Trent Edwards

[K-9]

I'm not sure how much it retarded his maturation as an NFL QB but I would be interested in your explanation of what you meant.

 

One of the most amazing things to me about Kelly over his entire career was for a guy with a huge ego, a cannon for an arm, a bunch of good fast receivers, and free reign calling plays, he sure called an awful lot of runs.

 

Perhaps maturation is the wrong term. But he had to learn to be a drop back QB at the NFL level as a result of being a run and shoot QB. Just a different animal. Sometimes it's harder to unlearn something than learn something new. But with his acquired ability to make hot reads on the go in the R&S it made it easier for him to do the same in the NFL while doing staight drop backs.

 

As for calling those runs, I agree. He could make pre-snap reads with the best of them (again, a skill I attribute to his pro experience working with Mouse Davis) and he was NEVER afraid to audible to a run. A particular play against KC, I believe in his first year with us, where he audibled to a run to Riddick was a thing of beauty. We were in the stands seeing the same KC adjustments and were screaming for Kelly to make that call. Fantastic.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[SouthGeorgiaBillsFan]

But, correct me if i'm wrong, wouldn't that have indicated that we should have stuck with JP?

 

You are wrong.

[billsfan_34]

Not to push the issue but is 10 years really longevity?

Of course it is in the NFL. Its a physical sport where the average life expectancy of a career is 4 years.

[Tcali]

Im calling your bluff...show me, because thats ludricrus...Kurt Warner has a lot of them and a heck of a lot in his super bowl years and you can add Manning, Brady, Farve, and McNabb all to that list amongst others. Sure, they may be exceptions where a QB like Cutler goes off but the defense gives up 45 points and they still lose, but a 300 yard QB is a very good thing and I am sure it equals more wins than losses...

 

In other words, all the top QB's are likely to throw for 300 yards on any given day, and I would be willing to bet that they win a lot more than they lose when they have thrown for 300 yards...

 

No offense inteded, but it sure sounds like you just pulled that out of your ass with that one to help soften the blow in the TE discussion becuase he has only one 300 yard game since High School, yes, High School...just one...and none in the NFL...

 

FYI: During that span since High School of only one 300 yard game, Trent has a losing record and nearly half his games have been under 200 yards in the pros...

 

Here is a way more accurate statement...you show me a QB who throws for under 200 yards and I will show you the QB of the LOSING team...

Of course I wasn't speaking in absolutes. But QBs who tend to rack up big #s are often coming from behind and playing agianst prevent defenses...and are also more prone to big mistakes.They also aren't killing the clock and demoralizing and tiring the other teams D. I stand by my statement.-TRENT is a very poor example because he doesnt throw for 300 yards anyway. What kind of conclusions can you draw from that?-And bringing in the fact that half his games are under 200 yards doesn't prove any point.-I would love Trent to throw for more yards--and to be a better downfield passer. That doesn't change the fact that QBs throwing a huge number of passes and racking up big yards tend to be on the losing side of games(with obvious common sense exceptions implied of course).

[Tcali]

See Brady, Tom.

 

 

And I'm sure all top 5 high school Qbs (as Trent was) are just recruited by college powerhouses because they are just "cool" in the pocket. They rarely have any physical tools.

I didn't say he didn't have any physical tools. I like the way you reword my post to suit your needs.

Brady has a better arm than Trent(not by much).

[Virgil]

I didn't say he didn't have any physical tools. I like the way you reword my post to suit your needs.

Brady has a better arm than Trent(not by much).

 

I'm not sure how you would prove that, but I would have to strongly disagree. I saw some deep throws by Brady two years ago that I sincerely doubt Edwards could make with the same velocity. Especially the deep ball. However, I remember people talking about Brady not having a strong arm when he first took over for Bledsoe, but did some off-season work to improve that. I can't imagine it was just as simple as working out, but whatever he did, please pass that knowledge on to Trent.

[The Dean]

I didn't say he didn't have any physical tools. I like the way you reword my post to suit your needs.

Brady has a better arm than Trent(not by much).

 

 

Brady has developed a very good long ball, something he didn't have early in his career. I would guess Trent's arm strength now, is similar to what Brady had at the same time in his career. Don't forget, Montana didn't have a canon, either. But, those guys are the exceptions, and Trent isn't likely to be either. Still, Trent's arm strength is way down the list on his issues, IMO.

[Flbillsfan#1]

Brady has developed a very good long ball, something he didn't have early in his career. I would guess Trent's arm strength now, is similar to what Brady had at the same time in his career. Don't forget, Montana didn't have a canon, either. But, those guys are the exceptions, and Trent isn't likely to be either. Still, Trent's arm strength is way down the list on his issues, IMO.

I agree, I think Trents problem is the fact he does not make the throw that is there & instead CHECKS DOWN when he doesn't have to.

[Tcali]

Brady has developed a very good long ball, something he didn't have early in his career. I would guess Trent's arm strength now, is similar to what Brady had at the same time in his career. Don't forget, Montana didn't have a canon, either. But, those guys are the exceptions, and Trent isn't likely to be either. Still, Trent's arm strength is way down the list on his issues, IMO.

mmmm..i still give Brady the edge(slight) in arm strength. I think TEs arm strength is sufficient though. Montana of course did not have a cannon...but he threw a very tight ball..tight spiral.

I agree Trent isnt gonna be montana or Brady..but I do think he has some very good qualities for a young QB. He needs to work on finishing drives--developing the killer instinct..........But dare I say it..lets hope he isn't concussion prone. If he is he will be out of the league in 2 years.

[Tcali]

I agree, I think Trents problem is the fact he does not make the throw that is there & instead CHECKS DOWN when he doesn't have to.

yeah--thats part of the wimpiness factor....perhaps a reflection of the coach he loves so much?

[Tcali]

QUOTE (Tcali @ Apr 30 2009, 06:40 PM)

I didn't say he didn't have any physical tools. I like the way you reword my post to suit your needs.

Brady has a better arm than Trent(not by much).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'm not sure how you would prove that, but I would have to strongly disagree. I saw some deep throws by Brady two years ago that I sincerely doubt Edwards could make with the same velocity. Especially the deep ball. However, I remember people talking about Brady not having a strong arm when he first took over for Bledsoe, but did some off-season work to improve that. I can't imagine it was just as simple as working out, but whatever he did, please pass that knowledge on to Trent.

 

You are strongly disagreeing with me?? hmmmmmmm

[bizell]

I didn't say he didn't have any physical tools. I like the way you reword my post to suit your needs.

Brady has a better arm than Trent(not by much).

 

I agree with Dean - Brady at this point in his career can make every throw at every level. Did you see that last throw to Moss in the Super Bowl before last? It had to be at least 60 yards and it was right on the money to Moss.

 

I also agree that Edwards at this point is probably comparable to Brady's arm at this point in his career.

[Tcali]

I agree with Dean - Brady at this point in his career can make every throw at every level. Did you see that last throw to Moss in the Super Bowl before last? It had to be at least 60 yards and it was right on the money to Moss.

 

I also agree that Edwards at this point is probably comparable to Brady's arm at this point in his career.

So you agree with me that Brady has a better arm than Trent. We can only speak of the here and now not what may be in the future. QBs dont necessarily get better arm stength as their careers progress.

By the way a 60 yard pass in the NFL is expected--not some great feat.

[WordByrd]

I agree, I think Trents problem is the fact he does not make the throw that is there & instead CHECKS DOWN when he doesn't have to.

 

And how would you know? Can you look downfield to see what's open from your seat/TV? not well enough. I'll take Trent's ability to get someone the ball, and let them do something with it over a guy who has a cannon that can't find a receiver. Enough with the "Checkdown Trent". It's all over TSW, and it's not even a problem in reality. Once again, I suggest you watch the tapes of last year's games. Trent threw deep when he had the opportunity. Problem was, with receivers like Short Lee, Slow Josh, and whoever happened to be #3 that day, in addition to horrible TE's, Trent did fine.

[The Dean]

And how would you know? Can you look downfield to see what's open from your seat/TV? not well enough. I'll take Trent's ability to get someone the ball, and let them do something with it over a guy who has a cannon that can't find a receiver. Enough with the "Checkdown Trent". It's all over TSW, and it's not even a problem in reality. Once again, I suggest you watch the tapes of last year's games. Trent threw deep when he had the opportunity. Problem was, with receivers like Short Lee, Slow Josh, and whoever happened to be #3 that day, in addition to horrible TE's, Trent did fine.

 

 

Actually it's very easy to see when you watch the game in person, and fairly easy to see on TV replays: Trent opts to the check down far too often. I doubt Trent or the coaches will even argue with that.

 

I think Trent needs to develop the confidence to throw the ball to the WR BEFORE he becomes wide open. Trent is still at the point where he needs to see the WR open before he lets it go. That isn't going to get it done, in the NFL. I hope the addition of TO helps Trent develop the confidence to trust the WR and let the ball go, more often.

[thebug]

So you agree with me that Brady has a better arm than Trent. We can only speak of the here and now not what may be in the future. QBs dont necessarily get better arm stength as their careers progress.

By the way a 60 yard pass in the NFL is expected--not some great feat.

 

 

Yep, playbooks are loaded with 60 yard pass patterns.

[San Jose Bills Fan]

From a different thread a few weeks ago.

 

If you listened to the radio last year, Kelso was saying over and over and over as he did the color, "He had a man open downfield but he went to the safety valve. Perhaps he didn't see him..."

This is a very legitimate concern with Trent. He definitely could change, and we all would love to see it happen, but right now he takes the safe two-yarder much too often, even if it's third and eleven.

 

As most of you know I'm a big Trent fan. As most serious football fans know, the 3rd year for a quarterback is considered a make or break year. For some reason it tends to be the year where a quarterback shows his true colors.

 

As much as I believe in Trent, his biggest weakness is throwing down the field. Unlike others who insist that it's an arm strength issue, I believe it is simply a reluctance to take risks. He has plenty enough arm to hit downfield targets. His arm is considerably stronger than Drew Brees' for instance.

 

When former Bill Matt Bowen stated last week in no uncertain terms that Edwards hesitates to make downfield throws it carried a lot of weight. Bowen is a former teammate and as a longtime NFL DB has and probably continues to study a lot of film.

When I worked for the CBS affiliate in Buffalo Brian Blessing and I had an opportunity to watch some game film with Mark Kelso. It was amazing seeing how advanced his understanding of the game was. If Mark Kelso and Matt Bowen say the same thing, then in my mind, the criticism of Trent is valid. Two experts, former NFL defensive backs say that Trent has to take more chances downfield and be less willing to check down. Period.

 

That said, I believe he will take the next step as a QB and become an outstanding NFL player this year.

[2020 Our Year For Sure]

And how would you know? Can you look downfield to see what's open from your seat/TV? not well enough. I'll take Trent's ability to get someone the ball, and let them do something with it over a guy who has a cannon that can't find a receiver. Enough with the "Checkdown Trent". It's all over TSW, and it's not even a problem in reality. Once again, I suggest you watch the tapes of last year's games. Trent threw deep when he had the opportunity. Problem was, with receivers like Short Lee, Slow Josh, and whoever happened to be #3 that day, in addition to horrible TE's, Trent did fine.

Uh...no. In addition to San Jose's post, I remember Jaws pointing out during the Cleveland game that he had open guys all over the field and wasn't getting them the ball. The kid was fantastic in the first 6 games last year, but equally as bad in most of the others.

 

People always want to make excuses, its Jauron, its Schonert, its the receivers, its the line, and on and on. But far too often last year, the protection held up, and our guys were open but nothing came their way. This is squarely on the quarterback; he's got to get better.

 

There's really nothing wrong with a quarterback being imperfect and inconsistent at this point in his career. But this season, surrounded by all these weapons and a solid interior O-line, its time for the light to click.

 

But I don't want to hear about coaching if he's dropping back and standing around like he doesn't know the playcall, like I've seen far too often. We all know he's capable of being a good quarterback; its time to put it all together.

[billsrcursed]

Actually it's very easy to see when you watch the game in person, and fairly easy to see on TV replays: Trent opts to the check down far too often. I doubt Trent or the coaches will even argue with that.

 

I think Trent needs to develop the confidence to throw the ball to the WR BEFORE he becomes wide open. Trent is still at the point where he needs to see the WR open before he lets it go. That isn't going to get it done, in the NFL. I hope the addition of TO helps Trent develop the confidence to trust the WR and let the ball go, more often.

 

This is the first post I've ever read of yours that I'm going to have to disagree with, and slightly at that.

 

The idea or thought that Trent didn't throw to guys who were covered can be dismissed by what some would call the best catch of the year last year; Evans in the endzone against his head. A designed play in which, if you watch the replay, Trent had an open check down and chucked it up anyway to allow Lee to make a play. Lee was covered about as good as anyone could have covered him in that situation. there were plenty more, but I'm not going to sift through game tape and list them all.

 

Just because he threw to Reed and Royal more often than others does NOT mean he was checking down every time he got them the ball (BTW, we all KNOW Lee was double teamed more times than not, so in that case, a check down is warranted) and I would even go as far as to suggest Reed was targeted for his ability to gain the first down marker, get open, and catch the ball, all while not being double teamed.

 

The Cleveland game, however, was a case where Trent simply played poorly. I did not see that Trent anywhere else throughout the season.

[The Dean]

This is the first post I've ever read of yours that I'm going to have to disagree with, and slightly at that.

 

The idea or thought that Trent didn't throw to guys who were covered can be dismissed by what some would call the best catch of the year last year; Evans in the endzone against his head. A designed play in which, if you watch the replay, Trent had an open check down and chucked it up anyway to allow Lee to make a play. Lee was covered about as good as anyone could have covered him in that situation. there were plenty more, but I'm not going to sift through game tape and list them all.

 

Just because he threw to Reed and Royal more often than others does NOT mean he was checking down every time he got them the ball (BTW, we all KNOW Lee was double teamed more times than not, so in that case, a check down is warranted) and I would even go as far as to suggest Reed was targeted for his ability to gain the first down marker, get open, and catch the ball, all while not being double teamed.

 

The Cleveland game, however, was a case where Trent simply played poorly. I did not see that Trent anywhere else throughout the season.

 

 

Feel free to disagree with me any time you care to. Especially when you are going to be correct! IMO you are correct about the throw to Evans...it was a terrific, and bold throw.

 

But, I don't think anyone suggested Trent checks down on EVERY single throw...just on far too many. It is probably a combination of him being young, having a suspect offensive line and perhaps having smaller WRs that has caused him to overuse the check down. It also may reflect the Bills conservative style, which might work against throwing to WRs before they make their breaks.

 

I also think you are correct about Reed, but I would make one alteration. Trent actually throws to Josh when he is covered (sometimes well covered) and I think he has confidence to do that because Reed has proven he will make the catch even while getting contact, and the passes to Reed are generally shorter routes, which I think are a little more comfortable for Trent, at this point in his career.