LGB Posted December 26, 2008 Posted December 26, 2008 2006 Donte Whitner = ? 2006 McCargo = Bust 2004 JP Losman = Bust (has any Bill turned the ball over more than JP (51 turnovers) during the time that they have appeared on the field?) 2003 McGahee = Bust (traded away when problems arose) 2002 Mike Williams = Bust 2000 Erik Flowers = Bust Five first round busts in 8 years might have something to do with no playoffs during that time (and current 7-9 year after year)...but hopefully the Bills can build upon their selections of Lynch and McKelvin the last two years and get to .500 again...
Frez Posted December 26, 2008 Posted December 26, 2008 2006 Donte Whitner = ?2006 McCargo = Bust 2004 JP Losman = Bust (has any Bill turned the ball over more than JP (51 turnovers) during the time that they have appeared on the field?) 2003 McGahee = Bust (traded away when problems arose) 2002 Mike Williams = Bust 2000 Erik Flowers = Bust Five first round busts in 8 years might have something to do with no playoffs during that time (and current 7-9 year after year)...but hopefully the Bills can build upon their selections of Lynch and McKelvin the last two years and get to .500 again... Agreed.................. Would like to see Buffalo draft more lineman in the first round. Take the big boys!
marauderswr80 Posted December 26, 2008 Posted December 26, 2008 Those drafts have been pretty bad, I think the worst pick of them all was McCargo. I will cut Whitner some slack, his DL dont help him at all with a pass rush and when a QB has all the time in the world to throw the ball it is harder to cover a WR or TE......But in some ways you have a point with Whitner.....
ganesh Posted December 26, 2008 Posted December 26, 2008 Those drafts have been pretty bad, I think the worst pick of them all was McCargo. I will cut Whitner some slack, his DL dont help him at all with a pass rush and when a QB has all the time in the world to throw the ball it is harder to cover a WR or TE......But in some ways you have a point with Whitner..... Whitner is a pretty good player. Unfortunately our front four has been so-so and with the injury to Schoebel and Crowell it has been bad. The McCargo pick was the worst. It was a pretty stretch to get him since he was the 3rd player on that dominant NCState line (Mario and Manny). We should have stayed ground and got Mangold. Unfortunately the Bills had already put their money on the center by signing Fowler and they had no where but to take the DT. This is the kind of Personnel decisions that hurt the Bills since they are cash strapped franchise. Plus where is the "character" for McCargo. The guy has been so down here with no motivation. The Marv Levy draft is neither a success nor a bust...Just another average draft like many other NFL teams.
KD in CA Posted December 26, 2008 Posted December 26, 2008 2006 Donte Whitner = ?2006 McCargo = Bust 2004 JP Losman = Bust (has any Bill turned the ball over more than JP (51 turnovers) during the time that they have appeared on the field?) 2003 McGahee = Bust (traded away when problems arose) 2002 Mike Williams = Bust 2000 Erik Flowers = Bust Sad list, although Whitner is not a '?'. He's a solid player. Maybe someday if the Bills have an NFL caliber front seven we'll see how good he can really be. People bitching because he can't cover Lavereous Coles for 8 seconds is laughable. Also, didn't we get some picks for McGahee?
BuffaloRebound Posted December 26, 2008 Posted December 26, 2008 Equally as problematic as the busts, the players we have hit on in the 1st round - Clements, Evans, Lynch, McKelvin, and Whitner - are not QB's, pass rushers, or lineman. Take it back 3 more years and it is the same story - '97 Antowain Smith was a bust on the Bills, '98 Johnson bust, and '99 hit with Winfield but also a CB. Maybe that's why the Bills keep picking DB's in the 1st round... it's one of the few positions they know how to pick.
drinkTHEkoolaid Posted December 26, 2008 Posted December 26, 2008 there is a reason the bills are abysmal. there is no reason that our scouts should still have jobs
BuffaloBill Posted December 26, 2008 Posted December 26, 2008 2006 Donte Whitner = ?2006 McCargo = Bust 2004 JP Losman = Bust (has any Bill turned the ball over more than JP (51 turnovers) during the time that they have appeared on the field?) 2003 McGahee = Bust (traded away when problems arose) 2002 Mike Williams = Bust 2000 Erik Flowers = Bust Five first round busts in 8 years might have something to do with no playoffs during that time (and current 7-9 year after year)...but hopefully the Bills can build upon their selections of Lynch and McKelvin the last two years and get to .500 again... Whitner does not belong on the list.
marauderswr80 Posted December 26, 2008 Posted December 26, 2008 Well thats the thing, with a good DL I think our DB's would be some of the best in the league. Face the facts guys when a DL cant get to the QB, even the BEST cover corners in the league cant cover all day long, just cant happen. I know I always do this, but look at the Giants, they have average DB's and their DL makes them look spectacular. Every inch of football is won & lost in the trenches, everything within a football is won in the trenches. When you have a weakness in the trenches ALL other weaknesses are exploited. Look at the team that will be in the playoffs, all of them have solid guys within the trenches...... When Buffalo gets that, they will make the playoffs. Right now we have 2-3 guys worthy of being on anyones team in the trenches.....
The Big Cat Posted December 26, 2008 Posted December 26, 2008 Well thats the thing, with a good DL I think our DB's would be some of the best in the league. Face the facts guys when a DL cant get to the QB, even the BEST cover corners in the league cant cover all day long, just cant happen. I know I always do this, but look at the Giants, they have average DB's and their DL makes them look spectacular. Every inch of football is won & lost in the trenches, everything within a football is won in the trenches. When you have a weakness in the trenches ALL other weaknesses are exploited. Look at the team that will be in the playoffs, all of them have solid guys within the trenches...... When Buffalo gets that, they will make the playoffs. Right now we have 2-3 guys worthy of being on anyones team in the trenches..... For once we agree on something! Whitner is a question mark because we can't accurately discern whether he's a good player or a GREAT player since the DLine does him no favors whatsoever. As for McCargo, he is NOT the worst on the list. The worst part of the list is the culminatation of years 2002-2005 (we didn't even have a first rounder in 2005, because of Losman, IIRC). BTW you left out Evans, but there's only so much a WR can do on a team devoid of talent at QB and OL. So what we have are FOUR STRAIGHT YEARS of no first round picks. FOUR YEARS. IN A ROW! Talk about the best way to set a franchise back ten years! Holy cow!
marauderswr80 Posted December 26, 2008 Posted December 26, 2008 IMHO Evans is turning into another Moulds.....great talent gone to the trash cause of Buffalo's lack of producing talent to help him......I guess I say McCargo was the worst cause of what has gone on....he dont even see the field come Sunday, at least the other guys did even though they didnt produce, they still made the team come Sunday's And yeah we dont agree much do we Big kitty Cat.......lol.....and no i didnt use kitty cat, it wont let me put what I want... Have a happy new year man!
The Big Cat Posted December 26, 2008 Posted December 26, 2008 IMHO Evans is turning into another Moulds.....great talent gone to the trash cause of Buffalo's lack of producing talent to help him......I guess I say McCargo was the worst cause of what has gone on....he dont even see the field come Sunday, at least the other guys did even though they didnt produce, they still made the team come Sunday's And yeah we dont agree much do we Big kitty Cat.......lol.....and no i didnt use kitty cat, it wont let me put what I want... Have a happy new year man! Emoticon beer is on me this NYE, my friend in Bills misery! Couldn't agree more about the Moulds situation. Wow, two for two today! Just the other day I was thinking about what Moulds might have told Evans in his last years in Buffalo, or if Lee was in any way aware of Moulds' squandered career. Thank God we locked him down before he started to see the forest through the trees!
LGB Posted December 26, 2008 Author Posted December 26, 2008 It is unclear whether Whitner is a bust or not at this point. He has had some injury problems, but it seems to me that he has not had the impact that you would like to see in someone drafted that high (like say Antoine Winfield - who is about the same size), but the Bills needed a safety at the time. Also not sure how Donte was higher on their draft board than Haloti Ngata (hindsight being what it is - they screwed up and then they reached for McCargo).
Steve O Posted December 26, 2008 Posted December 26, 2008 2006 Donte Whitner = ?2006 McCargo = Bust 2004 JP Losman = Bust (has any Bill turned the ball over more than JP (51 turnovers) during the time that they have appeared on the field?) 2003 McGahee = Bust (traded away when problems arose) 2002 Mike Williams = Bust 2000 Erik Flowers = Bust Five first round busts in 8 years might have something to do with no playoffs during that time (and current 7-9 year after year)...but hopefully the Bills can build upon their selections of Lynch and McKelvin the last two years and get to .500 again... Equally absymal are the busts and mediocre 2nd round picks 2000 Traveres Tillman - bust 01 - Schoebel/Henry - above average value here 02 - Reed / Denney- neither a bust but had hoped for more from both 03 - Kelsay - had hoped for more 04 - gave up the pick for JP 05 - Roscoe - had hoped for more 06 - gave up the pick for Mcargo book still out on Pos and Hardy, 07 and 08 picks though can pobaly again say had hoped for more from both at this stage
CFLstyle Posted December 26, 2008 Posted December 26, 2008 I agree, but I'm not sure if McGahee was a bust, he was a late first-round gamble, and it's easy to forget that he made an enormous impact out of the gates as he put Travis Henry on the bench and dug the team out of an 0-4 start. That being said, I wonder how many other teams have had first round busts since 2000.
Erik Posted December 26, 2008 Posted December 26, 2008 Whitner does not belong on the list. Ummm...it's a list of former first round picks. I'm not sure how he doesn't belong on the list?
marauderswr80 Posted December 26, 2008 Posted December 26, 2008 Whitner is on the list with an asterik.......No DL dont help his case at all. Some of the best FS or SS in the NFL all have a strong front on the DL, which they thrive off of.... But I see Whitners coverage skills and they are pretty bad. I see TE's all game long run wild, but is there a different cause to that? Who knows..... Lets just say Whitner is on the bubble of being a bust..... And by the way, if this was baseball and I was 2-2, im sure the Yankees might sign me a 3yr deal worth 98 million.......scum bags! I know baseball dont belong here, but 420 million for 3 guys??????
Erik Posted December 26, 2008 Posted December 26, 2008 And by the way, if this was baseball and I was 2-2, im sure the Yankees might sign me a 3yr deal worth 98 million.......scum bags! I know baseball dont belong here, but 420 million for 3 guys?????? Haha as a guy living in Boston I love the people complaining about it. It's not their money plus the Yankees haven't won anything since they started spending like crazy (I think Mussina was the one who popped that cherry).
iluk92 Posted December 27, 2008 Posted December 27, 2008 Those drafts have been pretty bad, I think the worst pick of them all was McCargo. I will cut Whitner some slack, his DL dont help him at all with a pass rush and when a QB has all the time in the world to throw the ball it is harder to cover a WR or TE......But in some ways you have a point with Whitner..... Agreed. Safeties are supposed to be the last line of defense... NOT the only one.
San-O Posted December 27, 2008 Posted December 27, 2008 It is unclear whether Whitner is a bust or not at this point. He has had some injury problems, but it seems to me that he has not had the impact that you would like to see in someone drafted that high (like say Antoine Winfield - who is about the same size), but the Bills needed a safety at the time. Also not sure how Donte was higher on their draft board than Haloti Ngata (hindsight being what it is - they screwed up and then they reached for McCargo). Whitner is average at best IMO, and noone other than the Bills had him going that high. Everyone said it was a reach at No. 8 and they were right. Marv was a coach, and not a GM, and if you look at that '06 draft you can see that. Marv screwed the pooch. How you don't take Ngata and then trade UP for McCargo is ridiculous and beyond me. Amateur hour at One Bills Drive.
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