Bill from NYC Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 Um, Manning, Brady, Warner, Kelly, Montanna, Marino, Brees, McNabb, etc, etc...I could go on and on... You are missing my point. If you have a guy in your face hitting you, yes, no QB will play well. But Trent is not good at getting rid of the ball early when the pressure is coming. He does not progress through his reads fast enough. Casual fans think dumping off to a safety valve is good under pressure...its not. He consistently takes bad sacks from holding the ball too long, misses open recievers becase he checks down instantly to a dump off, or throws a bad pass because he was hurried that falls badly incomplete or is picked off. You wanna see a QB handle the pressure well...go back and watch Warner beat the Eagles... Sorry to be short. Dental work....8 grand and it hurts. Read your posts. Warner is 40 with superbowl experience. great targets, and a coach with a clue. Trent has none of this, and he managed to win us some games (more than 2 per season). Do you think that I just started watching quarterbacks a year or so ago? Trent will never be a pre-injury Joe Namath, but he is FAR from being the problem with this team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 Sorry to be short. Dental work....8 grand and it hurts. Read your posts. Warner is 40 with superbowl experience. great targets, and a coach with a clue. Trent has none of this, and he managed to win us some games (more than 2 per season). Do you think that I just started watching quarterbacks a year or so ago? Trent will never be a pre-injury Joe Namath, but he is FAR from being the problem with this team. S*cks about the dental work...that doesnt sound awesome...hope you feel better... I must say though, I have a problem with this statement. How is he not a problem? I am not saying he wont "BE" a good QB one day but QB play has been a problem... His overall play after the 4-0 start was very poor. His only good games, which are not exactly outstanding games, were against 2 of the worst defenses in the league in SD and Den. I am not saying he is the worst QB in the league, but we literally are not in the playoffs because of the combined play of our QB's after the 5-1 start. Why was JP in the game? Because Trent was hurt...that hurts the team and is a liability and something that is part of seasons going back to high school. When he came back from the concussion, he played ok against SD (terrible D at the time) and then seriously regressed. He was awful the rest of the year except at Den (who couldnt stop a high school team and was missing Champ Bailey). Look, I think he has potential to become something better, but the fact remains, with better QB play we win games like Cle, SF, Mia, NE, and Jets. We couldnt move the ball and Cle, SF, and Jets had bottom third pass defenses. NE def wasnt very good either...every one of those games our D played well enough to win, our offense, specifically the QB position didnt get it done through most of those games. Sure, coaching decisions hampered us in Cle and Jets game, but with better QB play we dont need a last second FG to beat lowly Cle, and JP doesnt fumble because the QB should be smart enough to throw the ball away on a busted play in that situation... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PushthePile Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 Trent has played well enough at times to give us hope that he could be a capable starter. At other times he has looked outclassed and limited. The team should see this as a question mark and get a legit young QB as a backup plan. I can't see bringing in a veteran QB for mentoring. We need a veteran who can play, Edwards, and a good prospect. I've said it before, we should be taking QB's middle to late every year and hoping we hit the jackpot. The days of waiting and waiting for a QB to develop seem to be over. Immediate success at the position can be had. I also think that Edwards hinders the coaching just as much they hinder him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 Trent has played well enough at times to give us hope that he could be a capable starter. At other times he has looked outclassed and limited. The team should see this as a question mark and get a legit young QB as a backup plan. I can't see bringing in a veteran QB for mentoring. We need a veteran who can play, Edwards, and a good prospect. I've said it before, we should be taking QB's middle to late every year and hoping we hit the jackpot. The days of waiting and waiting for a QB to develop seem to be over. Immediate success at the position can be had. I also think that Edwards hinders the coaching just as much they hinder him. good points... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPDontletthedoorhityourars Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 S*cks about the dental work...that doesnt sound awesome...hope you feel better... I must say though, I have a problem with this statement. How is he not a problem? I am not saying he wont "BE" a good QB one day but QB play has been a problem... His overall play after the 4-0 start was very poor. His only good games, which are not exactly outstanding games, were against 2 of the worst defenses in the league in SD and Den. I am not saying he is the worst QB in the league, but we literally are not in the playoffs because of the combined play of our QB's after the 5-1 start. Why was JP in the game? Because Trent was hurt...that hurts the team and is a liability and something that is part of seasons going back to high school. When he came back from the concussion, he played ok against SD (terrible D at the time) and then seriously regressed. He was awful the rest of the year except at Den (who couldnt stop a high school team and was missing Champ Bailey). Look, I think he has potential to become something better, but the fact remains, with better QB play we win games like Cle, SF, Mia, NE, and Jets. We couldnt move the ball and Cle, SF, and Jets had bottom third pass defenses. NE def wasnt very good either...every one of those games our D played well enough to win, our offense, specifically the QB position didnt get it done through most of those games. Sure, coaching decisions hampered us in Cle and Jets game, but with better QB play we dont need a last second FG to beat lowly Cle, and JP doesnt fumble because the QB should be smart enough to throw the ball away on a busted play in that situation... Good post. I agree with a lot of it. Trent's injury-proneness has to be a factor in the Bills' quest for becoming a playoff team in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 His overall play after the 4-0 start was very poor. His only good games, which are not exactly outstanding games, were against 2 of the worst defenses in the league in SD and Den. Good point. SD was a playoff team, and Denver always gets beat at home, in the smow. Also, the 121 qb rating against KC shouldn't count either. A win, or even a good game means nothing unless the other team is great and the qb stats meet your standards. I get it now. Sorry for taking so long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUFFALOTONE Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 I'm crushed!! what will I do now that I lost credibility with you look at Peytons record the in his first and second season then get back to me. It takes TIME for a QB to mature. Plain and simple. Trent is going to be a very good QB in this league. But he needs time and needs to build confidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUFFALOTONE Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 Um, Manning, Brady, Warner, Kelly, Montanna, Marino, Brees, McNabb, etc, etc...I could go on and on... You are missing my point. If you have a guy in your face hitting you, yes, no QB will play well. But Trent is not good at getting rid of the ball early when the pressure is coming. He does not progress through his reads fast enough. Casual fans think dumping off to a safety valve is good under pressure...its not. He consistently takes bad sacks from holding the ball too long, misses open recievers becase he checks down instantly to a dump off, or throws a bad pass because he was hurried that falls badly incomplete or is picked off. You wanna see a QB handle the pressure well...go back and watch Warner beat the Eagles... The underlined are terrible under pressure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickey Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 Sorry I hate Peters--this time I'll take Bills management side. He stunk this year. I hope Gross signs such a huge deal the Bills will just let Peters walk after his contract is due. If he sits out again--sayonara. The fact is Edwards biggest strength is his poise in the pocket and his fast release. Edwards is not going to get sack often even if Jason Robards is the LT. The reason I feel this way is the Bills MADE him. Any other team that brought him in might have kept him as a tightend and eventually cut his ungrateful ass. This is a business. Whether or not he is kind to his dog, bows deep enough when Ralph walks by or double dips his chips doesn't matter. If the team could get a pro bowl career out of him for a bag of beans, they would and if he can get them to pay 100 times his worth, he will. All the rest is public relations. For me, I don't care about what is fair or what is right, just and good. I am not looking to the NFL to serve as some sort of fairness paradise or a passion play for justice and virtue. I want to win and I want a GM, coaches and players who are ready to do whatever it takes, within the rules, to do just that. And if along the way some jerk gets more jack than Mr. Nice guy in the locker next to him, well, I will worry about such things when we have won a super bowl and can afford to care who stretches out their pinkies drinking tea and who, heaven fofend, does not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 look at Peytons record the in his first and second season then get back to me. It takes TIME for a QB to mature. Plain and simple. Trent is going to be a very good QB in this league. But he needs time and needs to build confidence. What the heck does Future Trent have to do with the Trent Edwards playing behind center now? I dont care if he is Joe Montanna come 2011, that doesnt dismiss the fact that he currently is NOT playing consistently well now... I KNOW a QB needs time to develop...but until he develops, we are NOT going to be a very good team, thats my point. You seem to delusionally think he is already a top QB and has no role in our losses. You even said the outlandish statement that "he's Phenomally accurate", which he's not. Brady, Manning, Brees, Warner...thats phenomenally accurate...Trent is above average accurate. Im so sick of the excuse of how good he MIGHT be someday to ignore the point of his CURRENT short comings. I have never said he wont ever be good, I said we have been losing because we are not currently getting good enough play at QB to beat good teams... I hope he becomes as great as you delusionally think he plays now, but the fact remains, UNTIL then we will not be a consistently good team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 The underlined are terrible under pressure. Geezus, you just keep with ridiculous statements... Warner is terrible with pressure?...did you even watch the Eagle game? All game long the not only marvelled how great he is against the Blitz in that game, but how great he has handled it his whole career. The guy is a smart QB and gets the ball out quick... Payton Manning is terrible with pressure? Are you 12 and just dont know anything about football? If so, I sincerely apologize, otherwise this was about as dumb a post I have ever seen on here, and there have been some doozies. And you some how think Trent Edwards is amazing under pressure but McNabb, Warner and Manning are not? Go play Madden or Super Tecmo Bowl... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PushthePile Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 The underlined are terrible under pressure. You are terrible at QB analysis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 You are terrible at QB analysis. HA! Awesome... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PushthePile Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 Good point. SD was a playoff team, and Denver always gets beat at home, in the smow. Also, the 121 qb rating against KC shouldn't count either. A win, or even a good game means nothing unless the other team is great and the qb stats meet your standards. I get it now. Sorry for taking so long. Three games does not prove your point either. In fact, what is your point? No one has said he is done and not the answer. The point others are trying to make is that he has looked good and bad. At one time the same could have been said about losman for that matter. What is the big deal about wanting to have another young QB in camp? I mean just on the off chance he's not Manning, right? God forbid Trent have any competition! The Bills could always bring in the veteran lifelong backup to do the job of the qb coach. Who's going to coach him when Trent goes down? This franchise has suffered through to many project quarterbacks. Keep drafting until you get it right. Why not bring in 2 or 3? Maybe even let the best one start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flbillsfan#1 Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 look at Peytons record the in his first and second season then get back to me. It takes TIME for a QB to mature. Plain and simple. Trent is going to be a very good QB in this league. But he needs time and needs to build confidence. MOST QB's need time to develop, some more than others, some NEVER develop. Where does Trent fit in here? NOBODY knows at this point. The one irrefutable thing we do know about Trent is He is injury prone. As someone that has had more than his share of injuries myself, I can tell you, the older you get the longer it takes to heal & you better be able to live with the pain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PushthePile Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 What the heck does Future Trent have to do with the Trent Edwards playing behind center now? I dont care if he is Joe Montanna come 2011, that doesnt dismiss the fact that he currently is NOT playing consistently well now... I KNOW a QB needs time to develop...but until he develops, we are NOT going to be a very good team, thats my point. You seem to delusionally think he is already a top QB and has no role in our losses. You even said the outlandish statement that "he's Phenomally accurate", which he's not. Brady, Manning, Brees, Warner...thats phenomenally accurate...Trent is above average accurate. Im so sick of the excuse of how good he MIGHT be someday to ignore the point of his CURRENT short comings. I have never said he wont ever be good, I said we have been losing because we are not currently getting good enough play at QB to beat good teams... I hope he becomes as great as you delusionally think he plays now, but the fact remains, UNTIL then we will not be a consistently good team. You look at things in a proactive manner Alpha. I'm with you in the hopes of Edwards being the franchise QB but why not have a backup plan? Would it be so bad if we found a gem in the draft and he beat out Edwards for the starting job? Would it be so bad if it pushed Edwards to better play? I don't get the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUFFALOTONE Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 What the heck does Future Trent have to do with the Trent Edwards playing behind center now? I dont care if he is Joe Montanna come 2011, that doesnt dismiss the fact that he currently is NOT playing consistently well now... I KNOW a QB needs time to develop...but until he develops, we are NOT going to be a very good team, thats my point. You seem to delusionally think he is already a top QB and has no role in our losses. You even said the outlandish statement that "he's Phenomally accurate", which he's not. Brady, Manning, Brees, Warner...thats phenomenally accurate...Trent is above average accurate. Im so sick of the excuse of how good he MIGHT be someday to ignore the point of his CURRENT short comings. I have never said he wont ever be good, I said we have been losing because we are not currently getting good enough play at QB to beat good teams... I hope he becomes as great as you delusionally think he plays now, but the fact remains, UNTIL then we will not be a consistently good team. Hey Dbag you are thinking of the wrong poster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUFFALOTONE Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 Geezus, you just keep with ridiculous statements... Warner is terrible with pressure?...did you even watch the Eagle game? All game long the not only marvelled how great he is against the Blitz in that game, but how great he has handled it his whole career. The guy is a smart QB and gets the ball out quick... Payton Manning is terrible with pressure? Are you 12 and just dont know anything about football? If so, I sincerely apologize, otherwise this was about as dumb a post I have ever seen on here, and there have been some doozies. And you some how think Trent Edwards is amazing under pressure but McNabb, Warner and Manning are not? Go play Madden or Super Tecmo Bowl... Look at Warner against Philly and New England this year and re think your assessment tool box. Mcnab short arms everything when he gets pressured, his only upside is he is strong and can scramble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 You look at things in a proactive manner Alpha. I'm with you in the hopes of Edwards being the franchise QB but why not have a backup plan? Would it be so bad if we found a gem in the draft and he beat out Edwards for the starting job? Would it be so bad if it pushed Edwards to better play? I don't get the problem. Agreed...anyone who thinks we are set at Qb is deluisional. We might have our guy because he has potential...but potential just means you are not good enough now to be called good, but shown signs you could get better. Some do, and some dont...until Trent turns the corner or is replaced with someone better, we wont be very good... Scary thing is, even if he does become good, will he even be able to stay on the field? Which furthers the need for a good QB behind him because they are likely going to be leaned on to win 2-4 games per year based on Trents injury track record. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUFFALOTONE Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 Agreed...anyone who thinks we are set at Qb is deluisional. We might have our guy because he has potential...but potential just means you are not good enough now to be called good, but shown signs you could get better. Some do, and some dont...until Trent turns the corner or is replaced with someone better, we wont be very good... Scary thing is, even if he does become good, will he even be able to stay on the field? Which furthers the need for a good QB behind him because they are likely going to be leaned on to win 2-4 games per year based on Trents injury track record. So you are ready to throw the towel in based on a season and a half? Im not disagreeing with you that we are set at QB but we arent set at 1 position on that team besides RB. Trent is only going to be as good as the coaches and players around him. Until that straitens he will be behind the 8 ball every time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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