The Poojer Posted February 7, 2009 Share Posted February 7, 2009 I know the instant it is past noon it becomes PM and midnight, AM, but straight up on the nose, is noon, 12:00 PM and midnight 12:00 AM??????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Poojer Posted February 7, 2009 Author Share Posted February 7, 2009 never mind...wikipedia kind of answered my question for me Since the word meridies means noon or midday, it is illogical to refer to noon as either "12 a.m." (12 ante meridiem, 12 hours before noon) or as "12 p.m." (12 post meridiem, 12 hours after noon). On the other hand, midnight could logically be called either "12 p.m." (12 post meridiem, 12 hours after the previous noon) or "12 a.m." (12 ante meridiem, 12 hours before the following noon); "x a.m." no longer literally means "x hours before noon", but "x hours into the day but before noon" or "x th hour before noon". The National Maritime Museum, Greenwich, states: To avoid confusion, the correct designation for twelve o'clock is 12 noon or 12 midnight. Alternatively, the twenty-four-hour-clock system may be used. The abbreviation a.m. stands for ante-meridiem (before the Sun has crossed the line) and p.m. for post-meridiem (after the Sun has crossed the line). At 12 noon the Sun is at its highest point in the sky and directly over the meridian. It is therefore neither "ante-" nor "post-".[8] However, as discussed elsewhere in the same reference, the Sun is highest at 12 noon local Solar time, not 12 noon civil time, the difference being given by the equation of time. [9] In the United States, noon is often called "12:00 p.m." and midnight "12:00 a.m.". With this convention, thinking of "12" as "0" makes the system completely logical. The American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language (Fourth Edition, 2000) has a similar usage note on this topic: "Strictly speaking, 12 a.m. denotes midnight, and 12 p.m. denotes noon, but there is sufficient confusion over these uses to make it advisable to use 12 noon and 12 midnight where clarity is required."[10] The use of "12:00 a.m." for midnight and "12:00 p.m." for noon, however, is contrary to the U.S. Government Printing Office Style Manual[11] which recommends the opposite: "12 p.m." for midnight and "12 a.m." (formerly "12 m.") for noon. Many U.S. style guides (including the NIST website) recommend that it is clearest if one refers to "noon" or "12:00 noon" and "midnight" or "12:00 midnight" (rather than to "12:00 p.m." and "12:00 a.m.", respectively). Some other style guides suggest "12:00 n" for noon and "12:00 m" for midnight,[12] but that conflicts with the older tradition of using "12:00 m" for noon[1](Latin meridies), and "12:00 mn" for midnight (Latin media nox). The Canadian Press Stylebook (11th Edition, 1999, page 288) says, "write noon or midnight, not 12 noon or 12 midnight." Phrases such as "12 a.m." and "12 p.m." are not mentioned at all. The use of "12:00 midnight" or "midnight" is still problematic because it does not distinguish between the midnight at the start of a particular day and the midnight at its end. To avoid confusion and error, some U.S. style guides recommend either clarifying "midnight" with other context clues, or not referring to midnight at all. For an example of the latter method, "midnight" is replaced with "11:59 p.m." for the end of a day or "12:01 a.m." for the start of the next day. That has become common in the United States in legal contracts and for airplane, bus, or train schedules, though some schedules use other conventions. The 24-hour clock notation avoids all of those ambiguities by using 00:00 for midnight at the start of the day and 12:00 for noon. From 23:59:59 the time shifts (one second later) to 00:00:00, the beginning of the next day. Some variants of 24-hour notation (including the world standard ISO 8601) use 24:00 when referring to a midnight at the end of a day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UConn James Posted February 7, 2009 Share Posted February 7, 2009 This is one of the quirks in the absurdo reductum that we humans have created about time. AP style writes to use "noon" or "midnight." I go with that. Anything more you try to add is either unnecessary or creates confusion. "Simplify. Simplify." --- Thoreau Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Poojer Posted February 7, 2009 Author Share Posted February 7, 2009 hahahaha...you said "absurd rectum" absurdo reductum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eSJayDee Posted February 7, 2009 Share Posted February 7, 2009 FWIW, I've always known midnight as 12 AM & noon as 12 PM. I'm hardly an authority though. Coincidentally, I was reading this thread as the noon siren went off (that's primarily why I posted). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buckeyemike Posted February 7, 2009 Share Posted February 7, 2009 Poojer, I have come to the conclusion that you are either a very thoughtful person or that you have way too much time on your hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Poojer Posted February 7, 2009 Author Share Posted February 7, 2009 yes to both...it actually started because a friend said her husbands plane was landing at 12PM, i asked if that meant noon or midnight, told her that am/pm always confused me...couldn't get it out of my head, so i dug deeper Poojer, I have come to the conclusion that you are either a very thoughtful person or that you have way too much time on your hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullpen Posted February 7, 2009 Share Posted February 7, 2009 AP style writes to use "noon" or "midnight." I go with that. Anything more you try to add is either unnecessary or creates confusion. Oh crap, you cited the AP styleguide! Do you have a background in journalism? I remember when I was taking my basic journalism courses you had to look almost everything up on that friggin book. In my younger years, it was almost like I had that thing commited to memory. Thanks for giving me nightmares tonight James! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 Just use a 24 hour clock (military time)... Much less hassle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Poojer Posted February 8, 2009 Author Share Posted February 8, 2009 maybe for you...i only have 20 digits...once 8.00 pm passes, i am lost Just use a 24 hour clock (military time)... Much less hassle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 maybe for you...i only have 20 digits...once 8.00 pm passes, i am lost Use two toes... You can add or subtract 12??... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UConn James Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 maybe for you...i only have 20 digits...once 8.00 pm passes, i am lost Count your nose, your ears, and then open your fly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Poojer Posted February 8, 2009 Author Share Posted February 8, 2009 like i said...i am lost :wallbash: Count your nose, your ears, and then open your fly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thirdborn Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 I know the instant it is past noon it becomes PM and midnight, AM, but straight up on the nose, is noon, 12:00 PM and midnight 12:00 AM??????? You would seem to havr far too much time on your hands. Now my brain hurts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thirdborn Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 You would seem to havr far too much time on your hands. Now my brain hurts. ........ and I didn't read mikes post before I made mine ...... I, then concur. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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