3 years with the Bills and done...

[2020 Our Year For Sure]

The 3 and Out will end when The Bills actually hire a HC that can Win with consistancy...This whole "lack of continuity" argument has to be one of the dumbest I've heard in a while...Lets see now...DJ goes 7-9, 7-9, and probably 6-10 in His 3 Years as a HC...So I ask the continuity freaks this...What exactly can we expect, based on what we already know about DJ as a HC, should we keep Him for another Year?...A HC who consistantly loses, and has a History of losing in the NFL, can be expected to have another losing Season can he not? That's the consistancy He brings...That's the continuity we should expect...He consistantly loses...

The point is, we've tried hiring a new crappy coach every three years. It doesn't work.

 

If we fire Jauron, we're just going to get another crappy coach. There is absolutely no reason to think otherwise. Ralph Wilson and Russ Brandon would be making the hire.

 

Instead of bringing in a new crappy coach and letting him go three years from now, lets stick with a crappy coach, who, for all his faults, does have a few encouraging traits on the other side of the coin.

 

Continuity is really the only card we're holding here.

[dave mcbride]

What is with the revising of history?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

All three articles were pulled from the Buffalo News archives.

Note the dates on every one. All were before TD arrived. (TD was hired in early 2001, IIRC)

 

The salary cap problem was real.

These are all before Butler left, no? What does that have to do with Donohoe?

[Dan]

The point is, we've tried hiring a new crappy coach every three years. It doesn't work.

 

If we fire Jauron, we're just going to get another crappy coach. There is absolutely no reason to think otherwise. Ralph Wilson and Russ Brandon would be making the hire.

 

Instead of bringing in a new crappy coach and letting him go three years from now, lets stick with a crappy coach, who, for all his faults, does have a few encouraging traits on the other side of the coin.

 

Continuity is really the only card we're holding here.

I must admit, this is where I tend to sit on the issue. Am I happy with Jauron's team? No. Would I like to see a new coaching regime? Yes. However, at what cost?

 

If Jauron is replaced with another retread-type or a run of the mill coordinator with no HC experience, then why? Seems like we could do far more harm than good - ala Williams/Mularky. So, I'm not so sure.

 

Given this team's past HC hires, who really thinks we would bring in a Cowher type?

[DIE HARD 1967]

First of all, great thread

 

Every successful NFL franchise has 3 things in common,

 

#1 Top NFL experience in the front office

 

#2 The ability to draw up a plan and stick with it.

 

#3 The ability to use the draft, free agency, and the waiver wire to fill the holes effectively when injuries become a problem.

 

The coaching staff has one function only, MAKE IT ALL WORK

 

My biggest problem with Dick Jauron is simple, he has problems with time management, his game plans are questionable, and he has had problems (in my opinion,) motivated his team.

 

The discission to replace him should not be with the fans or Ralph Wilson, it should come from a capable front office.

 

If Ralph would fire Bill Polion and John Butler, can we really trust his judgment?

[Sisyphean Bills]

The 3 and Out will end when The Bills actually hire a HC that can Win with consistancy...This whole "lack of continuity" argument has to be one of the dumbest I've heard in a while...Lets see now...DJ goes 7-9, 7-9, and probably 6-10 in His 3 Years as a HC...So I ask the continuity freaks this...What exactly can we expect, based on what we already know about DJ as a HC, should we keep Him for another Year?...A HC who consistantly loses, and has a History of losing in the NFL, can be expected to have another losing Season can he not? That's the consistancy He brings...That's the continuity we should expect...He consistantly loses...

 

So why in Gods Name would Bills Fans want to see another Year of a consistant loser at HC? And Oh will it not be fun if the Bills go 6-10 or 7-9 again next Year under Jauron...There is not going to be anyone left who will sit through that garbage live...Not a soul...

Well, to summarize the argument, because Jauron's 6 or 7 wins are better than a rookie HC, like say Mularkey, who could get 9. Say nothing of the notion that the Bills now have far more talent than we did under Donahoe.

[dave mcbride]

Well, to summarize the argument, because Jauron's 6 or 7 wins are better than a rookie HC, like say Mularkey, who could get 9. Say nothing of the notion that the Bills now have far more talent than we did under Donahoe.

You really think the team is more talented than it was in 2004??? Moulds was still a good player, McGahee was excellent, Bledsoe was reasonably competent, and they had a dominating defense -- possibly the best in the league when you combine their #2 yardage ranking with leading the league in forcing turnovers.

[Sisyphean Bills]

You really think the team is more talented than it was in 2004??? Moulds was still a good player, McGahee was excellent, Bledsoe was reasonably competent, and they had a dominating defense -- possibly the best in the league when you combine their #2 yardage ranking with leading the league in forcing turnovers.

No, not me. (Hence the face.)

 

But there are plenty of posts that say this team is much improved over what it was under Donahoe.

[marauderswr80]

As many times as it takes Ralph Wilson to stop being a cheap ass and get a real coaching staff in there. While he's at it hire a real GM.

 

exactly......

[dave mcbride]

No, not me. (Hence the face.)

 

But there are plenty of posts that say this team is much improved over what it was under Donahoe.

Aha. My bad.

[KOKBILLS]

The point is, we've tried hiring a new crappy coach every three years. It doesn't work.

 

If we fire Jauron, we're just going to get another crappy coach. There is absolutely no reason to think otherwise. Ralph Wilson and Russ Brandon would be making the hire.

 

Instead of bringing in a new crappy coach and letting him go three years from now, lets stick with a crappy coach, who, for all his faults, does have a few encouraging traits on the other side of the coin.

 

Continuity is really the only card we're holding here.

 

Even a blind squirrel gets a nut every now and again...Ralph is never going to hire a good HC unless He keeps trying...Keeping Jauron for continuities sake is just about the dumbest thing I can think of...Unless Your some sort of NFL masochist...The continuity of continually losing!!! Oh joy!

[Ramius]

These are all before Butler left, no? What does that have to do with Donohoe?

 

Your post said that the salary cap "hell" we went through was Donahoe's own making, when in fact, it was that fat ass butler who screwed the team over. TD had limited choices given the lack of talent and the mess of a cap situation. Cap wise, TD handled things correctly.

[dave mcbride]

Your post said that the salary cap "hell" we went through was Donahoe's own making, when in fact, it was that fat ass butler who screwed the team over. TD had limited choices given the lack of talent and the mess of a cap situation. Cap wise, TD handled things correctly.

No, that's not what I said. What I was referring to was the decision by Donohoe and Williams to "blow up" the team by letting Jones, Holocek, etc. go after June 1 and then letting their amortized bonuses accelerate into both the 2001 and 2002 seasons. He then cried cap poverty whilst replacing those players with people who were no better than they were. By the time Donohoe arrived, most of the cap cutting had already occurred. The only outstanding issue was the Flutie/Johnson situation because Flutie outperformed all expectations.

[thewildrabbit]

If Marv Levy and Ted Marchibroda were out coached in the Bills first super bowl by Bill Parcels and Bill Belichick how can you think that Dick Jauron will ever see the playoffs?I seriously doubt Jauron will ever beat a bill Belichick team. He managed to take a nobody from nowhere as a RB and he rushed for over 100+ yards against Buffalo. Not to mention Matt Cassel who hasn't played since high school and now he looks like a pro bowl QB with 2- 400 yard passing games this year.

 

What on gods green earth makes you think Dick Jauron will ever beat the Jets and Dolphins now that they don't suck?

 

Get real guys, this team is about to be swept in the AFC East with Tom Brady out all year and the Bills with one of the easiest schedules in the NFL.I don't care how much talent you bring in by drafts or free agency this coaching staff will continue to fail because they just don't have the talent themselves.

[BLZFAN4LIFE]

If Marv Levy and Ted Marchibroda were out coached in the Bills first super bowl by Bill Parcels and Bill Belichick how can you think that Dick Jauron will ever see the playoffs?I seriously doubt Jauron will ever beat a bill Belichick team. He managed to take a nobody from nowhere as a RB and he rushed for over 100+ yards against Buffalo. Not to mention Matt Cassel who hasn't played since high school and now he looks like a pro bowl QB with 2- 400 yard passing games this year.

 

What on gods green earth makes you think Dick Jauron will ever beat the Jets and Dolphins now that they don't suck?

 

Get real guys, this team is about to be swept in the AFC East with Tom Brady out all year and the Bills with one of the easiest schedules in the NFL.I don't care how much talent you bring in by drafts or free agency this coaching staff will continue to fail because they just don't have the talent themselves.

 

Someone mark his words. Very sad but very true.

[Tcali]

If Marv Levy and Ted Marchibroda were out coached in the Bills first super bowl by Bill Parcels and Bill Belichick how can you think that Dick Jauron will ever see the playoffs?I seriously doubt Jauron will ever beat a bill Belichick team. He managed to take a nobody from nowhere as a RB and he rushed for over 100+ yards against Buffalo. Not to mention Matt Cassel who hasn't played since high school and now he looks like a pro bowl QB with 2- 400 yard passing games this year.

 

What on gods green earth makes you think Dick Jauron will ever beat the Jets and Dolphins now that they don't suck?

 

Get real guys, this team is about to be swept in the AFC East with Tom Brady out all year and the Bills with one of the easiest schedules in the NFL.I don't care how much talent you bring in by drafts or free agency this coaching staff will continue to fail because they just don't have the talent themselves.

So true. We are outclassed. We would need 3x the talent of NE just to beat them. The Bills have been a dumb organization for the past 13 years--and for a good 30 out of 48 yrs..

[Cynical]

No, that's not what I said. What I was referring to was the decision by Donohoe and Williams to "blow up" the team by letting Jones, Holocek, etc. go after June 1 and then letting their amortized bonuses accelerate into both the 2001 and 2002 seasons. He then cried cap poverty whilst replacing those players with people who were no better than they were. By the time Donohoe arrived, most of the cap cutting had already occurred. The only outstanding issue was the Flutie/Johnson situation because Flutie outperformed all expectations.

 

No, the all cap cutting did NOT already take place.

Go back and look at the date of the first article: 12/31/2000. Even that blurb of the article talks about how the Bills will have to let players go. Does that sound like all cap cutting is done?

 

IIRC, after the 2000 season, the Bills were projected to be OVER the cap limit for the 2001 season based on the then present contracts. By the end of 2000, Butler was handing the keys to Wilson and was looking to board the plane to San Diego.

As Ramius pointed out, TD had to go in and clean up Butler's mess. And that mess was huge.

 

 

As for the June 1 date, IMO, you are trying to make a mountain out of a mole hill.

 

If TD cuts players before June 1, the entire remaining signing bonus hits the 2001 cap. By cutting the player after June 1, only 1 year of the bonus impacted the 2001 salary cap, with the rest coming due in 2002. If you thought the 2001 team was bad, the team would have been worse if he had cut everybody before June 1.

[BillsVet]

Get real guys, this team is about to be swept in the AFC East with Tom Brady out all year and the Bills with one of the easiest schedules in the NFL.I don't care how much talent you bring in by drafts or free agency this coaching staff will continue to fail because they just don't have the talent themselves.

 

This fact, being swept in the AFC East, is the one which hurts the most. The easiest path to the playoffs is winning the division. To think this team will end up 0-6 in their own division is utterly ridiculous. I can't put into words how bad that is.

 

NFL HC's rarely have second chances to prove they can coach. DJ got one, courtesy of someone unfit to handle the GM role in Levy. DJ has not improved his game management, nor has he stopped wasting timeouts. What more can he screw up to get himself fired?

 

He has had unparalleled control in personnel (the product of not having a legit GM) and still loses. What more can he have that he doesn't already? The UFA additions have been underwhelming. The 06 draft is barely average. 07 and 08 are too early to tell.

 

This team needs a new vision, preferably one in which teams fear Buffalo. But the Bills haven't had that, and have become a laughingstock throughout the NFL. If we want to retain that reputation, keep DJ. I guarantee he'll give us continuity in that respect.

[KOKBILLS]

If Marv Levy and Ted Marchibroda were out coached in the Bills first super bowl by Bill Parcels and Bill Belichick how can you think that Dick Jauron will ever see the playoffs?I seriously doubt Jauron will ever beat a bill Belichick team. He managed to take a nobody from nowhere as a RB and he rushed for over 100+ yards against Buffalo. Not to mention Matt Cassel who hasn't played since high school and now he looks like a pro bowl QB with 2- 400 yard passing games this year.

 

What on gods green earth makes you think Dick Jauron will ever beat the Jets and Dolphins now that they don't suck?

 

Get real guys, this team is about to be swept in the AFC East with Tom Brady out all year and the Bills with one of the easiest schedules in the NFL.I don't care how much talent you bring in by drafts or free agency this coaching staff will continue to fail because they just don't have the talent themselves.

 

If only You were wrong rabbit...

 

But Your dead on! And for the life of Me I can't see how some Bills Fans think the lamp of continuity will suddenly be lit...lighting the way for Jauron to become a decent HC...Whatever...Can You imagine how much talent The Bills will have to have to consistantly compete with dead Dick at the helm?

 

Those who have yet to wake up and smell the coffee are advised do so quickly...I don't think anyone is guaranteeing the next guy will be great...What we are saying is Jauron simply sucks out loud...He's a PROVEN loser and there is no denying it...The only continuity you get with Dead Dick at HC is continuously losing...

[spartacus]

If only You were wrong rabbit...

 

But Your dead on! And for the life of Me I can't see how some Bills Fans think the lamp of continuity will suddenly be lit...lighting the way for Jauron to become a decent HC...Whatever...Can You imagine how much talent The Bills will have to have to consistantly compete with dead Dick at the helm?

 

Those who have yet to wake up and smell the coffee are advised do so quickly...I don't think anyone is guaranteeing the next guy will be great...What we are saying is Jauron simply sucks out loud...He's a PROVEN loser and there is no denying it...The only continuity you get with Dead Dick at HC is continuously losing...

 

Getting rid of Dick will not improve anything unless you clear out the clowns in the front office as well.

 

keep Brandon but limit his role to marketing.

 

they need a football guy at the top

[dave mcbride]

No, the all cap cutting did NOT already take place.

Go back and look at the date of the first article: 12/31/2000. Even that blurb of the article talks about how the Bills will have to let players go. Does that sound like all cap cutting is done?

 

IIRC, after the 2000 season, the Bills were projected to be OVER the cap limit for the 2001 season based on the then present contracts. By the end of 2000, Butler was handing the keys to Wilson and was looking to board the plane to San Diego.

As Ramius pointed out, TD had to go in and clean up Butler's mess. And that mess was huge.

 

 

As for the June 1 date, IMO, you are trying to make a mountain out of a mole hill.

 

If TD cuts players before June 1, the entire remaining signing bonus hits the 2001 cap. By cutting the player after June 1, only 1 year of the bonus impacted the 2001 salary cap, with the rest coming due in 2002. If you thought the 2001 team was bad, the team would have been worse if he had cut everybody before June 1.

The article from 12/31/2000 said absolutely nothing about specific cap problems. It was a general complaint about the constraints the cap placed on the Bills by a Buffalo New columnist. Without looking, probably Jerry Sullivan ...

 

Re 2001, please provide me with some specifics to convince me. No offense (seriously), but the debate over this issue on this board has been going on for just over a half decade now, and no one has ever proven to me that the Bills were in cap hell on June 1, 2001.