TO + Mike Martz?

[VOR]

You see, this is the problem when you focus on yards and nothing else. The Lions had the 19th ranked scoring offense in 2006 and the 16th ranked scoring offense in 2007. Hardly a juggernaut. And while it was better than the Bills have had the past several years, the Bills also didn't have TO at WR to pair with Evans.

[Lori]

He underutilizes the RB position? This is the dumbest contention you could have repeated. Marshall Falk made a nice career (a HOF career) running the ball in SL--despite never playing a full season! In the span that Martz assembled "the greatest show on turf"--1999-2001 (that's 3 playoffs, 2 SB appearances, 1 SB win and over 500 points per season--not bad for an offense that "is figured out by midseason")---Faulk ran for 4122 yards on 766 carries and 37 TDs (avgs of 1374, 255, 12). AND, as if that were no enough, he also caught 251 passes for 2643 yards and 22TDs (avgs of 881, 84 and 7.5).

 

Let's put that in perspective. In that 3 year span (the Rams were ranked 5th, 17th and 5th in rushing), Faulk averaged about as many carries per season as our "run centered" offense of Lynch has the past two seasons. In the same time, he averaged as many catches as our #1 receiver. Poor Marshall Faulk! Injuries limited his production after those 3 years, not Mike Martz.

Really? Because our offense totaled 439 carries last season, 448 in 2007. 448>439>255. (And, by the way, Faulk did play all 16 games in 1999.)

 

What would Bobby April say? Who cares? But I'll take a wild guess. Obviously, Bobby, who passes for a coaching genius by the current Bills staff standards (which, since he is a ST coach, is a very sad fact) would prefer not to fall under the shadow of someone who would challenge him for this designation. No, Bobby's ambition begins and ends with his comfy spot "coaching" special teams. He realizes he would be crazy to look for a HC coach job and end up being viewed like DJ, or other failures.

You do realize the history between the two, don't you?

[PushthePile]

This is a perfect example of the level of discourse on this topic. Every sentence is nonsense.

 

His playcalling is "horrid"? How so?

 

He gets QBs "killed"? Name one. Warner broke his hand and that led to his rapid decline in SL. Hardly "killed".

 

His offense "causes a lot of turnovers"? Warner is a great QB, but he turns over the ball--a lot. He had 49 of his career 114 ints AFTER he left St. Louis. He had 54 of 91 fumbles AFTER he left St. Louis. That's 5 years before and and 5 years since.

 

He underutilizes the RB position? This is the dumbest contention you could have repeated. Marshall Falk made a nice career (a HOF career) running the ball in SL--despite never playing a full season! In the span that Martz assembled "the greatest show on turf"--1999-2001 (that's 3 playoffs, 2 SB appearances, 1 SB win and over 500 points per season--not bad for an offense that "is figured out by midseason")---Faulk ran for 4122 yards on 766 carries and 37 TDs (avgs of 1374, 255, 12). AND, as if that were no enough, he also caught 251 passes for 2643 yards and 22TDs (avgs of 881, 84 and 7.5).

 

Let's put that in perspective. In that 3 year span (the Rams were ranked 5th, 17th and 5th in rushing), Faulk averaged about as many carries per season as our "run centered" offense of Lynch has the past two seasons. In the same time, he averaged as many catches as our #1 receiver. Poor Marshall Faulk! Injuries limited his production after those 3 years, not Mike Martz.

 

So, Martz's offense never let the defense rest? Whose defense? The Rams? The other team's? This comment makes no sense whatsoever---in addition to being patently untrue. Few defenses "rested" more than those of the high flying Rams of 1999-2001. During those years, the Rams allowed the 4th, 10th and 2nd lowest opponent time of possession.

 

His offense "inflates WR numbers above the level of talent"? GREAT! That sounds like what this lame ass team needs--ANY coach to make these guys perform above the level of their talent. Why wouldn't you want that??

 

Otherwise, a top notch post.

 

I love Warner--he's one of the 3 smartest QBs in the league, and was the perhaps best last season. In fact how great would it have been to have persued him and brought him to Buff? Far better than TO. But Warner was an Arena League grocery store bag boy who came off the bench when Green was hurt. Does anyone really believe that Warner would have had that type of success then and now if he had not paired up with Martz at that very moment? Martz built that offense around Warner and Faulk.

 

 

What would Bobby April say? Who cares? But I'll take a wild guess. Obviously, Bobby, who passes for a coaching genius by the current Bills staff standards (which, since he is a ST coach, is a very sad fact) would prefer not to fall under the shadow of someone who would challenge him for this designation. No, Bobby's ambition begins and ends with his comfy spot "coaching" special teams. He realizes he would be crazy to look for a HC coach job and end up being viewed like DJ, or other failures.

Mr. Weo you do realize Mike Martz went on to coach after his successful 99-01 run, right? Let me give you a few stats to back up my claim he is overrated. In the six seasons after 2001 that he has been a HC or coordinator, his teams have never been better than 4th most in Qb sacks taken. That's kind of what I mean when I say he gets Qbs killed. In those same six seasons his teams have never been better than 3rd in Qb interceptions. That kind of supports my claim that his absurd offense is a turnover machine. Six freaking seasons to not be among the four worst of both of those stats!!!

 

 

Mike Martz made it only two seasons in Detroit before he was shown the door. The FO claimed he was a problem for the rest of the coaching staff and players were openly complaining about his pass-happy offense. His next failure came in S.F. last year. The 49ers were brutal to watch and to top it off he rubbed players and coachs the wrong way again. The mad scientist led his team to the most turnovers in the NFL last season. This guy has been a locker room problem at every city he's coached in.

 

So why is it you think he should be considered for the Bills? Are you going to try and tell me that you honestly believe Trent and company will be able to run that crap system in the snow and wind? The only time his schemes have ever worked is when he had 5 HOF offensive players in their prime!!!! Even there he started to fail and would have been shown the door if it weren't for health problems forcing him to step down. So I say NO THANKS. Mr. Weo you can live in your fantasy 99-01 world if you like but I will consider his last six failures in judging him as well.

[VOR]

It's a shocker that Martz is unemployed, no?

[R!P REVOLUTIONARIES]

Mr. Weo you do realize Mike Martz went on to coach after his successful 99-01 run, right? Let me give you a few stats to back up my claim he is overrated. In the six seasons after 2001 that he has been a HC or coordinator, his teams have never been better than 4th most in Qb sacks taken. That's kind of what I mean when I say he gets Qbs killed. In those same six seasons his teams have never been better than 3rd in Qb interceptions. That kind of supports my claim that his absurd offense is a turnover machine. Six freaking seasons to not be among the four worst of both of those stats!!!

 

 

Mike Martz made it only two seasons in Detroit before he was shown the door. The FO claimed he was a problem for the rest of the coaching staff and players were openly complaining about his pass-happy offense. His next failure came in S.F. last year. The 49ers were brutal to watch and to top it off he rubbed players and coachs the wrong way again. The mad scientist led his team to the most turnovers in the NFL last season. This guy has been a locker room problem at every city he's coached in.

 

So why is it you think he should be considered for the Bills? Are you going to try and tell me that you honestly believe Trent and company will be able to run that crap system in the snow and wind? The only time his schemes have ever worked is when he had 5 HOF offensive players in their prime!!!! Even there he started to fail and would have been shown the door if it weren't for health problems forcing him to step down. So I say NO THANKS. Mr. Weo you can live in your fantasy 99-01 world if you like but I will consider his last six failures in judging him as well.

 

Finally someone filleted that guy on bringing in Martz.

[Mr. WEO]

VOR,

 

No, I was using yardage, catches, carries, TDs, rankings for rushing offense, ranking for time of possession........anyway. Read it again. Also, Martz didn't have TO in Detroit. He didn't have Lee Evans either, or Marshawn Lynch. He had Kitna, who isn't Warner, by a long shot. Yet he was able to put together a decent offense out of nothing on a terrible team. How'd they do after he left?

 

Sorry, Lori. I meant to compare Lynch to Faulk. The "RB neglecting Martz Rams" of 1999 and 2001 SB years carried 431 and 416 times----for over 2000 yards, a total higher than a "run oriented team" such as the Bills---remember, this was WHILE he was also allowing for Warner to pass for over 9000 yards and 77 TDs. I don't recall anyone concluding that the paltry 1800 yard seasons of the Bills amounted to "neglecting the RB". Maybe we should?

 

As for the history between April and Martz--again, who cares? What team, other than the Bills, would base a major coaching/hiring decision on the feelings a a special teams coach? Special teams are only special if they have talented players (Martz realized this at some point, probably after he replaced April and had the same result).

 

Has having a "top ranked sepecial teams unit" year after year had any impact on the fortunes of the Bills? If it's all you've got, it seems like a big deal, but it's just not. Special teams "coaching" is not comparable to running an offense or a defense. So let Bobby April go pout in the corner if Big Bad Mike Martz comes to town. As OC, Martz can't fire April again, so what's he worried about? He can continue to be addressed as the "highly respected special teams coach Bobby April"-----heck, "the greatest in the League", if it makes him happy.

 

I'm intrigued to see what will happen with TO, but this does not seem, on the surface to be a well thought out plan and not an act of desperate distraction.

 

You see, blade, it can be difficult.

 

And didn't Jauron let some of his staff go in Chicago?

 

Hey pushthepile, Kurt Warner takes a lot of sacks--in the 5 years after he left SL, he's had 122 (compared to the 114 he had in SL). Kurt Warner turns the ball over a lot (54 of career 91 fumbles after he left SL, 49 of 114 ints). Kitna was on track to smash his own sack record before he was benched (he claimed he was still able to play) and a year after Martz was gone.

[PushthePile]

VOR,

 

No, I was using yardage, catches, carries, TDs, rankings for rushing offense, ranking for time of possession........anyway. Read it again. Also, Martz didn't have TO in Detroit. He didn't have Lee Evans either, or Marshawn Lynch. He had Kitna, who isn't Warner, by a long shot. Yet he was able to put together a decent offense out of nothing on a terrible team. How'd they do after he left?

 

Sorry, Lori. I meant to compare Lynch to Faulk. The "RB neglecting Martz Rams" of 1999 and 2001 SB years carried 431 and 416 times----for over 2000 yards, a total higher than a "run oriented team" such as the Bills---remember, this was WHILE he was also allowing for Warner to pass for over 9000 yards and 77 TDs. I don't recall anyone concluding that the paltry 1800 yard seasons of the Bills amounted to "neglecting the RB". Maybe we should?

 

As for the history between April and Martz--again, who cares? What team, other than the Bills, would base a major coaching/hiring decision on the feelings a a special teams coach? Special teams are only special if they have talented players (Martz realized this at some point, probably after he replaced April and had the same result).

 

Has having a "top ranked sepecial teams unit" year after year had any impact on the fortunes of the Bills? If it's all you've got, it seems like a big deal, but it's just not. Special teams "coaching" is not comparable to running an offense or a defense. So let Bobby April go pout in the corner if Big Bad Mike Martz comes to town. As OC, Martz can't fire April again, so what's he worried about? He can continue to be addressed as the "highly respected special teams coach Bobby April"-----heck, "the greatest in the League", if it makes him happy.

 

I'm intrigued to see what will happen with TO, but this does not seem, on the surface to be a well thought out plan and not an act of desperate distraction.

 

You see, blade, it can be difficult.

 

And didn't Jauron let some of his staff go in Chicago?

 

Hey pushthepile, Kurt Warner takes a lot of sacks--in the 5 years after he left SL, he's had 122 (compared to the 114 he had in SL). Kurt Warner turns the ball over a lot (54 of career 91 fumbles after he left SL, 49 of 114 ints). Kitna was on track to smash his own sack record before he was benched (he claimed he was still able to play) and a year after Martz was gone.

This should be a warning to all Fantasy Football players. If you can't come back to reality after setting your lineup, it's time to put down the cheatsheets and walk away.

[VOR]

VOR,

 

No, I was using yardage, catches, carries, TDs, rankings for rushing offense, ranking for time of possession........anyway. Read it again. Also, Martz didn't have TO in Detroit. He didn't have Lee Evans either, or Marshawn Lynch. He had Kitna, who isn't Warner, by a long shot. Yet he was able to put together a decent offense out of nothing on a terrible team. How'd they do after he left?

How'd they do after Martz left? Well, Kitna got injured 4 games into the season and they had to go with Orlovsky and then the washed-up Culpepper. So no real comparison can be made.

 

But like with the Lions, the QB'sin SF put up a decent amount of yards and still had the 27th ranked scoring offense to show for it. And their QB's took a ton of sacks.

[PushthePile]

How'd they do after Martz left? Well, Kitna got injured 4 games into the season and they had to go with Orlovsky and then the washed-up Culpepper. So no real comparison can be made.

 

But like with the Lions, the QB'sin SF put up a decent amount of yards and still had the 27th ranked scoring offense to show for it. And their QB's took a ton of sacks.

But don't you get fantasy points for yardage?

[Lori]

Sorry, Lori. I meant to compare Lynch to Faulk. The "RB neglecting Martz Rams" of 1999 and 2001 SB years carried 431 and 416 times----for over 2000 yards, a total higher than a "run oriented team" such as the Bills---remember, this was WHILE he was also allowing for Warner to pass for over 9000 yards and 77 TDs. I don't recall anyone concluding that the paltry 1800 yard seasons of the Bills amounted to "neglecting the RB". Maybe we should?

Then who do you have taking Fred Jackson's 130 carries from last year? None of Faulk's backups ran the ball more than 78 times in a season during the 1999-2001 time period. Lynch also didn't have the Greatest Show on Turf taking DBs off the line of scrimmage, ramping up his ypc average.

 

And Lynch isn't a Hall of Famer. Faulk was pushing that status before he left Indy.

 

The Rams ran on 43.4 percent of their total plays in 1999, 37.8 in 2000, 41.3 in 2001. By the time Martz coached his final full season in St. Loo in 2003, just 38 out of every 100 plays were runs. And for the most part, the Rams were a decent team while he was there, so some of those were undoubtedly to burn clock at the end of wins. Take that away, and ...

 

Lions 2006: 304 of 963, 31.6 % (down from 404 of 955, 42.3 % the year before he got there)

Lions 2007: 324 of 965, 33.6 %

 

To compare, the Bills ran 45.9 percent of the time last year, down from 48.7 the year before.

 

"RB neglecting"? Guilty as charged.

[Guest dog14787]

Mr. Weo you do realize Mike Martz went on to coach after his successful 99-01 run, right? Let me give you a few stats to back up my claim he is overrated. In the six seasons after 2001 that he has been a HC or coordinator, his teams have never been better than 4th most in Qb sacks taken. That's kind of what I mean when I say he gets Qbs killed. In those same six seasons his teams have never been better than 3rd in Qb interceptions. That kind of supports my claim that his absurd offense is a turnover machine. Six freaking seasons to not be among the four worst of both of those stats!!!

 

 

Mike Martz made it only two seasons in Detroit before he was shown the door. The FO claimed he was a problem for the rest of the coaching staff and players were openly complaining about his pass-happy offense. His next failure came in S.F. last year. The 49ers were brutal to watch and to top it off he rubbed players and coachs the wrong way again. The mad scientist led his team to the most turnovers in the NFL last season. This guy has been a locker room problem at every city he's coached in.

 

So why is it you think he should be considered for the Bills? Are you going to try and tell me that you honestly believe Trent and company will be able to run that crap system in the snow and wind? The only time his schemes have ever worked is when he had 5 HOF offensive players in their prime!!!! Even there he started to fail and would have been shown the door if it weren't for health problems forcing him to step down. So I say NO THANKS. Mr. Weo you can live in your fantasy 99-01 world if you like but I will consider his last six failures in judging him as well.

 

 

Couldn't agree with you more, Folks around here are probably sick of me pointing out the very same thing, especially considering we are still dealing with the remnants of the Fairchild monster he spawned. Martz led the league in getting his QB sacked last year and the only way his offense will work is with a boat load of Pro bowl caliber weapons at his disposal and even then, defenses have learned by disrupting the timing with blitzes it puts the QB in harms way as he's waiting for longer routes to develop.

 

In my opinion TO has fallen into the perfect offense with the perfect QB and the perfect weapons around him. By opening up the shorter and intermediate routes, TO is going to completely change the face of the offense and how well it operates. Lee Evans will become open more frquently on longer routes as the defense tries to tighten up to contain TO, plus its going to leave Josh Reed and Roscoe Parish so much room to work defenses will be completely on there heels and we haven't even mentioned the RB's yet.

 

TO is the missing piece to the puzzle, at least for now.

[Mr. WEO]

Then who do you have taking Fred Jackson's 130 carries from last year? None of Faulk's backups ran the ball more than 78 times in a season during the 1999-2001 time period. Lynch also didn't have the Greatest Show on Turf taking DBs off the line of scrimmage, ramping up his ypc average.

 

And Lynch isn't a Hall of Famer. Faulk was pushing that status before he left Indy.

 

The Rams ran on 43.4 percent of their total plays in 1999, 37.8 in 2000, 41.3 in 2001. By the time Martz coached his final full season in St. Loo in 2003, just 38 out of every 100 plays were runs. And for the most part, the Rams were a decent team while he was there, so some of those were undoubtedly to burn clock at the end of wins. Take that away, and ...

 

Lions 2006: 304 of 963, 31.6 % (down from 404 of 955, 42.3 % the year before he got there)

Lions 2007: 324 of 965, 33.6 %

 

To compare, the Bills ran 45.9 percent of the time last year, down from 48.7 the year before.

 

"RB neglecting"? Guilty as charged.

 

So now Faulk is underutilized AND his numbers are inflated? Look, the point being argued here is that Martz got the reputation of "neglecting the RB"---specifically Faulk--and that this is ridiculous and demonstrably false.

 

Faulk would have been a HOFer in Indy? Maybe, but it was his 3 straight seasons of over 2100 yards from scrimmage in SL that sealed it for him. The irony is that he was utilized so much, that he career was likely shortened by Martz's offense. After 2001, it was a slow steady decline as injuries affected his utility.

 

Martz's last full season was 2004. They ran 38% of the time. In '06, when "Mike the Neglector" was long gone?--39.8% runs. In '07---39.3%. So was the ghost of Martz still running the offense in SL for years after he was gone? Are you really arguing over 38 v. 39%?

 

In Detroit, Martz looked down the bench and saw 1st round bust Kevin Jones and Arlen Harris and decided to go with Kitna. What was he supposed to do?? The defense was absolutely awful and the only chance to put points on the board was to keep his offense on the field--that meant passing the ball. They were were 5-11 before he got there, 7-9 when he left and they famously haven't won a game since (and when whoever was OC this past season restored a "proper" balance of 38.5% runs, the offense went straight into the tank--going from 21.6 PPG to 16.7).

 

In SF? Well, you will no doubt be surprised to learn that Martz actually ran the ball 41% of the time. They scored more PPG than the Bills. He did this with a staff of awful QBs and an platoon of has beens and nobody WRs. And he got fired because Singletary wants to build his offense around the running game!! Ladies and gentlemen your 2006 49ers!

 

And what of the Cards? Seems Warner's current team "neglected the RB" to the tune of 34% run plays. Is Mike Martz the OC of the Cards also?? Or is yet ANOTHER OC making the best and most obvious use of Warner and 3 top WRs?

 

"The Rams were a decent team while he was there." Well. I guess you get credit for spotting that.

 

Martz has dramatically improved every offense he has coached. SL went from 24th to 1st. Detroit 28th to 16th. SF 32 to 22nd. But he's "difficult". Yet we are all claiming our worries are over here in Buffalo because we just picked an aging WR great who is internationally known as the most difficult teammate in professional sports.

 

And as for this nonsense that Martz gets QBs "killed". While in SL, his QB sack #s were 33, 44, 40, 46, 43, 50. After he left...............46, 49, 48!! Was it the ghost of Mike Martz, AGAIN, haunting a past team??? How about the 49ers? Before Martz: 55 sacks. With Martz.........55! Maybe the 49ers were getting READY for Martz's QB-killing offense a year before he got there! And as has already been pointed out, Warner took more sacks in the 5 years after he left SL than he did in SL. On the Giants, he took 39 sacks in 10 games! Was Martz stalking him on the sidelines?? Kitna was on pace to get another 60 sacks this past season when he was injured (note, he was not injured or "killed" when under Martzs brutal regime).

 

You people simply reject a guy like Martz out of hand based on what others say, yet you welcome TO and disregard the same.

 

Go figure.

[Lori]

I reject Martz based on my own observations. And if you'd been paying attention, I'm not all that happy about Owens being here, either.

 

But thanks for stopping by, Mr. LaMont, and good luck with your client's job search.

[PushthePile]

So now Faulk is underutilized AND his numbers are inflated? Look, the point being argued here is that Martz got the reputation of "neglecting the RB"---specifically Faulk--and that this is ridiculous and demonstrably false.

 

Faulk would have been a HOFer in Indy? Maybe, but it was his 3 straight seasons of over 2100 yards from scrimmage in SL that sealed it for him. The irony is that he was utilized so much, that he career was likely shortened by Martz's offense. After 2001, it was a slow steady decline as injuries affected his utility.

 

Martz's last full season was 2004. They ran 38% of the time. In '06, when "Mike the Neglector" was long gone?--39.8% runs. In '07---39.3%. So was the ghost of Martz still running the offense in SL for years after he was gone? Are you really arguing over 38 v. 39%?

 

In Detroit, Martz looked down the bench and saw 1st round bust Kevin Jones and Arlen Harris and decided to go with Kitna. What was he supposed to do?? The defense was absolutely awful and the only chance to put points on the board was to keep his offense on the field--that meant passing the ball. They were were 5-11 before he got there, 7-9 when he left and they famously haven't won a game since (and when whoever was OC this past season restored a "proper" balance of 38.5% runs, the offense went straight into the tank--going from 21.6 PPG to 16.7).

 

In SF? Well, you will no doubt be surprised to learn that Martz actually ran the ball 41% of the time. They scored more PPG than the Bills. He did this with a staff of awful QBs and an platoon of has beens and nobody WRs. And he got fired because Singletary wants to build his offense around the running game!! Ladies and gentlemen your 2006 49ers!

 

And what of the Cards? Seems Warner's current team "neglected the RB" to the tune of 34% run plays. Is Mike Martz the OC of the Cards also?? Or is yet ANOTHER OC making the best and most obvious use of Warner and 3 top WRs?

 

"The Rams were a decent team while he was there." Well. I guess you get credit for spotting that.

 

Martz has dramatically improved every offense he has coached. SL went from 24th to 1st. Detroit 28th to 16th. SF 32 to 22nd. But he's "difficult". Yet we are all claiming our worries are over here in Buffalo because we just picked an aging WR great who is internationally known as the most difficult teammate in professional sports.

 

And as for this nonsense that Martz gets QBs "killed". While in SL, his QB sack #s were 33, 44, 40, 46, 43, 50. After he left...............46, 49, 48!! Was it the ghost of Mike Martz, AGAIN, haunting a past team??? How about the 49ers? Before Martz: 55 sacks. With Martz.........55! Maybe the 49ers were getting READY for Martz's QB-killing offense a year before he got there! And as has already been pointed out, Warner took more sacks in the 5 years after he left SL than he did in SL. On the Giants, he took 39 sacks in 10 games! Was Martz stalking him on the sidelines?? Kitna was on pace to get another 60 sacks this past season when he was injured (note, he was not injured or "killed" when under Martzs brutal regime).

 

You people simply reject a guy like Martz out of hand based on what others say, yet you welcome TO and disregard the same.

Go figure.

By "you people" are you referring to all of the posters who disagree with you, or are you referring to the entire NFL and college ranks that feel Martz is not good enough for a job? You are entitled to your own opinion on Martz and the rest of us are entitled to ours, but you still haven't mentioned how you think this offense would work in the Buffalo winds. Wasn't that the point of this foolish thread in the first place?

[Mr. WEO]

By "you people" are you referring to all of the posters who disagree with you, or are you referring to the entire NFL and college ranks that feel Martz is not good enough for a job? You are entitled to your own opinion on Martz and the rest of us are entitled to ours, but you still haven't mentioned how you think this offense would work in the Buffalo winds. Wasn't that the point of this foolish thread in the first place?

 

You rejected Martz based on your "own observations"? Geez, why didn't you say that right up front? Then I wouldn't have brought out the facts documenting his success in the NFL. I would have accepted that you don't like him based on "observations" (whatever they were) and realized that further argument was a waste of time.

 

Pilepusher,

 

The point of this foolish thread was why pick up a guy like TO and not bring in someone who is a passing offense speacialist, in particular, Martz. It was not about "Buffalo winds". (WTF???)

 

Martz-directed offenses won on the road in late October through December against the Giants, Jets, Bears, Pitt, and Bills.

 

And remind me, how have offenses of Gilbride, Fairchild and Schonert "worked in the Buffalo winds"?

 

Shanahan doesn't have a job either, yet Jauron is still our HC. What's your point? That GMs all know what they doing when it comes to picking a coaching staff?? Who's that guy Al Davis re-signed as HC?

 

Look at Martz's last team. They fired their HC midseason and replaced him with a guy who for years has been on every team with a vacnacy's short list and was always passed over for someone else---and who promptly showed his team what he was all about by dropping his pants at halftime and subsequently firing Martz. Yup. That team is going places.

[Lori]

As I said, thanks for stopping by, Mr. LaMont, but we're not currently in a position to hire your client.

 

And FWIW, because I don't go by "what others say," here are some of my observations:

http://www.stadiumwall.com/index.php?showtopic=50529

http://www.stadiumwall.com/index.php?showtopic=53376

http://www.twobillsdrive.com/articles/game...me_day_preview/

[ax4782]

And don't we already sort of know this offense won't work in Buffalo? Wasn't that Martz style offense supposed to be the reason that Steve-the-Mike-Martz-Prodigy-Fairchild was hired to come in and be the OC? Maybe I missed something but that didn't seem to work out so well for us. I think that the offense we had in place last season will be much better with TO here, and bringing in yet another OC with yet another offense for these players to learn is going to do nothing but set us back for another guaranteed losing season even with TO. And as for Jauron being willing to get rid of coordinators, you were paying attention to the fact that he was pretty much ready to fire SF at the end of the year in 07 had SF not gotten that job at Colorado State, right?

 

And Lori, as always, you seem to be right on.

[Mr. WEO]

As I said, thanks for stopping by, Mr. LaMont, but we're not currently in a position to hire your client.

 

And FWIW, because I don't go by "what others say," here are some of my observations:

http://www.stadiumwall.com/index.php?showtopic=50529

http://www.stadiumwall.com/index.php?showtopic=53376

http://www.twobillsdrive.com/articles/game...me_day_preview/

 

That's nice. Three "articles" documenting your longstanding dislike of Martz.

 

In actuality, the first describes nicely the awful offense that Martz inherited his first year with the Lions.

 

The second accurately predicts that both Kitna and the Lions will have their first 4000 yard passing season under Martz (why not congradulate him?), throws in the gratuitous "if he doesn't get killed"-type comment (Kitna somehow survived to go on to a consecutive 4000+ season), that Martz and Kitna were doing this with 2 1st round WR busts on the roster and that Martz cobbled together an effective receiver corps with old vets and journeymen. You also documented, but didn't grasp the significance of, the fact that K Jones was not going to be a force on this offense.

 

The third accurately desribes the mess that Martz inherited in SF--an offense absolutely bereft in talent at WR, o-line and QB. How he "brought in" JTO (as if he was benching Montana or Young to make room) and how he subsequently replaced him with Hill. Guess there were no "old tricks" as Gore was getting his touches, eh?

 

If you take away the snide editorial comments and reread those articles, you might see that Martz was, in both Detroit and SF, making do with bad situations and was able to achieve results that no one prior to his arrival could for at least several years and, in the case of the Lions, couldn't continue after he left.

 

What you fail to mention is that Martz beat Juaron in both of those regular season games, despite having significantly inferior talent.

[Lori]

That's nice. Three "articles" documenting your longstanding dislike of Martz.

 

In actuality, the first describes nicely the awful offense that Martz inherited his first year with the Lions.

 

The second accurately predicts that both Kitna and the Lions will have their first 4000 yard passing season under Martz (why not congradulate him?), throws in the gratuitous "if he doesn't get killed"-type comment (Kitna somehow survived to go on to a consecutive 4000+ season), that Martz and Kitna were doing this with 2 1st round WR busts on the roster and that Martz cobbled together an effective receiver corps with old vets and journeymen. You also documented, but didn't grasp the significance of, the fact that K Jones was not going to be a force on this offense.

 

The third accurately desribes the mess that Martz inherited in SF--an offense absolutely bereft in talent at WR, o-line and QB. How he "brought in" JTO (as if he was benching Montana or Young to make room) and how he subsequently replaced him with Hill. Guess there were no "old tricks" as Gore was getting his touches, eh?

 

If you take away the snide editorial comments and reread those articles, you might see that Martz was, in both Detroit and SF, making do with bad situations and was able to achieve results that no one prior to his arrival could for at least several years and, in the case of the Lions, couldn't continue after he left.

 

What you fail to mention is that Martz beat Juaron in both of those regular season games, despite having significantly inferior talent.

"Martz" beat Jauron? Please stop.

[lets_go_bills]

I can't believe this thread is still standing.