Magox Posted March 17, 2009 Share Posted March 17, 2009 He needs to follow his own advice... are you still sore about the other day? its ok hun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damj Posted March 17, 2009 Share Posted March 17, 2009 It's not just me, is it? What is it with the continually incessant ramblings about cutting/trading our good players? It seems to me that unless our players are playing at HOFer level(from their rookie year)......never get injured.....are happy to play at reasonable salaries(based on salaries from 4 year ago)......and never do anything wrong.....there is a large contingent here who will continually agressively argue that we should get rid of the player. ... Sorry about the ramble/rant but it feels like the patients have taken over the asylum around here lately. Well said ... some fans are real quick to want to run someone out of town ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted March 17, 2009 Share Posted March 17, 2009 are you still sore about the other day? its ok hun So when the shoe is on the other foot, it's no big deal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibs Posted March 17, 2009 Author Share Posted March 17, 2009 First off, this is cut and pasted right from your post: "I know....let's trade every starter.....we'll surely be able to re-build a superbowl team with all of the draft picks. " So dont say you didn't say it. Now what is there yet for Peters to hold out from yet? They haven't had anything to hold out from. We'll see when workouts start if he shows up. See if he is there when camp starts, my guess is no unless he gets traded or gets the money he so doesn't deserve. Another cut and pasted: "Has he held out? Has he bitched & moaned?" You haven't read about him stating he wants to be the highest paid LT in the AFC, with a statement like that he is more qualified to be a standup comic than a LT. One More: "the Bills said "You're not getting one, but we'll give you one next year." Where you there to get a direct quote like this? What? Huh? Your cut and paste of my 'statement' was followed by a rolleyes( ). I was being sarcastic. My entire thread is based upon me thinking the opposite of that. .....and my second post to you stated...... "I never said that anybody said trade every starter....." Which was in response to your.... "I don't recall anyone besides you ever coming on this board and saying trade every starter." What are you talking about??? I'm sorry I used quotation marks when I paraphrased the common knowledge that the Bills said they would re-work his contract after the 2008 season. I'm not going to rummage round and find you a link for something that was widely known at the time. I've read a 'report' saying he wants to be the highest paid LT in the AFC.....putting him $3mil apart from the Bills offer(which is what I said). The fact that you believe he is not worth the money is irrelevant. His value will be determined by the contract he ends up getting(whether it be with the Bills or with another team).....not by some emotional fan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magox Posted March 17, 2009 Share Posted March 17, 2009 So when the shoe is on the other foot, it's no big deal? :lol: I've noticed somethin, not that it was difficult to see. Just about every post you make, is not so much football related, but it is in response to other posters to either criticize, chastise or demean them in some sort of way. You are a classic internet Troll. I'm sorry that your life is so bitter, and that you are frustrated, that you have nothing better to do than look for people's faults and criticize them. Try looking at the brighter side of life, I promise you that the grass is greener on the other side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted March 17, 2009 Share Posted March 17, 2009 I've noticed somethin, not that it was difficult to see. Just about every post you make, is not so much football related, but it is in response to other posters to either criticize, chastise or demean them in some sort of way. You are a classic internet Troll. I'm sorry that your life is so bitter, and that you are frustrated, that you have nothing better to do than look for people's faults and criticize them. Try looking at the brighter side of life, I promise you that the grass is greener on the other side. I'm glad you have reviewed my 8 years of posting here and come to this conclusion. Can I sidestep the board terms of service for a brief moment... You're an idiot! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magox Posted March 17, 2009 Share Posted March 17, 2009 I'm glad you have reviewed my 8 years of posting here and come to this conclusion. Can I sidestep the board terms of service for a brief moment... You're an idiot! I don't need to see your 8 years of posting. I call it how I see it. Keep them coming Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DazedandConfused Posted March 17, 2009 Share Posted March 17, 2009 Dibs, I hope you keep right on posting rants similar to the one which began this thread because though one can pull out and cut and past individual points to make a specific argument, I think that your point about folks being too willing to discard current players for the next designated savior is right on target. The items cut and pasted by billsfreak are almost certainly accurate cuts and pastes, but they strike me as being too focused on the small ball tasks of the individual statements and thus miss the bigger objective you are laying out (I think not seeing the forest because of all the trees is the cliche that describes this approach). In general, I agree with your sense that many of us fans are way too willing in the face of unsatisfactory results over the past decade to want to jump to a conclusion that it would have all been better if we just eliminated a some discrete number of overpaid and/or bad players. Though perhaps this is true in specific cases, it does tend to overlook the fact that 1. It was Ralph who has the ultimate responsibility for hiring the GM to organize this thing and the HC to lead this thing and that if one wants to identify any specific people, the buck stops with the big boss first, second and third. 2. it also glosses over the likelihood that the result even with better players is going to be a trainwreck with TD in charge and is going to mediocre except in the rare season with Jauron in charge. A focus on cutting this player or that player or even shipping out the whole team simply misses the point of who oversaw and created this mess of the past decade. What? Huh? Your cut and paste of my 'statement' was followed by a rolleyes( ). I was being sarcastic. My entire thread is based upon me thinking the opposite of that. .....and my second post to you stated...... "I never said that anybody said trade every starter....." Which was in response to your.... "I don't recall anyone besides you ever coming on this board and saying trade every starter." What are you talking about??? I'm sorry I used quotation marks when I paraphrased the common knowledge that the Bills said they would re-work his contract after the 2008 season. I'm not going to rummage round and find you a link for something that was widely known at the time. I've read a 'report' saying he wants to be the highest paid LT in the AFC.....putting him $3mil apart from the Bills offer(which is what I said). The fact that you believe he is not worth the money is irrelevant. His value will be determined by the contract he ends up getting(whether it be with the Bills or with another team).....not by some emotional fan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whycali Posted March 17, 2009 Share Posted March 17, 2009 On the whole topic I can only add this, since the last time we made the playoffs the Colts, Ravens, Bucs, Cards and Patriots have turned their pitiful teams into superbowl teams. Teams that lose consistantly without regret or recriminations can only count on one thing, adding the prefix perennial to their "loser" title. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanoverbills Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 As Far as Edwards regressing last year, the statistics don't bear out your statement. As a whole, Edwards vastly improved last year in every statistical category. He has tremendous upside and with receivers on both sides of the field this year he will only get better this season. And please note, Edwards has not started 25 games yet. He has only started twenty. Let's see what he looks like over the first seven or eight games this year before we run him out of town. Continuity means a lot in the NFL. This year we finally have it. If Buffalo can't get to the playoffs this year, then we'll have to make some changes with the coaching staff and perhaps at QB too. He has 23 games started. 7 tds his rookie year in 9 starts and 11 tds in 14 starts his second year. 4 fumbles his rookie year and 9 fumbles his second year. He was sacked 12 times his rookie year and 23 sacks his second year. I think no improvement in two years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibs Posted March 18, 2009 Author Share Posted March 18, 2009 He has 23 games started. 7 tds his rookie year in 9 starts and 11 tds in 14 starts his second year. 4 fumbles his rookie year and 9 fumbles his second year. He was sacked 12 times his rookie year and 23 sacks his second year. I think no improvement in two years. Really? You must have a strange stat site you look at......it obviously shows only a few of the stats(those being the ones where TE regressed in). From year 1 to year 2..... QBR up from 70.4 to 85.4 YPA up from 6.06 to 7.22 TD% up from 2.6 to 2.9 INT% down from 3.0 to 2.7 Yep....no improvement there at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfreak Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 What? Huh? Your cut and paste of my 'statement' was followed by a rolleyes( ). I was being sarcastic. My entire thread is based upon me thinking the opposite of that. .....and my second post to you stated...... "I never said that anybody said trade every starter....." Which was in response to your.... "I don't recall anyone besides you ever coming on this board and saying trade every starter." What are you talking about??? I'm sorry I used quotation marks when I paraphrased the common knowledge that the Bills said they would re-work his contract after the 2008 season. I'm not going to rummage round and find you a link for something that was widely known at the time. I've read a 'report' saying he wants to be the highest paid LT in the AFC.....putting him $3mil apart from the Bills offer(which is what I said). The fact that you believe he is not worth the money is irrelevant. His value will be determined by the contract he ends up getting(whether it be with the Bills or with another team).....not by some emotional fan. And you say I am just arguing for the sake of arguing, you are pulling sh*t out of your *ss just becuase you can't admit that you are wrong. WAAAAH! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibs Posted March 18, 2009 Author Share Posted March 18, 2009 And you say I am just arguing for the sake of arguing, you are pulling sh*t out of your *ss just becuase you can't admit that you are wrong. WAAAAH! I truly value your insightful thoughts and feel terrible that you seem antagonistic towards me. You have quickly become a doyen of TSW and I know all of our fellow posters will be cut to the quick that I have upset you. Please.....enlighten me where I am wrong. I don't really have any idea what point you were making.....so therefore have no idea where I may have said something which was incorrect(in relation to your points). ***BTW, it wasn't me who said you were just arguing for the sake of arguing......but I'm not arguing with the poster who said it.*** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanoverbills Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 Really?You must have a strange stat site you look at......it obviously shows only a few of the stats(those being the ones where TE regressed in). From year 1 to year 2..... QBR up from 70.4 to 85.4 YPA up from 6.06 to 7.22 TD% up from 2.6 to 2.9 INT% down from 3.0 to 2.7 Yep....no improvement there at all. Losman from 2005 to 2006 QBR up from 64.9 to 84.9 YPA up from 5.9 to 7.1 TD% up from 3.5 to 4.4 INT% down from 3.5 to 3.3 lost job after two games of 2007 , considered a bust . Got all stats from nfl stats.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibs Posted March 18, 2009 Author Share Posted March 18, 2009 Losman from 2005 to 2006QBR up from 64.9 to 84.9 YPA up from 5.9 to 7.1 TD% up from 3.5 to 4.4 INT% down from 3.5 to 3.3 lost job after two games of 2007 , considered a bust . Got all stats from nfl stats.com The point is you can't use selective stats to try and prove your thoughts and ignore other stats which counter your thoughts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2020 Our Year For Sure Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 Losman from 2005 to 2006QBR up from 64.9 to 84.9 YPA up from 5.9 to 7.1 TD% up from 3.5 to 4.4 INT% down from 3.5 to 3.3 lost job after two games of 2007 , considered a bust . Got all stats from nfl stats.com So Losman improved, and then crashed and burned. So...now we should hope that young quarterbacks DON'T improve? Is that your point here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Jose Bills Fan Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 The nitpickers who are trying to deconstruct the entire original post syllable by syllable are missing the point IMO. I believe the point being made here is that it seems like there is a bias towards negativity on this message board. I would say that there is. Is it justified? The team has been futile for a very long time. Mediocrity with a few high water marks has been the history of this franchise. That being said, I think the negativity and criticism of the team and the acrimony amongst the people who follow the team is a bit over the top and unwarranted. I understand it so some degree but it's kind of sad. As the saying goes, "it takes 37 muscles to frown but only 22 muscles to smile." Yes the team has kinda sucked but there's also a lot of people here who'd rather be miserable and unhappy than focus on the positives. To those people I say, I hope your lives and families are not the same way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dog14787 Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 Well, "You can please some of the people all of the time and all of the people some of the time, but you can’t please all of the people all of the time" a poet once wrote Or better yet and one of my favorites, "You can fool some of the people all the time, all the people some of the time, but you can't fool all the people all the time." Per Abraham Lincoln Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steely Dan Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 Dibs, I agree with you on the overall concept and most of what you say but there are a couple of things I have a different view on: name='Dibs' date='Mar 17 2009, 07:26 AM' post='1357154']It's not just me, is it? What is it with the continually incessant ramblings about cutting/trading our good players? It seems to me that unless our players are playing at HOFer level(from their rookie year)......never get injured.....are happy to play at reasonable salaries(based on salaries from 4 year ago)......and never do anything wrong.....there is a large contingent here who will continually agressively argue that we should get rid of the player. If OBD were to listen to the vocal minority here(I'm assuming it's a minority.....I bloody hope it is), we would be saying goodbye to....Peters(2 probowls, widely considered one of the best young talents at LT in the league): Greedy, lazy, no good, troublemaker Lynch(1 probowl): Thug who is not a superstar Schobel(2 probowls, very few match his sack production, injured last season): Over-rated, over-paid, useless. Whitner(Generally considered a very solid player): No big plays, isn't N'Gata. Parrish(Best punt returner statistically in NFL history): We could get something for him. The only other 'good' players we have are Evans & Stroud.....and apparently Evans is over-paid & Stroud is OK. I have mixed feelings on Lynch. He met with Goodell and that's never a good sign. He'll probably end up with some kind of suspension. His next infraction will cost him more, maybe a full year suspension. What good is he if he's out for four games this year and a possible one year suspension in his future? Should the Bills try to get something for him while his value is high? I'd keep him this year and then trade him next offseason. JMO With the signing of TO there is an extra spot on the receiving corp that will likely not stay and someone will be cut. The Bills have FJ and LM who can return punts. If the Bills could get a third rounder or better for RP then it would make sense. JMO And it's not just the good players....Edwards Hasn't hit probowl levels yet....after his 2 seasons. Poz Isn't an instant star....after his 2 seasons(missing his first). McGee Getting older....should be traded while he is still worth something. I know....let's trade every starter.....we'll surely be able to re-build a superbowl team with all of the draft picks. McGee is very valuable to this team and I hope to hades that they are working on an extension but if they plan to let him runaway next year then the question is should they trade him while he has value? The Drayton Florence signing doesn't replace McGee if he goes but he does make the question more difficult. AY is a starting caliber CB when healthy but he rarely is. How does the coaching staff view RC for this coming year? It's not a simple question to answer when everything is considered. Hell.....big cheers for cutting dockery! Over-paid....obviously a bad player. Still landed himself a $5mil/year deal shortly after being cut. Five Million per year.....for a player that was garbage for us! I still can't believe that there were far more comments about being glad that he's gone than about the huge hole at LG that was created. Draft picks always look better than our current players. Let's trade them for draft picks....we can easily fill the holes via the draft. For those that are not aware.....DRAFT PICKS ARE HIT OR MISS! There is no guarantee of success and in fact there is more chance of failure. And why do people think that our players are more valuable to other teams than to us? It boggles the mind to think that some other team is willing to not only trade valuable draft picks for our guys....but to also then pay them top dollar. If it was going to happen, surely the player is valuable to us!!! Sorry about the ramble/rant but it feels like the patients have taken over the asylum around here lately. I agree that cuts should never be made without a solid backup plan and it appears the Bills don't have one for RG unless they plan on taking a C or guard in the early rounds and as you pointed out it's hit or miss. I remember people say that 25 games started ,you should be able to tell how good your qb should be .Long enough they said. Well how many games did Edwards start? Plus he is injury prone. And you look he has gotten worse as the season went on both years as a starter. After our 5 and 1 start, he was the worse QB in football. Losman was blamed for every bad game that we had, but when Edwards looses its because of coaches and offensive line,everything but him. the guy showed promise his rookie year but he didn't show me any improvement his second year as a starter and that worries me. And you can't look at a win and lost record and judge a QB. Because your Qb could have a winning drive and the other team could score on your defense with a minute to go on a last second FG and that would count as a lost to the starting QB or the backup QB could come in and score the winning TD and it would count as a win for guy who started. I think we would be a better team with Cutler than Edwards. If Edwards starts this year I hope he shows more improvement than he did his second year as a starter. He has the recievers and if they keep Peters a good left tackle to protect him. I'm guessing you mean worst and if so what stats do you have to back that up? I was going to make a point on this in the opener to the thread but figured I'd covered too many issues already. But since you bring it up..... Another thing that has been bugging me....and it relates to the "We should get rid of players." concept....along side with the "We have no talent on the roster." concept....is..... There is a general consensus that the coaching/gameplanning/co-ordinating has been sub-par to say the least.....yet we still end up with 7-9 seasons. Logic would have it that if we were as devoid of talent as many believe....and the coaching is sooooo bad.....we should be finishing closer to 3-13 each year. Putting Wins on the board has the magical effect of turning all of the players into better players. 'Average at best' players become solid starters....solid starter become good....etc. It happens regularly.....sometimes dramatically. Usually it occurs in unison with good QB & line play. I know what you're alluding to......but I don't tend to comment much on RW since I can't figure out how much he sets the agenda(apart from hiring GMs). The whole 'Ralph is cheap' thing I find is overstated.....though an earlier poster in the thread(8and8forever) raised an interesting concept of RW playing favourites which I feel might be closer to the truth. Before I went blaming RW for everything.....I'd like to see what this team could do with a QB who could play at a high level regularly. And you say I am just arguing for the sake of arguing, you are pulling sh*t out of your *ss just becuase you can't admit that you are wrong. WAAAAH! You would be very smart to stay away from an argument with Dibs. When it comes to football is he one of the smartest posters here and uses stats to back up his points. I think you'd lose any argument you have with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dean Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 I have mixed feelings on Lynch. He met with Goodell and that's never a good sign. I believe the meeting was a Lynch's request. That says something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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