Beerball Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 Here's Scouts ranking of DEs Aaron Maybin DE 6'3" 250 PENN STATE Grade 95 Positional ranking 1 Overall ranking 10Sorry, nothing else posted for him at this time. Brian Orakpo DE 6'3" 255 TEXAS Grade 94 Positional ranking 2 Overall ranking 14 Production Orakpo has played in 35 career games (10 starts) and has notched 90 tackles, 19 TFL, 10.5 sacks, 32 pressures, two forced fumbles and a fumble recovery during his three seasons of playing time thus far. He redshirted in 2004 before playing in all 13 games (one start) at defensive end in 2005. He played in all 13 games as a sophomore in 2006, finishing with 26 tackles, including 4.5 sacks. Orakpo then started eight of the nine games he played as a junior in 2007, finishing with 37 tackles, nine TFL, 5.5 sacks, 12 pressures and a forced fumble Height-Weight-Speed Possesses adequate height and bulk. Still has some room left on his frame to get bigger. Speed is adequate-to-good but not at elite level Durability Sprained right knee during 2007 opener (Arkansas State) was an early setback. He missed the next four games as a result but did finish the season strong, including two sacks vs. ASU in Holiday Bowl. Character N/A Agility/Quickness Very fluid athlete. Can change directions smoothly for a taller end and shows good closing quickness in pursuit. But he lacks ideal initial burst and seems to take too long to reach full speed. Strength/Toughness Stronger in the upper body than he is in the lower body. Does not have the base to win many phone booth battles and he doesn't do himself any favors by playing too high at times Instincts Snap anticipation is inconsistent. Seems to find the ball quickly in the backfield. Also does a good job of getting his arms up as a pass rusher in order to bat passes down when he doesn't get to the QB in time Pass Rusher He's a fluid athlete with some good double moves as a pass rusher. He has solid instincts and closing burst to the QB. However, his initial burst was not that of an elite edge rusher in 2007, which is partially attributed to his sprained knee in the season opener. Most of his sack production comes from him stunting/angling/twisting to the inside. Needs to prove in 2008 he has to burst to consistently turn the corner as an edge rusher in the NFL. Run Stopper Much improved in this area but still a work in progress. Does a good job of using his long arms and quick hands to keep blockers off his pads temporarily. Plays with discipline and will fight to finish. However, he lacks ideal size, he plays with a narrow base and he struggles to hold ground when teams run at him. Also does not protect his legs well enough. Everette Brown DE 6'4" 252 FLORIDA STATE Grade 93 Positional ranking 3 Overall ranking 15 Brown is as good as any pass-rusher Scouts Inc. has seen this season. He has a smooth outside-in move that uses a subtle head fake, has great leaping ability and as a run defender shows the athleticism to recover when he makes a bad read. And while we did not see him drop into coverage in the film we studied, Brown has the speed and athletic ability to make the move to outside linebacker at the next level a possibility. His one weakness is that when he gets to the quarterback he is sometimes too intent on stripping the ball and does not concentrate enough on getting the quarterback to the ground. No other info available at this time. Tyson Jackson DE 6'4" 295 LSU Grade 92 Positional ranking 4 Overall ranking 21 Production Redshirted in 2004. Played in 12 of 13 games in 2005 as a reserve. Took over as a fulltime starter in 2006 (Sophomore), finishing with 37 total tackles, 10 TFL and 8.5 sacks in 13 games. He started all 14 games as a junior in 2007, finishing with 36 total tackles, 3.5 sacks, 10 PBUs and 15 QBHs. Height-Weight-Speed Excellent all-around size. Is tall and well-proportioned. Speed is adequate for such a massive DE prospect but below average for the position Durability Has played in 40 games during his three seasons (2005-'07), including 27 consecutive starts heading into his senior year Character Needs to show a more consistent motor on the field. However, he does not have any off-the-field incidents to our knowledge and he is considered by the coaches to be one of the core leaders on LSU's football team Agility/Quickness Moves well for his size and plays very much under control. However, he's not a typical highly-regarded DE prospect with explosive burst. He lacks ideal quick-twitch athlete and loses too much in transition when changing directions Strength/Toughness He flashes a mean streak but would like to see him play with more consistent effort. Otherwise, his game is built around size, strength and power. There are not many DE's coming out of college with his phone booth skills Instincts Displays good overall awareness and recognition skills. Finds the ball quickly and also plays with discipline. Gets his arms up as a pass rusher and bats down more throws than most DE's Pass Rusher Can win some battles with power moves. Shows the ability to drive OT's back into the QB. Has some strong upper-body moves to get an OT off-balance, but lacks closing burst to consistently take advantage. Will never be a threat to turn the corner with pure speed off the edge in the NFL. Will always be a better run-plugger than pass rusher Run Stopper Is an outstanding run defender. Big-bodied DE with a wide base, long arms and big hands. Can stack and shed. Powerful hitter with adequate wrap-up skills in space, especially for such a big D-lineman Link to article Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oak tree 12 Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 Here's Scouts ranking of DEs Link to article i've been saying what do all you guys see in orapko. in todays scouts inc top 32 he is rated number 5 among DE's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted January 28, 2009 Author Share Posted January 28, 2009 i've been saying what do all you guys see in orapko. in todays scouts inc top 32 he is rated number 5 among DE's Actually, he's #2 and #15 overall. (unless I'm misreading something besides the fact that they don't have their rankings synced up) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan74 Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 Interesting how these guys rank before the combine. A few months ago Michael Johnson from GT was a can't miss top 5 pick. Now who knows where he will be drafted, wonder if that will change after the combine? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewildrabbit Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 The SportsXchange lists Aaron Maybin as the 4th best OLB but OLB / DE 6'4'' 248 4.67 40 The guy is skipping the final two seasons at Penn St to declare, 12 sacks and 49 tackles, 20 for a loss and helped lead the Nittany Lions to a 11-1 record. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBill Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 Actually, he's #2 and #15 overall. (unless I'm misreading something besides the fact that they don't have their rankings synced up) None of these guys are being called a sure bet ... They rate Orkapo higher but their review of him is not exactly kind. I hope the Bills pick a DE in round 1 or 2 but we can't afford a busted pick in either round. I am kinda coming around to liking the trade down route and pick up an extra pick(s) for doing so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotPocket Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 A random thought that my friends and I usually bring up when it comes to the draft, how will the guy play in the elements? The Bills play 8 at home (minus Toronto games), then at the Patriots and Jets every season; that's 10 games with the chance of bad weather. Obviously it's narrow minded to plan your team around the weather but it's a solid opportunity to take advantage of as a side thought. Also, you don't want your star players to disappear when the weather gets cold and the like (as we've seen in the playoffs, some Pro Bowlers do in past years) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 I still believe that Larry English is the best pure pass-rusher in the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBill Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 I still believe that Larry English is the best pure pass-rusher in the draft. Not disagreeing with what you said .. just a thought .. The Bills seem to have thought this about Ellis last year ... he has been an impact player hasn't he? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 Not disagreeing with what you said .. just a thought .. The Bills seem to have thought this about Ellis last year ... he has been an impact player hasn't he? They may indeed have thought that. Truth-be-told: I didn't have Ellis on my draft board last year at all. To me, he appeared slow off the snap, weak at the point of attack, and very limited in terms of his arsenal of pass-rush moves. By contrast, the game-speed, variety of techniques, tenacity, and versatility English displayed on a game-to-game basis really stood out to me. I wanted to see how he'd hold up against a higher level of competition, so I recorded every minute of Senior Bowl practices and the game itself. He looked fast, really fast. Almost dominant at times. Since I was already well-aware of his speed, what really caught my eye were two other things: (1) his ability to drop his hips at top speed to get full extension of his arms on the bull rush and (2) the way he plants his feet (again, at full speed) at the corner while simultaneously dropping his shoulder to get "small" around the reach of the tackle. I watched him go up against Tony Kropog of Tulane (whom many scouting services have rated as a second round pick) in practice on Tuesday, and it was really impressive. In back-to-back plays, English used his speed to fly around Kropog to the outside (employed his shoulder-duck maneuver) for a would be sack; then--having set him up on the previous play--used a club technique to disengage Kropog's hands and bull-rushed him straight back into the QB. This kind of stuff is what you really love to see from a young guy with a lot of raw talent. The only hang-up on English, which I have to admit bothered me a little, is that he'll occassionally get too fancy for his own good and try to use too many moves off the snap. When that happens, he makes it easy for an OT to get inside his shoulder pads, which any DE will tell you is a proverbial death sentence. However, he got coached up a little bit in Monday's practice and I think I only saw it once or twice from him the rest of the week. I could keep going on about him, but I think I'll leave it at that...I really love the guy (not like that, not that there's anything wrong with that). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PushthePile Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 They may indeed have thought that. Truth-be-told: I didn't have Ellis on my draft board last year at all. To me, he appeared slow off the snap, weak at the point of attack, and very limited in terms of his arsenal of pass-rush moves. By contrast, the game-speed, variety of techniques, tenacity, and versatility English displayed on a game-to-game basis really stood out to me. I wanted to see how he'd hold up against a higher level of competition, so I recorded every minute of Senior Bowl practices and the game itself. He looked fast, really fast. Almost dominant at times. Since I was already well-aware of his speed, what really caught my eye were two other things: (1) his ability to drop his hips at top speed to get full extension of his arms on the bull rush and (2) the way he plants his feet (again, at full speed) at the corner while simultaneously dropping his shoulder to get "small" around the reach of the tackle. I watched him go up against Tony Kropog of Tulane (whom many scouting services have rated as a second round pick) in practice on Tuesday, and it was really impressive. In back-to-back plays, English used his speed to fly around Kropog to the outside (employed his shoulder-duck maneuver) for a would be sack; then--having set him up on the previous play--used a club technique to disengage Kropog's hands and bull-rushed him straight back into the QB. This kind of stuff is what you really love to see from a young guy with a lot of raw talent. The only hang-up on English, which I have to admit bothered me a little, is that he'll occassionally get too fancy for his own good and try to use too many moves off the snap. When that happens, he makes it easy for an OT to get inside his shoulder pads, which any DE will tell you is a proverbial death sentence. However, he got coached up a little bit in Monday's practice and I think I only saw it once or twice from him the rest of the week. I could keep going on about him, but I think I'll leave it at that...I really love the guy (not like that, not that there's anything wrong with that). That's alot of good info on English, thanks. I think that there are 7-9 really good D-lineman in this draft. If the Bills get lucky and focus on defense, they could really score some talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lets_go_bills Posted January 28, 2009 Share Posted January 28, 2009 Good bless your Insider status. Maybin and Orakpo are the only true blue-chippers here. Brown's close. Maybin's lack of weight is red flag, if he was 250-260lbs he'd be a top-3 pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DIE HARD 1967 Posted January 29, 2009 Share Posted January 29, 2009 Nice Post Beerball Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2o Posted January 29, 2009 Share Posted January 29, 2009 Ayers from Tennessee showed me something in the Senior Bowl. I liked what I saw from him and he could be had in the second round probably. There is still the combine and personal workouts left to go so I'm sure we'll see alot of changes in opinion before April. It's fun to speculate and talk about though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VOR Posted January 30, 2009 Share Posted January 30, 2009 Looking at the videos, English has excellent burst off the line, shoulder dip, and speed in pursuit. And according to NIU's website (which often lie), he's 6'3" and 255#. I'd take him at 11th overall (even better if they can trade down a few spots and grab him) and go center in the 2nd. I'm not overly impressed with the other DE's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted January 30, 2009 Share Posted January 30, 2009 Looking at the videos, English has excellent burst off the line, shoulder dip, and speed in pursuit. And according to NIU's website (which often lie), he's 6'3" and 255#. I'd take him at 11th overall (even better if they can trade down a few spots and grab him) and go center in the 2nd. I'm not overly impressed with the other DE's. His Senior Bowl measurables were recorded at 6'2" 254 lbs, so it looks like the Huskies' website is pretty accurate. And, as you can tell from my posts, I whole-heartedly agree that he's the best pass-rusher available. I don't mean to compare the two players, but it kind of reminds me of 2002, when Dwight Freeney was obviously the draft's best pass-rusher, but most scouts felt he wouldn't be selected in round 1. The knocks against him were his size and the level of competition he faced. Then the Colts surprised everyone and took him at 11 overall. I can remember thinking, despite all of the criticism, that they'd be really happy the first time he lead the league in sacks. I would be thrilled if the Bills took him at 11. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PastaJoe Posted January 30, 2009 Share Posted January 30, 2009 FWIW, this week's Sporting News projects the Bills 1st pick being Larry English, 2nd pick WR Patrick Turner, USC. They have Orakpo going to Cincy at #6. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PushthePile Posted January 30, 2009 Share Posted January 30, 2009 FWIW, this week's Sporting News projects the Bills 1st pick being Larry English, 2nd pick WR Patrick Turner, USC. They have Orakpo going to Cincy at #6. I saw that myself and found it interesting in comparison to every other mock. English seems to be gaining momentum and could really make himself alot of money with a good combine. I haven't heard anything about Patrick Turner yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VOR Posted January 31, 2009 Share Posted January 31, 2009 His Senior Bowl measurables were recorded at 6'2" 254 lbs, so it looks like the Huskies' website is pretty accurate. And, as you can tell from my posts, I whole-heartedly agree that he's the best pass-rusher available. I don't mean to compare the two players, but it kind of reminds me of 2002, when Dwight Freeney was obviously the draft's best pass-rusher, but most scouts felt he wouldn't be selected in round 1. The knocks against him were his size and the level of competition he faced. Then the Colts surprised everyone and took him at 11 overall. I can remember thinking, despite all of the criticism, that they'd be really happy the first time he lead the league in sacks. I would be thrilled if the Bills took him at 11. Thanks, didn't see the Senior Bowl measurements. That's good size, I think I'm sold on him. Pass rush is definitely a priority for the Bills. I'd be curious to know if the "experts" think he has room to add bulk to his frame. His height doesn't concern me, and actually it seems better to be a little shorter, since it's harder for the OT to gain leverage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsCelticsAngelsBama Posted January 31, 2009 Share Posted January 31, 2009 They may indeed have thought that. Truth-be-told: I didn't have Ellis on my draft board last year at all. To me, he appeared slow off the snap, weak at the point of attack, and very limited in terms of his arsenal of pass-rush moves. By contrast, the game-speed, variety of techniques, tenacity, and versatility English displayed on a game-to-game basis really stood out to me. I wanted to see how he'd hold up against a higher level of competition, so I recorded every minute of Senior Bowl practices and the game itself. He looked fast, really fast. Almost dominant at times. Since I was already well-aware of his speed, what really caught my eye were two other things: (1) his ability to drop his hips at top speed to get full extension of his arms on the bull rush and (2) the way he plants his feet (again, at full speed) at the corner while simultaneously dropping his shoulder to get "small" around the reach of the tackle. I watched him go up against Tony Kropog of Tulane (whom many scouting services have rated as a second round pick) in practice on Tuesday, and it was really impressive. In back-to-back plays, English used his speed to fly around Kropog to the outside (employed his shoulder-duck maneuver) for a would be sack; then--having set him up on the previous play--used a club technique to disengage Kropog's hands and bull-rushed him straight back into the QB. This kind of stuff is what you really love to see from a young guy with a lot of raw talent. The only hang-up on English, which I have to admit bothered me a little, is that he'll occassionally get too fancy for his own good and try to use too many moves off the snap. When that happens, he makes it easy for an OT to get inside his shoulder pads, which any DE will tell you is a proverbial death sentence. However, he got coached up a little bit in Monday's practice and I think I only saw it once or twice from him the rest of the week. I could keep going on about him, but I think I'll leave it at that...I really love the guy (not like that, not that there's anything wrong with that). You have a draft board ? where do you keep it ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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