Adam Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 Again, this argument just doesn't work for me. You can handle the situation like Peters, or you can handle it like Boldin. You can point fingers all you want...there's no excusing his play when he returned. He wasn't even worth a roster spot let alone $11-13m. I don't like the idea that a guy you're going to pay to be in the Top 5 of his position can play at the level outside the top 32 for any reason. He should have been using the second half of last year to justify that kind of salary. Instead he used it to raise questions about whether or not he's worth it. He was stupid for listening to his agent and holding out- but the Bills weren't smart in not signing him. He ended up coming back not in football shape. Give him the money and bring him back- I can't see them letting both he and Dockery go. Wouldn't be a smart move to turn over the whole left side. Dockery was mediocre at best- they picked the right one to get rid of
Bufcomments Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 To me its kinda simple folks, You dont let a 2 time Pro bowl LT go...... Lets look back to where he was an undrafted free agen, a Tight End out of college. He went from basically a TE to Starting RT to starting LT. LT is the 2nd most important player on any great team behind QB Jason has to get paid what the market says and even though it sucks its the truth of the matter. Now I don't believe he is the sharpest cookie but neither is his agent for giving him bad advice last year and telling his client to hold out last year. If he would have came to work last spring and summer it would have done wonders for his situation ( see Lee Evans) But now both sides have bad tastes in their mouths , Jason for not being paid what he is worth....The Bills for him not coming to the OTAs and training camp and let his team down in the process. The Bills hold the cards in this mess, they can make him honor his contract, hell 4 million sounds good to me But the Bills are smart to upgrade his deal because they dont want to see or have an unhappy camper that protects Trents backside Based on what happened last year id say 8.5 million a year with workout incentives and a roster bonus of 3 million next spring which would give you 11 million within a year with at least 25 million (3 yrs) guarantied But no way I would trade him for draft picks as some of you good people suggested
Spiderweb Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 Whats even crazier is that the Bills are offering $8.5 Million a year. That is ridiculous!! Some people on this board were thinking that he was demanding $13.5 Million a year. $11.5 Million a year is a reasonable asking price from Peters. That makes his offer slightly higher than Jake Long's, who is not as accomplished. I would imagine if they offered a deal of around $10 Million a year and add incentives to where he could receive another $1 Million they could hammer out a deal. Jake long had a better year. Look at Peters sacks allowed and it took him 4/3 of the season to offer any value in the run game as well. I fact, I'd take Long over Peters, hands down. 11.5 Mil is really off base. In fact the entire NFL payscale is off base.
lucks Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 If you think Peters is ever going to stop holding out / asking for more $ your crazy. This is going to be a " par for the course " event every 2 years or so. Cut bait and take all the early draft picks so we can get. I totally agree. Ther are at least a half dozen teams interested in this overrated selfish bozo. I say let's stock up on picks!!!!
Adam Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 Jake long had a better year. Look at Peters sacks allowed and it took him 4/3 of the season to offer any value in the run game as well. I fact, I'd take Long over Peters, hands down. 11.5 Mil is really off base. In fact the entire NFL payscale is off base. The entire NFL mentality is off base- they want everything and they want it now. We have Peters. We don't have Long and never will
Bill from NYC Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 Some of you are still living in the 90's of NFL salaries. Dudes, Laveranues friggin Coles got 7 Mil per year !! A top 10 LT with top 3 talent surely deserves double figures per year. Please shut up about this and also stop thinking that landing a high draft pick would somehow justify trading this guy. (I know you won't ) Thank you for this.
disco Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 He was stupid for listening to his agent and holding out- but the Bills weren't smart in not signing him. He ended up coming back not in football shape. Give him the money and bring him back- I can't see them letting both he and Dockery go. Wouldn't be a smart move to turn over the whole left side. Dockery was mediocre at best- they picked the right one to get rid of There's no excuse for coming back totally out of shape either. I doubt his agent recommended he return to football totally unprepared to play. I'd rather see him doing push-ups in his driveway with a camera crew. Instead he apparently did nothing at all and returned to make us a worse football team.
Simon Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 There's no excuse for coming back totally out of shape either. I doubt his agent recommended he return to football totally unprepared to play. I'd rather see him doing push-ups in his driveway with a camera crew. Instead he apparently did nothing at all and returned to make us a worse football team. And giving him 50 million dollars is only likely to make it even worse. If I'm the Bills I go to great lengths to make him understand that his performance this year is going to be what decides what his next contract looks like. If he wants to make 10mil+/year he cannot show up fat, lazy and stupid in 2009. Hopefully we get a good year out of him and then at the end of the year let it slip that a small market team is reluctant to give that kind of money to one player, then deal him for the best package of picks we can get. Let somebody else give him a massive contract and then have to sit back and watch him eat potato chips off his own stomach.
Adam Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 There's no excuse for coming back totally out of shape either. I doubt his agent recommended he return to football totally unprepared to play. I'd rather see him doing push-ups in his driveway with a camera crew. Instead he apparently did nothing at all and returned to make us a worse football team. Working out in your driveway doesn't get you into football shape- it creates a spectacle and a distraction. They need to sign him and get him in for training camp- if the line isn't good, it won't matter if we have the 1989 49ers WR's and Edwards will end up looking more like Hannah Montana than Joe Montana
disco Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 Working out in your driveway doesn't get you into football shape- it creates a spectacle and a distraction. They need to sign him and get him in for training camp- if the line isn't good, it won't matter if we have the 1989 49ers WR's and Edwards will end up looking more like Hannah Montana than Joe Montana Remind me again what our record was before he came back last year...and the record after he returned. All he showed us for sure last year is his inclusion on the line did not help create W's. What happens when we sink $11m into him and he continues to play as he does last year? How is NOW the time to agree to pay him as a Top 3 LT? How is having a deal with 3 years left on it a good time to hold out? How is coming back to play football out of shape a good idea? How is giving up the most sacks in the league a good intro to 'I want a $7m raise?' I just don't believe in paying a guy with those kind of questions that kind of money. I'd be more interested in paying Greer the $4m/year he got from NO.
Adam Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 Remind me again what our record was before he came back last year...and the record after he returned. All he showed us for sure last year is his inclusion on the line did not help create W's. What happens when we sink $11m into him and he continues to play as he does last year? How is NOW the time to agree to pay him as a Top 3 LT? How is having a deal with 3 years left on it a good time to hold out? How is coming back to play football out of shape a good idea? How is giving up the most sacks in the league a good intro to 'I want a $7m raise?' I just don't believe in paying a guy with those kind of questions that kind of money. I'd be more interested in paying Greer the $4m/year he got from NO. You just aren't going to get consistency out of your left tackle when you don't have much at left guard or center. I also think Walker is sub par. When in shape, Peters has shown the feet and explosiveness of a pro bowl caliber left tackle (note, I said pro bowl caliber, not pro bowl). He definitely has the ability to finish a block and get to the next level. I don't think he has peaked as a run blocker either. I couldn't care less if he's called a top 5 OT or not. He is a foundation block of a strong line.
Bill from NYC Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 I just don't believe in paying a guy with those kind of questions that kind of money. I'd be more interested in paying Greer the $4m/year he got from NO. Me too. We hardly put any resources into the secondary, and we are loaded with Probowl Left Tackles. I am fed up with the way that the Bills use up all of their first day picks on blockers.
manateefan Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 I say no way do you pay him that much. I don't think based on his 2008 season that he is worth what he is making under his current deal. He is lazy with terrible work ethics. If he gets his way this time, in another year or two, after a couple more Pro Bowl selections that he didn't deserve, and a few more lineman sign for more than him, we will go through it all again. Don't do it Buffalo, be smart for a change. AMEN!!!!! He played like crap last year. He still has 3 years left on his contract! Make him prove he's even worth what they did offer him. At the bottom of sacks allowed and he wants a raise.
disco Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 You just aren't going to get consistency out of your left tackle when you don't have much at left guard or center. I also think Walker is sub par. When in shape, Peters has shown the feet and explosiveness of a pro bowl caliber left tackle (note, I said pro bowl caliber, not pro bowl). He definitely has the ability to finish a block and get to the next level. I don't think he has peaked as a run blocker either. I couldn't care less if he's called a top 5 OT or not. He is a foundation block of a strong line. Not getting consistency and what happened last year are two very different things. You also mean when he's in shape, when he's healthy, and when he feels like playing. It's been a few years since we've seen him meet all 3 of those conditions. I don't want another Mike Williams situation.
Magox Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 Stop calling him "All Pro". Last time I looked he has NEVER been named to any of the "All Pro" teams. This is NOT the same as being named to the watered down Pro Bowl which has a bunch of substitutes after the players named originally, turn it down. Ok. Did I say he was ALL PRO? Before you type and offer your opinion on something, it may be wise to at least read what people write first, or at least comprehend what is written. I mean, it does make sense doesn't it. I said All Pro Talent.
Adam Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 Not getting consistency and what happened last year are two very different things. You also mean when he's in shape, when he's healthy, and when he feels like playing. It's been a few years since we've seen him meet all 3 of those conditions. I don't want another Mike Williams situation. There is no comparison between Williams and Peters. He was not only out of football shape last year, but he was out of shape. If that problem can be remedied, he could be out LT for the next 7-8 years.
ChasBB Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 Maybe he expects to be paid by the pound. He's just asking for $1.27 million dollars for each point on his Wonderlic test results.
KOKBILLS Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 Buffalo had theier chance to put this to bed last year. They probably could have had him (very happy) at the numbers they are trying to sign him for today. Every year the asking price goes up. I refer back to the many posts I have put up before - the Bills were stupid for believing they could get away on the cheap last year. Agreed... And I'm afraid I know where this thing is going... I'm fundamentally against Trading Jason Peters...I think when You get a LT in House that is capable (yes I know he was WAY down in 08) of playing at an All-Pro level You keep the Guy...Period...The thought that The Bills will be able to replace Peters with a Rookie, or move Walker to LT...well...it's risky thinking... I also feel VERY strongly that The Bills cannot afford another lengthy Hold-Out by Peters...Shuffling around the Line again and showing The League how stubborn both sides can be is going to do NOTHING for morale (Locker Room, Fan Base, Organizational...etc...) overall... This is The Buffalo Bills Organization of 2009...I think We as Bills Fans know exactly where this situation is headed...I don't believe The Bills are going to do what it will take (Salary-wise) to keep Peters...I hope I'm wrong, but I think I'm right... I think they have been seeking a "Home-town-discount" type of extension from the get-go...And there is NO WAY Peters' Agent is going to agree to that type of Deal...Peters is a 27 Year Old, 2 time Pro-Bowl, LT...His People will never accept anything but being the highest paid LT in the NFL when He Signs the Deal...And They know beyond a shadow of a doubt there are Teams out there, probably a few of them, that will give Peters the big deal...If The Bills won't, I don't think they have any choice but to Trade Peters now and try to get a ton in return...It's step up or get the heck out time... It's still REAL risky, but JP's Trade Value is about as high as it's going to get...And if The Bills are not interested in making Peters the Top paid LT in the Game, they might as well move on immediately...I was watching "Path To The Draft" yesterday and the feeling is just about every Team in the Top 10 Needs a LT...We all know Philly has a HUGE need there and two 1st round Picks...Might as well see what You can get Buffalo...By no means am I saying Peters can be replaced by a Draft Pick or two...In fact I kinda doubt this will work out all that well...But it is what it is...And if You assume the Bills are not willing to pay Peters what He wants, I can't see how there is another viable solution...Plus if You hit on the extra Draft Picks along with your own, it could turn into a REAL bonanza...Buffalo's Scouting Department aside...Come on! It could happen... We'll see...
disco Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 There is no comparison between Williams and Peters. He was not only out of football shape last year, but he was out of shape. If that problem can be remedied, he could be out LT for the next 7-8 years. He's got years left on his deal. I'm fine keeping him on for another year to find out if he's got the ability to play a full season at a high level. I don't see a guy who's best effort was warming our bench last year suddenly becoming our highest paid player.
Adam Posted March 14, 2009 Posted March 14, 2009 He's got years left on his deal. I'm fine keeping him on for another year to find out if he's got the ability to play a full season at a high level. I don't see a guy who's best effort was warming our bench last year suddenly becoming our highest paid player. Sign him to a backloaded deal with an option that will allow us to release him if he doesn't perform- remember you can't judge a single OL on stats. He plays along w/the others. If he is in shape, he has shown some solid traits that could make him one of the top OL's in team history- he showed that over more than a single season. We can't keep letting our top guys leave.
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