Beerball Posted April 14, 2009 Share Posted April 14, 2009 Should his age be a factor? Link Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SageAgainstTheMachine Posted April 14, 2009 Share Posted April 14, 2009 Should his age be a factor? Link Wow, tricky situation indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Poojer Posted April 14, 2009 Share Posted April 14, 2009 something tells me that this statement from his own attorney only strengthens the prosecutions point of deportation, if he was instrumental in the atrocities committed then yes, he should be sent back, no matter what his age. And what is pre-leukemia? I think I have a 'pre-cold' You have an 89-year-old man with various physical ailments, and you have eight guys from [immigrations and Customs Enforcement] trying to stuff him into a wheelchair to send him to Germany. This looks like something taking place in Germany and not in the United States. Should his age be a factor? Link Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buckeyemike Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 Hmmm...this has always been interesting, b/c I grew up watching this case. Personally, I think the evidence is strong that he was a guard...under duress. The U.S. government's point is that he lied on his citizenship application, and on his original application to get into the United States. Of course, I think that there have been a number of prosecutors that made their careers on this case as well, so I certainly don't think that the government's hands are squeaky clean on this one. Demjanjuk's not going to live much longer anyway. He's 89 and nearly bedridden. He does not look the same as he did even five years ago. What I think will happen is that he will be deported, but Germany will not try him and he will live out his few remaining days in a prison hospital somewhere in Germany. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tcali Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 Should his age be a factor? Link YES. Hauling an 89 yr old off in his wheel chair??? For God's sake let it go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 YES. Hauling an 89 yr old off in his wheel chair??? For God's sake let it go. If only the Nazis had been so compassionate! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 The Germans want to try a guy for working at Sobibor who's Israeli conviction for working at Treblinka was overturned by an Israeli court? I'm all for putting away anyone who was involved with Sobibor, even an 89-year old man...but something here seems a little off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim in Anchorage Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 The Germans want to try a guy for working at Sobibor who's Israeli conviction for working at Treblinka was overturned by an Israeli court? I'm all for putting away anyone who was involved with Sobibor, even an 89-year old man...but something here seems a little off. Its the UAW trying to dump his pension. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD in CA Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 YES. Hauling an 89 yr old off in his wheel chair??? For God's sake let it go. Agreed. It seems to me people need to start getting past the bad stuff that happened 65 years ago. Hunting down 90 year guys is taking it a little too far IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 Agreed. It seems to me people need to start getting past the bad stuff that happened 65 years ago. Hunting down 90 year guys is taking it a little too far IMO. I guess I am in the minority on this one... I know, ultimately it doesn't serve any purpose, but if the guy had been doing time for the last 65 years, I might say, "enough"... but he got to live a long, peaceful life. What happened all those years ago, can't really be forgiven, IMO. I am not one in favor of the death penalty, but I do think there is room for justness. If he is truly guilty of what he is suspected, why should his age and health be any consideration? There is some truth that to the old adage, you reap what you sow... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 Hmmm...this has always been interesting, b/c I grew up watching this case. Personally, I think the evidence is strong that he was a guard...under duress. The U.S. government's point is that he lied on his citizenship application, and on his original application to get into the United States. Of course, I think that there have been a number of prosecutors that made their careers on this case as well, so I certainly don't think that the government's hands are squeaky clean on this one. Demjanjuk's not going to live much longer anyway. He's 89 and nearly bedridden. He does not look the same as he did even five years ago. What I think will happen is that he will be deported, but Germany will not try him and he will live out his few remaining days in a prison hospital somewhere in Germany. Like that's such a huge issue. We've got 30 million souls in this country who are guilty of pretty much that. Of course, they're not war criminals in all likelihood, so they can stay. He has to go. Citizen - meet the coercive force of the US Government. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steely Dan Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 Wow, tricky situation indeed. Not at all IMO. On Friday, a federal immigration board rejected an emergency appeal for a stay of Demjanjuk's deportation. His attorney, John Broadley, had argued that deporting him would constitute torture because of his health problems. Broadley has said Demjanjuk suffers from pre-leukemia, kidney problems, spinal problems and "a couple of types of gout." _____________________________________________ Rabbi Marvin Hier of the Simon Wiesenthal Center found irony in Broadley's argument for his client. "He wants to plead the sense of fairness that he regularly denied all of the victims at Sobibor," Hier said. He called Demjanjuk's comparison of his planned deportation to torture "preposterous coming from a person that served the [Nazi organization] S.S. in a death camp. It is a preposterous argument and insulting to the survivors of the Holocaust." Hier said that 250,000 Jews were killed at the camp and that none of the guards who worked there was blameless. "You were there for one job: kill the Jews," he said. "And that's what they did full-time."[/i] 'Nuff said. YES. Hauling an 89 yr old off in his wheel chair??? For God's sake let it go. He committed heinous war crimes. I don't see any reason to let anyone go on that one. The Germans want to try a guy for working at Sobibor who's Israeli conviction for working at Treblinka was overturned by an Israeli court? I'm all for putting away anyone who was involved with Sobibor, even an 89-year old man...but something here seems a little off. I think we need to know why it was overturned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBill Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 Demjanjuk's not going to live much longer anyway. He's 89 and nearly bedridden. He does not look the same as he did even five years ago. What I think will happen is that he will be deported, but Germany will not try him and he will live out his few remaining days in a prison hospital somewhere in Germany. Not sure why now is the right time .... the man is nearly on is death bed. I understand the concept of justice but at this stage justice will be served by a much different authoriy upon his death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tcali Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 I guess I am in the minority on this one... I know, ultimately it doesn't serve any purpose, but if the guy had been doing time for the last 65 years, I might say, "enough"... but he got to live a long, peaceful life. What happened all those years ago, can't really be forgiven, IMO. I am not one in favor of the death penalty, but I do think there is room for justness. If he is truly guilty of what he is suspected, why should his age and health be any consideration? There is some truth that to the old adage, you reap what you sow... You think all prison camp guards were guilty of murder??? not so simple.. There may have been guards secretly helping the prisoners.I know----probbly 2 or 3 out of a hundred. But what if they wanted to help? I am saying that while many or most of the guards likely DESERVE severe punishment-its hard to prove which ones were the most guilty. Were there eyewitnesses to this guys cruelty? Did the Israeli courts rule incorrectly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
el Tigre Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 I'm in favor of leaving the old guy alone at this point. We'll never know what really went on and God will be his judge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tennesseeboy Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 There are a lot more than gaurds who share blame. Those people got there on railroad cars driven by someone, the lists were typed by folks who knew what they were doing, the police who rounded them up knew what they were doing, and people living near the camps knew what was going on. In Kyiv the jews ran to the Dnipro river to welcome the Germans as they thought they would treat them better than the Russians did...until they were taken to Babi Yar and shot. We could have our own little holocaust punishing those culpable in the last one. And then the next generation could punish us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tcali Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 There are a lot more than gaurds who share blame. Those people got there on railroad cars driven by someone, the lists were typed by folks who knew what they were doing, the police who rounded them up knew what they were doing, and people living near the camps knew what was going on. In Kyiv the jews ran to the Dnipro river to welcome the Germans as they thought they would treat them better than the Russians did...until they were taken to Babi Yar and shot. We could have our own little holocaust punishing those culpable in the last one. And then the next generation could punish us. very true Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dib Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 there are some things for which there is no statute of limitations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dib Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 there are some things for which there is no statute of limitations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whites Bay Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 I don't know where I come down on this one. About 4 weeks ago, I would have said "Jesus, let it go." I just read a really good book entitled "Hunting Eichmann". You might want to take a few hours to chew through this one, and then re-post. Just a suggestion. Again, I don't know where I come down on this one. Let's just say that the book was enough to balance the pendulum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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