Trent Edwards

[The Dean]

I don't think he did have plenty of talent around him at all. Josh Reed is a below average #2 WR, and teams were able to effectively focus their defense on shutting out Evans, and Royal was below average and we also got poor play from LT and Interior O Line last year.

 

 

Reed is not your typical #2, and shouldn't have to fill that role. But, why do the coaches treat the WR corp in a traditional manner, if they don't have traditional talent? Instead of using a #2, they should have found more opportunities to spread the field with Evans, Reed, Parish, Jackson, Lynch, Johnson, Hardy, etc. Remove Royal from the equation and force the defense to deal with 4 wides. I think they could have run all day, out of that formation, and had plenty of opportunities for a quick strike.

 

But, really, the coaching brain cramps cane on easier, and more traditional situations, more often than not. Regularly leaving the backfield empty on a short yardage play is downright dumb, and does nothing to help the QB succeed, IMO. Thankfully Reed is a sensational 3rd down WR, who catches everything thrown his way. If it wasn't for that, they would have had even less production.

 

Yes, this year they have more talent, and can use the WRs more traditionally. I think it will be harder for the coaches to screw up, with TO and a better TE added to the receiving options. I think the improved interior will help the O Line, too.

 

But, don't excuse the coaches for not calling plays, and using formations, that fit the talent they have. That's their job, IMO.

[K-9]

Reed is not your typical #2, and shouldn't have to fill that role. But, why do the coaches treat the WR corp in a traditional manner, if they don't have traditional talent? Instead of using a #2, they should have found more opportunities to spread the field with Evans, Reed, Parish, Jackson, Lynch, Johnson, Hardy, etc. Remove Royal from the equation and force the defense to deal with 4 wides. I think they could have run all day, out of that formation, and had plenty of opportunities for a quick strike.

 

I want to agree with this and have often espoused the use of the spread formation to do just what you suggest. But then I realize we didn't have the talent across the board to do that. Even with Royal removed (and I'm glad he is), your OL has got to be DOMINANT to run that spread. The formation is VERY vulnerable off the edge and I won't even mention up the middle (Fowler, Preston?).

 

#2, your QB and receivers have to be masters at pre/post snap reads. JP was never there and Edwards wasn't there either. But neither are any QBs so early in their careers. I hope he takes the leap this year.

 

#3, your WRs in that spread better be able to make their own pre/post snap reads AND be on the same page as their QB. Again, especially in the case of Roscoe and Hardy, it was apparant they are not good at it.

 

All that adds up to the coaches not having the confidence in their personnel to run formations that pressure defenses to adjust to mismatches created by being spread out. Young QB, especially.

 

I'm hoping that changes this year. I know Evans, Reed, and TO have the smarts/awareness. But that's a wash if TE doesn't mature as well. I'm confident our OL has the smarts and now the physical ability to mititgate the vulnerabilities of being spread out. We can do serious damage as was evidenced the few times the last couple years when we DID use the spread and WERE successful, especially running the ball. But doing it all the time when you don't have the personnel makes it too easy for the D adjust and blow it up as was the case the last couple years.

 

Here's hoping we see it A LOT more this year. I really believe we have the horses in place to do it.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[BuffaloBill]

The Bills season will be defined by whether Edwards takes a big step forward this year. He has shown flashes of great play and good decision making but has done the opposite also. In the Cleveland game last year he looked lost and confused. He also struggled against teams that just dropped seven or eight guys into coverage even though he had time to throw. TO gives him another target so we will see how this helps. Clearly, this is a make or break year for TE and his coach.

[flomoe]

In answer to the original question...........NO

 

I would settle for him being a consistantly 200 yard guy about now, but that isn't even realistic yet. Obviously, Trent has a couple more weapons this year that he didn't last but possibly the biggest glaring weakness of Trent is that, besides the fragilty, his mental state to be an every down quarterback in this league is suspect. Overlooking his ability to garner a 4th quarter comeback in the Jax game, the games in which he downright sucked for large portions of them trumps all the decent things he did. Yes, there are 10 other players on the field at any given time but there still has to be that huge question mark about his overall mental state for 60 minutes.

 

Flame away but the record is there. Flashes of a decent QB.....yes, flashes of a great QB........maybe, signs of just a decent QB in todays NFL......REALISTIC.

 

I like the guy, I just hope he blossoms before he wilts.

[Magox]

The Bills season will be defined by whether Edwards takes a big step forward this year. He has shown flashes of great play and good decision making but has done the opposite also. In the Cleveland game last year he looked lost and confused. He also struggled against teams that just dropped seven or eight guys into coverage even though he had time to throw. TO gives him another target so we will see how this helps. Clearly, this is a make or break year for TE and his coach.

Dean makes a good point about the preparation or lack of on game day. I don't think it is coincidental that Edwards struggled much more against 3-4 teams than the 4-3 teams. I think a lack of gameday preparation from the coaching staff and the weak interior O Line had as much to do with that than the play of Edwards. It was his first full year under the center and it was Schonerts first year as OC as well. My guess is that they will address that this year, which they all ready have in adding Hangartner, Levitre and Wood, and I believe that they will game plan much more intensely in being more effective against 3-4 alignments that drop back more DB's into coverage. Edwards seems to be a very intelligent QB and I believe he will recognize open Receivers more effectively than last year.

[DieHardBillsFan]

What I want to see from TE is a strong second half of the season. As soon as some cold creeps up on him he seems to fall apart. His QB rating was close to 100 and granted the quality of defenses Buffalo played in the first half of the year was poorest in the NFL. But the same happened his rookie season. I need a strong second half before TE is the real future for Buffalo IMO. Along with that a serious increase in TDs. But I try not to ask too much of anyone

[C.Biscuit97]

In answer to the original question...........NO

 

I would settle for him being a consistantly 200 yard guy about now, but that isn't even realistic yet. Obviously, Trent has a couple more weapons this year that he didn't last but possibly the biggest glaring weakness of Trent is that, besides the fragilty, his mental state to be an every down quarterback in this league is suspect. Overlooking his ability to garner a 4th quarter comeback in the Jax game, the games in which he downright sucked for large portions of them trumps all the decent things he did. Yes, there are 10 other players on the field at any given time but there still has to be that huge question mark about his overall mental state for 60 minutes.

 

Flame away but the record is there. Flashes of a decent QB.....yes, flashes of a great QB........maybe, signs of just a decent QB in todays NFL......REALISTIC.

 

I like the guy, I just hope he blossoms before he wilts.

 

 

1) He averaged 214 yards per game last year in games he finished, including that NE with was a stat killer (see Matt Cassell's 78 yards).

 

2) Teams with a worse receving core than us last year: Fins, Titans, and Bears. Reed is a really good #3 receiver but is a terrible #2. Teams wanted Royal to attempt to catch the ball because he might just fumble it. Defenses keyed on Evans and forced other guys to beat you. We couldn't because our weapons weren't good enough.

 

In his 7 seasons as a starting NFL, Brady only 3 times had more than the 7.2 ypa tht Edwards had. One of those came after they got Randy Moss. All QBs need playmakers. We didn't have enough. Now, we do.

 

3) Edwards just finished his 2nd season right? Players are allowed to improve, right???

[Mickey]

As I look at our offensive weapons, it's hard to not get excited about the explosive possibilities. With TO and Evans on both sides of the field, Reed/Johnson/Parrish should see great open zones. With Nelson, Derek Fine becomes immediately better just by now having the worst coverman on the other team put on him.

 

I admit that I am concerned about out OT situation. But I also agree that, with such a solid interior, the Tackle position becomes less important. Jason Peters was usually left out on an island by himself. This won't be the case with our new O-line. I also believe that our power run game will be much improved which will only open up the passing game more.

 

From that, I have two concerns. Our Offensive Scheme and Trent Edwards.

 

For the Offensive Scheme, there really isn't much we can do about that. Especially if DJ trys to play the game close to the vest and hope for a 4th quarter win. That basically screws us.

 

However, I also have to wonder how much different we all would feel with a Cutler, Favre, Manning's, McNabb. I know that I am listing Pro Bowler's here, but there are all guys who consistently find their way to 300 yard games. I think it's something that some QB's "have" and other don't. I don't have the stats in front of me, but I don't think Trent has even broken this barrier. Between that, and his health issues, my question is, how sold on him are you to lead this offense to it's potential?

I love your enthusiasm but some of this is pretty pie in the sky. For example, where does this "...such a solid interior..." notion come from? Wood and Levitre haven't played a single down of NFL football yet. Hangartner wasn't good enough to start with his last team. I think we are all hoping that they will improve over time but it is a little premature to prounounce the interior of the line to be "solid".

[flomoe]

1) He averaged 214 yards per game last year in games he finished, including that NE with was a stat killer (see Matt Cassell's 78 yards).

 

2) Teams with a worse receving core than us last year: Fins, Titans, and Bears. Reed is a really good #3 receiver but is a terrible #2. Teams wanted Royal to attempt to catch the ball because he might just fumble it. Defenses keyed on Evans and forced other guys to beat you. We couldn't because our weapons weren't good enough.

 

In his 7 seasons as a starting NFL, Brady only 3 times had more than the 7.2 ypa tht Edwards had. One of those came after they got Randy Moss. All QBs need playmakers. We didn't have enough. Now, we do.

 

3) Edwards just finished his 2nd season right? Players are allowed to improve, right???

 

Yes. I honestly hope he does because we don't have another QB on the roster that can step in and honestly take this team to another level.

 

The stats are there to argue my point about Edwards but it's the intangibles in his game that really make me question him. I think he has all the physical tools to be an above average QB in the league. It's the mental part that I worry about. The sulking on the sideline, the inability to figure out a 3-4 defense....ever, the inability to adjust to the climatic changes that happen in Buffalo or his propensity to dump off long before allowing the play to develop or just sticking it in there when there is a hole to stick it in.

 

That's all mental and hopefully with him being a 3rd year QB, some of that mental block has worn off. I'm just not sure it has or will. As a Bills fan, I hope it will.

[Mickey]

1) He averaged 214 yards per game last year in games he finished, including that NE with was a stat killer (see Matt Cassell's 78 yards).

 

2) Teams with a worse receving core than us last year: Fins, Titans, and Bears. Reed is a really good #3 receiver but is a terrible #2. Teams wanted Royal to attempt to catch the ball because he might just fumble it. Defenses keyed on Evans and forced other guys to beat you. We couldn't because our weapons weren't good enough.

 

In his 7 seasons as a starting NFL, Brady only 3 times had more than the 7.2 ypa tht Edwards had. One of those came after they got Randy Moss. All QBs need playmakers. We didn't have enough. Now, we do.

 

3) Edwards just finished his 2nd season right? Players are allowed to improve, right???

Yes, and we are also allowed to assess their performance whenever we want. Trent Edwards has not covinced me that he is a franchise QB yet. He just hasn't played particularly well in a number of games. The jury is still out but by this time next year we could be talking either about his new contract or about his release. This is a pivotal year for him.

[C.Biscuit97]

[/b]

 

Yes. I honestly hope he does because we don't have another QB on the roster that can step in and honestly take this team to another level.

 

The stats are there to argue my point about Edwards but it's the intangibles in his game that really make me question him. I think he has all the physical tools to be an above average QB in the league. It's the mental part that I worry about. The sulking on the sideline, the inability to figure out a 3-4 defense....ever, the inability to adjust to the climatic changes that happen in Buffalo or his propensity to dump off long before allowing the play to develop or just sticking it in there when there is a hole to stick it in.

 

That's all mental and hopefully with him being a 3rd year QB, some of that mental block has worn off. I'm just not sure it has or will. As a Bills fan, I hope it will.

 

 

Fair enough, but I don't remember Edwards sulking. But IMO, part of Edwrds' problem with 3-4 defenses is that 2 of our top 3 receiving options (Reed and Royal) aren't fast enough to cause a defense to adjust. Reed has average to below average speed for a wr and a LB could somewhat effectively cover him. And we all know about Robert Royal.

 

Football is all about matchups. We were on offense, we didn't have many favorable ones. However, with TO, Reed being a #3, and now a speedy TE like Nelson, we have a lot of favorable matchups. It's all on Turk and Edwards. No excuses. And personally, I look for a very good year out of this offense. If not, then it's back to drawing board.

[C.Biscuit97]

Yes, and we are also allowed to assess their performance whenever we want. Trent Edwards has not covinced me that he is a franchise QB yet. He just hasn't played particularly well in a number of games. The jury is still out but by this time next year we could be talking either about his new contract or about his release. This is a pivotal year for him.

 

 

Agred about this being his make or break year. But how many QBs prove without a doubt that they are franchise guys in their 2nd season out of college?

[Alphadawg7]

Are we supposed to making a case for Trent? I thought we were responding to a dumbass post about his ability to throw for 300 yards, as if that is something important in the NFL.

 

I try to be a realist about Trent, the way I would be about any QB for the Bills. When the coaches start calling a competent game, and the QB fails to execute that plan at a competent level, then I will judge the Bills' QB harshly. Until then, we really don't know what we have. We know some of his strengths and weaknesses, but QBs with greater weaknesses have been successful in the NFL, in the past.

 

I'm still amused you think we should take a thread this stupid seriously.

 

lol, relax dean, no offense was intended..I was poking fun in the post, so wasnt taking it that serioulsy either in my response to yours. I just found it amusing that people were debating this guy could be a 300 yard guy when he has only 1 game with 300 yards since high school.

 

I pretty much agree with you that we dont know what we have...he has stregnths and weaknesses, and people with his weaknesses have been succesful in the NFL. However, it is put up or shut up this year for him, and if he plays like last year we wont make the playoffs.

[Alphadawg7]

Dean makes a good point about the preparation or lack of on game day. I don't think it is coincidental that Edwards struggled much more against 3-4 teams than the 4-3 teams. I think a lack of gameday preparation from the coaching staff and the weak interior O Line had as much to do with that than the play of Edwards. It was his first full year under the center and it was Schonerts first year as OC as well. My guess is that they will address that this year, which they all ready have in adding Hangartner, Levitre and Wood, and I believe that they will game plan much more intensely in being more effective against 3-4 alignments that drop back more DB's into coverage. Edwards seems to be a very intelligent QB and I believe he will recognize open Receivers more effectively than last year.

 

Come on guys, you are really stretching now in defense of Trent. You are blaming gameday preperation without any first hand knowledge of how much game day preperation they do. You are speculating excuses to justify Trents struggles rather than letting Trent shoulder those struggles. Thats the stuff that frustrates me so much about the Trent defense. Sure our coaching staff made some mistakes out there last year, but Trent made so many terrible decisions on the field, so many bad throws, and when he had guys wide open he didnt find them as he panicked and checked down way too much when he was struggling.

 

I am going to give Trent the benefit of the doubt that this was due to lack of experience and part of his struggles as a young QB and hope he can over come this in 09, but that is not the fault of DJ, and Trent gets to shoulder those struggles and hopefully grow from them.

 

Having played football all the way through college, I would be a fool if I said the coaching staff wasnt important, so I am definitely not saying that. But, what is lost in all of this is the fact that Trent was not even close to a good decidsion maker last year despite what you want to believe.

 

A friend of mine who is a LB coach in the NFL told me that the best way to rattle Trent was to bring some pressure and take away his hot route because he is not fast enough in his progessions yet to find other options while under any kind of pressure. He said he actually likes the kid and thinks Trent can blossom, but said until he can progress through his reads faster and gain confidence in his reads to make throws to where the WR will be before he even gets there, then he will continue to struggle.

 

Now back to the comments about preperation. People I know in the NFL cirlces who have first hand knowledge of him have always said the opposite of what you are claiming. So, I dont understand how people who have no first hand knowledge of how they prepare for a game can say he isnt properly preparing his team as an excuse for how poorly Trent played in the second half of last year.

[bladiebla]

I think the preperation remarks were more aimed at the coaching staff as judged by the resulted playcalling especially throughout the early parts of the game at the later part of the season then at Trent personally. We all know him and Hamdan are the ones to turn the lights out at one bills drive.

[Virgil]

Are we supposed to making a case for Trent? I thought we were responding to a dumbass post about his ability to throw for 300 yards, as if that is something important in the NFL.

 

I try to be a realist about Trent, the way I would be about any QB for the Bills. When the coaches start calling a competent game, and the QB fails to execute that plan at a competent level, then I will judge the Bills' QB harshly. Until then, we really don't know what we have. We know some of his strengths and weaknesses, but QBs with greater weaknesses have been successful in the NFL, in the past.

I'm still amused you think we should take a thread this stupid seriously.

 

Wow. Thanks for that one. If you don't think it's a good conversation to discuss if Trent or our OC has the ability to take full advantage of all our offensive weapons, then why are you posting on this at all?

[thebug]

Just win baby!

[2020 Our Year For Sure]

Wow. Thanks for that one. If you don't think it's a good conversation to discuss if Trent or our OC has the ability to take full advantage of all our offensive weapons, then why are you posting on this at all?

If thats really what you mean by this thread, then take the 300 yards junk out of the title.

[dave mcbride]

I want to agree with this and have often espoused the use of the spread formation to do just what you suggest. But then I realize we didn't have the talent across the board to do that. Even with Royal removed (and I'm glad he is), your OL has got to be DOMINANT to run that spread. The formation is VERY vulnerable off the edge and I won't even mention up the middle (Fowler, Preston?).

 

#2, your QB and receivers have to be masters at pre/post snap reads. JP was never there and Edwards wasn't there either. But neither are any QBs so early in their careers. I hope he takes the leap this year.

 

#3, your WRs in that spread better be able to make their own pre/post snap reads AND be on the same page as their QB. Again, especially in the case of Roscoe and Hardy, it was apparant they are not good at it.

 

All that adds up to the coaches not having the confidence in their personnel to run formations that pressure defenses to adjust to mismatches created by being spread out. Young QB, especially.

 

I'm hoping that changes this year. I know Evans, Reed, and TO have the smarts/awareness. But that's a wash if TE doesn't mature as well. I'm confident our OL has the smarts and now the physical ability to mititgate the vulnerabilities of being spread out. We can do serious damage as was evidenced the few times the last couple years when we DID use the spread and WERE successful, especially running the ball. But doing it all the time when you don't have the personnel makes it too easy for the D adjust and blow it up as was the case the last couple years.

 

Here's hoping we see it A LOT more this year. I really believe we have the horses in place to do it.

 

GO BILLS!!!

Excellent post. I actually thought the offensive playcalling was fine last year. The problems stemmed from the players more than anything. The passing game was a joke when Reed went down for a few games. Evans was the only good receiver out there.

 

People have been blaming the playcalling for years, and often without much thought. I'll never forget Dan Henning's response to being questioned about playcalling (I'm paraphrasing): you can't make silk from a sow's ear. He did pretty well for himself after he was bounced off of the Todd Collins/Lonnie Johnson/William Joseph Hobert express.

[K-9]

...A friend of mine who is a LB coach in the NFL told me that the best way to rattle Trent was to bring some pressure and take away his hot route because he is not fast enough in his progessions yet to find other options while under any kind of pressure. He said he actually likes the kid and thinks Trent can blossom, but said until he can progress through his reads faster and gain confidence in his reads to make throws to where the WR will be before he even gets there, then he will continue to struggle.

 

This seems to contradict what some people I know have said about TE's struggles last year; that chiefly it was when Ds DID NOT bring pressure and dropped 7 or 8 into coverage is when he had his biggest troubles. Drop that many into coverage and his second and third options tend to disappear as well. He became frustrated because as he went through his progressions (which the people I know say he's quite good at) and saw they weren't there he tried forcing things. They also mentioned that Parrish and Royal couldn't make a hot read to save their lives.

 

Ironically, one of the best plays he made last year was against pressure: the safety blitz against AZ. He got creamed but made the right play. He's beat blitzes before as well but again, more often than not his receivers (Parrish, Royal mostly and Hardy at times) didn't give him ANY help. And while our RBs got better with their blitz reads they also had times where they could have given him and JP some help.

 

I'm certainly critical of much of TE's play. I attribute 99% of that to sheer inexperience. But pressure is the least of my worries with him. He's good at pre-snap reads (his receivers will be better this year) and is improving on hot reads (any young QB can be fooled at times).

 

GO BILLS!!!