OH Look! A New Palin Thread!

[Kelly the Dog]

Yeah. Keep talking about something you know nothing about. Good plan.

 

Oh, wait, don't you talk about economics too? I guess you're used to it, huh? Or am I getting you confused with Molson/Eliott/whatever?

You just make numbers up out of nowhere, with no verification. Me, on the other hand, show four separate links, a couple of which were the official sites of your alleged school, and I am the one that knows nothing about this? What year did you allegedly graduate, I could probably find the official number of admissions for that year, too, or one close to it. Like I just posted, 14 years ago it was the same numbers. From earlier posts you have made here that would likely fall in the general time period. You just consistently spew nonsense and happen to get called on it as well as shown you are dead wrong all the time.

[OCinBuffalo]

It was 13.5% acceptance rate for the class of 1995, too. Seems pretty consistent.

http://eric.ed.gov/ERICDocs/data/ericdocs2...80/15/9b/12.pdf

These numbers are about kids who are nominated. That's around 5 steps deep into the process. I think this is hysterical you guys grabbing all these links super-fast, like you know something.

 

Hmm. I seem to recall getting up at 5 am every day and told:

 

"Sixty Thousand other people were nominated for for this, never mind the 160,000 that applied, and you are going to tell me that you belong here, when you can't even tell me [insert knowledge here] or [insert physical training here]."

 

Yeah, I didn't hear those numbers every time I turned around, every time I, or any other plebe made a mistake. You were there, and you know better.

 

But go on, this is highly entertaining. I am going to send this to my Beast squad. They will get a kick out of it. Especially the guy that quit Princeton after 3.5 years and went there, because he wanted to do something "harder". We still can't figure him out either...

[OCinBuffalo]

You just make numbers up out of nowhere, with no verification. Me, on the other hand, show four separate links, a couple of which were the official sites of your alleged school, and I am the one that knows nothing about this? What year did you allegedly graduate, I could probably find the official number of admissions for that year, too, or one close to it. Like I just posted, 14 years ago it was the same numbers. From earlier posts you have made here that would likely fall in the general time period. You just consistently spew nonsense and happen to get called on it as well as shown you are dead wrong all the time.

Hahahaha. Read my post above. I just make #s up out of nowhere? Keep talking.

 

Edit: Verification? You need verification?

 

OK.

 

"Sir, there are 324 days and a butt until Army Beats Navy!"

"Sir, there are 1 million days and a butt until Kelly realizes this is a loser argument for him."

[SageAgainstTheMachine]

You just make numbers up out of nowhere, with no verification. Me, on the other hand, show four separate links, a couple of which were the official sites of your alleged school, and I am the one that knows nothing about this? What year did you allegedly graduate, I could probably find the official number of admissions for that year, too, or one close to it. Like I just posted, 14 years ago it was the same numbers. From earlier posts you have made here that would likely fall in the general time period. You just consistently spew nonsense and happen to get called on it as well as shown you are dead wrong all the time.

 

Jesus H. Christ, if he says he went to West Point, he went to West Point. Big man, picking on the US military officer on a message board. Just lay off.

[Kelly the Dog]

These numbers are about kids who are nominated. That's around 5 steps deep into the process. I think this is hysterical you guys grabbing all these links super-fast, like you know something.

 

Hmm. I seem to recall getting up at 5 am every day and told:

 

"Sixty Thousand other people were nominated for for this, never mind the 160,000 that applied, and you are going to tell me that you belong here, when you can't even tell me [insert knowledge here] or [insert physical training here]."

 

Yeah, I didn't hear those numbers every time I turned around, every time I, or any other plebe made a mistake. You were there, and you know better.

 

But go on, this is highly entertaining. I am going to send this to my Beast squad. They will get a kick out of it. Especially the guy that quit Princeton after 3.5 years and went there, because he wanted to do something "harder". We still can't figure him out either...

The typical numbers run like this: There are 10,000 to 12,000 files opened each year; of those approximately 5,000 to 7,000 complete their file for consideration for admission; of those approximately 3,000 to 4,000 receive a nomination; of those approximately 2,000 to 2,500 are fully qualified; and of those approximately 1,200 are offered admission and enter West Point each year.

[Kelly the Dog]

Jesus H. Christ, if he says he went to West Point, he went to West Point. Big man, picking on the US military officer on a message board. Just lay off.

I believe he went to West Point. He's just completely full of crap half of the things he says, and myself and numerous others constantly show it. You can see earlier how he just said the RCP (which stand for Real Clear Politics) were way off, and I just went to the site and in three seconds showed the numbers werent way off they were dead close.

[OCinBuffalo]

I believe he went to West Point. He's just completely full of crap half of the things he says, and myself and numerous others constantly show it. You can see earlier how he just said the RCP (which stand for Real Clear Politics) were way off, and I just went to the site and in three seconds showed the numbers werent way off they were dead close.

What am I full of crap about Kelly, specifically?

What others are you talking about, besides the ones in your head?

When have you ever consistently shown anything?

And what RCP #s are you talking about? The favorables or the LV polls?

[OCinBuffalo]

Edit: The numbers are down significantly it appears.

 

I don't doubt it. The reason should be obvious, even for you Kelly.

[Kelly the Dog]

What am I full of crap about Kelly, specifically?

What others are you talking about, besides the ones in your head?

When have you ever consistently shown anything?

And what RCP #s are you talking about? The favorables or the LV polls?

I just posted the nomination numbers for you again.

 

The final polls the day of the election are the RCP polls, which if you bothered to look, I linked.

 

Here are the numbers for your nominations: "The typical numbers run like this: There are 10,000 to 12,000 files opened each year; of those approximately 5,000 to 7,000 complete their file for consideration for admission; of those approximately 3,000 to 4,000 receive a nomination; of those approximately 2,000 to 2,500 are fully qualified; and of those approximately 1,200 are offered admission and enter West Point each year."

 

This comes from a guy who works for the West Point Alumni.

Expertise: I can answer questions about admissions to West Point; about the history of West Point; about how to travel to West Point, where to eat, where to stay, etc.; and about West Point`s alumni organization, the West Point Association of Graduates.

I am a 1970 Graduate of West Point. I served six years on active duty and another 8 years in the active reserve. I have been actively involved as a Field Admissions Representative for over 15 years and have participated on my Congressman's Academy Selection Panel for over 20 years. I am actively involved in West Point Alumni affairs, serving in roles both with the West Point Association of Graduates and the local alumni chapter in Annapolis, MD. I also have two sons who graduated from West Point in 1995 and 2001. Both are veterans of the Iraq war and continue to serve on Active Duty in the Army.

[Kelly the Dog]

Edit: The numbers are down significantly it appears.

 

I don't doubt it. The reason should be obvious, even for you Kelly.

As I already linked, they were the same for people who enrolled in 1991, too.

[OCinBuffalo]

I just posted the nomination numbers for you again.

 

The final polls the day of the election are the RCP polls, which if you bothered to look, I linked.

 

Here are the numbers for your nominations: "The typical numbers run like this: There are 10,000 to 12,000 files opened each year; of those approximately 5,000 to 7,000 complete their file for consideration for admission; of those approximately 3,000 to 4,000 receive a nomination; of those approximately 2,000 to 2,500 are fully qualified; and of those approximately 1,200 are offered admission and enter West Point each year."

 

This comes from a guy who works for the West Point Alumni.

Again, if you are talking about the famous "Army of the 70's"(another thing we had drilled into our head), then I, again, would agree with you.

 

This guy graduated in 70. Which means he was a plebe in 1966. Hmmm. What does 1966 and 2008 have in common? It couldn't be that we were fighting REAL SHOOTING WARS both years COULD IT? How many people do you think were signing up to be officers in Viet f'ing Nam, where more were killed by their own men than by the enemy? Man, your ignorance of history/military matters is astounding.

 

Kellllllyyyyyy.....this is a loser argument for you.

 

And, when I went, we were at the end of the great Reagan/Bush military build up. We were fighting no one, and the incentive to come out of the Point at the time was astronomical. It virtually guaranteed that you could skip 10 years of your career. My buddies are all VP's of blah, blah at [insert company you know].

 

Is it within your grasp to assume that the # of people who start the process is indirectly proportional to the likelihood that they catch a round, in real war?

[OCinBuffalo]

As I already linked, they were the same for people who enrolled in 1991, too.

No way, not even close. There's simply no way that was true for me.

 

Let me be clear. There's like 15 steps to this. It's not, send your application, and then they pick, like everywhere else.

 

160,000 kids started the process my year, thats definite.

 

At each step, kids are weeded out. So, it's more like(estimated):

 

Application 160,000

Medical Tests 100,000

Physical Tests 70,000

Citizenship Stuff 65,000

Congressional/Army Stuff 60,000

Actual Nominees that they really consider 15,000

FBI stuff and a bunch of Army tests like the ASFAB...

 

...or in my case the lacrosse coach simply appoints you, after you get past the nomination.

1500. (and the really funny part is around 300 of those are gone during the first week)

 

So if you want to compare my year's process to college, which you really can't anyway, it's exactly as I said.

 

All the numbers you keep linking either refer to actual nominees, which each Congressperson gets a number based on population, Senators, VP and President 5 each, Puerto Rico 1, etc.<-- This group gets in no matter what, unless there is an FBI problem, the rest get appointed by the Com's office.

 

Look this has all been entertaining, but let's not forget, the HONOR part of the honor code. I don't like getting mine questioned based on ignorance. I have no problem explaining something you don't understand, though.

[Kelly the Dog]

Again, if you are talking about the famous "Army of the 70's"(another thing we had drilled into our head), then I, again, would agree with you.

 

This guy graduated in 70. Which means he was a plebe in 1966. Hmmm. What does 1966 and 2008 have in common? It couldn't be that we were fighting REAL SHOOTING WARS both years COULD IT? How many people do you think were signing up to be officers in Viet f'ing Nam, where more were killed by their own men than by the enemy? Man, your ignorance of history/military matters is astounding.

 

Kellllllyyyyyy.....this is a loser argument for you.

 

And, when I went, we were at the end of the great Reagan/Bush military build up. We were fighting no one, and the incentive to come out of the Point at the time was astronomical. It virtually guaranteed that you could skip 10 years of your career. My buddies are all VP's of blah, blah at [insert company you know].

 

Is it within your grasp to assume that the # of people who start the process is indirectly proportional to the likelihood that they catch a round, in real war?

For the third time, the numbers were the same in the early and mid 90s. In 1995, the admissions rate was the same, 13.5%. In 1995, 11,954 applied total, 1611 were admitted, and 1224 subsequently enrolled. These numbers included ALL rejectees. The guy quoted didnt just graduate in 1970, he has been working for alumni. It sure seems like he knows the numbers. The other link used numbers specifically supplied by the school itself and included all of the rejectees. Unless you want me and everyone to believe it's 10-12,000 in 1970, 1995, 2001, 2006, 2007, 2008 but it was 160,000 just YOUR year, I think your numbers arent looking so good.

[Kelly the Dog]

No way, not even close. There's simply no way that was true for me.

 

Let me be clear. There's like 15 steps to this. It's not, send your application, and then they pick, like everywhere else.

 

160,000 kids started the process my year, thats definite.

 

At each step, kids are weeded out. So, it's more like(estimated):

 

Application 160,000

Medical Tests 100,000

Physical Tests 70,000

Citizenship Stuff 65,000

Congressional/Army Stuff 60,000

Actual Nominees that they really consider 15,000

FBI stuff and a bunch of Army tests like the ASFAB...

 

...or in my case the lacrosse coach simply appoints you, after you get past the nomination.

1500. (and the really funny part is around 300 of those are gone during the first week)

 

So if you want to compare my year's process to college, which you really can't anyway, it's exactly as I said.

 

All the numbers you keep linking either refer to actual nominees, which each Congressperson gets a number based on population, Senators, VP and President 5 each, Puerto Rico 1, etc.<-- This group gets in no matter what, unless there is an FBI problem, the rest get appointed by the Com's office.

 

Look this has all been entertaining, but let's not forget, the HONOR part of the honor code. I don't like getting mine questioned based on ignorance. I have no problem explaining something you don't understand, though.

The numbers in the link provided above was a study done on the people who were rejected. And again, the numbers were provided by the school.

http://eric.ed.gov/ERICDocs/data/ericdocs2...80/15/9b/12.pdf

It also mentions several of the other factors that you did in admissions and yet includes them as part of the 12000 or so admissions. It's pretty clear.

[OCinBuffalo]

For the third time, the numbers were the same in the early and mid 90s. In 1991, the admissions rate was the same, 13.5%. In 1995, 11,954 applied total, 1611 were admitted, and 1224 subsequently enrolled. These numbers included ALL rejectees. The guy quoted didnt just graduate in 1970, he has been working for alumni. It sure seems like he knows the numbers. The other link used numbers specifically supplied by the school itself and included all of the rejectees. That was 1991 freshmen (the class of 1995). Unless you want me and everyone to believe it's 10-12,000 in 1970, 1991, 1995, 2001, 2006, 2007, 2008 but it was 160,000 just YOUR year, I think your numbers arent looking so good.

And for the third time, this guy isn't talking about what you think he is talking about. I have no reason to think you aren't being earnest here, you simply don't know. He is talking about the #s he gets, not the #s that start the process in total. I understand what you think he is saying. No need to explain it again.

 

The problem is, hopefully for the last time, that applications are not submitted until after you have qualified medically, physically, etc., otherwise they would be wasting massive amounts of time reviewing kids that are going to get profiled anyway. These tests start in your Junior year of high school, and they are the standard "join the Army tests" not specific to West Point. This guy is talking basically about the back half of the process, not the whole thing, which is in fact what he deals with. The reason is: West Point itself doesn't handle the entire process. Most of it is done locally first, before you even get anywhere near them.

 

Specifically, I had to get a crazy ass physical. Then I had to do a whole bunch of crap at the armory, tests, PT, etc. (Edit: this was all going on in the summer between junior and senior.) Only after all of that, was I given the rest of the application to fill out. Basically it starts with your guidance counselor, or the local recruiter. You don't start out by filling out the entire application. You then do the essays and crap like that, but even then it's not your entire "file".

 

So, the "files they open" are really kids who have already passed a slew of tests. The numbers I had beaten in to my head are about the # of kids who start the process, period. I could be wrong about the # of nominations though. We don't really know about the part that happens between the big interview and who gets nominated for what. They just tell you what rank you are, and then you sit around waiting, or in my case, the coach calls and asks you to come.

 

Edit: Or, the more I think about it, we were lied to/there were "exaggerations". It wouldn't be the first time, or the 1000th time I was lied to in the Army. Who knows? Like I said originally, I am merely repeating what I was told. But there's no way in hell only 10,000 people or so start the process. The numbers don't jive. There were 40+ kids that were made it to the first little interview in my district alone. Multiply that by 400 congressman and you have 16,000 +/- right there, never mind the prior service people, the prep school and all the rest. And that interview is AFTER the attrition from the earlier tests.

[OCinBuffalo]

A ha!

Harvard cuts admissions rates for economic reasons

So West Point raises theirs because of a war, and Harvard drops theirs because nobody can afford it in a recession. Drat.

 

Oh well, I guess that makes them better.

[Kelly the Dog]

And for the third time, this guy isn't talking about what you think he is talking about. I have no reason to think you aren't being earnest here, you simply don't know. He is talking about the #s he gets, not the #s that start the process in total. I understand what you think he is saying. No need to explain it again.

 

The problem is, hopefully for the last time, that applications are not submitted until after you have qualified medically, physically, etc., otherwise they would be wasting massive amounts of time reviewing kids that are going to get profiled anyway. These tests start in your Junior year of high school, and they are the standard "join the Army tests" not specific to West Point. This guy is talking basically about the back half of the process, not the whole thing, which is in fact what he deals with. The reason is: West Point itself doesn't handle the entire process. Most of it is done locally first, before you even get anywhere near them.

 

Specifically, I had to get a crazy ass physical. Then I had to do a whole bunch of crap at the armory, tests, PT, etc. (Edit: this was all going on in the summer between junior and senior.) Only after all of that, was I given the rest of the application to fill out. Basically it starts with your guidance counselor, or the local recruiter. You don't start out by filling out the entire application. You then do the essays and crap like that, but even then it's not your entire "file".

 

So, the "files they open" are really kids who have already passed a slew of tests. The numbers I had beaten in to my head are about the # of kids who start the process, period. I could be wrong about the # of nominations though. We don't really know about the part that happens between the big interview and who gets nominated for what. They just tell you what rank you are, and then you sit around waiting, or in my case, the coach calls and asks you to come.

 

Edit: Or, the more I think about it, we were lied to/there were "exaggerations". It wouldn't be the first time, or the 1000th time I was lied to in the Army. Who knows? Like I said originally, I am merely repeating what I was told. But there's no way in hell only 10,000 people or so start the process. The numbers don't jive. There were 40+ kids that were made it to the first little interview in my district alone. Multiply that by 400 congressman and you have 16,000 +/- right there, never mind the prior service people, the prep school and all the rest. And that interview is AFTER the attrition from the earlier tests.

I was just going to say that it was probably just the government lying to you. In that study, it clearly states that there are other factors that make up admissions, but it's included in the 12,000 total. They said the academy takes 60% into consideration of your academics, 30% leadership qualities and 10% the physical tests they put you through. It also explains that the school is not the sole arbiter, and that Senators, etc, are also responsible for deciding who gets in. But those again are inclusive of the 12,000 applicants. That shows those things you were speaking of, and previous tests, etc, are true, just in smaller numbers.

[OCinBuffalo]

I was just going to say that it was probably just the government lying to you. In that study, it clearly states that there are other factors that make up admissions, but it's included in the 12,000 total. They said the academy takes 60% into consideration of your academics, 30% leadership qualities and 10% the physical tests they put you through. It also explains that the school is not the sole arbiter, and that Senators, etc, are also responsible for deciding who gets in. But those again are inclusive of the 12,000 applicants. That shows those things you were speaking of, and previous tests, etc, are true, just in smaller numbers.

Yes. MREs = 3 lies in a bag. There's not Meals, they're not ready, and you can't eat them. It's strange that upperclassmen would lie to us about something like this though, but then again, they easily might have been lied to as well.

 

Well the one thing nobody realizes is that you actually have to join the Regular Army before you do anything else. We actually got paid, in addition to the free school, like an E5. So, it goes like, you fill out a one page West point paper = a credit app, then you do all the RA stuff, then you do some of the real App, then you do interview stuff, then essays and all the bulk of getting all the paper in order, then you dinners and meet cadets, then you do more interviews, then the big interview, and the rest didn't apply to me because the coach rubber-stamped me.

 

The big thing is: none of this wonderful discussion means I am going to start thinking Ivy people will ever be any better than average in our business. I have yet to meet one that is.

[Johnny Coli]

No, and no, and women don't lie in general, but they will about this specific issue. To not lie is to admit the truth. The truth = biologically women aren't as likely to succeed on the whole as men, due to kids, hormones, you name it. There are individual exceptions as there is with most everything. But generally women are at a serious biological, and therefore psychological disadvantage, when it comes to success outside the home. It's not an indictment of their character, it's just the way it is.

 

This truth however, is something that that cannot be accepted, or admitted to, because it is tantamount to surrendering to nature/god/whoever decided to make women be the ones who carry the babies. The real "lie", that women are actually "equal" to men, must be supported at all cost, however nuts. So, yeah, there's every reason to assume that they lied, and, the election results, not the polls, prove that. The actual results were a lot closer than the polls I saw on RCP right before the election = lies, lies, lies.

 

If I had to write two paragraphs explaining misogyny it would probably go something like that. What century do some of you people live in?

[DC Tom]

The big thing is: none of this wonderful discussion means I am going to start thinking Ivy people will ever be any better than average in our business. I have yet to meet one that is.

 

I don't know. I think Ivy Leaguers can tell the difference between 160000 and 12000. That's a pretty big distinction in the business world.