San Jose Bills Fan Posted January 15, 2009 Posted January 15, 2009 Fans of the NY Giants are angst-ridden over last week's loss to the Eagles and particularly interesting is the attitude many have towards their QB Eli Manning. Bills fans are mixed on Trent Edwards (not me, I'm a believer) but the situation has similarities to Manning and the Giants. Bottom line, our All-Rookie QB from last year has an average offensive line and very few targets in the passing game. In addition either he and/or the coaches couldn't solve 3-4 defenses. Yet in spite of this, Trent had a pretty good year, particularly in QB rating and yards per attempt which are viewed as the best barometers of quarterback effectiveness. With the Giants, Manning has the league's best rushing attack and offensive line but with the loss of Plaxico Burress and Shockey, he had few targets to throw to this year. In spite of some success running against the Eagles, Manning and the passing attack repeatedly failed to make plays against Philly. And Giants fans are not too happy about it. From a NY Daily News survey: "A little more than half felt Manning was undeserving of a huge raise when his current contract expires after next season." They're talking about a contract in line with other Pro Bowl QBs which Manning now is. I don't think it's possible for a QB to have much success when he's surrounded by mediocrity as Trent is. For the record: Trent career passer rating 79.1, Eli career passer rating 76.1. My point is, Manning, with five NFL seasons under his belt, Pro Bowler this year and Super Bowl MVP last season is not much different than the 2nd year Edwards, who also had few weapons in the passing game. And Manning has the consensus best O-line in football in front of him. Comparing Trent to another young quarterback, is there anyone in their right mind who'd rather have Matt Leinart than Trent and while on the subject of Arizona, how do you think Trent would do if he quarterbacked that offense with Fitzgerald, Boldin and Breaston? And how about Arizona's opponent last week? Would Trent have done a better job than four-interception Delhomme did?
Magox Posted January 15, 2009 Posted January 15, 2009 I believe Trent Edwards is going to be one hell of a quarterback in this league, don't take it from me, take it from Bill Walsh (who knows a little something about what it takes to be a good quarterback) Grant it, Trent did not have a good year against the 3-4 this past year, but I have a lot of faith in his intelligence, his commitment and his preparation that he will vastly improve in that area next year (assuming he stays healthy). He is about as an accurate of a passer as you will find, and with another year under the belt, the progression of our running game and the emergence of Steve Johnson, I see a better offensive year than this past one.
lets_go_bills Posted January 15, 2009 Posted January 15, 2009 Personally, I think Eli is a good QB, but not great. He's a legit starter but nothing special. And if the Giants fans wanna be mad at someone it should be Plaxico Burress.
lets_go_bills Posted January 15, 2009 Posted January 15, 2009 I believe Trent Edwards is going to be one hell of a quarterback in this league, don't take it from me, take it from Bill Walsh (who knows a little something about what it takes to be a good quarterback) Trent did not have a good year against the 3-4 this past year, but I have a lot of faith in his intelligence, his commitment and his preparation that he will vastly improve in that area next year (assuming he stays healthy). He is about as an accurate of a passer as you will find, and with another year under the belt, the progression of our running game and the emergence of Steve Johnson, I see a better offensive year than this past one. I agree with you. And I'm not just saying that because I bought an Edwards jersey after Week 4. Seriously though, I think Trent's gonna be a good one moving forward. Provided he can stay healthy.
ricojes Posted January 15, 2009 Posted January 15, 2009 Eli Manning Under Fire He may be under fire by the media and fans, but the front office is ready to sign him to the largest contract in the league. From what I heard, it will be somewhere in the neighborhood of 15 million a season....
Paup 1995MVP Posted January 15, 2009 Posted January 15, 2009 If we can get a legitimate tight end to throw the 15-20 yard seam pass to like just about every other NFL team does, I think TE has the potential to be good. That big target in the middle of the field who can run is a huge need that this team needs to address. In addition, we need to start stretching the field vertically regardless of who is our QB. We had the fewest downfield passing attempts in the league this past season. That is a huge reason why our passing game sucks year and year after.....
Dan Posted January 15, 2009 Posted January 15, 2009 Fans of the NY Giants are angst-ridden over last week's loss to the Eagles and particularly interesting is the attitude many have towards their QB Eli Manning. Bills fans are mixed on Trent Edwards (not me, I'm a believer) but the situation has similarities to Manning and the Giants. Bottom line, our All-Rookie QB from last year has an average offensive line and very few targets in the passing game. In addition either he and/or the coaches couldn't solve 3-4 defenses. Yet in spite of this, Trent had a pretty good year, particularly in QB rating and yards per attempt which are viewed as the best barometers of quarterback effectiveness. With the Giants, Manning has the league's best rushing attack and offensive line but with the loss of Plaxico Burress and Shockey, he had few targets to throw to this year. In spite of some success running against the Eagles, Manning and the passing attack repeatedly failed to make plays against Philly. And Giants fans are not too happy about it. From a NY Daily News survey: "A little more than half felt Manning was undeserving of a huge raise when his current contract expires after next season." They're talking about a contract in line with other Pro Bowl QBs which Manning now is. I don't think it's possible for a QB to have much success when he's surrounded by mediocrity as Trent is. For the record: Trent career passer rating 79.1, Eli career passer rating 76.1. My point is, Manning, with five NFL seasons under his belt, Pro Bowler this year and Super Bowl MVP last season is not much different than the 2nd year Edwards, who also had few weapons in the passing game. And Manning has the consensus best O-line in football in front of him. Comparing Trent to another young quarterback, is there anyone in their right mind who'd rather have Matt Leinart than Trent and while on the subject of Arizona, how do you think Trent would do if he quarterbacked that offense with Fitzgerald, Boldin and Breaston? And how about Arizona's opponent last week? Would Trent have done a better job than four-interception Delhomme did? Take away any QBs best pass catchers and its amazing how average they look. Imagine that. Did anyone watch that Eagles/Giants game? Manning hit several receivers right on the hands with long throws that were dropped. Plax makes those catches; average receivers don't. Giants lose. Simple as that. As suggested, if a Giant fan wants to be mad at anyone it should be Burris for being an idiot.
H2o Posted January 15, 2009 Posted January 15, 2009 With the Giants, Manning has the league's best rushing attack and offensive line but with the loss of Plaxico Burress and Shockey, he had few targets to throw to this year. In spite of some success running against the Eagles, Manning and the passing attack repeatedly failed to make plays against Philly. And Giants fans are not too happy about it. I don't think it's possible for a QB to have much success when he's surrounded by mediocrity as Trent is. For the record: Trent career passer rating 79.1, Eli career passer rating 76.1. My point is, Manning, with five NFL seasons under his belt, Pro Bowler this year and Super Bowl MVP last season is not much different than the 2nd year Edwards, who also had few weapons in the passing game. And Manning has the consensus best O-line in football in front of him. Comparing Trent to another young quarterback, is there anyone in their right mind who'd rather have Matt Leinart than Trent and while on the subject of Arizona, how do you think Trent would do if he quarterbacked that offense with Fitzgerald, Boldin and Breaston? And how about Arizona's opponent last week? Would Trent have done a better job than four-interception Delhomme did? In bold at the top is the reason for Manning's decline. No Burress. Burress was his "go to guy" and him shooting himself was the worst thing to happen to Eli. He could hang up any kind of duck, Burress was going up to get it with his 6'5" frame jumping and shielding defenders off. After Burress he had Steve Smith (unexperienced still), Amani Toomer (old and lost a step), Domenick Hixon (unexperienced), Mario Manningham (rookie), and Sinorice Moss (clearly not like his brother). I'd say that we have a better group of WR's here in Buffalo than what Eli had to work with. To say that Trent would do better in Arizona or Carolina is nothing but speculation. Warner is probably one of the top 20 QB's ever to come through the NFL. He has a stronger arm and is more accurate than Trent. We all know that Delhomme isn't really much, but he can throw a decent deep ball which is why he has had the success in Carolina. It also doesn't hurt to have Steve Smith and Muhsin Muhamed as your WR's. To say Trent would do better there isn't really realistic either since he hasn't shown the ability to connect on deep passes. Carolina's offense is predicated on power running and play action to get Smith open. Would Trent have put up better #'s in Arizona? Yes, but not Kurt Warner #'s I'll tell you that. Would he have performed better than Delhomme that playoff game? Psshh, who knows? You guys want to talk about all of these other QB's choking, but have we forgotten our own woes? We also need to not forget our most heralded QB's Super Bowl stats. 1990- 18 of 30 for 212 yards no TD's or INT's 1991- 28 of 58 for 275 yards 2 TD's and 4 INT's 1992- 4 of 7 for 82 yards no TD's and 2 INT's 1993- 31 of 50 for 260 yards no TD's and 1 INT Kelly had 2 TD passes versus 7 INT's in the biggest games of his career. That's a 56% completion rate. It's also not getting it done on the grandest of stages. Eli got it done and so has Warner. What has Trent done really to garner any comparison to the two forementioned?
bizell Posted January 15, 2009 Posted January 15, 2009 I don't think it's possible for a QB to have much success when he's surrounded by mediocrity as Trent is. For the record: Trent career passer rating 79.1, Eli career passer rating 76.1. and Kelly Holcomb's career passer rating is 79.2 Holcomb > Edwards
Cash Posted January 15, 2009 Posted January 15, 2009 If we can get a legitimate tight end to throw the 15-20 yard seam pass to like just about every other NFL team does, I think TE has the potential to be good. That big target in the middle of the field who can run is a huge need that this team needs to address. In addition, we need to start stretching the field vertically regardless of who is our QB. We had the fewest downfield passing attempts in the league this past season. That is a huge reason why our passing game sucks year and year after..... It occurs to me that we had so few downfield attempts because our quarterback elected to dump off the ball at an extremely high rate. Go back to the game threads - in just about all of them, there are accounts from people who were at the game that we had a man open deep a few times, but the throw was never made. Trent may become a very good quarterback, and I hope he does sooner than later. But he was a bad quarterback in 2007, he was a bad quarterback after Week 7 in 2008, and keeping him healthy looks like a very dicey proposition right now.
kota Posted January 15, 2009 Posted January 15, 2009 It must be nice being mad at someone who was the superbowl MVP last year.
stuckincincy Posted January 15, 2009 Posted January 15, 2009 Fans of the NY Giants are angst-ridden over last week's loss to the Eagles and particularly interesting is the attitude many have towards their QB Eli Manning. They ought to direct their angst towards a dreadful performance by their coaching staff and if that doesn't satiate, they can turn their blame on the weather conditions that was the same for both clubs. Coughlin & Co. and Fox & Co. fell down on the job. Watching both - both of 'em..."You know our offensive strengths - Hah! - we will fool ya and not use them! Hah!". What a pair of egotistical jerks. I wouldn't blame a player or two on both squads if they whacked them and their various hires hard with an empty Gatorade cooler.
Thurman#1 Posted January 15, 2009 Posted January 15, 2009 The Bills played one of the two easiest schedules in the league. The Giants played one of the hardest schedules in the league. Their stats were similar. Yet the Giants were angry at Eli and felt he didn't have a good year when looked at neutrally. Get it? The Giants fans were right. Eli didn't have a good year against much harder competition than the Bills played against. Trent didn't have a good year either, only it was largely against much easier competition.
thewildrabbit Posted January 16, 2009 Posted January 16, 2009 whiney crying Giants fans,jeez they just won a super bowl and complain about their SB MVP QB... poor them. Eli is gonna cash in like crazy and he deserves the money he will get. Like someone mentioned earlier, Blame Plaxico Burress, he probably cost them this years SB and not Eli. The Bills would have been so much better this season if the rookie OC called more running plays to take pressure away from Trent Edwards. Keep the offensive game plays simple and limit them to about 25 total plays. Edwards was in the shotgun formation more then he should have been and the Bills didn't utilize play action passing nearly enough. Not to mention what the Bills could do with a power running game AND another receiver comparable to Lee Evans and a speedy tight end. They had the running game this past season and simply failed to use it enough.
Johnny Coli Posted January 16, 2009 Posted January 16, 2009 I don't think it's possible for a QB to have much success when he's surrounded by mediocrity as Trent is. For the record: Trent career passer rating 79.1, Eli career passer rating 76.1. My point is, Manning, with five NFL seasons under his belt, Pro Bowler this year and Super Bowl MVP last season is not much different than the 2nd year Edwards, who also had few weapons in the passing game. And Manning has the consensus best O-line in football in front of him. Another way to look at it is that Marshawn Lynch is surrounded by mediocre talent and has a mediocre QB whom opposing coaches know won't throw downfield to open up the running game. Comparing Trent Edwards to a QB who just won the Superbowl MVP a year ago is insanity. Tell me, how many coaches in this league would trade Eli Manning straight up for Trent Edwards based on what each has done so far? Some of you people really need to take an objective look at how bad Edwards was last season.
Flbillsfan#1 Posted January 16, 2009 Posted January 16, 2009 Another way to look at it is that Marshawn Lynch is surrounded by mediocre talent and has a mediocre QB whom opposing coaches know won't throw downfield to open up the running game. Comparing Trent Edwards to a QB who just won the Superbowl MVP a year ago is insanity. Tell me, how many coaches in this league would trade Eli Manning straight up for Trent Edwards based on what each has done so far? Some of you people really need to take an objective look at how bad Edwards was last season. It amazes me, the VOCAL FEW on this board that "SEE something in Trent" or "Have a FEELING that Trent will be GREAT" or "Just KNOW Trent will be GREAT - Trust Me" when he has not shown ANYTHING except an inability to stay healthy.
Bill from NYC Posted January 16, 2009 Posted January 16, 2009 It amazes me, the VOCAL FEW on this board that "SEE something in Trent" or "Have a FEELING that Trent will be GREAT" or "Just KNOW Trent will be GREAT - Trust Me" when he has not shown ANYTHING except an inability to stay healthy. No, he has shown one more thing.....an improvement at the Bills QB position over the garbage that tainted this team for 5 years in terms of both sucking, and what it cost to bring him here to suck. Maybe this can help you get over the oh so sad loss of your favorite bad football player.
Magox Posted January 16, 2009 Posted January 16, 2009 It amazes me, the VOCAL FEW on this board that "SEE something in Trent" or "Have a FEELING that Trent will be GREAT" or "Just KNOW Trent will be GREAT - Trust Me" when he has not shown ANYTHING except an inability to stay healthy. you know nothing
Flbillsfan#1 Posted January 16, 2009 Posted January 16, 2009 No, he has shown one more thing.....an improvement at the Bills QB position over the garbage that tainted this team for 5 years in terms of both sucking, and what it cost to bring him here to suck. Maybe this can help you get over the oh so sad loss of your favorite bad football player. Yeah, he played GREAT last season. I just can't wait for another year of 11 TD's & a 7-9 record.
Hazed and Amuzed Posted January 16, 2009 Posted January 16, 2009 When Trent has a SB ring on, then we'll talk about similarities. I don't give a rats ass if the defense won it or not, Eli made it to the show and didn't choke. We've never had a QB that's done that. Truth hurts.
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