WHY ARE THE BILLS SO DAMN CHEAP!!!

[cale]

What youre saying makes sense in theory, but the reality is we are NOT the Pats*/Colts or Steelers, we cant draft. So were not looking to be the ideal franchise, the ship has sailed along time ago, I would just like to pick up some upgraded talent and back into the playoffs in my lifetime.

 

Amen. Reading elsewhere - the Dockery move (ie. overpaying) was the right thing to do. Problem was we didn't overpay for the right guy. For that we can blame John Guy.

 

Every media outlet at the time was surprised that we payed that much money for Dockery. But they were pleasantly surprised that the Bills actually played and were aggressive.

 

I think we overpaid for Walker as well. But at least that dude can block. At the time, I thought Dockery was the better investment. The real dumb move would have been to keep Dockery after us overpaying and he under performing.

[SevenandNine]

You know befeore you get your feathers all ruffled. Jackosn was an EFA=exclusive free agent no one can sign him but us IF we retained the right by TENDERING him the offer. He will have a long term contract but the bills dont want to worry about him first they have other pressing needs to tend to Jackson will get the pay he desrves. This is one area the bills have not been cheap with the RFA;s that shou outstanding ability.

 

Second Jason Peters is an example of dont ask for a new contract after you just got a new contract if the organization didnt play hardball with him they would have to renegotiate everyones contract that threatens them and thats no way to run a team.

 

Third you think the team is Cheap yet they are dishing out 9 Mill to a receever that can only catch the deep ball about 4.5 mil to a receiver that can only return punts, I dont think they are being cheap not completely smart but certainly not cheap.

 

Finally- Everyone here knows we could over Coles 10 mil a year and he still woud not want to be here. They only way we seem to acctract good players these days is by trading for them. Yes coles is a possession receiver we could certainly use and its believed we are offering what hes looking for but just the fact hes holding out says hes looking for a BETTER team as well as more money. Buffalo was his leverage team only.

 

Right now the bills are in idle mode waiting for Peters/Greer/ and Coles to make decisons on their offers. They will resume picking up second teir players as the weekend approaches.

 

Well said. The Bills have been in an idle state for many years now. I just can't find one good thing to say about this incredibly inept organization. I'm more excited about the Mets AAA team moving here than the Bills.

[Cornerville]

They have made no effort in trying to sign anyone in positions that they need! They tender Jackson with a little bull sh-- sum of 400 and some grand. We have Jason Peters still wanting a new contract granted some people may not think hes worth it but we have the money to do it. There is no doubt we need another receiver to help out evens and coles could be the man. there is really no other good receiver out there in FA that can take the pressure off Evans. do they really think they can address all these things in the draft. we need experience on this team were too damn young!! WE HAVE THE MONEY TO DO THIS BUT THEY WONT. I REALLY THINK THIS SHOWS THAT WE WILL NEVER BE A CONTENDER UNTIL MANAGEMENT AND OWNERSHIP CHANGES. AND BY THEN THEY WILL PROB BE GONE! I am a die hard Bills fan but I just cant take another year of this same old sh--.

 

PLEASE LET ME KNOW WHAT YOU THINK, THANKS

 

 

I get it: You probably still want the cheap prices for the tickets etc but want Ralph to be like Jones or Snyder....you want to hang with the new NFL, hope for a new stadium and ticket prices shoot through the roof...would you pay???

[Thurman#1]

Guys come cheaper when you have success. If you were an NFL FA would you pick the Bills and give them a discount on the possibility of going to the playoffs/championship? Didn't think so.

 

We have an unproven QB, a suspect pass rush, and a so-so OL. We have a blue chip WR and RB (when he isn't being arrested). I haven't even mentioned our coaching staff.

 

Success breeds success. Right now we have zilch. Ergo, we have to overpay to get respectable talent. Unless those players:

 

a) Have a soft spot for BUF

 

b) Are on the downside of their careers.

 

c) Just losers.

 

C

 

 

 

Pretty clearly, I am not saying that we shouldn't be the highest bidder for FAs. 90% of the time, FAs go to whoever bids highest. And when you are talking about low to mid-priced FAs who fill gaps, exactly like Hangartner and Fitz, that's good news when we get them.

 

But the whole "guys go to winning teams for cheaper" thing is largely a myth. It happens with an extremely small percentage of guys, and almost always the players who do that are either already with the team or have already made 20 - 30 million or more. Those guys and those guys only are generally willing to give a discount to winners, a discount that usually amounts to about 10% and no more.

 

Dockery, for example, is NOT a good example of this. His contract offer with Detroit offered him about 10% more over 5 years than the Skins did. But the Skins offered significantly more over the first two years of the contract, the period Dockery is far more likely to be employed for. His decision may well have been influenced by the fact that the Redskins contract was financially surer and better. If you are wanting a good time to make investments, this is it. Get a lot of money now, when you're neither injured nor old and therefore less likely to be cut, and at the same time, stocks, real estate and virtually all investments are historically cheap.

 

None of what you said much pertains to what I said, which is that we need to NOT go for the highest paid FAs. Instead, we should follow the Pats/Indy/etc. blueprint of building with the draft and filling in with low to medium priced guys.

[Thurman#1]

No he was always like this. The 90s snapped him out of it a little bit, but now it's back to the same old Ralph.

 

 

 

Again, only 10 teams are on different spending plans than the Bills. The rest are all on cash-to-cap just like us.

[Thurman#1]

Those teams did not build entirely on the draft. How about Larry Izzo, David Patten, A. Vinatieri, Joe Andruzzi, Christian Fauria, Je'rod Cherry, Randall Gay, Roman Phifer, Mike Vrabel, Antwain Smith, Corey Dillon, Rodney Harrion are just a few of the players that contributed on Super Bowl winning teams for the Pats. You also have Randy Moss, Wes Welker, Junior Seau, Jabar Gaffney, Lamont Jordan, Sam Aiken and several other who they didn't draft and played for them in 2008 when they won 11 games.

How about Plaxico Burress, Kavika Mitchell, Eli Manning, Derrick Ward, Antonio Pierce, Ruben Droughns, Sam Madison, R.W. McQuarters, Jeff Feagles, Shaun O'Hara were a few of the players that the Giants did not draft but started for them in 2007 when they won the Super Bowl.

Not going to get into the Colts and Steelers, as the result will be the same. My point is no team can win just using draft picks. This issue should be dead, as these are facts not opinions as is yours.

 

 

 

Try reading my posts carefully before you answer them.

 

I didn't say don't get any FAs. I said plug the gaps with low to medium priced FAs and build through the draft and get only the occasional high-priced premium FA.

 

Look at your list again. How many of those guys are anything but low to medium priced? How many high-priced guys do you see there? Moss was not an FA, by the way, he was acquired by trade. Eli Manning was NOT an FA. He was essentially their draft choice, but you could also call him a trade. In no way is he an FA.

 

Did Larry Izzo get $8 mill a year? Are you seriously implying that Aiken is a high-priced FA?

 

The fact is that if you leave out the guys who came by trade, your list has MAYBE - MAYBE - two or three guys who could be considered high-priced FAs. In other words, it falls EXACTLY into the system I suggested. EXACTLY, Mr. Facts. Thanks for supporting my argument.

[metzelaars_lives]

Did you know that in 2008, 153 NFL players made $5 million and the Bills had 5 of them? That's right on par for the course. Did you know where the Bills total team salary ranked in 2008? 16th. Right in the middle of the pack. Now consider how decrepit Western New York's economy is relative to some of the teams that spent less than the Bills last year- DC, Philly, New England! The Bills are also operating out of the third smallest market in the league. Maybe the Bills have made some poor personnel decisions as of late, but this whole thing about Ralph being miserly has been blown WAY out of proportion. Some time after he's gone, presuming the Bills remain in Buffalo, people are gonna take a step back and realize how good Ralph was for Buffalo and feel like real jerks for the way they bashed him the last couple years. There's a reason he got voted into the Hall of Fame.

 

sources:

 

http://www.theredzone.org/2008/salaries/TeamRankings.asp

 

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/...s/2008/all.html

[Thurman#1]

Coles has little to no desire to play in Buffalo. That should be obvious by now. He will either end up going to the Bengals or the Vikes.

 

As for being too damn young, that is a BS excuse thrown out by the Jauron apologists in attempt to cover up his horrendous coaching.

 

This past season, two teams younger than the Bills made the playoffs, one of them being the Dolphins.

 

 

 

I agree with the rest of your post, but the stuff above is very very arguable.

 

Coles, it appears to me, is looking for an offer equal to the salary he gave up to become a free agent, $6 mill a year, and finding that nobody is willing to give him that much. He will come to the team with the best offer, whether it is the Bills or not, but only after discovering that nobody wants to pay him what he thinks they will.

 

And as for the Bills youth, how did those two teams do in the playoffs? Both lost in the first game. Why? Because they are too young. The only reason the Fins did so well this year is because one of the players dragging their average up is their extremely experienced, consistent QB. If we had one of those, we might have won two to four more games and made the playoffs too. Both the two teams that are younger than us (Indy and Miami) have QBs who are anything but young and inexperienced.

[Thurman#1]

What youre saying makes sense in theory, but the reality is we are NOT the Pats*/Colts or Steelers, we cant draft. So were not looking to be the ideal franchise, the ship has sailed along time ago, I would just like to pick up some upgraded talent and back into the playoffs in my lifetime.

 

 

Ah, we can't draft. So you must think that we pick FAs superbly.

 

What you do if you draft poorly is you change the way you draft and make it better, which the Bills have absolutely done this year by bringing back Nix and giving Modrak more power.

 

And I would argue with you that our last two years drafts have looked a lot better than drafts before that, though Marshawn's legal problems are threatening to horribly downgrade those drafts if we have to get rid of him in the next year or two. Obviously, it's too early to grade those years fully, but 2007 looks terrific, and McKelvin was a brilliant pick.

[Thurman#1]

Did you know that in 2008, 153 NFL players made $5 million and the Bills had 5 of them? That's right on par for the course. Did you know where the Bills total team salary ranked in 2008? 16th. Right in the middle of the pack. Now consider how decrepit Western New York's economy is relative to some of the teams that spent less than the Bills last year- DC, Philly, New England! The Bills are also operating out of the third smallest market in the league. Maybe the Bills have made some poor personnel decisions as of late, but this whole thing about Ralph being miserly has been blown WAY out of proportion. Some time after he's gone, presuming the Bills remain in Buffalo, people are gonna take a step back and realize how good Ralph was for Buffalo and feel like real jerks for the way they bashed him the last couple years. There's a reason he got voted into the Hall of Fame.

 

sources:

 

http://www.theredzone.org/2008/salaries/TeamRankings.asp

 

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/...s/2008/all.html

 

 

 

Thank you. Nice post.

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

They have made no effort in trying to sign anyone in positions that they need! They tender Jackson with a little bull sh-- sum of 400 and some grand. We have Jason Peters still wanting a new contract granted some people may not think hes worth it but we have the money to do it. There is no doubt we need another receiver to help out evens and coles could be the man. there is really no other good receiver out there in FA that can take the pressure off Evans. do they really think they can address all these things in the draft. we need experience on this team were too damn young!! WE HAVE THE MONEY TO DO THIS BUT THEY WONT. I REALLY THINK THIS SHOWS THAT WE WILL NEVER BE A CONTENDER UNTIL MANAGEMENT AND OWNERSHIP CHANGES. AND BY THEN THEY WILL PROB BE GONE! I am a die hard Bills fan but I just cant take another year of this same old sh--.

 

PLEASE LET ME KNOW WHAT YOU THINK, THANKS

 

 

i think FA is often treated like the NFL's version of a Washington stimulus plan.

 

Many have specualted that Jackson was tendered to meet a contractual deadline, that certainly doesn't mean his contract won't be addressed. Frankly, I'd think it would be in Jackson's best interest to negotiate his deal after a better picture shapes up on what is happening with Lynch, but I could be wrong on that. Jason Peter's situation has been debated at length, but he had boatloads of time left on his current contract when he sat out, his play certainly reflected his hold out, and his play hurt the team at times. We can debate the merits of re-doing his deal at that time---but let's be honest. You re-do his deal with three years left, nothing prevents him from holding out at any other time when that new deal no longer looks good to him. It would seem logical that with an emphasis on rebuilding the o-line, he'd be an important part of the plan. Just like all the players say...it's about the money, and that goes both ways.

 

as for coles, coles hasn't signed anywhere, i'm sure that there is a price point the Bills don't want to cross (perhaps saving some money for Peters of Jackson), and it would be foolish for them to cross that line. why pay more for a guy than you beleive he's worth? they've apparently made a play for him, but he's not ready to sign up. nobody is indispensable in the game

 

now the issue of overall managment of the team, well, that's another subject entirely. you can't help the weather in WNY, you can't help the size of the market, you can't help the lack of nightclubs for players to go hang out and maybe shoot themselves in the weener, you can't do much about ANY of that (for the record, i live in Albany, grew up in Kenmore and love the area and will always consider it home)---but you can work toward establishing yourself as a franchise that wins consistently over time and as a well run football team. absent a few good times along the way, my humble opinion is management has abjectly failed in that regard. using the pats as an example, they sign players to their squad because they have established a tradition and expectation of winning, they don't throw money at them (in most cases), and they work a solid plan (all shenanigans aside). were players flocking to the pats when they sucked?

 

here's the burning question for me---if we had a chance to win a frigging playoff game and maybe, just maybe had a shot at the big game again--would Buffalo be an attractive place to play? i think it would. it'll never be miami, of course, but players leave there too.

 

my benchmark for the Bills has been this for many years now---enough about being a players coach, enough about being a hard ass, enough about salary caps, etc. win the games, win more than you lose, and win enough to play into January. if lynch rolls over some hapless pedestrian, if he carries a gun in his car, but plays and runs for 1,800 yards and gets us to the playoffs, keep him. if he's a distraction who can't get it done due to off the field issues or his running style, move him on.

[JPicc2114]

Bills are not cheap.. just the city of Buffalo is a mess economically and is lucky it even has a football team. Teams like NY, Dallas, and Washington have the $$ to spend. The Bills do not

[kota]

Wow people get so worked up when they see the Redskins, cowboys, and raiders sign big money FA. Have you guys seen any of those teams do anything recently?

[PromoTheRobot]

They have made no effort in trying to sign anyone in positions that they need! They tender Jackson with a little bull sh-- sum of 400 and some grand. We have Jason Peters still wanting a new contract granted some people may not think hes worth it but we have the money to do it. There is no doubt we need another receiver to help out evens and coles could be the man. there is really no other good receiver out there in FA that can take the pressure off Evans. do they really think they can address all these things in the draft. we need experience on this team were too damn young!! WE HAVE THE MONEY TO DO THIS BUT THEY WONT. I REALLY THINK THIS SHOWS THAT WE WILL NEVER BE A CONTENDER UNTIL MANAGEMENT AND OWNERSHIP CHANGES. AND BY THEN THEY WILL PROB BE GONE! I am a die hard Bills fan but I just cant take another year of this same old sh--.

 

PLEASE LET ME KNOW WHAT YOU THINK, THANKS

The joke is between your ears.

 

PTR

[Leonidas]

Seriously, people need to calm down. Who have we missed out on? Haynesworth? Houshmandzadeh? Jon Kitna? Get serious, people. The Bills are doing some good things now, even if they aren't sexy. People complained last year when we didn't sign Bryant Johnson because we were "cheap." Where's he now? He flaked out of SF and signed an extremely meager 9 year/$3M deal with...the Lions. I think the FO realizes the positions of need and is filling them the best they can until draft day. Ever think we may not need a guy like Coles, especially at what he's asking? Same goes for Fred Taylor (although I would have loved to have him as our 3rd RB).

[Leonidas]

The joke is between your ears.

 

PTR

 

 

I agree with this guy.

[Cynical]

I agree with the rest of your post, but the stuff above is very very arguable.

 

Coles, it appears to me, is looking for an offer equal to the salary he gave up to become a free agent, $6 mill a year, and finding that nobody is willing to give him that much. He will come to the team with the best offer, whether it is the Bills or not, but only after discovering that nobody wants to pay him what he thinks they will.

 

I think it's pretty obvious nobody is willing to pay him what he thinks hes worth. Teams are not lined up around the corner for his services.

I also think he now realizes it. He would have to be an idiot not to realize it.

Just do not be surprised when Coles signs with another team, and we later find out the deal he signed was similar to the one the Bills offered.

 

And as for the Bills youth, how did those two teams do in the playoffs? Both lost in the first game. Why? Because they are too young. The only reason the Fins did so well this year is because one of the players dragging their average up is their extremely experienced, consistent QB. If we had one of those, we might have won two to four more games and made the playoffs too. Both the two teams that are younger than us (Indy and Miami) have QBs who are anything but young and inexperienced.

 

I do not care how those teams did in the playoffs. The big picture is being missed.

Those teams made the playoffs.

Football is a team game.

The same youth that cost them a playoff game is the same youth that got them there.

You can spin it and say they had experienced QBs, but it was the same experienced QBs in the playoffs.

 

And how you account for the Falcons and the Ravens both making the playoffs with rookie QBs?

[Captain Caveman]

Did you know that in 2008, 153 NFL players made $5 million and the Bills had 5 of them? That's right on par for the course. Did you know where the Bills total team salary ranked in 2008? 16th. Right in the middle of the pack. Now consider how decrepit Western New York's economy is relative to some of the teams that spent less than the Bills last year- DC, Philly, New England! The Bills are also operating out of the third smallest market in the league. Maybe the Bills have made some poor personnel decisions as of late, but this whole thing about Ralph being miserly has been blown WAY out of proportion. Some time after he's gone, presuming the Bills remain in Buffalo, people are gonna take a step back and realize how good Ralph was for Buffalo and feel like real jerks for the way they bashed him the last couple years. There's a reason he got voted into the Hall of Fame.

 

sources:

 

http://www.theredzone.org/2008/salaries/TeamRankings.asp

 

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/...s/2008/all.html

 

Awesome Post. Nice to see some folks being reasonable.