The Big Cat Posted December 26, 2008 Share Posted December 26, 2008 I"m not sure when it became common knowledge that Chad Pennington is a weak Quarterback. It's a notion that's certainly not based on any of the evidence I'VE witnessed. The AFC East is the toughest division in the AFC, no questions asked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dog14787 Posted December 26, 2008 Share Posted December 26, 2008 The Turk is weak (lol) Ot-oh, here we go! I have no problem with Turk Shonert, he's a good coach coaching the wrong offense. The greatest show on turf is a thing of the past and anyone who is using the same offensive philosophy is struggling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BhamBillsFan Posted December 26, 2008 Share Posted December 26, 2008 The problems are on the offensive side of the ball not with the HC. If we keep starting over from scratch every two to three years this team will never accomplish anything. I agree with you when it comes to an OC or DC for continuity, but definitely not HC. With the young guys that we have, we need a leader, someone that takes charge and is tough on the players, Jauron is not that type of coach. He would be a fine addition as a coordinator though. Just look at what the Dolphins did this year with a new coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloWings Posted December 26, 2008 Share Posted December 26, 2008 The AFC East is the toughest division in football. If we finish 8-8 then our division doesn't even have a losing team. With names like Tom Brady, Brett Favre, Belicheat and now the big Tuna to deal with playing in the AFC East is like having 6 extra playoff games every year. I'm not trying to find excuses, but the teams in our division combined with Buffalo being the smallest market makes it real tough to compete. But also look at the schedule...the AFC East crossed with the NFC West, one of the weakest divisions (if not THE weakest). The AFC East teams went 11-5 against the NFCW teams. You could say that the AFCE is one of the toughest divisions on paper, but I want to see what happens when they go up against the NFC South next year. Dick Jauron is coaching one of the youngest, most inexperienced teams in the NFL. The Bills are one of the least penalized teams in the NFL which is a tell tale sign of a well coached football team. Two years straight we have been wracked with injuries with some of our best players going down for long periods. It would be a huge mistake to let Jauron go because replacing him with someone better is next to impossible. Did you watch the end of the Cleveland game? Did you see the play that lost us the Jets game? Did you see any of the plays that he should have or shouldn't have challenged? What this young team needs is a young coach...someone that can relate to the players better than an old-school, by-the-book coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dog14787 Posted December 26, 2008 Share Posted December 26, 2008 I agree with you when it comes to an OC or DC for continuity, but definitely not HC. With the young guys that we have, we need a leader, someone that takes charge and is tough on the players, Jauron is not that type of coach. He would be a fine addition as a coordinator though. Just look at what the Dolphins did this year with a new coach. To bring in a new head coach and not fix the offense would be a huge mistake, continuity is not something we need on offense or Fairchild could haunt us forever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dog14787 Posted December 26, 2008 Share Posted December 26, 2008 But also look at the schedule...the AFC East crossed with the NFC West, one of the weakest divisions (if not THE weakest). The AFC East teams went 11-5 against the NFCW teams. You could say that the AFCE is one of the toughest divisions on paper, but I want to see what happens when they go up against the NFC South next year. Did you watch the end of the Cleveland game? Did you see the play that lost us the Jets game? Did you see any of the plays that he should have or shouldn't have challenged? What this young team needs is a young coach...someone that can relate to the players better than an old-school, by-the-book coach. Right, another inexperienced young coach, geesh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DIE HARD 1967 Posted December 26, 2008 Author Share Posted December 26, 2008 To bring in a new head coach and not fix the offense would be a huge mistake, continuity is not something we need on offense or Fairchild could haunt us forever. We simply need experienced winning coaches. The Best head coaches can lure the best assistants. I would suggest Jack Del-Rio or Mike Holmgren if they are fired I think Mike Holmgren would make a excellent VP similar to Bill Parcells You need to have an organization that top coaches and assistants want to coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobChalmers Posted December 26, 2008 Share Posted December 26, 2008 Guys - The AFC East is NOT as strong as their records indicate. The whole division had one of the easiest possible schedules this season, with both the NFC West and AFC West on the schedule. The two worst divisions in football by this year's records (though the NFC North comes close). The Bills are the whipping boy in the division, btw - lose this weekend and Buffalo alone gave two wins to each of the three others - padding their records. Add to that games all 4 AFC East teams had against: St. Louis (2 wins) Kansas City (2 wins) (wow, Missouri pro football is BAD) Seattle (4 wins) (How did the Jets lose to these stiffs?? The Jets are an illusion) Oakland (4 wins) San Francisco (6 wins) San Diego (7 wns) Denver and Arizona may still finish with only 8. (And they each got 6 games in those two lousy divisions to pad their records!) Six (or even 8) (9 counting Buffalo) games the AFC East teams all got to play against teams that will not have winning records. Who needs Cincy? No - it's really sad - the schedule and Brady's injury really lined up perfectly for the Bills to make a serious run. Just imagine - all they needed were home wins against 6-win SF and 4-win Cleveland and even with the lousy division record they'd still be in it for a playoff chance this Sunday. Put another way - if they had only done what they did last season - win only the games against non-winning teams (they were perfect against losers last year) they would have finished no worse than 8-8 and possibly 10-6 if Denver and Arizona both lose this week and join that group. THAT's how WEAK the the Bills really are. Having said that, I'm still on the hopeful side. They really were 7-0 when both Edwards and Reed played - I don't think that's coincidence. Edwards needs Reed, and the team needs Edwards. Losing Schobel was disastrous. They seem to realize they need a new Center - which was obvious last year. If they fix only those two positions they will be a MUCH better team noone will want to face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dog14787 Posted December 26, 2008 Share Posted December 26, 2008 We simply need experienced winning coaches. The Best head coaches can lure the best assistants. I would suggest Jack Del-Rio or Mike Holmgren if they are fired Players just don't react well to the tough guy coach mentality anymore and is one of the reasons why Parcells and Cowher decided to take a break from coaching. Screaming and spitting in people's faces hurts the players feelings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DIE HARD 1967 Posted December 26, 2008 Author Share Posted December 26, 2008 Guys - The AFC East is NOT as strong as their records indicate. The whole division had one of the easiest possible schedules this season, with both the NFC West and AFC West on the schedule. The two worst divisions in football by this year's records (though the NFC North comes close). The Bills are the whipping boy in the division, btw - lose this weekend and Buffalo alone gave two wins to each of the three others - padding their records. Add to that games all 4 AFC East teams had against: St. Louis (2 wins) Kansas City (2 wins) (wow, Missouri pro football is BAD) Seattle (4 wins) (How did the Jets lose to these stiffs?? The Jets are an illusion) Oakland (4 wins) San Francisco (6 wins) San Diego (7 wns) Denver and Arizona may still finish with only 8. (And they each got 6 games in those two lousy divisions to pad their records!) Six (or even 8) (9 counting Buffalo) games the AFC East teams all got to play against teams that will not have winning records. Who needs Cincy? No - it's really sad - the schedule and Brady's injury really lined up perfectly for the Bills to make a serious run. Just imagine - all they needed were home wins against 6-win SF and 4-win Cleveland and even with the lousy division record they'd still be in it for a playoff chance this Sunday. Put another way - if they had only done what they did last season - win only the games against non-winning teams (they were perfect against losers last year) they would have finished no worse than 8-8 and possibly 10-6 if Denver and Arizona both lose this week and join that group. THAT's how WEAK the the Bills really are. Having said that, I'm still on the hopeful side. They really were 7-0 when both Edwards and Reed played - I don't think that's coincidence. Edwards needs Reed, and the team needs Edwards. Losing Schobel was disastrous. They seem to realize they need a new Center - which was obvious last year. If they fix only those two positions they will be a MUCH better team noone will want to face. I agree with you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted December 26, 2008 Share Posted December 26, 2008 I was a big defended of Jauron and believe he is a great guy. He did an amazing job last year with all the injuries and the Bills have rated as one of the best teams in terms of turnover margain and least penalties during his tenure. Also, his players play for him and I believe alot of people take this for granted. So in many respects, he is a good coach. Unfortunately, he is not a winning coach. 1 winning season is not enough. You can't send the message that 7-9 is acceptable. If the Fins can turn around in one season with equal (and in my eyes, less) talent, you can't accept another 7-9 or 8-8 season. Hopefully, goodbye Dick. I could care less that you didn't get excited on the isdelines. unfortunately, you just couldn't get enough wins. You a class guy and the best coach we have had since Levy (Wade just inherited good players). Take care and all the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DIE HARD 1967 Posted December 26, 2008 Author Share Posted December 26, 2008 I was a big defended of Jauron and believe he is a great guy. He did an amazing job last year with all the injuries and the Bills have rated as one of the best teams in terms of turnover margain and least penalties during his tenure. Also, his players play for him and I believe alot of people take this for granted. So in many respects, he is a good coach. Unfortunately, he is not a winning coach. 1 winning season is not enough. You can't send the message that 7-9 is acceptable. If the Fins can turn around in one season with equal (and in my eyes, less) talent, you can't accept another 7-9 or 8-8 season. Hopefully, goodbye Dick. I could care less that you didn't get excited on the isdelines. unfortunately, you just couldn't get enough wins. You a class guy and the best coach we have had since Levy (Wade just inherited good players). Take care and all the best. He could have planted a few trees though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted December 26, 2008 Share Posted December 26, 2008 Guys - The AFC East is NOT as strong as their records indicate. The whole division had one of the easiest possible schedules this season, with both the NFC West and AFC West on the schedule. The two worst divisions in football by this year's records (though the NFC North comes close). The Bills are the whipping boy in the division, btw - lose this weekend and Buffalo alone gave two wins to each of the three others - padding their records. Add to that games all 4 AFC East teams had against: St. Louis (2 wins) Kansas City (2 wins) (wow, Missouri pro football is BAD) Seattle (4 wins) (How did the Jets lose to these stiffs?? The Jets are an illusion) Oakland (4 wins) San Francisco (6 wins) San Diego (7 wns) Denver and Arizona may still finish with only 8. (And they each got 6 games in those two lousy divisions to pad their records!) Six (or even 8) (9 counting Buffalo) games the AFC East teams all got to play against teams that will not have winning records. Who needs Cincy? No - it's really sad - the schedule and Brady's injury really lined up perfectly for the Bills to make a serious run. Just imagine - all they needed were home wins against 6-win SF and 4-win Cleveland and even with the lousy division record they'd still be in it for a playoff chance this Sunday. Put another way - if they had only done what they did last season - win only the games against non-winning teams (they were perfect against losers last year) they would have finished no worse than 8-8 and possibly 10-6 if Denver and Arizona both lose this week and join that group. THAT's how WEAK the the Bills really are. Having said that, I'm still on the hopeful side. They really were 7-0 when both Edwards and Reed played - I don't think that's coincidence. Edwards needs Reed, and the team needs Edwards. Losing Schobel was disastrous. They seem to realize they need a new Center - which was obvious last year. If they fix only those two positions they will be a MUCH better team noone will want to face. Fair points but this logic is very flawed. This is the NFL. They are all professional players. You don't get more points by beating certain teams. The Titans lost to the Texans, who just lost to the Raiders. The Giants lost to the Browns, who are terrible. So save the nonsense about schedule. Any win in the NFL is impressive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DIE HARD 1967 Posted December 26, 2008 Author Share Posted December 26, 2008 Fair points but this logic is very flawed. This is the NFL. They are all professional players. You don't get more points by beating certain teams. The Titans lost to the Texans, who just lost to the Raiders. The Giants lost to the Browns, who are terrible. So save the nonsense about schedule. Any win in the NFL is impressive. New England, no Brady Jets, an average team with a decent QB but nothing special Miami, Chad Pennington, you guys wouldn't give me 50 bucks for the guy! Lets face it Trent Edwards has a stronger arm, yet the guy is a hero in Miami! None of the above team are going anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted December 26, 2008 Share Posted December 26, 2008 The 2007 Miami Dolphins don't belong in ANY conversation about 2008. They're not the same team. At all. Last year they didn't have Ronnie Brown for half the season, Joey Porter did absolutely nothing, and they had John Beck/Cleo Lemon taking the majority of snaps at QB. They also had a sh------- coach that nobody wanted to play for. The Jets have a future HOF QB and that doesn't hurt ANYBODY. They also have a monster at NT, and the AFC's leading rusher. Remember when the Patriots broke every offense record known to man, won their first 18 games last year and narrowly missed winning the Super Bowl? So explain to me again, using something other than match-ups, how the AFC East is a weak division. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted December 26, 2008 Share Posted December 26, 2008 New England, no Brady Jets, an average team with a decent QB but nothing special Miami, Chad Pennington, you guys wouldn't give me 50 bucks for the guy! Lets face it Trent Edwards has a stronger arm, yet the guy is a hero in Miami! None of the above team are going anywhere. They are going to the playoffs and that's all that matters. Did you have the Giants or Steelers winning the Super Bowl when they were wild cards? Hell no you didnt. Again, this isn't college football. Yuo actually have to win games to become a champion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted December 26, 2008 Share Posted December 26, 2008 New England, no Brady Jets, an average team with a decent QB but nothing special Miami, Chad Pennington, you guys wouldn't give me 50 bucks for the guy! Lets face it Trent Edwards has a stronger arm, yet the guy is a hero in Miami! None of the above team are going anywhere. Yeah, and you know what? People here called me crazy when I said Tom Brady was just an average quarterback playing behind an impenetrable offensive line, in one of the best, most efficient systems every established. Funny how Matt Cassel- a guy who hadn't started a game since high school- more or less proved that point for me. So don't tell me that no Brady = bad Patriots TEAM. CHAD PENNINGTON IS A GOOD QUARTERBACK. Read my post above about the Jets. Decent QB??? DECENT!? Hahaha way to cherry pick THAT point, buddy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloWings Posted December 26, 2008 Share Posted December 26, 2008 Right, another inexperienced young coach, geesh We thought we had an experienced coach.....tell me how that worked out. I wanted an experienced coach, too. But I've come to realize that experience doesn't always equate to success. If you can find a winning, experienced coach that doesn't have a job and is actively looking for one, then point him out to me...I don't think that person exists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DIE HARD 1967 Posted December 26, 2008 Author Share Posted December 26, 2008 Yeah, and you know what? People here called me crazy when I said Tom Brady was just an average quarterback playing behind an impenetrable offensive line, in one of the best, most efficient systems every established. Funny how Matt Cassel- a guy who hadn't started a game since high school- more or less proved that point for me. So don't tell me that no Brady = bad Patriots TEAM. CHAD PENNINGTON IS A GOOD QUARTERBACK. Read my post above about the Jets. Decent QB??? DECENT!? Hahaha way to cherry pick THAT point, buddy. If Pennington is good then Edwards is great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted December 26, 2008 Share Posted December 26, 2008 If Pennington is good then Edwards is great. No, in fact Pennington is better than Edwards. His team is going to the playoffs and he has better stats: Link. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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