billybob Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 The Bills want to get Bell into the lineup- might be at guard or might be at RT and Walker moves to guard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seq004 Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 I'm stunned at this move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jester43 Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 I got to be honest, I do not like this move. This is why the bills never improve. They make holes in the roster when they do not have to. Say what you want about DD but there is not a guy on the roster right now that could replace him in the starting lineup & be an upgrade. I understand making the move to clear salary but why not wait until they bring in another guard & then cut him? With the bills it is always seems like it is one step forward, two steps back. They are constantly every offseason making moves that create holes in the roster that do not have to be made. That is why we never improve from our usual 7-9. i agree with you in principle but i'd be shocked if they did not try to sign someone who at least LOOKS like an upgrade. of course they'll probably wind up overpaying another crappy player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dickie do-right Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 The Inner Circle has spoken !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 i agree with you in principle but i'd be shocked if they did not try to sign someone who at least LOOKS like an upgrade. of course they'll probably wind up overpaying another crappy player. Really, how hard will it be to repalce the talent of Dockery? We may have a better guy on the bench right now. Hell, we had a morbidly obese TE who we simply MADE into a "pro Bowl" LT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apuszczalowski Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 I dont get the move. They save $0.40 million in cap room and don't have to pay a $1.75 million bonus. He wasn't horrible last year (But he wasn't great) so all this does is save them $1.75 million in cash, and gives them another expensive hole to fill with a dead cap weight of $5.4 million. I really don't think this was a great move unless theres something even bigger on the horizon they were opening up a spot for and decided to give Dockery a chance to catch on to a new team at the start of FA. This will mean they now have 2 huge holes to fill in an o-line that was decent enough and just needed a NFL caliber centre. I read one report that said he didn't fit the direction the new o-line coach was going in Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dean Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 Good news...Royal and Dockery getting cut because they did not play up to the level of their contracts Bad news...Your head of pro scouting(John Guy) who I assume gave his blessing on these two players, is still employed by the Bills Dockery was a big improvement over what was here, even if he didn't play to his contract. Royal looked to be an upgrade (and was, in some aspects), but couldn't consistently catch the ball, and ended up hurting the team in important situations. People need to remember the context of when these signings occurred, and the people they replaced. While I'd say these guys didn't deliver to their paychecks or expectations, their signing was a legitimate attempt to upgrade the OL quickly, in order to start rebuilding the team without suffering a decline in on-field performance. Given the improvement of the offensive line, compared to that unit in 2005, they did succeed at some level. As the Bills (Ralph) can't/won't outspend other teams in FA to make a fast huge turnaround, and understand that they also can't take the slow rebuild that might end up with the team winning fewer than the 5 games they won in 2005 (they have to sell seats in December), they chose a path that kept them somewhat competitive, while at the same time replacing older, declining and expensive players. So far, the plan hasn't panned out the way it was planned, I'm guessing. I think that is mostly the result of coaching. Dick may have been the right guy to keep the team from going straight down the tubes, but he hasn't been able to properly use the talent on the field to make real progress in the standings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 People need to remember the context of when these signings occurred, and the people they replaced. While I'd say these guys didn't deliver to their paychecks or expectations, their signing was a legitimate attempt to upgrade the OL quickly, in order to start rebuilding the team without suffering a decline in on-field performance. Given the improvement of the offensive line, compared to that unit in 2005, they did succeed at some level. As the Bills (Ralph) can't/won't outspend other teams in FA to make a fast huge turnaround, and understand that they also can't take the slow rebuild that might end up with the team winning fewer than the 5 games they won in 2005 (they have to sell seats in December), they chose a path that kept them somewhat competitive, while at the same time replacing older, declining and expensive players. So far, the plan hasn't panned out the way it was planned, I'm guessing. I think that is mostly the result of coaching. Dick may have been the right guy to keep the team from going straight down the tubes, but he hasn't been able to properly use the talent on the field to make real progress in the standings. I'll do some quick math here. The Bills signed 14 free agents between 2006-07. Out of those, only one of them remains. That's Langston Walker, who's contract isn't too bad. He'll never be a Pro Bowler, but thats 13 misses in free agency. I don't care what context those guys were signed under, all of them were failures by the Levy-led front office. Marv gave personnel authority to people because he wasn't up to speed on his job after sitting out 8 NFL seasons. And for the record, Dick Jauron's influence on this team spread out from the playing field. He had a lot of sway in personnel, and the drafts and free agency periods are the resulting product. Building consensus is how Buffalo got where it is now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCbillsfan Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 The Bills have a plan to make Peters the highest paid member of the OL. But instead of paying him, they are going to cut everyone who makes more than him. Dude. Thank you. I had an absolute shi--y day and you made me laugh! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 First, I want to say that while I don't claim to be an offensive line expert, I will also say that as strange as it sounds, this is where I am looking the most when I watch games both live and on tv. That said, here is my take on Dockery.....The guy is huge but I never thought that he played a very strong game at all. He was decent at times on pass protection, but there were too many whiffs. It's hard to say how much of this was caused by having a terrible center next to him. Now, I don't think that he was a big "effort" type of player. Many times he seemed to be simply standing around with a clean uniform. This is not what you want from any player, let alone a Guard. The thing that is simply amazing is that as Bills Guards go in the last 15 or so years, only a couple were better than him, and I am even including Chris Villarial for approx. 1/2 of a season. THAT folks is how bad this team has been up front. In summary, I am actually glad to see him go. To me, he was somewhat of a fat guy with millions of dollars in his pocket who played a rather uninspired game. He will leave a hole of sorts, but nothing that an early round pick cannot cure imo. That said, do we almost have to trade down now? If we can't bring in a solid free agent, we absolutely MUST draft a center and 2 guards. Even at that, this is a lot of pressure to place on any quarterback. We have all seen this before. Either way......it isn't such a big loss overall imo because we need tough guys, not soft, disinterested millionaires up front. The question now is whether or not Jauron will address this need, or continue on his endless quest to shore up the secondary and play them 75 yards off scrimage. Time will tell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Hindsight Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 I'll do some quick math here. The Bills signed 14 free agents between 2006-07. Out of those, only one of them remains. That's Langston Walker, who's contract isn't too bad. He'll never be a Pro Bowler, but thats 13 misses in free agency. I don't care what context those guys were signed under, all of them were failures by the Levy-led front office. Marv gave personnel authority to people because he wasn't up to speed on his job after sitting out 8 NFL seasons. And for the record, Dick Jauron's influence on this team spread out from the playing field. He had a lot of sway in personnel, and the drafts and free agency periods are the resulting product. Building consensus is how Buffalo got where it is now. i would argue alot of those players were stop gaps until we could fill those positions in the draft. Guys like Bowen, peerless price and anthony thomas i doubt were long term solutions in the mind of the front office..... at least i hope so Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawgg Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 As the Bills (Ralph) can't/won't outspend other teams in FA to make a fast huge turnaround, and understand that they also can't take the slow rebuild that might end up with the team winning fewer than the 5 games they won in 2005 (they have to sell seats in December), they chose a path that kept them somewhat competitive, while at the same time replacing older, declining and expensive players. Right. That's why the Bills outspent the entire league by making Derrick Dockery the highest paid guard in football and rewarding him with the richest contract in franchise history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 i would argue alot of those players were stop gaps until we could fill those positions in the draft. Guys like Bowen, peerless price and anthony thomas i doubt were long term solutions in the mind of the front office..... at least i hope so They became more than stop-gaps when no one was there to replace them. All of those guys you mentioned are out of the league less than 2 years from signing with Buffalo. I'd expect a stop gap to last longer than that in the NFL. Yet when the Bills spent big in FA, they ended up with guys who were released 2 years later. So we've learned when the spend little they're not very good. When they go big in FA, they aren't that hot either. But don't change the front office. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dean Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 Right. That's why the Bills outspent the entire league by making Derrick Dockery the highest paid guard in football and rewarding him with the richest contract in NFL history. They spent big money on two players, and picked up a bunch of others. They weren't about to spend their way back to respectability, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 How is a 7 year deal a "stop gap"? The average cost was ~7M/year for the Dockery deal and by walking early the Bills end up paying an even higher rate than that, over 10M/yr. The verdict on the Dockery move is in. It was nothing but a fug up of titanic proportions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jahnyc Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 This makes no sense to me. At approximately $4 million per year over the remaining five years of his contract, Dockery's compensation is not crazy. The Bills have no replacement currently on the roster and it is a weak year for guard in the draft and in free agency. This is a big hole, and with another big hole at center, how does this get fixed? Clearly, Peters and Dockery regressed this year. Does our o-line coach know how to coach? Do we miss Mouse? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 How is a 7 year deal a "stop gap"? The average cost was ~7M/year for the Dockery deal and by walking early the Bills end up paying an even higher rate than that, over 9M/yr. The verdict on the Dockery move is in. It was nothing but a fug up of titanic proportions. And it begs the question, among the carousel of front office characters, who made the final decision to acquire this guy? Right, it was a consensus approach. And the guys making that decision, Levy, Jauron, and Guy are people who had/have no idea when it comes to building a NFL team. It probably seems like I'm piling on. I'll give credit to the front office for making the move, but that doesn't excuse how big of a screw up they made two short years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 Moves like this one are a big reason why the Bills never improve. They have to waste time and resources replacing too many competent (if overpaid) players that they dump for various reasons. You can only plug so many holes in one offseason. They were already going to be pressed to fill all of their needs, and now, the Bills have all but guaranteed that yet one more won't be adequately addressed. You are right...But in this case what are they to do? Doc simply NEVER even scratched what the Bills were paying Him for...He was at best average and seemed to decline last Year when they expected Him to take a BIG step forward both as a Starting LG and a Team Leader...So sure it hurts because the Bills have another hole...But keeping Him at that Salary, or anything even close to that kind of cash...well...I give the Bills credit for recognizing the mistake, and moving on now instead of later...And I'm not real big on giving The Bills credit for anything nowadays... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Doug Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 Who is Peters gonna text this coming summer while he's holding out now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLZFAN4LIFE Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 Who is Peters gonna text this coming summer while he's holding out now? They're gonna show him the money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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