Williams+Williams+Williams Posted March 11, 2009 Share Posted March 11, 2009 I am not at all impressed with Turk's play calling. He is predictable. However, with the addition of TO teams will no longer be able to stack the box to stop the run and double Lee Evans. The idea is that if teams stack the box, we can burn them with the pass. If a team doubles Lee up top, TO will be open underneath. If they double TO over the middle, there isnt a corner in the league that can run with Lee up top one on one. If a team sits in a nickle, there is no reason Marshawn should not be able to run all over a pass coverage formation. If Trent plays well, we should have one of the most high powered offenses in the league. My major concern is Turk Schonerts vanilla, predictable offense. Last year, he couldn't make a call from a cell phone. Im excited about TO's impact. Even if teams know our tendencies, they still have to play the game. With 2 pro bowl caliber wr's, a pro bowl caliber running back, and pro bowl LT, there is no doubt we have the personell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlbanyBill Posted March 11, 2009 Share Posted March 11, 2009 I am not at all impressed with Turk's play calling. He is predictable. However, with the addition of TO teams will no longer be able to stack the box to stop the run and double Lee Evans. The idea is that if teams stack the box, we can burn them with the pass. If a team doubles Lee up top, TO will be open underneath. If they double TO over the middle, there isnt a corner in the league that can run with Lee up top one on one. If a team sits in a nickle, there is no reason Marshawn should not be able to run all over a pass coverage formation. If Trent plays well, we should have one of the most high powered offenses in the league. My major concern is Turk Schonerts vanilla, predictable offense. Last year, he couldn't make a call from a cell phone. Im excited about TO's impact. Even if teams know our tendencies, they still have to play the game. With 2 pro bowl caliber wr's, a pro bowl caliber running back, and pro bowl LT, there is no doubt we have the personell. I think with the addition of TO and him opposite Lee, both will have good oppurtunities to get open and the extra attention that the two of them will get should free up other receivers/TEs (like Pettigrew ) and will also help free up the run game for Beast Mode and Freddie. I'm excited for sure. I think we need to give Turk a chance though, last year wasn't great but let's see what happens with the added talent... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2o Posted March 11, 2009 Share Posted March 11, 2009 We all have to remember it was only Turk's first season as OC. You have to give the guy a chance. If things don't start to look different this year, then by all means, throw the guy under the bus. But I also think that DJ was still meddling in the offense last season, especially in the second half of the season. It just seemed like his style of offense that we were all used to. Hopefully Schonert tells him to get screwed if he tries it this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R!P REVOLUTIONARIES Posted March 11, 2009 Share Posted March 11, 2009 I don't know why so many people get down about Shonert. Our offense last year was more productive than it has been in atleast the last 3 years. It may have seemed predictable at times but we have always complained about our offense being too predictable even before Shonert came in. We passed more last year & used a lot of spread offense formations. Remember when we used to always run-run-pass. Our offense last year atleast tried to pass the ball. Owens will open everything up, even if he's not the one making the plays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted March 11, 2009 Share Posted March 11, 2009 I thought bulldog said something really interesting (and true) on WGR this morning..... Take any HC, DC, OC that you consider to be a great one and I will show you someone who also makes mistakes.....the difference probably is that those mistakes are overshadowed by having superior talent on the field. This team isn't finished by a long shot....but it is going to see what our offense looks like with multiple legit receiving threats and how the running game will look because of that. Stack the box.....we dare you.....either Lee or TO is going to be open Double cover the receivers and drop LB's back into coverage.....Lynch eats you up underneath all day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lets_go_bills Posted March 11, 2009 Share Posted March 11, 2009 With Owens in the fold and hopefully a pass catching tight end too, I expect Schonert to call more aggressive plays. He has more weapons to utilize and with Edwards hopefully making progress, the offense should open up as he gets more comfortable with the system. Year two with Schonert should show improvement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ennjay Posted March 11, 2009 Share Posted March 11, 2009 I wish we had a TE, but I think TO and Evans on the outside also opens a lot of opportunities for Roscoe in the slot (until he gets injured again). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PushthePile Posted March 11, 2009 Share Posted March 11, 2009 I thought bulldog said something really interesting (and true) on WGR this morning..... Take any HC, DC, OC that you consider to be a great one and I will show you someone who also makes mistakes.....the difference probably is that those mistakes are overshadowed by having superior talent on the field. This team isn't finished by a long shot....but it is going to see what our offense looks like with multiple legit receiving threats and how the running game will look because of that. Stack the box.....we dare you.....either Lee or TO is going to be open Double cover the receivers and drop LB's back into coverage.....Lynch eats you up underneath all day Great Post. Bills fans aren't used to seeing coaching mistakes that get overshadowed by great play. We are told every year by the FO that we have a very talented football team. After selling that point if the team doesn't win (which it hasn't) everyone is going to look at the coaching. Well we have been through lots of coaching changes and we still don't win. For the first time in awhile the Bills have kept a coach on board despite the record, and admitted that the talent on the team was poor. I am optimistic about where the team is headed and I think we can win with this coaching staff and not despite it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewildrabbit Posted March 11, 2009 Share Posted March 11, 2009 I thought bulldog said something really interesting (and true) on WGR this morning..... Take any HC, DC, OC that you consider to be a great one and I will show you someone who also makes mistakes.....the difference probably is that those mistakes are overshadowed by having superior talent on the field. This team isn't finished by a long shot....but it is going to see what our offense looks like with multiple legit receiving threats and how the running game will look because of that. Stack the box.....we dare you.....either Lee or TO is going to be open Double cover the receivers and drop LB's back into coverage.....Lynch eats you up underneath all day Remember that 49er game at all? the 10-3 loss at Buffalo The Niners dropped everyone into coverage and only rushed with their front four most of the day. Lynch had 136 yards by the end of the 3rd QTR and Turk Schonert in his infinite wisdom didn't give Lynch but ONE carry in the entire 4th QTR. Instead he had the back up QB (JP) throw every play. This was against a team that wasn't even trying to stop the run,they didn't need to either,because Schonert kept forcing the QB to throw into double and triple coverages. Jeez, even a pee wee league coach would have stopped trying to throw into that kind of coverage and simply run the ball. Now you say Schonert was a rookie last year as the Bills OC,somehow that doesn't give me any confidence in his ability to improve considering he has 10 years as a back up QB in the NFL and 10 years as an assistant coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VOR Posted March 11, 2009 Share Posted March 11, 2009 Remember that 49er game at all? the 10-3 loss at Buffalo The Niners dropped everyone into coverage and only rushed with their front four most of the day. Lynch had 136 yards by the end of the 3rd QTR and Turk Schonert in his infinite wisdom didn't give Lynch but ONE carry in the entire 4th QTR. Instead he had the back up QB (JP) throw every play. This was against a team that wasn't even trying to stop the run,they didn't need to either,because Schonert kept forcing the QB to throw into double and triple coverages. It wasn't as simple as you make it out to be. The Bills were still running on their drive to end the 3rd quarter and to start the 4th, and had a chance to kick a FG 5 minutes into the 4th quarter, but elected to pass on 4th down and failed. The next drive was a 3-and-out with a run mixed in there, and ended with a missed FG by Lindell. And then the Bills got the ball back with 1:47 and were forced to pass, and failed. It was a poor performance all over that day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsNYC Posted March 11, 2009 Share Posted March 11, 2009 He was less predictable than his predecessor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spartacus Posted March 11, 2009 Share Posted March 11, 2009 I am not at all impressed with Turk's play calling. He is predictable. However, with the addition of TO teams will no longer be able to stack the box to stop the run and double Lee Evans. The idea is that if teams stack the box, we can burn them with the pass. If a team doubles Lee up top, TO will be open underneath. If they double TO over the middle, there isnt a corner in the league that can run with Lee up top one on one. If a team sits in a nickle, there is no reason Marshawn should not be able to run all over a pass coverage formation. If Trent plays well, we should have one of the most high powered offenses in the league. My major concern is Turk Schonerts vanilla, predictable offense. Last year, he couldn't make a call from a cell phone. Im excited about TO's impact. Even if teams know our tendencies, they still have to play the game. With 2 pro bowl caliber wr's, a pro bowl caliber running back, and pro bowl LT, there is no doubt we have the personell. teams will defense the Bills the way they have done for the last decade pressure the middle of the OL to disrupt the timing of the offense and stuff the run with a backup C and nobodies at LG- teams will test the Bills early and often by attacking the middle. last year, the Bills were able to control the jail breaks - but they may not be as successful in 2009 with lesser talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VOR Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 teams will defense the Bills the way they have done for the last decade pressure the middle of the OL to disrupt the timing of the offense and stuff the run with a backup C and nobodies at LG- teams will test the Bills early and often by attacking the middle. last year, the Bills were able to control the jail breaks - but they may not be as successful in 2009 with lesser talent. Lesser talent than Fowler/Preston and Dockery? LOL! I like how everyone uses the sacks-given-up argument for Peters. Well Dockery gave-up 8.25 sacks last year and the Bills considered benching him at mid-season. And unfortunately for him, he couldn't blame missing the entire off-season and pre-season like Peters could. Hangartner has good size, smarts, and nastiness, which beat Fowler and Preston right off the bat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 I wish we had a TE, but I think TO and Evans on the outside also opens a lot of opportunities for Roscoe in the slot (until he gets injured again). The Bills will come out of this draft better at TE than they have been. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heitz Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 With all these weapons, let's hope that he dips back into he and Wyche's heyday and starts running more no-huddle and up-tempo plays. His plan always was to get the ball out of the QB's hands and into the playmakers hands fast... The match-up problems that we have w TO and Lee alone are scary. Now throw in Reed, the potential growth of Hardy / Johnson (who I really like), Roscoe PLUS Marshawn / Freddy running the rock!? That has some potential. I also think that Hangartner is going to help shore up the middle of the O-line too. Hopefully we'll add a TE that's a gamer and an OG, but I like a lot of the pieces that we have. Finally I think, like everyone on team, Schonert will mature in his play calling this year and will use all this talent to get us consistently doing some things good. If we can do that we should be tough, if not explosive IMO!* And I'll drink to that *if TO doesn't go batsh*t crazy at some point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 I am not at all impressed with Turk's play calling. He is predictable. I tend to agree with that statement. At times he has a great game plan then he tanks it. I see the same with the defense. I love the move they call the "creep" as it works then they ABANDON IT !! Look at the JETS game when the Bills had the lead with around 2:10 to go in the 4th.. What they needed was a FIRST down by RUNNING the ball. What did they do? LET JP run a PASS PLAY!!! OOPS ... Sack, Fumble, JETS SCORE GAME OVER Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chandler#81 Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 It's certainly fun to think about. And how long has that been?? One aspect not discussed much about the addition of Owens is his downfield blocking. Combine this great skill with Reed's courage and a TE like Pettigrew -who also shows prowess knockin' the crap outta DB's- and the run game should flourish! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewildrabbit Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 It wasn't as simple as you make it out to be. The Bills were still running on their drive to end the 3rd quarter and to start the 4th, and had a chance to kick a FG 5 minutes into the 4th quarter, but elected to pass on 4th down and failed. The next drive was a 3-and-out with a run mixed in there, and ended with a missed FG by Lindell. And then the Bills got the ball back with 1:47 and were forced to pass, and failed. It was a poor performance all over that day. Yea it was that simple, the bills were driving down to the 49ers 6 yard line with 12:10 left to go in the game and decided to go for it on 4th down,they failed to get a first down so the bills turned the ball over on downs at the niners 6 yd line. On third down the bills ran Jackson up the middle, where was Lynch on 3rd and one? Why wouldn't you give it to your player with the hot hand,simply stupid! Then why run right up the middle against their strength and in an elephant type formation no less. Jeez, think the 49ers knew the Bills were gonna run it? If JP pitches the ball to Lynch instead of the quick hand off to Jackson,its a first down or a even a TD. The wrong call at the worst time. Now,the 49s punt the ball to the Bills with 7:14 left on the clock, Roscoe returns it from the bills 35 to the 49ers 40 yd line,plus a unsportsmanlike like penalty on the 49ers puts the ball on the 49ers 25 yd line. So the Bills have 25 yards to go with 7:13 time left and down by 7 points,score is SF 10-Bills3. They can't get a first down running Jackson again so they attempt a field goal and miss, again why no Lynch? 49ers were inept on offense more so then the Bills so they punt again with 2 min remaining,so the Bills start throwing from their 19 yard line with 1:47 left.Safties dropping deep and the Niners front 4 rushing JP,perfect time for a draw to Lynch. Instead they call a pass play and JP gets sacked,next play you guessed it a pass play.tries to dump it off to Reed and JP over throws him.Last Bills play,another pass play with JP completing it to Lynch at the line of scrimmage. Sorry but I just don't get when you have a player that is killing the opposing team,you simply stop utilizing him!He was still in the game,they simply stopped calling his number. Edwards may have won that game if he had been in there instead of JP,the OC needs to adjust his thinking and play calling when a back up is in the game at any position. It wasn't the players that lost that game,it was the coaches bad play calling IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PushthePile Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 It's certainly fun to think about. And how long has that been?? One aspect not discussed much about the addition of Owens is his downfield blocking. Combine this great skill with Reed's courage and a TE like Pettigrew -who also shows prowess knockin' the crap outta DB's- and the run game should flourish! I am starting to think Pettigrew might be the best pick if we stay at 11. Everything I read about the kid says he's an unbelievable blocker. Some so called draft experts have claimed he could play tackle. Those are some serious accolades. The only problem is he knocks the crap out of uniformed cops as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 I am not at all impressed with Turk's play calling. He is predictable. However, with the addition of TO teams will no longer be able to stack the box to stop the run and double Lee Evans. The idea is that if teams stack the box, we can burn them with the pass. If a team doubles Lee up top, TO will be open underneath. If they double TO over the middle, there isnt a corner in the league that can run with Lee up top one on one. If a team sits in a nickle, there is no reason Marshawn should not be able to run all over a pass coverage formation. If Trent plays well, we should have one of the most high powered offenses in the league. My major concern is Turk Schonerts vanilla, predictable offense. Last year, he couldn't make a call from a cell phone. Im excited about TO's impact. Even if teams know our tendencies, they still have to play the game. With 2 pro bowl caliber wr's, a pro bowl caliber running back, and pro bowl LT, there is no doubt we have the personell. I'm not sure how much of the blame from last years offense rests on Turk. For the first 5 games of the year when Trent was playing well and throwing the ball down field, he looked like a coaching genius. Then Trent decides to no longer throw it down field and instead throw to RBs behind the line of scrimmage most of the time. Guys were open and not thrown to. Turk had a great game plan against the Clowns, but it was executed horribly. Then, the offense looks dull, predictable, etc. The offense will be fine this year if whoever is under center plays well. If we get more play like in the 2nd half of the year, even if Mike Holmgren or Bill Walsh or Tom Landry is the OC, our offense is gonna suck again. I think Turk's fine. We need good QB play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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