lacoy38 Posted January 29, 2009 Share Posted January 29, 2009 C and TE are the biggest offseason needs and i'm convinced there is no way that Preston is back as a starter or that Fine will inherit the TE spot from worst TE in NFL history Robert Royal. As such, i also don't see them drafting two new starters and making an already young offense even younger, plus we've all seen the learning curve for a receiver (hardy). If we had the option of filling the voids, one as FA/trade and the other a pick how would you go about it. C (vets) TE vets Birk MIN Scaife TEN Brown BAL Smith PHI Saturday IND Daniels HOU (RFA) which would probably cost a #2 Meester JAC C (rookies) TE rookies Mack Cal Pettigrew Unger ORE Coffman Wood LOU Beckum Caldwell ALA Cook I'd go with Owen Daniels and draft Caldwell or Wood in the third. Any thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJBuffalo Posted January 29, 2009 Share Posted January 29, 2009 C and TE are the biggest offseason needs and i'm convinced there is no way that Preston is back as a starter or that Fine will inherit the TE spot from worst TE in NFL history Robert Royal. As such, i also don't see them drafting two new starters and making an already young offense even younger, plus we've all seen the learning curve for a receiver (hardy).If we had the option of filling the voids, one as FA/trade and the other a pick how would you go about it. C (vets) TE vets Birk MIN Scaife TEN Brown BAL Smith PHI Saturday IND Daniels HOU (RFA) which would probably cost a #2 Meester JAC C (rookies) TE rookies Mack Cal Pettigrew Unger ORE Coffman Wood LOU Beckum Caldwell ALA Cook I'd go with Owen Daniels and draft Caldwell or Wood in the third. Any thoughts? I don't think the Bills will go after Daniels if it costs a 2nd rounder and a new contract..... I would like them to sign Birk, he's already proven, adds a quality veteran to our O-line, and also frees up a first day pick that we would have used on a C. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cash Posted January 29, 2009 Share Posted January 29, 2009 Just say no to LJ Smith. Imagine if Royal was a worse blocker, and you have LJ Smith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WVUFootball29 Posted January 29, 2009 Share Posted January 29, 2009 Robert Royal is not the first TE in NFL history. Give Lonnie Johnson some credit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted January 29, 2009 Share Posted January 29, 2009 C and TE are the biggest offseason needs and i'm convinced there is no way that Preston is back as a starter or that Fine will inherit the TE spot from worst TE in NFL history Robert Royal. As such, i also don't see them drafting two new starters and making an already young offense even younger, plus we've all seen the learning curve for a receiver (hardy).If we had the option of filling the voids, one as FA/trade and the other a pick how would you go about it. C (vets) TE vets Birk MIN Scaife TEN Brown BAL Smith PHI Saturday IND Daniels HOU (RFA) which would probably cost a #2 Meester JAC C (rookies) TE rookies Mack Cal Pettigrew Unger ORE Coffman Wood LOU Beckum Caldwell ALA Cook I'd go with Owen Daniels and draft Caldwell or Wood in the third. Any thoughts? Explain to me how Owen Daniels will cost a 2nd round pick? Houston will definitely tender him at the highest level for a RFA, which is about $2.7M per year. Therefore, it would cost any team that wanted to sign him a first and third round pick. You are correct that he’s the only FA TE worth paying, but there’s absolutely no way Houston is letting him go. The TE is going to have to be a draft pick, the UFA’s that are out there are garbage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magox Posted January 29, 2009 Share Posted January 29, 2009 Explain to me how Owen Daniels will cost a 2nd round pick? Houston will definitely tender him at the highest level for a RFA, which is about $2.7M per year. Therefore, it would cost any team that wanted to sign him a first and third round pick. You are correct that he’s the only FA TE worth paying, but there’s absolutely no way Houston is letting him go. The TE is going to have to be a draft pick, the UFA’s that are out there are garbage. not true Bo Scaife is a very good option Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted January 29, 2009 Share Posted January 29, 2009 not true (in my opinion) Bo Scaife is a very good option Fixed that for you. Now, not to denigrate your opinion, but I think that you and I have a much different definition of "very good"... Year GP Rec Yds YPC YPG TD 2008 16 58 561 9.7 35.1 2 2007 16 46 421 9.2 26.3 1 2006 14 29 370 12.8 26.4 2 2005 16 37 273 7.4 17.1 2 There is nothing "very good" about those numbers. I would call him an "almost servicable" option at best. Statistically, he's no better than Billy Miller of the Saints or Desmond Clark of the Bears (both backups). I'd also prefer if my tight end finished in the top 50 in the league at his position in yards per catch. So I stand by my statement, outside of Daniels, the FA TEs aren't worth pursuing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oak tree 12 Posted January 29, 2009 Share Posted January 29, 2009 C and TE are the biggest offseason needs and i'm convinced there is no way that Preston is back as a starter or that Fine will inherit the TE spot from worst TE in NFL history Robert Royal. As such, i also don't see them drafting two new starters and making an already young offense even younger, plus we've all seen the learning curve for a receiver (hardy).If we had the option of filling the voids, one as FA/trade and the other a pick how would you go about it. C (vets) TE vets Birk MIN Scaife TEN Brown BAL Smith PHI Saturday IND Daniels HOU (RFA) which would probably cost a #2 Meester JAC C (rookies) TE rookies Mack Cal Pettigrew Unger ORE Coffman Wood LOU Beckum Caldwell ALA Cook I'd go with Owen Daniels and draft Caldwell or Wood in the third. Any thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted January 29, 2009 Share Posted January 29, 2009 Fixed that for you. Now, not to denigrate your opinion, but I think that you and I have a much different definition of "very good"... Year GP Rec Yds YPC YPG TD 2008 16 58 561 9.7 35.1 2 2007 16 46 421 9.2 26.3 1 2006 14 29 370 12.8 26.4 2 2005 16 37 273 7.4 17.1 2 There is nothing "very good" about those numbers. I would call him an "almost servicable" option at best. Statistically, he's no better than Billy Miller of the Saints or Desmond Clark of the Bears (both backups). I'd also prefer if my tight end finished in the top 50 in the league at his position in yards per catch. So I stand by my statement, outside of Daniels, the FA TEs aren't worth pursuing. In defense of Bo, how many TEs would put up good #s with Young and Collins throwing them the ball??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magox Posted January 29, 2009 Share Posted January 29, 2009 Fixed that for you. Now, not to denigrate your opinion, but I think that you and I have a much different definition of "very good"... Year GP Rec Yds YPC YPG TD 2008 16 58 561 9.7 35.1 2 2007 16 46 421 9.2 26.3 1 2006 14 29 370 12.8 26.4 2 2005 16 37 273 7.4 17.1 2 There is nothing "very good" about those numbers. I would call him an "almost servicable" option at best. Statistically, he's no better than Billy Miller of the Saints or Desmond Clark of the Bears (both backups). I'd also prefer if my tight end finished in the top 50 in the league at his position in yards per catch. So I stand by my statement, outside of Daniels, the FA TEs aren't worth pursuing. I had Bo Scaife as my Fantasy league TE this year because Winslow seemed to be injured through out the year. I watched and payed more attention to Scaife this year as a result of it. The Man had a very good year, he was one of Tennessee's more important weapons this year. He had lots of third down receptions and if you look at the stats close to 60 receptions at about 10 yards a clip. I don't know about you, but I'd be extatic with a TE with that sort of production, not to mention he is an excellent blocker and was part of the reason why Tennessee had a very tough ground game. And I'm glad you brought those stats out, did you happen to catch and notice how he has improved every year in yards receiving? The guy has improved by about 30-%40 PER YEAR at an average since his rookie year in 2005. Sorry, but the stats don't lie. And to call him "almost servicable" or "garbage" is a bunch of garbage. He would be a huge upgrade and I'd be very happy to pick up a player that is young and improving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oak tree 12 Posted January 29, 2009 Share Posted January 29, 2009 C and TE are the biggest offseason needs and i'm convinced there is no way that Preston is back as a starter or that Fine will inherit the TE spot from worst TE in NFL history Robert Royal. As such, i also don't see them drafting two new starters and making an already young offense even younger, plus we've all seen the learning curve for a receiver (hardy).If we had the option of filling the voids, one as FA/trade and the other a pick how would you go about it. C (vets) TE vets Birk MIN Scaife TEN Brown BAL Smith PHI Saturday IND Daniels HOU (RFA) which would probably cost a #2 Meester JAC C (rookies) TE rookies Mack Cal Pettigrew Unger ORE Coffman Wood LOU Beckum Caldwell ALA Cook I'd go with Owen Daniels and draft Caldwell or Wood in the third. Any thoughts? couldnt agree more on preston however i think fine will be a very good TE,however we need a TE to stretch the field and petegrew is not that fellow. he is a good blocker and a tall target but he cant stretch the field and is a reach @ 11. IMO we need a pass rushing OLB desperatly and a pass russing DE. that being said i dont feel there is a DE worthy of #11 so i hope there is a run on the OT's and QB's and a LB falls to us or we try to drop down in the first round and then snag a DE or petegrew later on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ans4e64 Posted January 29, 2009 Share Posted January 29, 2009 Isn't TE Desmond Clark a free agent? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lets_go_bills Posted January 30, 2009 Share Posted January 30, 2009 Isn't TE Desmond Clark a free agent? No, he signed a 3-year extension last offseason. But if we still need a TE in 2011, which we probably will , we can look his way. Reliable pass catcher. I suppose he could be had via trade with Greg Olsen emerging as a good TE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted January 30, 2009 Share Posted January 30, 2009 I had Bo Scaife as my Fantasy league TE this year because Winslow seemed to be injured through out the year. I watched and payed more attention to Scaife this year as a result of it. The Man had a very good year, he was one of Tennessee's more important weapons this year. He had lots of third down receptions and if you look at the stats close to 60 receptions at about 10 yards a clip. I don't know about you, but I'd be extatic with a TE with that sort of production, not to mention he is an excellent blocker and was part of the reason why Tennessee had a very tough ground game. And I'm glad you brought those stats out, did you happen to catch and notice how he has improved every year in yards receiving? The guy has improved by about 30-%40 PER YEAR at an average since his rookie year in 2005. Sorry, but the stats don't lie. And to call him "almost servicable" or "garbage" is a bunch of garbage. He would be a huge upgrade and I'd be very happy to pick up a player that is young and improving. In case you were wondering, Robert Royal improved in every statistical category in all 7 seasons he's been in the league. He also has more TD catches than Scaife does since Scaife entered the league, were you happy when the Bills signed him? When you say that Scaife is one of Tennessee's "more important weapons this year", who is he more important than? Chris Johnson? LenDale White? Kerry Collins? Justin Gage? That doesn't leave too many people left for him to be more important than. Yes, he lead one of the worst passing attacks in the game in receptions, hooray. He had one more touchdown than his backup, Alge Crumpler, who caught 1/3 the number of passes. Call me crazy, but I'd like my tight end to be a threat to score. His daunting 9.7 YPC (as I said before) ranks 54th in the league among TEs, that's not "very good". Regarding his run blocking being a big reason Tennessee's running game fluorished, I think more of the credit should go to their 2 $40M tackles (whom they signed to extensions when each had 3 years left on their deals, is anyone in our front office paying attention?), Kevin Mawae at center, and two high draft picks at running back. Also, to C. Biscuit: I hear what you're saying, but it's funny how when it comes to every other team's production, we make the excuse that it's difficult given the quality of the quarterback, but in Buffalo, it all falls on the TEs and WRs. I'm not saying that's your point, but I do find it ironic, know what I mean? I, for one, would not be "ecstatic" if the Bills signed Scaife. Sorry if I sound indignant/pompous here, but the fact that he had a very good fantasy season for you (I hope you are in a PPR league, because otherwise he didn't rank very highly in any leagues I saw) doesn't quite qualify him to be our starting TE. I do not like Scaife. I have the same opinion of him as I did of Royal. Suppose the Bills do sign him, and add his 2 TDs to the roster. I believe that after next season we'd be talking about what a waste of FA money he was. I personally think the Bills would do just as well spending a second or third round draft pick on a TE, and it will be more cost effective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lacoy38 Posted January 30, 2009 Author Share Posted January 30, 2009 Explain to me how Owen Daniels will cost a 2nd round pick? Houston will definitely tender him at the highest level for a RFA, which is about $2.7M per year. Therefore, it would cost any team that wanted to sign him a first and third round pick. You are correct that he’s the only FA TE worth paying, but there’s absolutely no way Houston is letting him go. The TE is going to have to be a draft pick, the UFA’s that are out there are garbage. i guess i was wrong about only a 2nd, perhaps wishful thinking! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted January 30, 2009 Share Posted January 30, 2009 i guess i was wrong about only a 2nd, perhaps wishful thinking! Well, perhaps you aren't as wrong as you think. Daniels himself was a 4th round pick, maybe Buffalo can strike gold and get a good TE in the first 3 rounds this year...could happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magox Posted January 30, 2009 Share Posted January 30, 2009 In case you were wondering, Robert Royal improved in every statistical category in all 7 seasons he's been in the league. He also has more TD catches than Scaife does since Scaife entered the league, were you happy when the Bills signed him? When you say that Scaife is one of Tennessee's "more important weapons this year", who is he more important than? Chris Johnson? LenDale White? Kerry Collins? Justin Gage? That doesn't leave too many people left for him to be more important than. Yes, he lead one of the worst passing attacks in the game in receptions, hooray. He had one more touchdown than his backup, Alge Crumpler, who caught 1/3 the number of passes. Call me crazy, but I'd like my tight end to be a threat to score. His daunting 9.7 YPC (as I said before) ranks 54th in the league among TEs, that's not "very good". Regarding his run blocking being a big reason Tennessee's running game fluorished, I think more of the credit should go to their 2 $40M tackles (whom they signed to extensions when each had 3 years left on their deals, is anyone in our front office paying attention?), Kevin Mawae at center, and two high draft picks at running back. Also, to C. Biscuit: I hear what you're saying, but it's funny how when it comes to every other team's production, we make the excuse that it's difficult given the quality of the quarterback, but in Buffalo, it all falls on the TEs and WRs. I'm not saying that's your point, but I do find it ironic, know what I mean? I, for one, would not be "ecstatic" if the Bills signed Scaife. Sorry if I sound indignant/pompous here, but the fact that he had a very good fantasy season for you (I hope you are in a PPR league, because otherwise he didn't rank very highly in any leagues I saw) doesn't quite qualify him to be our starting TE. I do not like Scaife. I have the same opinion of him as I did of Royal. Suppose the Bills do sign him, and add his 2 TDs to the roster. I believe that after next season we'd be talking about what a waste of FA money he was. I personally think the Bills would do just as well spending a second or third round draft pick on a TE, and it will be more cost effective. There is one major difference from Scaife and Royal here goes: 2006 Buffalo 16 23 233 14.6 10.1 33 4.5 13 3 1 -9 -0.6 -9.0 0 0 0 2007 Buffalo 16 25 248 15.5 9.9 28 6.3 10 3 0 0 0.0 0.0 0 2 2 2008 Buffalo 15 33 351 23.4 10.6 30 4.5 14 1 0 0 0.0 0.0 0 2 2 Like I said the numbers dont lie. I don't know about you, but I consider just about twice as many receptions and yards as Royal's as a major upgrade. And as far as Royal improving, if you look at his improvements they are barely better than the previous years, where as Scaife is vastly improving year over year, and yes he did lead his team in receptions and receptions for first down. So yes, he was a very important part of their offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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