"Gelling"

[San Jose Bills Fan]

My guys need time to"Gel" = Coaches speak for My Guys S__k at this point in the season

With a revamped Off. line I hope this not what you hear midway through the season.

They have from now till Sep. to "Gel" ( Jello in M. Williams case")

They need to be playing at least a half of every preseason game maybe more, or this is what you'll hear.

Good points. Whatever semantics we use and however we attempt to describe the indescribable, I like your point about coachspeak. I don't want to hear coach Kugler saying "My guys need time to gel" in week 1.

 

And I definitely agree that this unit should get more than the usual amount of reps in preseason. BTW, in the Gaughan chat he said that Levitre is lining up at left guard and Wood at right guard which is the opposite of what was stated by the Bills after the draft.

 

Also in Lori's post on the Booster Club Meeting, Jauron conceded that the tentative plan is for Butler at right tackle and Walker at left tackle.

 

So it's officially at the moment (left to right): Walker-Levitre-Hangartner-Wood-Butler

[JinWPB]

First I was afraid

I was petrified

Kept thinking I could never live

without you by my side

But I spent so many nights

thinking how you did me wrong

I grew strong

I learned how to carry on

[stuckincincy]

First I was afraid

I was petrified

Kept thinking I could never live

without you by my side

But I spent so many nights

thinking how you did me wrong

I grew strong

I learned how to carry on

 

 

Half a league

Half a league

Half a league

Onward

With a hey-nonny-nonny

And a hot-cha-cha! *

 

 

* Outright stolen from P.G. Wodehouse.

[DrDawkinstein]

there is definitely something to the whole "gelling" concept.

 

back in high school, i was a starting defenseman for my schools lacrosse team. by the time we got to senior year, the other 2 defensemen and I had 2 prior seasons together, AND we were very close friends. the way we played that third season compared to the first, was night and day. we were a dominant force out there that punished kids for trying to bring the ball into our zone.

 

it was to the point that i rarely ever had to turn and look where the other 2 were, and the same for them. we always knew where the others were going to be and what they were going to do. even though everyone knew what we were "supposed" to be doing according to the gameplan and general rules of defense.

 

the same holds true for the offensive line in football. even on something as simple as a running play where you are supposed to just hit the guy in front of you. yes, you can say that through coaching they should know where everyone is going to be, but when you are on the field good players play on instinct. you dont have time to think of the play diagram in your head and figure out where everyone is going to be. you either know it (feel it) or you dont. when you are close to everyone and familiar with everyone, you know. and that allows you the confidence to simply handle your job because you know everyone else is handling theirs.

[Deadstroke]

Can someone explain what it means for an OL to "gel?"

 

What sort of intrinsic skills and reads require this nebulous gel-time?

 

It seems that knowing your teammates habits and having the capacity for non-verbal communication (two of the things I ASSUME to be part of the "gelling" process) would come after a training camp together, at the very least.

 

Plus this whole "gelling" thing seems like a pretty Girl-Scout concept for a bunch of pros.

 

Can someone shed a little technical light on this subject?

 

You obviously never played the game... and now are foolishly making light of it, to your own detriment!

[SuperKillerRobots]

Nice. Thank you!

 

I'm still skeptical that all these intangible "gelling" elements can't be learned through OTA's, walkthroughs, and training camp. Still seems like "basic" stuff in the grand scheme of things.

 

I think you're right about it being basic stuff in the grand scheme of things, but I don't think you can discount the importance. It might not take a group of geniuses to "gel" (though I'm sure smarter players would get it together quicker), but I think it does take time. Depending on how complex the line calls are and how well everyone learns them, I could imagine it might take a year or more (or less for that matter). I think one of the things that everyone likes to discount about these "team/group" type things is the specific personality of each individual in the group. If the personalities are such where everyone gets a long naturally and can respect each other, they will come together as a group quicker. No one likes to admit this line of thinking because we view these guys as "professionals", but the reality of it is that they are just people and in msot cases they are not people who have worked incredibly hard for years and years to get to where they are now. Most of them have worked hard, but not over a 20 or even 10 year period. They are talanted, so it's not like comparing them to someone like Bob Wilmers over at M&T is really valid. These guys are just people and respond to things like most people (you, I, or anyone) would.

[The Big Cat]

I think one of the things that everyone likes to discount about these "team/group" type things is the specific personality of each individual in the group. If the personalities are such where everyone gets a long naturally and can respect each other, they will come together as a group quicker.

 

Hence the push for "high character" players and the benefit of having Jauron as the coach, IMO.

[The Big Cat]

You obviously never played the game... and now are foolishly making light of it, to your own detriment!

 

Oh applesauce! Did my draft value just drop!?

[Steely Dan]

Okay, then basic OL 101 followup question:

 

I assume if it's a run, unless a guy comes out to pull, they're just hitting the first guy in front of them, or at least a body in a pre-determined area.

 

If it's a pass, things get a little more tricky, but you're still blocking someone in somewhat of a designated area. Does an OLman pass block with his head on a swivel, especially if he's doubled up on a defender? Are they all collectively looking for someone else to block? (i.e. the delayed blitzer like you mentioned)

 

The reason I ask, is because the "gel" concept seems to assume zen-like expectations, the OLine moving in a synchronized, non-verbal harmony. And I get the impression that folks around here have been groomed to EXPECT this kind of gelling, as if OLine success if impossible without it.

 

I have never played OL, for some reason at 5'5", I was never even asked. Also, my medical problems kept me from playing. Anyhoo, It seems to me that an O-line can have great success when first put together but they get better and better as time goes on, in most cases. Also, on running plays they have to be prepared for a LB shooting through the hole and who's going to be the OL responsible for that if something unexpected happens.

 

I don't pretend to understand offensive line play. Like many fans I try to pay attention to it but it's pretty easy to be "distracted" by the skill positions and the actual location of the ball.

 

I tried to find (unsuccessfully) an article I read about the Steelers line in crisis last year around late October and how the O-linemen took it upon themselves to eat, drink, breath, sleep and talk football for every second available to them and how they credited this commitment with turning around their play.

It may be hard (I have no first hand knowledge) to understand the extent to which this unit needs to be in synch. I've played on sports teams before and in workplaces but I don't know if any of this even remotely approaches the commitment needed to succeed in professional sports where the "win at all costs" mentality pervades virtually every single opponent you play against. It seems like these guys have to work lots of voluntary overtime just to stay on par with their opponents (remember Donte Whitner's regular DB meetings during the season).

 

Offensive line play is as simple as John Madden makes it sound and is also probably very difficult to master as a unit. Like they say about Texas Hold'em, "it takes five minutes to learn and a lifetime to master."

 

Here's the very excellent Wikipedia entry on Zone Blocking schemes. Some teams use Zone blocking, others Man blocking, and most teams use a combination of both. It's a fascinating read and I hope many of you will check it out:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zone_blocking

 

Here's an article about the Steeler's line woes that explains your point above.

 

If a positive has come out of those mistakes — as well as the criticism leveled at the players responsible — it is the group film sessions that have bolstered the linemen's cohesion and confidence.

 

"I think we're starting to understand each other a lot more," Colon said. "I think we're starting to talk without talking, if you will. I think we're right where we need to be right now."

 

 

Yeah, I wasn't thrilled with his analogy either. No offense William Robert.

 

Mainly because you can fail in a free-flow game and then have the opportunity to make up for it seconds later. Seems to me that "failures" on the offensive line are brutally costly.

 

Having said that, just read Guahgagan's blurb about our new interior being "super smart:" how much of this 'gelling' nonsense falls to the three guys inside, and how much will those meaty brains expedite the "process?"

 

To quote Marv Levy, by memory, "Smart players get better". I think that's true of every position. JMO

 

 

You obviously never played the game... and now are foolishly making light of it, to your own detriment!

 

If you read through the whole thread, you'll see after having things explained to him, you'll see he is taking it seriously.

[Steely Dan]

[San Jose Bills Fan]

Can someone explain what it means for an OL to "gel?"

 

What sort of intrinsic skills and reads require this nebulous gel-time?

 

It seems that knowing your teammates habits and having the capacity for non-verbal communication (two of the things I ASSUME to be part of the "gelling" process) would come after a training camp together, at the very least.

 

Plus this whole "gelling" thing seems like a pretty Girl-Scout concept for a bunch of pros.

 

Can someone shed a little technical light on this subject?

You obviously never played the game... and now are foolishly making light of it, to your own detriment!

Wow. That wasn't my take at all Deadstroke. The Big Cat might have been skeptical, but I wasn't feeling that he was "making light" of it. It's a fair question IMO...basically how many hours/days/weeks/months before the line plays as one.

 

Steely, thanks for the solid post above and the link that I couldn't find. That's the one. Also thanks for the dollop of humor.

 

Well the new core of the Bills OL looks to be football junkies with a mean streak...students of the game and sadists at the same time. I expect great things from this group. I don't think we'll be seeing much underachieving from this group.

[Steely Dan]

Wow. That wasn't my take at all Deadstroke. The Big Cat might have been skeptical, but I wasn't feeling that he was "making light" of it. It's a fair question IMO...basically how many hours/days/weeks/months before the line plays as one.

 

Steely, thanks for the solid post above and the link that I couldn't find. That's the one. Also thanks for the dollop of humor.

Well the new core of the Bills OL looks to be football junkies with a mean streak...students of the game and sadists at the same time. I expect great things from this group. I don't think we'll be seeing much underachieving from this group.

 

[colin]

This what I really know about Gelling- If the Bills are starting a bunch of people who have never played together or are playing new positions Bills fans will say that gelling is coach speak hogwash- if the Bills suck in 2009, Bills fans will say we'll get them in 2010 when our OL gells- yes it's all about the gelling everybody knows that.

 

it's interesting that the exact same line was better in 07 than in 08. i don't buy gelling as much as i buy playing better together, which takes a lot less time if the offense and protections suit the players.

 

if the guys only have to block for a little bit, then they will seeming gel right away.

[John from Riverside]

There is a lot of communication that goes on between offensive linemen that you dont see when it comes to "who has what assignment" for a specific defensive player

 

To me the center is one of the most important aspects of this....that is why I could never understand why teams pay a zillion dollars to a LT....then go cheap on the center. To me it should be equal.

 

Then you have your communication between Guards and Tackles which is essential.

 

When teams "gel" these communications happen much quicker and are much more in sink. This is where you get your opportunity for either a big running play or a deep throw.

[Steely Dan]

There is a lot of communication that goes on between offensive linemen that you dont see when it comes to "who has what assignment" for a specific defensive player

 

To me the center is one of the most important aspects of this....that is why I could never understand why teams pay a zillion dollars to a LT....then go cheap on the center. To me it should be equal.

 

Then you have your communication between Guards and Tackles which is essential.

 

When teams "gel" these communications happen much quicker and are much more in sink. This is where you get your opportunity for either a big running play or a deep throw.

 

I totally agree with that!

[The Big Cat]

There is a lot of communication that goes on between offensive linemen that you dont see when it comes to "who has what assignment" for a specific defensive player

 

To me the center is one of the most important aspects of this....that is why I could never understand why teams pay a zillion dollars to a LT....then go cheap on the center. To me it should be equal.

 

Then you have your communication between Guards and Tackles which is essential.

 

When teams "gel" these communications happen much quicker and are much more in sink. This is where you get your opportunity for either a big running play or a deep throw.

 

Remember when Peters wouldn't communicate with ANYONE until training camp? That was so lame.

[San Jose Bills Fan]

There is a lot of communication that goes on between offensive linemen that you dont see when it comes to "who has what assignment" for a specific defensive player

 

To me the center is one of the most important aspects of this....that is why I could never understand why teams pay a zillion dollars to a LT....then go cheap on the center. To me it should be equal.

 

Then you have your communication between Guards and Tackles which is essential.

 

When teams "gel" these communications happen much quicker and are much more in sink. This is where you get your opportunity for either a big running play or a deep throw.

Very good point John. Not only that but the franchise figure for centers was even behind that of guards this past year (technically they're all considered offensive linemen). Players like Dockery, Hutchinson, Faneca, and Eric Steinbach all got big contracts as guards.

 

So as it stands now, centers are the lowest paid offensive linemen in terms of the franchise number.

[The Dean]

Can someone explain what it means for an OL to "gel?"

 

What sort of intrinsic skills and reads require this nebulous gel-time?

 

It seems that knowing your teammates habits and having the capacity for non-verbal communication (two of the things I ASSUME to be part of the "gelling" process) would come after a training camp together, at the very least.

 

Plus this whole "gelling" thing seems like a pretty Girl-Scout concept for a bunch of pros.

 

Can someone shed a little technical light on this subject?

 

It has something to do with Dr. Scholl's® inserts.

[Chandler#81]

It has something to do with Dr. Scholl's® inserts.

 

Indeed it does. Big Cat, I'm struggling to comprehend if you really don't understand that TIME TOGETHER is the essence of this magic 'gel' or just trying to get a rise out of everyone. If your intent is the latter, then I'm at least grateful for some well versed insights from many other posters, which have qualified your thread.

 

Short answer: even if we win the Super Bowl this year, the OL will be better next year from their experiences working together this year. Get it??

[/dev/null]

This should help explain it