Lost Season 5 Official Thread!

[DrDawkinstein]

Who the hell is Locke 2.0?

 

my best guess is either the "island incarnate", just like how we saw Alex. Or possibly Jacob's friend we saw him chatting with on the beach in the opening scene.

[duey]

Here are more thoughts on what we found out last night...

 

Christian arrives on the island and then apparently rises from the dead. It is Christian who then occupies Jacob's old cabin and eventually tells John that he has to die to get everyone to come back to the island. John does this, returns to the island also in a coffin, and then is also apparently brought back from the dead. We then find out at the end that the "risen John" is actually Jacob's beach buddy. It's very clear that Jacob and this other fellow are adversaries, and that both appear to be working towards something.

 

Jacob facilitates Nadia dying which sends Sayid on the path to where he shoots Ben, yet when John falls out of the window and seems like he should die, Jacob possibly brings him back to life and then apologizes and reassures.

 

Richard is the advisor to Jacob...then was Widmore the advisor to the beach dude? It certainly seems like the actions of the Widmore camp are in line with beach dude while Ellie and those associated with her are in line with Jacob. And it seems like Ilana and her gang are on Jacob's side too (oops...I just remembered that Jacob actually came to her bedside and asked for help, so this would make sense).

 

Random ramblings for sure...

[duey]

my best guess is either the "island incarnate", just like how we saw Alex. Or possibly Jacob's friend we saw him chatting with on the beach in the opening scene.

I think it's clear that he's Jacob's "friend," as in the beach seen that guy referred to trying to find a loophole so that he could kill Jacob. At the end, Jacob looks at "John" and remarks that "...it looks like you found your loophole."

[RayFinkle]

I think it's clear that he's Jacob's "friend," as in the beach seen that guy referred to trying to find a loophole so that he could kill Jacob. At the end, Jacob looks at "John" and remarks that "...it looks like you found your loophole."

I thought they made it pretty obvious with the loophole line...

[DrDawkinstein]

I think it's clear that he's Jacob's "friend," as in the beach seen that guy referred to trying to find a loophole so that he could kill Jacob. At the end, Jacob looks at "John" and remarks that "...it looks like you found your loophole."

 

exactly. what i find interesting is Jacob's comment when his "friend" says about the Black Rock something along the lines of "theyre just going to come and fight and kill" and Jacob says "at least it's progress".

 

what type of progress is he referring to? are we seeing the same routine from the black rock folk as we saw with the Oceanics? is the island a little experiment in humanity?

 

 

...im watching it all again tonight. maybe i'll catch something.

[duey]

I thought they made it pretty obvious with the loophole line...

Exactly. Now one has to ponder what I mentioned in a previous post...is this guy Christian as well?

[EZC-Boston]

Exactly. Now one has to ponder what I mentioned in a previous post...is this guy Christian as well?

 

That was my thinking. He is "bad" in human form and Jacob is "good" in human form.

 

I have a theory for the loophole: I think Ben could kill Jacob because he left the island and came back, which was supposedly against the rules. Not sure why it would work like that but that is my theory.

 

Can we put to rest the theory that Jack is Jacob? I never liked that one anyway, no offense to anybody.

 

These guys really had this whole story planned from Day 1? Crazy! I mean a few years ago we thought we had a bunch of random people who survived a plane crash, we've come so far.

[Ramius]

I missed most of the introductory scene with the two guys on the beach. %^&*ing antenna pointed toward Boston was cutting out (and people, I have a sweet antenna setup) and I had to manually switch to the Providence backup. Channel comes in fine every other time I have it on, worked all right during "A Journey Through Time" and it boinks out at ~9:02! Figures. I just had cut my toenails today, didn't I?! Bad things happen when I cut my toenails. The planes hit on 9/11, what was I doing at that exact moment? *Clip* The day my dog died last year. *Clip* There you go.

 

So... A little help on what the dialogue was b/w Jacob and ?? Classic miss the beginning and you're %$^&ing screwed! What happened there?

 

Even with all that.... HOLYSH--NOONEDOESFINALESLIKELOST!

 

Instead of the fade to black ala Sopranos, we get a fade to white. And we can all guess 'til we're blue in the face but we have no idea what it means. Was the light reminiscent of what happened to Desmond when he turned the key? Was it a regular old nuclear explosion and everything's toast? Was what happened here "The Incident" and Dharma will build the Swan anyway, and what happened happened? Dr. Chang's hand would seem to suggest this.

 

In the Doc Jensen link I provided above, Lindelof gave the cryptic, "This episode is going to be touching." And so, we find out that Jacob physically touches certain of the Lostaways. Let's see, there was Kate, Sawyer, Jack, Locke, Hurley ... and did he touch Juliet? I'm going to have to watch this again tomorrow. Really times like these I wish somebody made an (affordable) OTA-only DVR that's worth a damn. Anyway.... Is this like a "Tag, you're it!" kind of thing?

 

Don't know about any of you, but I could feel my heart pounding in my chest, especially in the last hour. Kind of like watching Bills games back when we were actually good... but there's very little in the world of fiction that does that to me.

 

I really would like an answer to that before I post much more.

 

By my count, Jacob had touched; Jack, Kate, Sawyer, Hurley, Sun, Jin, Locke, Sayid and Ilana. I know he didn't touch Juliette. I agree with some of the other posters that the bad guy on the beach with jacob prolly took over christian's body and then took over Locke's. I'm guessing the big battle will be between jacob's buddies and the bad guy's (undead Locke and Ben).

 

EDIT: Jacob physically touched Jin, Sun, Sayid, Ilana, Locke. Jacob handed something to Jack, Kate, Sawyer, and Hurley. I'm not sure what it means, but it probably means something.

 

As for the beginning, i was wondering if the ship jacob and the bad guy were looking at was the Black Rock. I also wonder if that was the ship that brought richard to the island, because Jacob was very interested in it. If i had to pick a current theory i am subscribing to, its the loop theory where the castaways and such are consistently looping through time. I'm wondering if the beginning of season 6 will start with Jack waking up in the jungle again, like the series premiere.

 

Juliette by the way, is gone and isn't coming back for season 6. So we can assume she's dead. She's got another TV show.

[duey]

EDIT: Jacob physically touched Jin, Sun, Sayid, Ilana, Locke. Jacob handed something to Jack, Kate, Sawyer, and Hurley. I'm not sure what it means, but it probably means something.

He touched Kate too...on her nose, remember?

 

I believe that boat to be the Blackrock, though how the heck did it get all the way inland (a time jump?)?

 

I thought the same about Juliette when I saw she was in a new show...sort of foreshadowing what might have been coming in last night episode.

 

A friend of mine suggested that the bomb exploding is what destroyed the statue.

[duey]

And I found this interesting...IMDb does not show in the cast list for last nights episodes either Jacob or the other beach guy.

[extrahammer]

Awesome episode last night. I'd rank it as one of the top 4 episodes in the series.

 

I knew when Jacob said looks like you found your loophole that the guy in Locke's body, or whatever, was the guy in the beginning dressed in black. So many questions! The fade to white was either the explosion or re-adjustment of place and time, or both. Very sad to see Juliet go, but it was her purpose for being there, to detonate the bomb.

 

I will definitely be re-watching this episode again today.

 

I feel like my brain has been literally f*%#@ !

 

P.S. - I'm gonna miss checking this thread every Thursday morning for the next 8 months!

[UConn James]

After rewatching the opening scene where we meet Jacob, I am even more convinced that my theory that everything has been happening on the island in one big loop in correct. Jacobs comment that "It only ends on[c]e...anything that happens before that is just progress" bears this out.

 

And I'm now convinced that Jacob represents a God-like figure and his unnamed counterpart represents a devil-like figure. Jacob in white vs. the other fellow in black. Could this island be God's continuing study of humanity in a microcosm?

 

Lastly, this scene also reminded me of the palaver between Roland and the man in black at the end of the first Dark Tower book.

 

Here's a link to the opening scene...

 

Thanks for the link.

 

Yeah, it's like a repeating test of humanity. It's like a running feud b/w two brothers with completely opposite viewpoints of humanity. Jacob touches people to bring them to the island to see if people can redeem themselves. The black-clothed character is tired of the testing b/c no one ever passes.

 

May not be good to attribute Jacob and black-robe man (could we call him Esau?) god-status.

 

Jeez, this is going to be a lot to digest for the next 8 months.

 

my other quick note for now... how great was it seeing Rose and Bernard living on the island?!? and that attitude of "it's always something with you people" and "we're retired", ha!

 

Yeah, that was awesome. I think that pretty much settles it for me that they are "Adam & Eve."

 

It was definitely one of the best episodes last night but when will we start getting answers and not more questions.

 

I'd say that will be in episode 6.17.

 

As for some other thoughts, it was strange seeing Ben being conned with the same motivations that he gave Locke to kill Anthony Seward, for Ben to kill Jacob. That he was just being used. Was also weird to see Ben actually be able to kill Jacob (and who can say for sure that Jacob is dead?), a being that seemed to have so much power to cure the sick, etc. It just gets into all of these sub-points of who caused what, who is one whose 'side', etc.

 

I believe Jacob's "They're coming" refers to the '77 Left-Behinders, especially given Lindelof's interview stuff that the time-travel stuff is coming to a close in this ep.

[UConn James]

my best guess is either the "island incarnate", just like how we saw Alex. Or possibly Jacob's friend we saw him chatting with on the beach in the opening scene.

 

Seems possible that... well, sh--, let's just call him "Jacob's adversary" has reanimated or possessed the bodies of numerous island-goers. He does this by way of the smoke monster which downloads their thoughts, etc. I'm going to make a list:

 

Coffin Locke

Christian (? or at least, one of the two Christians - suit / grunge)

The Frenchies in the Temple who Rousseau shot.

Yemmy, Eko's brother

This may be how young Ben was saved (and also why he went to it to be judged)

Alex

It's questionable whether it really was Jacob's cabin. The "Help me" apparition looked much more like Jacob's adversary than Jacob.

 

 

But to run with something similar here, what does Jacob's touch mean? Not for nothing that he poked Kate's nose or that he intentionally brushed fingers when handing the pen and Apollo bar, or Sun & Jin's and Locke's shoulders. But my question would be, why did Jacob bring Locke back after the fall if he knew that Locke would eventually be possessed and kill him?

 

I think it's clear that he's Jacob's "friend," as in the beach seen that guy referred to trying to find a loophole so that he could kill Jacob. At the end, Jacob looks at "John" and remarks that "...it looks like you found your loophole."

 

In the whole "Lost is a Game" theory, the rule may be that in each cycle, the players cannot kill each other. But the loophole might be that they can get others to kill their adversary for them.

 

exactly. what i find interesting is Jacob's comment when his "friend" says about the Black Rock something along the lines of "theyre just going to come and fight and kill" and Jacob says "at least it's progress".

 

what type of progress is he referring to? are we seeing the same routine from the black rock folk as we saw with the Oceanics? is the island a little experiment in humanity?

 

 

...im watching it all again tonight. maybe i'll catch something.

 

Well, let's be careful. Jacob did not say that the killing and fighting was progress. He said that there's only one end, and that everything that comes before that is progress. One end might be that there's only one Armageddon --- one final end. Each time an experiment is conducted isn't the End, it just means that one experiment/test failed; but there will be more experiments. As we all know, each experiment --- even, or especially, if it's a failure --- always brings the experimenter one step closer to finding what the answer really is.

 

He touched Kate too...on her nose, remember?

 

I believe that boat to be the Blackrock, though how the heck did it get all the way inland (a time jump?)?

 

I thought the same about Juliette when I saw she was in a new show...sort of foreshadowing what might have been coming in last night episode.

 

A friend of mine suggested that the bomb exploding is what destroyed the statue.

 

It appears like next season we will be finding out about the Black Rock. I don't expect it to be extensive.

 

Looks like the statue was destroyed long before '77 and the bomb. Ben said this as well (I know, I know. The running wisdom is to take everything Ben says, flip it to its inverse and you'll have the truth.)

 

Just the timing of it... was the 'electrical anomoly' finished when Juliet seemingly set the bomb off? Did the bomb go off or was it a time-flash?

 

Don't be so fast to remove Juliet from the series. There's only 17 eps left. She may be absent for a while, but I don't think that was the last we're going to see of her. I refuse to believe that. How great was that scene, tho?

[The Tomcat]

My quick and random thoughts...

 

I'm wondering what was on the material in Jacobs tomb.

 

Locke died twice off the island. Not sure how he fell out the window.

 

I love the way Locke questioned Ben on the beach. A total turn around in character. Ben had to kill Jacob, not Locke 2.0.

 

Whats in the guitar case?

 

Dr Chang seems to be very receptive of the idea of the people from the future.

 

I think the series will end when the plane lands and the people just get off the plane. Jack and Sawyer will both make googly eyes with Kate.

[UConn James]

My quick and random thoughts...

 

I'm wondering what was on the material in Jacobs tomb.

 

Locke died twice off the island. Not sure how he fell out the window.

 

I love the way Locke questioned Ben on the beach. A total turn around in character. Ben had to kill Jacob, not Locke 2.0.

 

Whats in the guitar case?

 

Dr Chang seems to be very receptive of the idea of the people from the future.

 

I think the series will end when the plane lands and the people just get off the plane. Jack and Sawyer will both make googly eyes with Kate.

 

I've yet to look to see what the tapestry read.

 

Also, let me make note how strikingly similar Jacob's "tomb" layout was to Widmore's office. Yes?

 

Locke was pushed out of the window by his father, shown in S3.

 

The guitar case is another one of the Abrahms' "mystery boxes." We got no answers in regard to any of them.... Specifically, what the "magic box" is that Ben said, "whatever you wish for, when you open it, there it would be"; the box that Ben his in the motel vent; the contents of the guitar case.

[Justice]

Just finished watching the season finale and I can honestly say that I'm more "lost" than ever. No pun intended. Can't really say I enjoyed the finale, hell, I'm not even sure I can say I enjoyed this whole season.

[UConn James]

Required reading --- EW: Doc Jensen's "The Incident" recap

 

Last week, I wondered if there was a villain hiding in plain sight, but I was certain the dirty one was Richard Alpert. I was wrong. Many of you suspected that Resurrected Locke really was all kinds of bogus, but the confirmation was mind-blowing, nonetheless. Alterna-Locke manipulated Ben into doing the actual dirty work of god slaying, and the humbled and defrocked leader/priest did so willingly, full of bitterness toward the god he had served faithfully and sight-unseen for decades without reward, without the assurance of his presence. ''Oh, so now after all this time, you've decided to stop ignoring me,'' Ben bitched. ''I did what I was told. But when I dared to ask to see you myself I was told I had to wait...What was it that was so wrong with me? What about me?''

 

The showdown was rife with spiritual subtext and will no doubt inspire a great many religion-major dissertations. (''Lost: Allegory For Mankind's Angry Alienation From God In A Post-Eden World.'') It seemed to me that Jacob willingly submitted himself to death, all but baring his breast and walking his heart right into Ben's knife. Yet we were left to wonder: Who was playing whom? Did Alterna-Locke's plan work — or did he play right into Jacob's touchy-feely hands? Has Ben really become Alterna-Locke's stooge — or does the old puppet master still have a string or two to play?

 

THEORY! Much of the castaways’ history — including the crash of Oceanic 815 — has been molded and manipulated by the entity that is the Nameless Man In Black, an intricate, divine conspiracy whose ultimate goal was to kill Jacob. That was the significance of Alterna-Locke’s gloating line: “And you have no idea what I’ve gone through to be here.” But what the Adversary didn’t know was that Jacob had been doing some plotting of his own to counter all of his enemy's moves. And in the last moment of the Jacob/Alterna-Locke/Ben showdown, I think what we saw was Alterna-Locke realizing that he’d been checkmated. ''They're coming,'' Jacob sputtered — referring, I believe, to Jack, Kate, Sawyer and the entire quantum leaping cavalry. I think the Adversary completely understood the significance of what Jacob was saying — and it pissed him off big time. Hence, why Alterna-Locke angrily kicked Jacob into the fire. Hence, that scowl on his face. It was the pout of defeat.

 

Also some interesting thoughts on the nature of Jacob, the identity of the statue, and his Jacob's Quibbles Theory.

[UConn James]

I was also struck by the flashback we got of Jack's "5 seconds" story. He had spoken of it so highly in S1. It was like something that happened to him alone, and that it was his choice, his method to 'count to 5.' Instead, we find out that it was his father watching almost over his shoulder.

 

That changed my impression of Christian. Early on, we were shown him at his worst and in later eps, he's come through as a better father than we've been shown or told.

[UConn James]

Can we put to rest the theory that Jack is Jacob? I never liked that one anyway, no offense to anybody.

 

These guys really had this whole story planned from Day 1? Crazy! I mean a few years ago we thought we had a bunch of random people who survived a plane crash, we've come so far.

 

I'm not sure. Even now. It would seem that it's debunked.

 

But the question is, now that Jacob seems to be dead.... what happens? Does someone take over his role? There's more to it. And again, there's something to Jacob's touching those Lostaways. What was delivered in that touch?

[Ramius]

On a lighter note, anyone else think that Bernard and Rose sounded like stuckincincy?