VJ91 Posted June 5, 2009 Posted June 5, 2009 http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patrio...ork-speaks.html My only bet on this situation is that the media will report this and the Pats*' reaction to it as 180 degrees different than they did when it was the Bills doing the exact same thing--if/when Kraft refuses to pay Fatboy it will be hailed all over the sports media world as an example of "principles" vs. when Ralph does it "he's just being his usual cheap loser self"....... The comparison is not valid. It is not the fact that Wilson is cheap while Kraft sticks to his priciples. It is more the fact that The Pats have other Pro Bowl players on their team all over the place, while Peters was one of only two from last season. And during the 9 year playoff drought Wilson's Bills have been in, Krafts' Pats have won 3 Super Bowls. And other stars with some very good years left, such as Drew Bledsoe and Lawyer Malloy, have been traded or cut from the Pats and traded to or picked up by Buffalo! Results? The same. Zero playoff games - Buffalo. Three Super Bowls - Pats. I suppose I could go on and on here. In the end, it is always the same thing, scoreboard. Who wins, who loses, that matters.
thebandit27 Posted June 5, 2009 Posted June 5, 2009 As noted way above, "lining up against" means compared to, since that was the idiotic premise of how you proposed to compare drafts, ie. who did we draft who could start on the Pats*. Really a false way to look at things, but I played along. It is moronic to say that Edwards was not a high value draft pick because he can't beat out a Hall of Fame QB. How is a QB who most neutral observers admit is better than at least 7-8 other starting QBs in this League in his second full year (and even better from a pure stats line I'd wager) and was picked in the third round in 2007 not a very good draft pick? I cited a neutral observer's view on Whitner over Meriweather--did you? That 1 sack and 1 interception of Poz's were one more than your boy Mayo had last year in those measurables that we have access to and that are the most widely used. Ever think that Mayo may have had better stats since he played behind one of the best D-lines in the League and one of the best NTs (even if he is a dirty player)? That ever cross your mind? Certainly helps to make plays in the backfield when your D-line can neutralize the O-line. Even so, Poz's numbers (since that's all we've got here to go by largely) stack up respectfully against the ROY and there's no denying that. Actually, MattM, Fingon was the poster that decided that the barometer would be "who could start for the Patriots?". I see that the two of you both like to make things up in order to support your argument. You see, there's this really neat activity called "reading", that I think would truly benefit you. Here, you can start with this (check out post #22): http://www.stadiumwall.com/index.php?showt...0036&st=20# Now that we've cleared that up, let's move on...where do you get some of this crap? Are you familiar with the term "shoots from the hip"? It means to make a statement without any backup whatsoever, like "a QB who most neutral observers admit is better than at least 7-8 other starting QBs in this League in his second full year (and even better from a pure stats line I'd wager)". However, since I'm sure that YOU said this, and not some other poster (because I took the time to actually READ the thread), I'll "play along"...so now you want me to believe that Trent is a "steal" because he's better than 7 or 8 starting QBs in the NFL? Awesome. The converse to that, of course, would be that there are at least (using your numbers) 24 other QBs you'd rather have starting for your team this year...yes, an absolute steal I tell you! But, since I promised I'd play along and give you my personal opinion, here you go: A guy that can only put up points against teams with defenses in the bottom 3rd of the league does not seem like a good QB to me. He played well against 1 good team last year, San Diego, and that was before they fired Ted Cottrell, who let their once-proud defense become a bottom-5 unit through week 6 of last season. The rest of his decent performances came against bottom-feeders, look it up for yourself. Here's another really poor excuse for an argument: I cited a neutral observer's view on Whitner over Meriweather--did you? Um, Matty, what "neutral observer's view" did you cite? Your own? Wow, that's convincing. We can go back and forth all day on this one, but (as you so conveniently put it) the only concrete evidence we have for a comparison are statistics, but you'd rather ignore those since they don't strengthen your assertion. Why is Mayo "my boy"? Because I think he's a better player? Wow, I guess that makes 3/4 of the NFL "my boys" then, since I think there are a lot of players in the league that are better than players on the Bills. And you call my statements idiotic, you're so full of it you could run for office. Your "boy" Poz didn't exactly play behind a slouch, you know. I happen to think Marcus Stroud is a top-5 NFL DT, or does that not count? Tell you what, let's ask Tim Graham in the pinned thread who (between Poz and Mayo) is more highly regarded in league circles, since he's a lot closer to NFL personnel than you or I...call it a wager...what say you? EDIT: Ok, I just posted the question for Tim's live chat today, we'll see if he answers...
thebandit27 Posted June 5, 2009 Posted June 5, 2009 Actually, MattM, Fingon was the poster that decided that the barometer would be "who could start for the Patriots?". I see that the two of you both like to make things up in order to support your argument. You see, there's this really neat activity called "reading", that I think would truly benefit you. Here, you can start with this (check out post #22): http://www.stadiumwall.com/index.php?showt...0036&st=20# Now that we've cleared that up, let's move on...where do you get some of this crap? Are you familiar with the term "shoots from the hip"? It means to make a statement without any backup whatsoever, like "a QB who most neutral observers admit is better than at least 7-8 other starting QBs in this League in his second full year (and even better from a pure stats line I'd wager)". However, since I'm sure that YOU said this, and not some other poster (because I took the time to actually READ the thread), I'll "play along"...so now you want me to believe that Trent is a "steal" because he's better than 7 or 8 starting QBs in the NFL? Awesome. The converse to that, of course, would be that there are at least (using your numbers) 24 other QBs you'd rather have starting for your team this year...yes, an absolute steal I tell you! But, since I promised I'd play along and give you my personal opinion, here you go: A guy that can only put up points against teams with defenses in the bottom 3rd of the league does not seem like a good QB to me. He played well against 1 good team last year, San Diego, and that was before they fired Ted Cottrell, who let their once-proud defense become a bottom-5 unit through week 6 of last season. The rest of his decent performances came against bottom-feeders, look it up for yourself. Here's another really poor excuse for an argument: I cited a neutral observer's view on Whitner over Meriweather--did you? Um, Matty, what "neutral observer's view" did you cite? Your own? Wow, that's convincing. We can go back and forth all day on this one, but (as you so conveniently put it) the only concrete evidence we have for a comparison are statistics, but you'd rather ignore those since they don't strengthen your assertion. Why is Mayo "my boy"? Because I think he's a better player? Wow, I guess that makes 3/4 of the NFL "my boys" then, since I think there are a lot of players in the league that are better than players on the Bills. And you call my statements idiotic, you're so full of it you could run for office. Your "boy" Poz didn't exactly play behind a slouch, you know. I happen to think Marcus Stroud is a top-5 NFL DT, or does that not count? Tell you what, let's ask Tim Graham in the pinned thread who (between Poz and Mayo) is more highly regarded in league circles, since he's a lot closer to NFL personnel than you or I...call it a wager...what say you? EDIT: Ok, I just posted the question for Tim's live chat today, we'll see if he answers... So here's Tim's response: My question: You're the man Tim! Can't wait for you to come back to Buffalo! A topic of a personal debate recently: between Paul Posluszny of the Bills and Jerod Mayo of the Patriots, who's the more highly-regarded LB in league circles? Thanks! Tim Graham: (2:59 PM ET ) Jerod Mayo. What he did as a rookie last year was phenomenal. He needs to make more game-changing plays (sacks, turnovers), but he's dynamite as a tackler. Posluszny will be a very good linebacker for many years, but he hasn't shown as much as Mayo yet. Here's the link: http://proxy.espn.go.com/chat/chatESPN?event_id=26809
MattM Posted June 5, 2009 Author Posted June 5, 2009 Actually, MattM, Fingon was the poster that decided that the barometer would be "who could start for the Patriots?". I see that the two of you both like to make things up in order to support your argument. You see, there's this really neat activity called "reading", that I think would truly benefit you. Here, you can start with this (check out post #22): http://www.stadiumwall.com/index.php?showt...0036&st=20# Now that we've cleared that up, let's move on...where do you get some of this crap? Are you familiar with the term "shoots from the hip"? It means to make a statement without any backup whatsoever, like "a QB who most neutral observers admit is better than at least 7-8 other starting QBs in this League in his second full year (and even better from a pure stats line I'd wager)". However, since I'm sure that YOU said this, and not some other poster (because I took the time to actually READ the thread), I'll "play along"...so now you want me to believe that Trent is a "steal" because he's better than 7 or 8 starting QBs in the NFL? Awesome. The converse to that, of course, would be that there are at least (using your numbers) 24 other QBs you'd rather have starting for your team this year...yes, an absolute steal I tell you! But, since I promised I'd play along and give you my personal opinion, here you go: A guy that can only put up points against teams with defenses in the bottom 3rd of the league does not seem like a good QB to me. He played well against 1 good team last year, San Diego, and that was before they fired Ted Cottrell, who let their once-proud defense become a bottom-5 unit through week 6 of last season. The rest of his decent performances came against bottom-feeders, look it up for yourself. Here's another really poor excuse for an argument: I cited a neutral observer's view on Whitner over Meriweather--did you? Um, Matty, what "neutral observer's view" did you cite? Your own? Wow, that's convincing. We can go back and forth all day on this one, but (as you so conveniently put it) the only concrete evidence we have for a comparison are statistics, but you'd rather ignore those since they don't strengthen your assertion. Why is Mayo "my boy"? Because I think he's a better player? Wow, I guess that makes 3/4 of the NFL "my boys" then, since I think there are a lot of players in the league that are better than players on the Bills. And you call my statements idiotic, you're so full of it you could run for office. Your "boy" Poz didn't exactly play behind a slouch, you know. I happen to think Marcus Stroud is a top-5 NFL DT, or does that not count? Tell you what, let's ask Tim Graham in the pinned thread who (between Poz and Mayo) is more highly regarded in league circles, since he's a lot closer to NFL personnel than you or I...call it a wager...what say you? EDIT: Ok, I just posted the question for Tim's live chat today, we'll see if he answers... Edwards QB rating was 17th in the League last year--look it up. That reallly makes him an awful third round pick from 2007, wouldn't you say? Guys behind him have names like Delhomme, Favre and, oh yeah, Roethlisberger, among others. That as a second year player. The guy's won slightly more than he's lost, that with a pretty mediocre team behind him. In case you haven't noticed, QB's don't play the games by themselves. See the Denver game or the Redskins game in his ROOKIE year, where he lead the team back late to win, for cases where he's showed poise and leadership. Will he be a Pro Bowler in 2-3 years? Who knows, but he's certainly a heck of a third round draft pick, no? As for Whitner, what I was citing way above was another thread this week that included a link to a Sporting News article that had Whitner as the 8th rated safety and Merriweather the 17th--look it up. On Poz vs. Mayo, way to change the argument when it goes against you--even a Pats fan said that Poz would start ahead of Tedy (your original statement being "no way would Poz start over Tedy or Mayo"). Mayo is a good player (I still say a bit overrated, but that tends to happens to players in NE), but so is Poz. See your own Tim Graham quote on that. I'm through debating with you--you bring a meanness to your illogical arguments that is almost ragelike. Chill out, dude, or get out more.....
Ice Cold Bruschi Posted June 5, 2009 Posted June 5, 2009 We'll see how he does in Cinci. Thanks for joining the conversation--as you'll see, we don't mind here when intelligent fans from other teams (even the Pats!) want to come over and chat..... Actually MattM you've flamed me pretty bad for some intelligent things I've said in other forums
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