Miyagi-Do Karate Posted March 4, 2009 Posted March 4, 2009 I am now breathing a sigh of relief Ditto. I think the Bills went after Coles thinking they could get a steal in a market where there was little demand. It was worth a shot if we could get him well-below market rate. They tried, and almost got him. But paying $30 mill to a #2 WR is stupid, after we just re-signed Evans and spent a second round pick on a WR.
Ramius Posted March 4, 2009 Posted March 4, 2009 Coles was paid more than I think he was worth. But I recall a lot of fans who assumed the Bills would make some moves with their cap room to get fans back after keeping DJ. They just didn't think it'd be a backup QB, lifelong backup C, and nickel CB. The "big move" everyone assumed would happen because DJ was retained isn't going to. I don't see another player out there to significantly improve this team. Instead they'll keep looking for reclamation projects they hope can play. I thought we learned after 2006 that spending on lesser players won't work. Guess they're relying on draft day to hype the team. Par for the course, now all we need is Chris Brown with his cheerleader pieces. The problem is that if we signed coles for 7 million, you'd be the first in line to complain that we overpaid for him and it was a stupid decision by a desperate front office. Coles isn't worth 7 million per season, especially not for 4 years. Yes i would have liked him on the Bills, but not at that price tag and for that length of time. Just because you have the cap space doesn't mean you should overpay players.
2020 Our Year For Sure Posted March 4, 2009 Posted March 4, 2009 This is ridiculous. For this one fckin guy, can't we just overpay and get him signed? They gave Buffalo every chance to make this thing happen. There is no other free agent that comes close to Coles! He was the only guy we could get who'd draw attention from defenses, allowing Evans to get loose. And we completely botched it. Jesus, you try to be optimistic, but this team just refuses to throw you a friggin bone once in awhile.
Big Turk Posted March 4, 2009 Posted March 4, 2009 Mixed feelings. That's a lot of money...but we still have a need there IMO. Kind of ambivalent. We don't know how much is guaranteed. We do know that his agent won't get fired. $7 mil per sounds pretty high for a guy on the downside of a good, but not great career. Your point about not knowing the guaranteed money is a very good one. All these crazy numbers are thrown around with the contracts, but a lot of it is for show for the agents, so they can then go to potential recruits and say "Hey I just got this guy a 7 year $50 million dollar deal", even though they know the actual deal is more like 4 years, 27 million or whatever, with multiple roster bonuses of $6-8 million that will never be seen by that player in years 6 and 7 of the contract...
H2o Posted March 4, 2009 Posted March 4, 2009 I really think that we go after Toomer or explore a Holt trade now. I wouldn't be hurt if we landed either of those guys. We need a solid veteran WR to teach the younger guys the finer points of the game like reading DB's, how to get separation, reading the defense, and running routes. I think that Holt and Toomer could do that for the younger guys and even help Evans as well.
NY Nole Posted March 4, 2009 Posted March 4, 2009 Way too much money to pay for this guy. Dumb move for Bills, dumb move for Bengals. But hey -- at least with that much money he won't have to "steal" any more shoes in his lifetime. We can now rightly focus our attention on other ways to improve this team for '09.
Tcali Posted March 4, 2009 Posted March 4, 2009 Wow 7 Mill is a bit much. true...4 mil shoulda done the trick
Big Turk Posted March 4, 2009 Posted March 4, 2009 true...4 mil shoulda done the trick well, I think his agent would have had some serious egg on his face if he told Coles to ask for his release from a 6 million guarantee to take a 4 million one...
d_wag Posted March 4, 2009 Posted March 4, 2009 i don't know how people can call this a "bad deal" or "to much money" before the signing bonus and breakdown has even been announced if the deal is as follows what would ya think: 6M signing bonus '09 - 2M '10 - 4M '11 - 7M '12 - 9M the structure is much more important then the overall value, especially considering the fact that coles won't likely see the last two years of the contract
SKOOBY Posted March 4, 2009 Posted March 4, 2009 We have a backup QB / center to show for our FA efforts so far, score!!
BillsGuyInMalta Posted March 4, 2009 Posted March 4, 2009 I'm headed home now. When I get there I'll give everyone what I know about this whole deal from my source. Pretty interesting stuff.
H2o Posted March 4, 2009 Posted March 4, 2009 We have a backup QB / center to show for our FA efforts so far, score!! It's alright SKOOBY, atleast you still got your BMW
stuckincincy Posted March 4, 2009 Posted March 4, 2009 The problem is that if we signed coles for 7 million, you'd be the first in line to complain that we overpaid for him and it was a stupid decision by a desperate front office. Coles isn't worth 7 million per season, especially not for 4 years. Yes i would have liked him on the Bills, but not at that price tag and for that length of time. Just because you have the cap space doesn't mean you should overpay players. Mike Brown is rolling in it. Forget winning - it's the money over the long run. He let 5 starters walk in FA this season and last. Coaches who stink are never fired - their contracts run out and they are simply not retained. He successfully beat the IRS over inheritance tax. He wrangled what is likely the most one-sided stadium deal in history. Lately, he is worried about losing customers and his concession cut - the ones that have sued him at least twice over his shady ticket and seat license schemes. He will however, sign a flashy offensive player to rev up and entice the saps who will pay go to the stadium.
BillsVet Posted March 4, 2009 Posted March 4, 2009 The problem is that if we signed coles for 7 million, you'd be the first in line to complain that we overpaid for him and it was a stupid decision by a desperate front office. Coles isn't worth 7 million per season, especially not for 4 years. Yes i would have liked him on the Bills, but not at that price tag and for that length of time. Just because you have the cap space doesn't mean you should overpay players. Don't assume I'd complain about any signing. Signing Coles would have been a force multiplier, in that Edwards' progression would benefit from a seasoned and capable WR. He'd be the first legit #2 WR since Evans was drafted in 04-and at that point Evans was a rookie. The market didn't offer much in the way of guys who've produced and aren't 34. Coles is slightly younger and I think has some decent years ahead of him. Now there's essentially nothing but ash and trash out there. The key is, would you pay 7M per year for a proven WR or gamble that Hardy or Johnson can step up? It's going to take some time to play out, but if the Bills passing game suffers because the aforementioned youngsters aren't developing, 7M wouldn't look bad. Besides, who else are they going to acquire to make either side of the ball that much better?
SKOOBY Posted March 4, 2009 Posted March 4, 2009 It's alright SKOOBY, atleast you still got your BMW It was 78 here today, so windows down and music up as well. I'll make it but Russ won't.
jwws9999 Posted March 4, 2009 Posted March 4, 2009 i don't know how people can call this a "bad deal" or "to much money" before the signing bonus and breakdown has even been announced if the deal is as follows what would ya think: 6M signing bonus '09 - 2M '10 - 4M '11 - 7M '12 - 9M the structure is much more important then the overall value, especially considering the fact that coles won't likely see the last two years of the contract most people on this board are too stupid to realize that he'll never see 28 million
Coach Tuesday Posted March 4, 2009 Posted March 4, 2009 Not overpaying was absolutely, 100% the right call. How can anyone see it otherwise? Those of you on this board who are saying that Ralph should've ponied up just to land a big name are completely off-kilter. As Mike Lombardi says, the quickest way to free agency hell is to overpay for marginal players. The Bills did that under the Marv Regime (Peerless, anyone?) and it killed them. Brandon obviously hasn't fallen into that trap. He stuck to his guns with Coles, and in the long run the franchise will benefit from that kind of approach. For a small market team with a ton of holes to fill, the Bills are doing exactly what they should be doing in free agency: talk to and negotiate with EVERYONE who will come in, but understand the market and don't overpay for easily replaceable players.
2020 Our Year For Sure Posted March 4, 2009 Posted March 4, 2009 Not overpaying was absolutely, 100% the right call. How can anyone see it otherwise? Those of you on this board who are saying that Ralph should've ponied up just to land a big name are completely off-kilter. As Mike Lombardi says, the quickest way to free agency hell is to overpay for marginal players. The Bills did that under the Marv Regime (Peerless, anyone?) and it killed them. Brandon obviously hasn't fallen into that trap. He stuck to his guns with Coles, and in the long run the franchise will benefit from that kind of approach. For a small market team with a ton of holes to fill, the Bills are doing exactly what they should be doing in free agency: talk to and negotiate with EVERYONE who will come in, but understand the market and don't overpay for easily replaceable players. Thats perfect to me, as soon as you show me the OTHER 31-year-old WR on the market who averages 900 yards a season and excels in the exact role we're seeking: intermediate passing routes. No, the Bills will go into the season with a 7th round sophomore with 10 career catches as their best hope to fill a starting WR position.
Coach Tuesday Posted March 4, 2009 Posted March 4, 2009 Thats perfect to me, as soon as you show me the OTHER 31-year-old WR on the market who averages 900 yards a season and excels in the exact role we're seeking: intermediate passing routes. No, the Bills will go into the season with a 7th round sophomore with 10 career catches as their best hope to fill a starting WR position. You continue to miss the point. I hear what you're saying, but you're not being rational about this. It's not about the production - it's about the price. The Bengals overbid, which is obvious because there was so little competition for Coles' services. If the market thought Coles' asking price was reasonable for someone of his production and age, there would've been more teams interested. Instead, a desparate team that just lost one of its key players and needed to re-assure its fanbase wildly overpaid. The Bills did the right thing when it comes to winning games, even if it isn't the right thing when it comes to selling tickets and jerseys. And I for one welcome that change.
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