Franken about to take lead...

[billnutinphoenix]

What does everyone think?

[DC Tom]

I think when elections stopped being about earning the most votes, and started being about finding the most votes by manipulating the counting after the voting finished, democracy died.

[Bishop Hedd]

I think when elections stopped being about earning the most votes, and started being about finding the most votes by manipulating the counting after the voting finished, democracy died.

I thought it was when judges decided outcomes and not the People.

[DC Tom]

I thought it was when judges decided outcomes and not the People.

 

You would think that. What with you not having a clue and all.

[blzrul]

I like to see the Republicans served with their own sauce. Franken wouldn't be any worse than the incumbent, who's already the target of two investigations/lawsuits.

[Cheeseburger_in_paradise]

I like to see the Republicans served with their own sauce. Franken wouldn't be any worse than the incumbent, who's already the target of two investigations/lawsuits.

 

I think I just found 200 votes in my trunk.

[/dev/null]

I think I just found 200 votes in my trunk.

 

I found a couple hundred thousand 2004 Ohio ballots between the cushions of my couch

[Steely Dan]

I think every vote should be counted. Especially in an election this close. I have no problem with what's going on.

[YellowLinesandArmadillos]

Great (sarcasm), Senator Smiley...

[Boomer860]

I think when elections stopped being about earning the most votes, and started being about finding the most votes by manipulating the counting after the voting finished, democracy died.

You are right . The politicians are a joke and the media loves it. As for the people ,deep down they all know what needs to be done. Hopefully every one has the scrotal fortitude to do it.

[Live&DieBillsFootball]

I think when elections stopped being about earning the most votes, and started being about finding the most votes by manipulating the counting after the voting finished, democracy died.

 

I agree.

 

I would like to see the AICPA in charge of elections. Have them create a ballot and voting process that has the proper internal controls that ensure that votes are counted once, precincts are properly tabulated and results are made accurately and timely.

 

We need to find the most efficient type of ballot that cannot be left to interpretation. Then use these same ballots nationwide. I have lived in a lot of states and the best I have come across is the one where you use a paper ballot and marker and fill in the arrow that points to your choice and then the voter personally feeds the ballot into an optical scanner which records the vote and retains the paper ballot. If 3000 people signed in to vote in a precinct, then 3000 ballots were handed out and the reader should show 3000 ballots recorded.

 

It probably makes too much sense, so I'm sure we will never see something like this.

[PastaJoe]

Franken would be an interesting addition to the Senate, bringing the traditional progressive viewpoint that Paul Wellstone had, but I still think Coleman will edge him out. I read that Gov. Pawlenty was looking into the legality of appointing a Senator if the election isn't resolved soon. There should be provisions in state elections to have runoffs if the vote is close and there's a 3rd party candidate that gets more than a certain percentage of votes, as was the case in Minnesota.

 

Also, isn't it time that states did away with paper ballots that allow for this type of uncertainty?

[DC Tom]

Franken would be an interesting addition to the Senate, bringing the traditional progressive viewpoint that Paul Wellstone had, but I still think Coleman will edge him out. I read that Gov. Pawlenty was looking into the legality of appointing a Senator if the election isn't resolved soon. There should be provisions in state elections to have runoffs if the vote is close and there's a 3rd party candidate that gets more than a certain percentage of votes, as was the case in Minnesota.

 

Also, isn't it time that states did away with paper ballots that allow for this type of uncertainty?

 

Provisions for defining "vote" before the votes are actually cast would be a good start. This is the same nonsense in FL that happened in 2000 - the vote was so close that it started to come down to "what's the definition of a valid vote?", which definition was, because of FL's bull sh-- election bylaws, left up to the initiative (and ultimately political bias) of the individuals charged with tallying the votes.

 

You've got the same thing happening here - "Gee, now that it might actually matter, maybe we should count these absentee ballots that we discarded earlier as invalid." There is NO way it should be legal for a ballot judged as miscast to be later deemed valid simply based on how it would influence the election!

 

The simplest and best solution would be for the states (who are responsible for their own election bylaws) to explicitly define a properly cast ballot - before the elections take place - and explicitly define the mechanism whereby statistical dead heats are resolved. Florida at least had the latter in 2000 (although all the lawsuits surrounding the election promptly !@#$ed that process up). Minnesota doesn't even seem to have that much going for it.

[YellowLinesandArmadillos]

Provisions for defining "vote" before the votes are actually cast would be a good start. This is the same nonsense in FL that happened in 2000 - the vote was so close that it started to come down to "what's the definition of a valid vote?", which definition was, because of FL's bull sh-- election bylaws, left up to the initiative (and ultimately political bias) of the individuals charged with tallying the votes.

 

You've got the same thing happening here - "Gee, now that it might actually matter, maybe we should count these absentee ballots that we discarded earlier as invalid." There is NO way it should be legal for a ballot judged as miscast to be later deemed valid simply based on how it would influence the election!

 

The simplest and best solution would be for the states (who are responsible for their own election bylaws) to explicitly define a properly cast ballot - before the elections take place - and explicitly define the mechanism whereby statistical dead heats are resolved. Florida at least had the latter in 2000 (although all the lawsuits surrounding the election promptly !@#$ed that process up). Minnesota doesn't even seem to have that much going for it.

Agreed, but it needs to be a national standard at this point, not one set by the states. But that is where the rub is. This is set by the States as written in the Constitution in Section 4 of Article 1. Unless there were to be an amendment to it, this kind of chicanery is likely to continue.

[IDBillzFan]

I think that Al Franken in the Senate and Joe Biden as VP could quite possibly be the comedic team this country has been waiting for.

 

Gone are the days of Rowen and Martin. Abbott and Costello. Lucy and Ethel. Lewis and Martin.

 

Franken and Biden could make them all suffer in comparison.

[Dante]

I think that Al Franken in the Senate and Joe Biden as VP could quite possibly be the comedic team this country has been waiting for.

 

Gone are the days of Rowen and Martin. Abbott and Costello. Lucy and Ethel. Lewis and Martin.

 

Franken and Biden could make them all suffer in comparison.

Gee, Franken was just so funny wasn't he? No wonder he got out of that racket and into another. Who the fug would pay to see that guy? Little fvk'n weasel.

[IDBillzFan]

Gee, Franken was just so funny wasn't he? No wonder he got out of that racket and into another. Who the fug would pay to see that guy? Little fvk'n weasel.

That's why I hope he wins. He has the potential to get more laughs as a Senator because he'll actually think he's being taken seriously in that position.

[/dev/null]

Gee, Franken was just so funny wasn't he? No wonder he got out of that racket and into another. Who the fug would pay to see that guy? Little fvk'n weasel.

 

This recount mess is the most entertaining thing he's ever done

[EasternOHBillsFan]

Gee, Franken was just so funny wasn't he? No wonder he got out of that racket and into another. Who the fug would pay to see that guy? Little fvk'n weasel.

 

He was mostly a WRITER and not an actor, and if you knew that then your comment doesn't make too much sense. Some of the best SNL material was when he was writing for the show...

[Steely Dan]

I agree.

 

I would like to see the AICPA in charge of elections. Have them create a ballot and voting process that has the proper internal controls that ensure that votes are counted once, precincts are properly tabulated and results are made accurately and timely.

 

We need to find the most efficient type of ballot that cannot be left to interpretation. Then use these same ballots nationwide. I have lived in a lot of states and the best I have come across is the one where you use a paper ballot and marker and fill in the arrow that points to your choice and then the voter personally feeds the ballot into an optical scanner which records the vote and retains the paper ballot. If 3000 people signed in to vote in a precinct, then 3000 ballots were handed out and the reader should show 3000 ballots recorded.

 

It probably makes too much sense, so I'm sure we will never see something like this.

 

 

I've said this before and I really think this is the best idea. Just use the machines that we have here in Western New York. Those machines are very, very difficult to rig. They are not connected to anything electronically and can't be hacked. They have push down buttons and large font that makes casting a mistaken ballot a slim possibility. They don't make them now but the patent is still out there and starting a company again would be fairly easy with a huge government order in hand.

 

Franken would be an interesting addition to the Senate, bringing the traditional progressive viewpoint that Paul Wellstone had, but I still think Coleman will edge him out. I read that Gov. Pawlenty was looking into the legality of appointing a Senator if the election isn't resolved soon. There should be provisions in state elections to have runoffs if the vote is close and there's a 3rd party candidate that gets more than a certain percentage of votes, as was the case in Minnesota.

Also, isn't it time that states did away with paper ballots that allow for this type of uncertainty?

 

In a tie Minnesota calls for a coin flip. They used it at least once before but that was in smaller local elections. I think you're right that if there is a 1% difference between the two leading candidates then a runoff election should be held. That also could lead to another statistical dead heat though.

 

I agree paper ballots are 1800's style voting.

 

 

Provisions for defining "vote" before the votes are actually cast would be a good start. This is the same nonsense in FL that happened in 2000 - the vote was so close that it started to come down to "what's the definition of a valid vote?", which definition was, because of FL's bull sh-- election bylaws, left up to the initiative (and ultimately political bias) of the individuals charged with tallying the votes.

 

You've got the same thing happening here - "Gee, now that it might actually matter, maybe we should count these absentee ballots that we discarded earlier as invalid." There is NO way it should be legal for a ballot judged as miscast to be later deemed valid simply based on how it would influence the election!

 

The simplest and best solution would be for the states (who are responsible for their own election bylaws) to explicitly define a properly cast ballot - before the elections take place - and explicitly define the mechanism whereby statistical dead heats are resolved. Florida at least had the latter in 2000 (although all the lawsuits surrounding the election promptly !@#$ed that process up). Minnesota doesn't even seem to have that much going for it.

 

Going back and looking at the votes were rejected isn't a bad thing in my opinion. Mistakes are made in all facets of the voting process. If we were talking about a difference in votes by 3,000 or more it would be ridiculous to do that but we're talking about a difference of less than three hundred. It's a pain in the ass but I think it needs to be done to ensure the closest possible count to actual ballots cast.