Ramius Posted December 16, 2008 Posted December 16, 2008 I don't know about hatred Dan. What strikes me is that JP has a cadre of fans here. Some are blatant, some passive agressive but they are here, and they think he is great. I read in the other thread that Lori met JP and thinks that he is a nice kid. I know Lori and trust her opinion. The thing is, he isn't good. If he didn't fumble and lose the game for us, he still isn't good. You know Dan, Losman probably is a nice guy. Levy and Jauron might be the nicest guys on the planet. I don't know, but we need to win. Jason Peters is probably our best player. Losman is sacked on 1 out of 9 attempts (or so says our stat man JDG), and without Peters having a good day against a tough jest DL, what would be left of Losman? Peters didn't look great on that particular play, but from where I sit this debate is about excuse making and blame shifting from the group who still clings to the premise that JP is a good qb, or at least doesn't suck. Put Jason Peters on my team any day of the week. There's been plenty of personal hate towards JP in the past 2 days (not from you). That irks me a lot worse that the football criticisms. I'm not saying JP played well, because he didn't. Peters also had a good game. However, on the play, the one that we all unanimously agree cost us the game, both peters and losman deserve equal blame. If either one of them had made a play, we probably win the game. But neither did and we lost. (Langston walker didnt help either with his whale flop). And for the record, i don't think JP is a good QB now. With the proper coaching in the future, he's got the potential to be a good QB. We've seen that in 2006. I don't know if he'll ever put it together mentally to be a good QB tho. But for him and the Bills, the best thing is for him to move along with his career elsewhere.
Adam Posted December 16, 2008 Posted December 16, 2008 I don't know about hatred Dan. What strikes me is that JP has a cadre of fans here. Some are blatant, some passive agressive but they are here, and they think he is great. I read in the other thread that Lori met JP and thinks that he is a nice kid. I know Lori and trust her opinion. The thing is, he isn't good. If he didn't fumble and lose the game for us, he still isn't good. You know Dan, Losman probably is a nice guy. Levy and Jauron might be the nicest guys on the planet. I don't know, but we need to win. Jason Peters is probably our best player. Losman is sacked on 1 out of 9 attempts (or so says our stat man JDG), and without Peters having a good day against a tough jest DL, what would be left of Losman? Peters didn't look great on that particular play, but from where I sit this debate is about excuse making and blame shifting from the group who still clings to the premise that JP is a good qb, or at least doesn't suck. Put Jason Peters on my team any day of the week. I agree about Peters, but excpet for a handful of players, we really need to blow this team up and start over. This group will never be better than .500 and it will take a lot of luck to get that far with them.....we have horribly neglected substance for style for a decade now, none of the offensive linemen fit well together and our supposedly small, quick DE's (aside from Schobel) are slow. Glad we signed Lee Evans to a huge contract, he's a great blocker......
Nervous Guy Posted December 16, 2008 Posted December 16, 2008 Sounds like you're going to have to T-Bone it. What team are you jumping to? blasphemer!!!
RJ (not THAT RJ) Posted December 16, 2008 Posted December 16, 2008 There's been plenty of personal hate towards JP in the past 2 days (not from you). That irks me a lot worse that the football criticisms. I'm not saying JP played well, because he didn't. Peters also had a good game. However, on the play, the one that we all unanimously agree cost us the game, both peters and losman deserve equal blame. If either one of them had made a play, we probably win the game. But neither did and we lost. (Langston walker didnt help either with his whale flop). And for the record, i don't think JP is a good QB now. With the proper coaching in the future, he's got the potential to be a good QB. We've seen that in 2006. I don't know if he'll ever put it together mentally to be a good QB tho. But for him and the Bills, the best thing is for him to move along with his career elsewhere. You make a lot of good points, Ramius, but I have to say that your conclusion does not add up for me. I wanted to believe that JP could be good as well, but frankly his last two performances have overdrawn the sympathy bank. At the most basic level of field awareness and good sense, he simply does not have it. We can talk all day about whether he would have had it if he had started consistently since 2005, but that is beyond moot. It is, after all, not unimportant to remember that part of the reason why he has not started consistently since 2005 is that, for one reason or another, he was unable to gain and hold the confidence of two head coaches, three offensive coordinators, and a few QB coaches. One could argue about the relative abilities of those coaches as well, but even then, the fact remains he was unable to gain and keep the confidence of people who saw him in practice, who watched him on film, and who actually had a vested interest in his success. Even the criticism of the play Sunday betrays the sad truth about JP. The problem with the call, so many people (including yourself, if I don't mistake myself) say, is that it was wrong to put the game in his hands. In the hands of a 5-year veteran who should have learned something by now. A more crushing indictment of JP as a QB is hard to find. I also agree he seems like a very nice kid. I wanted him to succeed, and would be pleasantly surprised if he did someday. But I just do not see that happening.
DrFishfinder Posted December 16, 2008 Posted December 16, 2008 Why keep him? Cut him now & make an example of him. A professional QB in the NFL can't lose that ball like he did on Sunday. This type of thing can not be tolerated. This loser mentality has got to be nipped in the bud NOW!!!! Grow a sack Dick!!!!! Nah....let him play. By the end of the NE game, he will have played himself right out of the NFL.
WellDressed Posted December 16, 2008 Posted December 16, 2008 HOW'S ABOUT GIVING THE BOY A RE-CIRCUMCISION. THAT MOVE'L LEARN THAT PRICK!!
BLZFAN4LIFE Posted December 16, 2008 Posted December 16, 2008 HOW'S ABOUT GIVING THE BOY A RE-CIRCUMCISION. THAT MOVE'L LEARN THAT PRICK!! You're assuming there's something there to circumcise
WellDressed Posted December 16, 2008 Posted December 16, 2008 You're assuming there's something there to circumcise Well the topic is cutting today. Unfortunately OJ is unavailable, so I figured there must a good rabbi around and he could take care of our unwanted skin.
Dan Posted December 17, 2008 Posted December 17, 2008 I don't know about hatred Dan. What strikes me is that JP has a cadre of fans here. Some are blatant, some passive agressive but they are here, and they think he is great. I read in the other thread that Lori met JP and thinks that he is a nice kid. I know Lori and trust her opinion. The thing is, he isn't good. If he didn't fumble and lose the game for us, he still isn't good. You know Dan, Losman probably is a nice guy. Levy and Jauron might be the nicest guys on the planet. I don't know, but we need to win. Jason Peters is probably our best player. Losman is sacked on 1 out of 9 attempts (or so says our stat man JDG), and without Peters having a good day against a tough jest DL, what would be left of Losman? Peters didn't look great on that particular play, but from where I sit this debate is about excuse making and blame shifting from the group who still clings to the premise that JP is a good qb, or at least doesn't suck. Put Jason Peters on my team any day of the week. Perhaps you don't read all the posts. Because there's plenty of vile thrown JP's way. One poster in particular as repeatedly wish him and anyone that ever thought he was good would get aids and die. I'd call that hatred. Of course, if you call them on it; they so "oh its a joke". Well, perhaps. But, when 90% of your posts are in some way bashing JP, its hard not to draw the conclusion that there's some strong negative feelings there. And to try and crawfish out of it at that point is a little shallow, IMO. I'm not saying everyone hates the guy, but he certainly has his "detractors" and certainly gets far more of the blame for poor play than many other players. Honestly, when you have posters seriously blaming bad defensive play on JP?? Come on man. But that's all neither here nor there, I suppose. The lines have been drawn and firmly laid in place. I suspect they'll always be that way. I'm not sure many will say he's a great QB (I can't think of any - well maybe 1). I'm not sure any have ever said that. However, certainly many have suggested and stated that he has great potential. Certainly, you'll find several that say he's "good". But, I'd suggest that most that even thought he had potential are falling off that wagon. The haters clearly outweigh the lovers at this point. For me, personally, I liked the guy. I liked what he tried to do. I hoped like hell he'd be our next great QB. And even when he's at his worst, I still cheer for him to do well. Why? Because he's wearing a Bills jersey. As long as he's on our sideline, I'll wish him well and defend him. But, that's just me. I don't blame him because he doesn't have the talent to do what we all want him to do. But, I do give him credit for the effort and the way he's handled his entire time here. Even his most ardent detractors have to admit that he could have been a much bigger locker room cancer and all around sh--. But again, I'd say that's all neither here nor there at this point in the season and his career. As far as Peters, I'd suggest that Lynch is our best player. I love the heart that that guy plays with on every play. Man he's something to watch.
keepthefaith Posted December 17, 2008 Posted December 17, 2008 There's been plenty of personal hate towards JP in the past 2 days (not from you). That irks me a lot worse that the football criticisms. I'm not saying JP played well, because he didn't. Peters also had a good game. However, on the play, the one that we all unanimously agree cost us the game, both peters and losman deserve equal blame. If either one of them had made a play, we probably win the game. But neither did and we lost. (Langston walker didnt help either with his whale flop). And for the record, i don't think JP is a good QB now. With the proper coaching in the future, he's got the potential to be a good QB. We've seen that in 2006. I don't know if he'll ever put it together mentally to be a good QB tho. But for him and the Bills, the best thing is for him to move along with his career elsewhere. I've watched that play 20 times. I think every QB in the NFL gets sacked on that play and a good number of them fumble too.
Sisyphean Bills Posted December 17, 2008 Posted December 17, 2008 I've watched that play 20 times. I think every QB in the NFL gets sacked on that play and a good number of them fumble too. Yes, but what's that got to do with anything?
BobbyC81 Posted December 17, 2008 Posted December 17, 2008 I agree, but.......thats not the way the organization works. believe it or not the Buffalo Bills front office do try and show some class towards their players. If they didnt cut McCargo by now, they will never do it with JP Losman. And the Bills wasted 1st round picks on both of these clowns after trading other picks to move back into the 1st round. Oy vay!! Whereas you have to give some credit to the front office for making these moves to try & get another 1st round quality guy. It just didn't work out with the 2 players they selected.
eliteqb Posted December 17, 2008 Posted December 17, 2008 Edwards won't play another down this season. If he can't go against Denver they're not going to put him in against NE* in the Ralph. If they're worried about his fragile psyche then putting a soft, low confidence young QB who hasn't played well in the cold and hasn't played in four + games would be malpractice. Plus, no way they put that kid in in the last game against a team that will crush his confidence and possibly his fragile body. Let Losman get the boos and the beat-down. He won't be in WNY next season. Makes a lot of sense
zow2 Posted December 17, 2008 Posted December 17, 2008 With the proper coaching in the future, he's got the potential to be a good QB. We've seen that in 2006. I don't know if he'll ever put it together mentally to be a good QB tho. But for him and the Bills, the best thing is for him to move along with his career elsewhere. This is where you are wrong. What JP lacks is something that even the best coaches cannot teach to him. It's the situational awareness. He also does not have the techniques with his throwing ability to be a top flight QB. Now that teams have taken away the bomb, he cannot sustain drives with the other parts of his passing ability (or lack thereof). I watched Ryan Leaf when he was with San Diego. How long did he last...a couple seasons? JP's overall game is no better than what i saw from Leaf.
stevewin Posted December 17, 2008 Posted December 17, 2008 This is where you are wrong. What JP lacks is something that even the best coaches cannot teach to him. It's the situational awareness. He also does not have the techniques with his throwing ability to be a top flight QB. Now that teams have taken away the bomb, he cannot sustain drives with the other parts of his passing ability (or lack thereof). I watched Ryan Leaf when he was with San Diego. How long did he last...a couple seasons? JP's overall game is no better than what i saw from Leaf. It's the exact reason Losman was labeled a coach-killer coming out of college - he has some athletic ability but it is the mental part of the game and intangibles that make good/great QBs - which he simply does not have and hasn't gotten after 5 years. At least most Losman fans have moved past some of the initial stages of QB grief - admitting he is not good "now". But they will always hold onto the 'proper coaching' excuse. If he can just go somewhere else and get proper coaching they say - then he'll be great. Then when that fails they will just go back to the old tired "he was mismanaged early in his career and that destroyed him for life" - which is the biggest load of crap I've ever heard. If you are good/decent you make plays - esp after being in the NFL for 5 yrs - at some point the onus is on the individual to have the skill and be able to put it together.
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