For those who kinda like Trent

[Thoner7]

I hear a lot of rumbling about how the Bills offense is not producing... news flash... and most of that blame lands in Edwards lap. No one can deny that he played poorly down the line, but no one could deny that there were some games we never would have won if he wasn’t in the lineup. I for one, think that the coaches are what’s hurting our offense/players. Whenever the Bills were running the 2 minute O, they were very successful. The multiple drives at the end of the half or game were near perfection. The times they were not successful, was when the coaches stepped in to mess it up (Freddie Jackson run play/Preston fight). I point this out because the 2 minute is when Trent is allowed to call his own plays, plays he is comfortable with. The result is pretty much undeniable. He said before the KC game that he was very comfortable with that game plan, we he played very well, albeit against a poor D. The Bills coaching staff are pretty much un cappable of putting together a successful game plan.

 

Un successful coaches, like DJ, are unsuccessful because they cannot get their players to play well enough to win...obviously. So how can we even judge Edwards plays under such a poor coaching staff? Everyone and their mother knew Losman was terrible, so dont give me that. Everyone here knows that Edwards has "IT". I think that the Bills need to give Edwards a chance until limp Dick is gone.

[thebandit27]

I hear a lot of rumbling about how the Bills offense is not producing... news flash... and most of that blame lands in Edwards lap. No one can deny that he played poorly down the line, but no one could deny that there were some games we never would have won if he wasn’t in the lineup. I for one, think that the coaches are what’s hurting our offense/players. Whenever the Bills were running the 2 minute O, they were very successful. The multiple drives at the end of the half or game were near perfection. The times they were not successful, was when the coaches stepped in to mess it up (Freddie Jackson run play/Preston fight). I point this out because the 2 minute is when Trent is allowed to call his own plays, plays he is comfortable with. The result is pretty much undeniable. He said before the KC game that he was very comfortable with that game plan, we he played very well, albeit against a poor D. The Bills coaching staff are pretty much un cappable of putting together a successful game plan.

 

Un successful coaches, like DJ, are unsuccessful because they cannot get their players to play well enough to win...obviously. So how can we even judge Edwards plays under such a poor coaching staff? Everyone and their mother knew Losman was terrible, so dont give me that. Everyone here knows that Edwards has "IT". I think that the Bills need to give Edwards a chance until limp Dick is gone.

 

I cannot, for the life of me, understand what people have seen that cause them to make statements like this. This guy was downright awful in every meaningful game down the stretch (see @ Mia, vs. NYJ, @ NE, vs. Cle, vs. SF).

 

I haven't seen anything from a Bills QB since Bledsoe that makes me think any one of them have this famous "IT" that people way smarter than me seem to see in Trent Edwards.

[Robert Paulson]

I hear a lot of rumbling about how the Bills offense is not producing... news flash... and most of that blame lands in Edwards lap. No one can deny that he played poorly down the line, but no one could deny that there were some games we never would have won if he wasn’t in the lineup. I for one, think that the coaches are what’s hurting our offense/players. Whenever the Bills were running the 2 minute O, they were very successful. The multiple drives at the end of the half or game were near perfection. The times they were not successful, was when the coaches stepped in to mess it up (Freddie Jackson run play/Preston fight). I point this out because the 2 minute is when Trent is allowed to call his own plays, plays he is comfortable with. The result is pretty much undeniable. He said before the KC game that he was very comfortable with that game plan, we he played very well, albeit against a poor D. The Bills coaching staff are pretty much un cappable of putting together a successful game plan.

 

Un successful coaches, like DJ, are unsuccessful because they cannot get their players to play well enough to win...obviously. So how can we even judge Edwards plays under such a poor coaching staff? Everyone and their mother knew Losman was terrible, so dont give me that. Everyone here knows that Edwards has "IT". I think that the Bills need to give Edwards a chance until limp Dick is gone.

what proof do we have that he calls his own plays during the 2 minute drill?

 

all but a few QBs have the plays sent in even in the 2 minute drill- sometmes 2 plays at once

 

another myth about trent christ that needs to stop

[bizell]

i don't want to hear the phrases "has IT" or "Poise" again. I just want to see Trent Edwards lead the Buffalo Bills to wins against teams other than the bottom feeders, then I'll be happy.

[300yrds]

I hear a lot of rumbling about how the Bills offense is not producing... news flash... and most of that blame lands in Edwards lap. No one can deny that he played poorly down the line, but no one could deny that there were some games we never would have won if he wasn’t in the lineup. I for one, think that the coaches are what’s hurting our offense/players. Whenever the Bills were running the 2 minute O, they were very successful. The multiple drives at the end of the half or game were near perfection. The times they were not successful, was when the coaches stepped in to mess it up (Freddie Jackson run play/Preston fight). I point this out because the 2 minute is when Trent is allowed to call his own plays, plays he is comfortable with. The result is pretty much undeniable. He said before the KC game that he was very comfortable with that game plan, we he played very well, albeit against a poor D. The Bills coaching staff are pretty much un cappable of putting together a successful game plan.

 

Un successful coaches, like DJ, are unsuccessful because they cannot get their players to play well enough to win...obviously. So how can we even judge Edwards plays under such a poor coaching staff? Everyone and their mother knew Losman was terrible, so dont give me that. Everyone here knows that Edwards has "IT". I think that the Bills need to give Edwards a chance until limp Dick is gone.

 

 

 

Sometimes I feel like me and the rest of the city of Buffalo are watching 2 different QB's

 

 

A few things...

 

While Trent has played well, he has rarely been the most productive part of our offense

 

I hate these end of the game drives that I guess makes him a "winner"...The results in those games are only because the defense plays prevent and all TE does is toss it to the check down. Its not hard to throw underneath when db are playing way off the WR.

 

TE's struggles down the line- game tape. His inability to find recievers down the field means that defenses dont need to respect it. Take away the underneath and he doesnt go over top. IE Marshawns production when JP was behind center(thank the lord hes gone), cant crowd the line

 

Trents Poise- where when what. blitz and hes done for, scared, nervous, blind...

 

Trent is a winner... not in this post, but I have read it and heard it here a ton...what makes him a winner, is it his outstanding record as an NFL starter, or his stellar college career

 

 

 

 

I am not saying TE is to blame, but in no way does he make anything better...the only improvement is he is not JP

coaching is a huge issue, however its not like TE and Co. are operating at a really high level either

[bflobarry]

I hear a lot of rumbling about how the Bills offense is not producing... news flash... and most of that blame lands in Edwards lap. No one can deny that he played poorly down the line, but no one could deny that there were some games we never would have won if he wasn’t in the lineup. I for one, think that the coaches are what’s hurting our offense/players. Whenever the Bills were running the 2 minute O, they were very successful. The multiple drives at the end of the half or game were near perfection. The times they were not successful, was when the coaches stepped in to mess it up (Freddie Jackson run play/Preston fight). I point this out because the 2 minute is when Trent is allowed to call his own plays, plays he is comfortable with. The result is pretty much undeniable. He said before the KC game that he was very comfortable with that game plan, we he played very well, albeit against a poor D. The Bills coaching staff are pretty much un cappable of putting together a successful game plan.

 

Un successful coaches, like DJ, are unsuccessful because they cannot get their players to play well enough to win...obviously. So how can we even judge Edwards plays under such a poor coaching staff? Everyone and their mother knew Losman was terrible, so dont give me that. Everyone here knows that Edwards has "IT". I think that the Bills need to give Edwards a chance until limp Dick is gone.

Thoner: Let the whiners whine, it's what they do. Edwards did have some bad games, clearly. He also had some really strong games (Denver, Jax, etc..). He was only in his second year, but b/c he's not Jim Kelly, some on this board revel in trashing him. He has played well more often than not, and his upside is significant. Considering he's had to play under the yoke of Dick "The Corpse" Jouron, and a defense that can't stop anybody, and he has no # 2 receiver, I think he's done remarkably well. Others see it differently; no problemo.......

[Albany,n.y.]

I cannot, for the life of me, understand what people have seen that cause them to make statements like this. This guy was downright awful in every meaningful game down the stretch (see @ Mia, vs. NYJ, @ NE, vs. Cle, vs. SF).

 

I haven't seen anything from a Bills QB since Bledsoe that makes me think any one of them have this famous "IT" that people way smarter than me seem to see in Trent Edwards.

A little bit of selective memory there.

You convieniently leave out 2 road games in the middle of that stretch: KC & Denver and call a game where he came out of the game at halftime with some form of injury (SF) awful. Personally, your analytical skills in analyzing him "down the stretch" are awful.

[ddaryl]

Edwards id doing fine for a 2nd year starter on a team that needs improvement in a few other postions.

 

I personbally do not understand at all why anyone does not think Edwards deserves to reamin the Bills starter. He manages the game well and he is the reason we won many of the games we did win.

 

actually the thought that Edwards is not worth keeping is laughable... I think he's going to be the Bills QB for quite awile personally

[San Jose Bills Fan]

I'm combining two posts here...the other one is 7 pages and counting.

 

Guys, these are important facts which will give meaningful context to the discussion. Think fairness.

 

In the last 29 years, there are only 12 rookie quarterbacks who had winning records as rookies. Trent is one of them.

 

Year QB, team Com-Att % Yards TD-INT QB rec. Team rec.

1979 Phil Simms, NYG 134-265 50.5 1,743 13-14 6-5 6-10

1980 David Woodley, Mia 176-327 53.8 1,850 14-17 6-5 8-8

1983 Dan Marino, Mia 173-296 58.4 2,210 20-6 7-2 12-4

1988 Chris Chandler, Ind 129-233 55.3 1,619 8-12 9-4 9-7

1995 Kerry Collins, Car 214-433 49.4 2,717 14-19 7-6 7-9

2003 Kyle Boller, Balt 116-224 51.8 1,260 7-9 5-4 10-6

2004 Ben R’brgr, Pitt 196-295 66.4 2,621 17-11 13-0 15-1

2005 Kyle Orton, Chi 190-368 51.6 1,869 9-13 10-5 11-5

2006 Vince Young, Tenn 184-357 51.5 2,199 12-13 8-5 8-8

2007 Trent Edwards, Buf 151-269 56.1 1,630 7-8 5-4 7-9

 

Matt Ryan and Joe Flacco joined this list in 2008.

 

There are only eight rookie quarterbacks ever to start a playoff game before this season.

1983 Dan Marino 15 25 60% 193 2 2

1985 Bernie Kosar 10 19 52.6% 66 1 1

1986 Jim Everett 9 18 50.0% 136 1 2

1991 Todd Marinovich 12 23 52.2 140 0 4

1999 Shaun King 15 32 46.9 157 1 1

2004 Ben Roethlisberger 17 30 56.7 181 1 2

 

Matt Ryan and Joe Flacco joined this list in 2008.

 

So the final analysis is that in the last 29 years, only 4 quarterbacks have had winning records as rookies and as a result, started a playoff game in their rookie seasons:

 

Dan Marino, Ben Roethlisberger, Matt Ryan and Joe Flacco.

 

Trent Edwards is one of only 12 quarterbacks to have a winning record as a rookie (5-4).

 

Please, let's lay off Trent and give him this year. I'm predicting success.

[Flbillsfan#1]

A little bit of selective memory there.

You convieniently leave out 2 road games in the middle of that stretch: KC & Denver and call a game where he came out of the game at halftime with some form of injury (SF) awful. Personally, your analytical skills in analyzing him "down the stretch" are awful.

You are right Trent played well enough to win those two games..............against two of the WORST Defenses in the NFL.

[Thoner7]

what proof do we have that he calls his own plays during the 2 minute drill?

 

all but a few QBs have the plays sent in even in the 2 minute drill- sometmes 2 plays at once

 

another myth about trent christ that needs to stop

 

 

The NFL only alows use of the helmet ear piece while teams are in the huddle. Once the huddle breaks, the communication must be terminated -- as to prevent the coach from doing any pre snap reads for the QB. The Bills dont use hand signals, as evidenced this year by the game with no power, and plays were ran into the huddle by players. Every QB calls their own plays during a hurry up O, I assumed that to be understood.... I guess Lynch or Peters could be calling the plays though...

 

 

To say that Trent is not HURT by the Bills coaching staff is a straight up lie in my opinion. In the last three years, who has really developed? Peters? He got worse. Whitner? No, his best year was his rookie year. John McCargo? Lynch is no better at reading plays now than when he came in. Kyle Williams and Brad Butler are maybe the only ones, and those are rookies who improved, which is expected of all new players. There has been no player developement anywhere, why would you expect it at the QB position? There was a reason Brady and Cassel got drafted so late, and its because out of college they werent any good. The patriots developed them, now they both perform.

[bizell]

I'm combining two posts here...the other one is 7 pages and counting.

 

Guys, these are important facts which will give meaningful context to the discussion. Think fairness.

 

In the last 29 years, there are only 12 rookie quarterbacks who had winning records as rookies. Trent is one of them.

 

Year QB, team Com-Att % Yards TD-INT QB rec. Team rec.

1979 Phil Simms, NYG 134-265 50.5 1,743 13-14 6-5 6-10

1980 David Woodley, Mia 176-327 53.8 1,850 14-17 6-5 8-8

1983 Dan Marino, Mia 173-296 58.4 2,210 20-6 7-2 12-4

1988 Chris Chandler, Ind 129-233 55.3 1,619 8-12 9-4 9-7

1995 Kerry Collins, Car 214-433 49.4 2,717 14-19 7-6 7-9

2003 Kyle Boller, Balt 116-224 51.8 1,260 7-9 5-4 10-6

2004 Ben R’brgr, Pitt 196-295 66.4 2,621 17-11 13-0 15-1

2005 Kyle Orton, Chi 190-368 51.6 1,869 9-13 10-5 11-5

2006 Vince Young, Tenn 184-357 51.5 2,199 12-13 8-5 8-8

2007 Trent Edwards, Buf 151-269 56.1 1,630 7-8 5-4 7-9

 

Matt Ryan and Joe Flacco joined this list in 2008.

 

There are only eight rookie quarterbacks ever to start a playoff game before this season.

1983 Dan Marino 15 25 60% 193 2 2

1985 Bernie Kosar 10 19 52.6% 66 1 1

1986 Jim Everett 9 18 50.0% 136 1 2

1991 Todd Marinovich 12 23 52.2 140 0 4

1999 Shaun King 15 32 46.9 157 1 1

2004 Ben Roethlisberger 17 30 56.7 181 1 2

 

Matt Ryan and Joe Flacco joined this list in 2008.

 

So the final analysis is that in the last 29 years, only 4 quarterbacks have had winning records as rookies and as a result, started a playoff game in their rookie seasons:

 

Dan Marino, Ben Roethlisberger, Matt Ryan and Joe Flacco.

 

Trent Edwards is one of only 12 quarterbacks to have a winning record as a rookie (5-4).

 

Please, let's lay off Trent and give him this year. I'm predicting success.

 

I love how people bring up the "He had a winning record as a rookie!" in their arguments that Trent Edwards is going to be good/great/god.

 

The 5-4 record is based on the fact that a game that JP Losman won (13-3 over the New York Jets after Edwards left due to injury). How did Edwards "lead" the Bills to victory if he left when the Bills were tied/trailing?

[San Jose Bills Fan]

I love how people bring up the "He had a winning record as a rookie!" in their arguments that Trent Edwards is going to be good/great/god.

 

The 5-4 record is based on the fact that a game that JP Losman won (13-3 over the New York Jets after Edwards left due to injury). How did Edwards "lead" the Bills to victory if he left when the Bills were tied/trailing?

bizell, I'm just stating (because you can dissect between the numbers on any of the other QBs I listed, how good their supporting casts were, etc) that there's enough evidence to suggest that he will be a very good quarterback.

 

As I suggest in my post, please be fair and give him at least until his next start (which would be career start #24) before you judge him.

 

He's 12-11 as a rookie/sophomore starter on a poor team. JP Losman was 2-7 as a veteran on those same teams. There's ample reason to believe that Trent will be a good quarterback. Of course I point this out knowing it is in vain.

 

This post probably will not change anyone's mind and I'm about done with this discussion. Give the guy a break, he deserves it.

[Robert Paulson]

The NFL only alows use of the helmet ear piece while teams are in the huddle. Once the huddle breaks, the communication must be terminated -- as to prevent the coach from doing any pre snap reads for the QB. The Bills dont use hand signals, as evidenced this year by the game with no power, and plays were ran into the huddle by players. Every QB calls their own plays during a hurry up O, I assumed that to be understood.... I guess Lynch or Peters could be calling the plays though...

 

 

To say that Trent is not HURT by the Bills coaching staff is a straight up lie in my opinion. In the last three years, who has really developed? Peters? He got worse. Whitner? No, his best year was his rookie year. John McCargo? Lynch is no better at reading plays now than when he came in. Kyle Williams and Brad Butler are maybe the only ones, and those are rookies who improved, which is expected of all new players. There has been no player developement anywhere, why would you expect it at the QB position? There was a reason Brady and Cassel got drafted so late, and its because out of college they werent any good. The patriots developed them, now they both perform.

 

so when T C is looking at the sidelines during the hurry up it is his way of not getting the play from the sidelines but choosing his own play- riiight

 

there is also clock stoppages via out of bounds or inc. passes to bring a play in

 

as far as the no power game- they had the full clock to bring plays in via player to ensure communication of the play was correct

 

he did not call his own plays- get that fallacy out of your head

[bizell]

bizell, I'm just stating (because you can dissect between the numbers on any of the other QBs I listed, how good their supporting casts were, etc) that there's enough evidence to suggest that he will be a very good quarterback.

 

As I suggest in my post, please be fair and give him at least until his next start (which would be career start #24) before you judge him.

 

He's 12-11 as a rookie/sophomore starter on a poor team.

 

more than likely, we're going to see what he's made of this year. i'm cautiously optimistic, we'll see.

[Alphadawg7]

Sometimes I feel like me and the rest of the city of Buffalo are watching 2 different QB's

 

 

A few things...

 

While Trent has played well, he has rarely been the most productive part of our offense

 

I hate these end of the game drives that I guess makes him a "winner"...The results in those games are only because the defense plays prevent and all TE does is toss it to the check down. Its not hard to throw underneath when db are playing way off the WR.

 

TE's struggles down the line- game tape. His inability to find recievers down the field means that defenses dont need to respect it. Take away the underneath and he doesnt go over top. IE Marshawns production when JP was behind center(thank the lord hes gone), cant crowd the line

 

Trents Poise- where when what. blitz and hes done for, scared, nervous, blind...

 

Trent is a winner... not in this post, but I have read it and heard it here a ton...what makes him a winner, is it his outstanding record as an NFL starter, or his stellar college career

 

 

 

 

I am not saying TE is to blame, but in no way does he make anything better...the only improvement is he is not JP

coaching is a huge issue, however its not like TE and Co. are operating at a really high level either

 

 

[PromoTheRobot]

Bills fans wouldn't know good QB play if it sat in their lap and called them mama. Discussions like this are pointless, circular and ponderous. TE is the QB, just like DJ is the coach. All this hemming and hawing will change nothing. So either accept it or find a different hobby.

 

PTR

[Stenbar]

Time to get a life fellas....Give it up..Youre gonna drive yourself nuts defending your opinion..The facts are Edwards is gonna be the starter..He is going to be given the chance and time to develop..This is getting more comical by the day...At least you are providing comic relief during a bad day...

[thebandit27]

A little bit of selective memory there.

You convieniently leave out 2 road games in the middle of that stretch: KC & Denver and call a game where he came out of the game at halftime with some form of injury (SF) awful. Personally, your analytical skills in analyzing him "down the stretch" are awful.

 

Perhaps you need to focus on the point of my post rather than trying to insult my analytical skills. I would hope that the crux of my argument would be apparent to even the reader with the most elementary "analytical skills", but since it is apparently lost on you, I will run through the details of my thought process:

 

It's not "selective memory" to point out that he was awful in the majority of the games down the stretch. And by "down the stretch", since you expressed that you have some difficulty understanding that phrase, I mean "in games that had implications toward the Bills' playoff chances" (EDIT: I purposely didn't count his familiarly-lousy finale against NE, since that one didn't count for anything). So yes, I'm taking the Denver game out of the equation, since it was completely meaningless. Although the premise of why Edwards played well against Denver is the same as the games against KC, Oakland, Seattle, St. Louis, and Jacksonville, which is that those teams were brutal defensively. In fact, San Diego, which was easily Edwards' highest quality win of the season, had to fire their defensive coordinator because they underperformed so badly.

 

But back to the point of my post: Edwards was awful "down the stretch". You seem to want to point to the KC game (and the completely meaningless Denver game) and use that as justification for the fact that Edwards was terrible against the teams I listed, and somehow, that makes my analytical skills awful? Right.

[Albany,n.y.]

Perhaps you need to focus on the point of my post rather than trying to insult my analytical skills. I would hope that the crux of my argument would be apparent to even the reader with the most elementary "analytical skills", but since it is apparently lost on you, I will run through the details of my thought process:

 

It's not "selective memory" to point out that he was awful in the majority of the games down the stretch. And by "down the stretch", since you expressed that you have some difficulty understanding that phrase, I mean "in games that had implications toward the Bills' playoff chances" (EDIT: I purposely didn't count his familiarly-lousy finale against NE, since that one didn't count for anything). So yes, I'm taking the Denver game out of the equation, since it was completely meaningless. Although the premise of why Edwards played well against Denver is the same as the games against KC, Oakland, Seattle, St. Louis, and Jacksonville, which is that those teams were brutal defensively. In fact, San Diego, which was easily Edwards' highest quality win of the season, had to fire their defensive coordinator because they underperformed so badly.

 

But back to the point of my post: Edwards was awful "down the stretch". You seem to want to point to the KC game (and the completely meaningless Denver game) and use that as justification for the fact that Edwards was terrible against the teams I listed, and somehow, that makes my analytical skills awful? Right.

Here's your exact quote "This guy was downright awful in every meaningful game down the stretch". 1st off, if you include SF, which was AFTER the KC game, you can't say every, since KC would be included in every, then change it to majority to fit your response. 2nd, "Down the stretch" means heading towards the finish. You can't selectively start the stretch in the middle of the race-it doesn't fit the definition. So maybe your problem is with defintions of the word every & the term down the stretch. Or you just don't want to give Edwards a fair shake.