, here we are. Same with our new center. He's great. Why? Because he's not Fowler.

 

And I could go on for almost every roster spot for years. But, the fact of the matter is this: not all the Bills players are bad or need to be cut just because they don't make the highlight reel. No team has a probowler at every position. It may be difficult to spot the nuances of each player's play, but educated observers do. And just because there may have been better or good players drafted after the Bills selected someone, that doesn't mean the player can't become good. I was equally shocked and dismayed at the selection of Whitner; however, it's nice to see that he's become a good, solid player that's a leader on the team.

 

(This post is not entirely directed at you Bill, justs the first half)

 

Good post as usual. Your point is taken about Whitner being a good player, even though I am certainly in the "50%" that think he was a very bad selection.

A good head coach might consider trading him imo but certainly not Jauron, who is in a make or break year (or so one would think). An additional pick would offer the Bills a better chance for instance to grab a nose tackle, and convert to a good system of defense.

It appears that we could have had a first round pick in 2010 for this years second, but instead chose to select another small safety. That pick had Dumbo Jauron written all over it.

 

Whitner is not the reason why the Bills suck, but imo his presence is symptomatic of what is wrong with this team. The Bills need big, dominant players (ala Seymour and Wilfork), but the Levy/Jauron way of thinking is to grab little defensive backs with extremely early picks, only to play them 2 continents from scrimage.

 

Either way, I think that the thread was salvaged.

[Pirate Angel]

The most vivid memories I have of Donte Whitner up to this point in his career are watching mediocre tight ends run right by him, or him draped on their back as they go up and catch the ball over the deep middle. I can honestly say I do not have a bias when it comes to Whitner. I was hoping he would step up his game last season. But lets face it, a #8 pick in the draft 4 years ago with 2 career interceptions, who makes no big plays is at this point a bust. Some might not agree but if I could compare him to one player it would be Coy Wire. Always just a half step late on all of his coverage but a decent tackler. Bryd can not possibly be less dynamic than Whitner.

 

My thought is that much of the league has not caught on to the fact that he stinks. (ESPN line of thinking, that most front offices use. "I've heard of him") So I say we let him go through training camp, hope a starting safety for another team gets injured, and try to get a 3rd round pick. Before everyone else realizes all he can do is tackle. Trade him this year or else all we will be able to get for him is a Losman jersey and a half eaten bag of Lays potatoe chips.

Its hard to really judge whitner as a player is only as good as the people around him. Where these mediocre tight ends running by him covered by him in the defensive scheme that was called making Donte (who is the last line of defense) tackle them in persuit which may have Whitner tackling from behind apperaing that he was beat in coverage. Two interceptions, how many picks would Ed and Troy have if there defensive front couldn't apply pressure, and since we cant apply presssure we must blitz to have a chance at the QB, where these mediocre tight ends exploiting a blitz. And our corners havent exactly been the best in the league. Is the defensive play calling having him help out a cornerback in coverage when all this big plays are happening when he is half a step late? Oh and I almost forgot we cant stop the run that well either which means he has to step up in the box to help the run leaving him backpeddling to gain ground to the deep middle. I agree he hasnt made the plays that we hoped for with the 8th overall pick but comparing him to coy wire- thats just wrong.

[Coach Tuesday]

Wow, this thread is still going on? I'm not going to read through all seven pages of it to see whether anyone else has made what I consider to be the key point:

 

Why trade a guy when his value isn't at or near its peak? Answer: you don't; you trade a guy when you think his value is at its highest. You NEVER trade a guy because you think he sucks and is overpaid = chances are, the team you're trading with thinks the same thing, and would only offer you a pile of gabage in return. Right now, they'd be lucky to get a 3rd for Whitner - more likely a 4th in return. And you don't necessarily have a replacement on the roster. Whitner's salary isn't outrageous. So you're giving away a starter, who is young and *may* become a star, in exchange for a second day pick, and creating a hole in your roster for no reason. Among the many stupid things that the OP appears to have spewed in this thread, his initial premise is probably the dumbest. An argument can be made for drafting/signing Whitner's replacement, or for not re-signing him when his contract is up. But the trade idea is remarkably stupid.

[Justice]

Simply put, Whitner has been moved around far too much to get a true assessment of his ability. Hopefully everyone stays healthy this year and we can finally evaluate DW as a SS for a full year. Only then can we talk about his replacement, if need be.

[Dan]

Good post as usual. Your point is taken about Whitner being a good player, even though I am certainly in the "50%" that think he was a very bad selection.

A good head coach might consider trading him imo but certainly not Jauron, who is in a make or break year (or so one would think). An additional pick would offer the Bills a better chance for instance to grab a nose tackle, and convert to a good system of defense.

It appears that we could have had a first round pick in 2010 for this years second, but instead chose to select another small safety. That pick had Dumbo Jauron written all over it.

 

Whitner is not the reason why the Bills suck, but imo his presence is symptomatic of what is wrong with this team. The Bills need big, dominant players (ala Seymour and Wilfork), but the Levy/Jauron way of thinking is to grab little defensive backs with extremely early picks, only to play them 2 continents from scrimage.

 

Either way, I think that the thread was salvaged.

Thanks for the kind remarks.

 

I would agree on one point. Certainly, I think almost anyone should be considered for a trade, barring a franchise quarterback perhaps. However, if we trade Whitner for a high round pick and select a top flight nose tackle, aren't we just continuing the trend of trading one hole for anther. Why not keep Whitner, allowing him to solidify the safety position for years to come and select a high round NT next year as well?

 

Granted, this year not withstanding, we don't have a good track record for picking linemen. But, if I had input that'd be what I would lobby for. With Whitner, McGee, McKelvin, the secondary should be set for the time being. Now it should be time to concentrate on the line (then LB). But not if we continue cutting/trading the DBs.

[Orton's Arm]

Clearly, the fact that Whitner hasn't lived up to his 8th overall draft status has caused some people to become embittered with him. But it wasn't Whitner's fault that he was drafted too high. Now that he's a Bill, it probably makes more sense to keep him than to trade him. He's probably a better fit in this system than he'd be in almost any other. Unless our hypothetical trading partner was some other team running the Tampa-2, he wouldn't be as valuable to that other team as he is to us. Which, in turn, suggests that a mutually beneficial trade would be hard to arrange.

 

On an emotional level, there would be something satisfying about trading away Whitner. Depending on what the team got in return, it would be an acknowledgment that taking him so early was a mistake. But teams should not be run based on emotion.

 

Bill's idea of trading away Whitner as part of a strategy to re-allocate talent away from the secondary, and toward the lines, makes more sense. I'm not completely comfortable with the idea though; and part of me would prefer to keep the players we have (at least, those worth keeping) while using future early picks first and foremost on the lines. Once the lines have been sufficiently built up--a process which could take several years--the Bills could then use their early picks on other positions.

 

There is one thing we should NOT do however. We should not allow Whitner, or McGee, or any other young, talented player, to go first contract and out. Trading such players away is infinitely better than letting them walk, and getting nothing in return when they go.

[Heart Throb]

And YOU should be thankful she doesn't just delete your drivel and do the board a big favor...

 

Ohhhhhhhh. Lurker you loser, stop sucking up. So if i don't agree with the masses (who by the way wouldn't dream of ever second guessing a 7-9 ,3 years running football team) I should be kicked off the board?

[Conch]

Another ridiculous post from a very uneducated football fan that has a post count <25

 

So a high post count means you are an educated fan?? By often adding to the inane prattle on this board makes your worthy to voice an opinion.

 

I think you swim in the shallow end of the gene pool.

[NewHampshireBillsFan]

Four reasons not to trade Whitner:

 

1.) He is one of the very few true leaders on this team and leadership is very important in football.

 

2.) You don't trade a player just because he may have been drafted too high.

 

3.) At this point he is good enough to start for this team so a trade would leave us with a less qualified replacement on the field.

 

4.) He doesn't even have a high salary that would be erased if he left.

[Heart Throb]

Four reasons not to trade Whitner:

 

1.) He is one of the very few true leaders on this team and leadership is very important in football.

 

2.) You don't trade a player just because he may have been drafted too high.

 

3.) At this point he is good enough to start for this team so a trade would leave us with a less qualified replacement on the field.

 

4.) He doesn't even have a high salary that would be erased if he left.

 

Four reasons to trade Whitner otherwised known as Coy Wire.

 

1.) We don't need "leaders" guaranteeing the playoffs, and then in the season finale after we don't make the playoffs getting flattened by a career 3rd down running back. He got ran over like a waitress in the way of Rosie Odonnel and a Pizza Hut Buffet.

 

2.) Boy George could put up better stats and make more plays than Wire......I mean Whitner.

 

3.) He is 6th round talent that we feel obligated to start because we wasted a 1st rounder on.

 

4.) He gets tasered outside of nightclubs far to often.

[NewHampshireBillsFan]

Four reasons to trade Whitner otherwised known as Coy Wire.

 

1.) We don't need "leaders" guaranteeing the playoffs, and then in the season finale after we don't make the playoffs getting flattened by a career 3rd down running back. He got ran over like a waitress in the way of Rosie Odonnel and a Pizza Hut Buffet.

 

2.) Boy George could put up better stats and make more plays than Wire......I mean Whitner.

 

3.) He is 6th round talent that we feel obligated to start because we wasted a 1st rounder on.

 

4.) He gets tasered outside of nightclubs far to often.

 

Anyone gets beat on some plays. The knock on Whitner is that he doesn't make big plays but most think he does a decent job of tackling. Anyway the coaches didn't feel obligated to start McCargo even though he was drafted in the first round and they DID try to trade him last year. Also McKelvin didn't start last year and is not certain to start this year. And although I don't think DJ is the best HC and Perry is still learning as a DC, Jauron is a former DB and DB coach and Perry was a DB coach before he got this gig with the Bills. I may not always agree with the defenses they run but I think they know how to evaluate a DB and decide who should play, esp. with the systems they want to employ.

[Heart Throb]

New Hampshirebills answer to my post:

 

A) 1.) We don't need "leaders" guaranteeing the playoffs, and then in the season finale after we don't make the playoffs getting flattened by a career 3rd down running back. He got ran over like a waitress in the way of Rosie Odonnel and a Pizza Hut Buffet.

 

His Reply:

 

B) "Anyone gets beat on some plays." - HAHAHAHAHA. Lori couldn't have put it any better herself. There it is in a nutshell.

 

That is not getting beat, that is getting embarrassed by a 31 year old 220 pound 3rd down running back!

 

 

A) The person who calls it like it happened=Me

 

B) The loser mentality shared by Dick Jauron and most of this board.

[Chef Jim]

That's a Nut Shell alright.