Tipster19 Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 The Colts also have Frank Reich as their QB coach. Seeing Polian having two of his former players on staff got me thinking why haven't the Bills employed any of their former greats. Doesn't it seem kind of strange that we have former players from the glory years that are into coaching and none of them are on the Bills' staff? I guess Alex Van Pelt will have to suffice. http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?i...ce=NFLHeadlines Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ans4e64 Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 If you were hired right now to coach the Jacksonville Jaguars, would you hire the coaches you know and have worked with, or would you hire Mark Brunell and Donovan Darius? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rpcolosi Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 If you were hired right now to coach the Jacksonville Jaguars, would you hire the coaches you know and have worked with, or would you hire Mark Brunell and Donovan Darius? um thats not a fair comparison. Clearly Polian knows how to hire coaches and hiring both those guys make sense. Usually a guy like Reich or AVP will end up being good coaches because they had limitation but were great students of the game and got to watch some great players play. I'd be more apt to hire a guy like James Stewart to coach the Jaguars as opposed to someone like Fred Taylor, in response to your question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvermike Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 Are either Reich or Metzelaars any good at coaching? I can't imagine Frank has anything to teach Peyton in terms of technique (though he's got plenty on Manning in the heart department, I'm not sure how teachable that is). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tipster19 Posted May 6, 2009 Author Share Posted May 6, 2009 If you were hired right now to coach the Jacksonville Jaguars, would you hire the coaches you know and have worked with, or would you hire Mark Brunell and Donovan Darius? Well, I understand what you're saying but when I think of a couple of our former players from our Super Bowl teams coaching for Polian and AJ Smith's (James Lofton) teams and we haven't had any in all these years, it just strikes me a bit odd. Where's the love for our guys? It just seems like some of our former administrators are making a way for some of them and we're not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsWatch Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 Reich has been asked in past about coaching for Bills at event in Buffalo and at time said he got inquiries from Bills and was not interested. Times have changed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ans4e64 Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 Well, I understand what you're saying but when I think of a couple of our former players from our Super Bowl teams coaching for Polian and AJ Smith's (James Lofton) teams and we haven't had any in all these years, it just strikes me a bit odd. Where's the love for our guys? It just seems like some of our former administrators are making a way for some of them and we're not. Polian and Smith have a connection with those guys... they were here. Jauron and Brandon do not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tipster19 Posted May 6, 2009 Author Share Posted May 6, 2009 Polian and Smith have a connection with those guys... they were here. Jauron and Brandon do not. I understand that but as a franchise/organization I would think that we would be a bit more receptive to some of our former players as coachs, regardless of the coaching staff. It's been how many years since the Super Bowl days and we haven't had ANY players-turned-coachs from that era on staff? I don't like it and it doesn't sit right with me. Is it because we had so many changes in our coaching staffs since then? If so, then all the more that this stands out to me. Where's the hiring/promotion philosophy that we seem to advocate with our administrators? Why not the same sentiment with our former players? They would have this franchise's best interest at heart versus all these outsiders that we keep bringing in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2020 Our Year For Sure Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 Polian and Smith have a connection with those guys... they were here. Jauron and Brandon do not. Levy was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 I understand where Tipster is coming from. Seeing Metz and Reich coaching on Polians' Colts, is like seeing the girl who broke your heart, years later, with the guy she was going out with, before you...if that makes any sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DazedandConfused Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 Hiring former stars cuts a lot of different ways. Some are the positive aspects you mention or are implied by the questiom, but some are negatives for this team in the present. For example, is the coaching work being judged by the team hierarchy, his peers and his players based on the job he does right now or like some of the fans based on feelings about pass success? This is good "baggage" that has the positives of connection to past winning, but the negative that implications of letting him go are larger than judging his current performance. Can the connection to the past tradition be supplied simply by having the old-timers around from time to time without diminishing the old accomplishment with current performance? Like it or not, the current goal is to win the SB and these past teams were certainly great but failed at this goal. There may be some taking the best but leaving the rest by having the old-timers around but not in a working role. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 Hiring former stars cuts a lot of different ways. Some are the positive aspects you mention or are implied by the questiom, but some are negatives for this team in the present. For example, is the coaching work being judged by the team hierarchy, his peers and his players based on the job he does right now or like some of the fans based on feelings about pass success? This is good "baggage" that has the positives of connection to past winning, but the negative that implications of letting him go are larger than judging his current performance. Can the connection to the past tradition be supplied simply by having the old-timers around from time to time without diminishing the old accomplishment with current performance? Like it or not, the current goal is to win the SB and these past teams were certainly great but failed at this goal. There may be some taking the best but leaving the rest by having the old-timers around but not in a working role. Well, hiring Frank Reich and Pete Metzelaars to coach, is not the same as hiring Jim Kelly and Andre Reed. Reich and Metzelaars got the most out of their careers, not because they were supremely talented, but because they knew how to maximize the talent that they did have, while mimimizing the problems that their limitations might cause. That makes them perfect coaching candidates. It is kind of a well known sports axiom, the best coaches who once were players, are those that were not superstar players. There have been very few superstar players, in any sport (except possibly baseball) who have had as much success as coaches. Yet, there are plenty of examples of lesser caliber players who became very good coaches. Playing the game didn't come easy to them, so they became students of the game...Reich and Metzelaars were both very mentally gifted football players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Jose Bills Fan Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 Firstly I would always want to believe and do believe, that Pete Metzelaars and Frank Reich are excellent coaches. We have no way of knowing if that's true but everything we know about them would suggest that they are excellent coaches and not riding some sort of Polian gravy train. And it does seem odd and unfortunate that so few of the men from our Super Bowl teams have any affiliation with the team. Even more curious because Marv was GM for two years and his tenure might have been an opportunity to recruit some alums from our glory years. I think what it might come down to is that few Bills from the Super Bowl years are still in football. That was roughly 15 years ago. On top of that few of the Bills great players (Smith, Kelly, Thomas, Reed, Hull, Bennett, Talley, Conlan, etc) ever went into coaching or administration. Not only did none of the all time greats stay in the game but none of the role players did either. Ray Bentley coached indoors for awhile. You could imagine guys like Rob Riddick or Nate Odomes coaching in the league but they never did. Steve Tasker works in broadcasting. John Butler passed away. The Bills employ one of the few players from those teams still in the NFL, Mark Kelso who's an analyst on Bills radio broadcasts. There actually seems to be very few former Bills players from any era working in the NFL. I think James Lofton might still be in football, and former Bills DB Martin Mayhew is GM of the Detroit Lions. Former Bills QB James Harris the first black QB to start a season opener, (Bills, 1969) was a long time VP Player Personnel with Jacksonville and works with Mayhew in Detroit now. Paul Maguire does college football broadcasts I believe. There's just not that many Bills from that or any era working in the NFL it seems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 Great players don't necessarily make great coaches -- in fact, there are probably more instances of great players flopping as coaches than the opposite. But I don't feel like doing the research. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DIE HARD 1967 Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 I wrote a thread about this very subject and got blasted. Seems none of our former players would be very good as coaches (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steely Dan Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 If you were hired right now to coach the Jacksonville Jaguars, would you hire the coaches you know and have worked with, or would you hire Mark Brunell and Donovan Darius? Head Coaches choose their own coaches to work with, for the most part. Jauron, IIRC, has some guys that worked with him in Chicago. The two Bills coaches in Indy were probably recommended by Polian to the new HC. um thats not a fair comparison. Clearly Polian knows how to hire coaches and hiring both those guys make sense. Usually a guy like Reich or AVP will end up being good coaches because they had limitation but were great students of the game and got to watch some great players play. I'd be more apt to hire a guy like James Stewart to coach the Jaguars as opposed to someone like Fred Taylor, in response to your question. Linky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsfaninFl Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 Are either Reich or Metzelaars any good at coaching? I can't imagine Frank has anything to teach Peyton in terms of technique (though he's got plenty on Manning in the heart department, I'm not sure how teachable that is). Keep in mind that coaching is not just teaching. Established players, even stars, need a coach to determine if they falling into bad habits in certain situations, or if there is a flaw developing in their mechanics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8-8 Forever? Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 The Colts also have Frank Reich as their QB coach. Seeing Polian having two of his former players on staff got me thinking why haven't the Bills employed any of their former greats. Doesn't it seem kind of strange that we have former players from the glory years that are into coaching and none of them are on the Bills' staff? I guess Alex Van Pelt will have to suffice. http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?i...ce=NFLHeadlines lets see... I can coach for tom donahoe or I can coach for Bill Polian/Tony Dungy , what will I do what will I do....? the bills organizatin sucks, that's why, nothing "strange" there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfreak Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 Are either Reich or Metzelaars any good at coaching? I can't imagine Frank has anything to teach Peyton in terms of technique (though he's got plenty on Manning in the heart department, I'm not sure how teachable that is). Reich and Metz are two of my favorite all time Bills, but what makes you think Manning doesn't have heart? Because he didn't play in Buffalo? He is going to retire as one of the top 5 or 6 QB's of all time, you don't do that with no heart. This organization could only wish we had a Peyton Manning, in fact in my span of being a Bills fan (over 40 years now), we have only had one QB come close to Manning in ability, heart or results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfreak Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 lets see... I can coach for tom donahoe or I can coach for Bill Polian/Tony Dungy , what will I do what will I do....? the bills organizatin sucks, that's why, nothing "strange" there... I think you hit the nail right on the head. Would you want to coach in an established organization with stability or one that changes coaches every 3 years, and with that comes changes in coaching staffs. Beside Polian having a connection with the ex-Bills, he always creates a stable organization with class where ever he as been. I have always said, that is when the Bills downhill slide began, when Ralph forced Polian out of Buffalo. Beside, Reich and Metz followed Polian to Carolina when he left Buffalo and started the expansion Panthers, so they must like working for/with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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