BuffaloBill Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 As my signature line says I live in Dallas. Listening to Cowgirl fans around the office, at church etc they do not sound much different than Bills fans - pissed off, complaining, blaming a meddling owner, poor coaching decisions, etc. The Cowgirls according to some should have it better (in reality they do not - have not won a playoff game in over 11 years): Cowgirls play in a very wealthy and growing city where idiots will pay outlandish amounts of money to build a stadium and buy tickets in it. Cowgirls have an owner that will throw money at coaches (Jason Garrett for example makes significantly more than Phillips) and at star players (Pacman, T.O., Romo come to mind). Cowgirls have a rich history - yes we all know they have won SB rings Point in all of this is to say there is a very fine line between winning and losing in the NFL - especially on a consistent basis. I believe that the Cheatriots (makes me sick) or maybe Pittsburgh or Tennessee probably represent the best models to follow: Consistency in head coach Front office that identifies and signs good talent through both the draft and FA An awareness of when to let players go (Bledsoe) - especially if you get good draft picks in exchange Proficiency, if not strength, in defense (ranked in top 1/3) A very good QB Good o-line and d-line A couple of star players but none of whom attract unwanted or negative attention Just a few thoughts so if the Bills really want to turn this around they have to figure out if they have any parts of that model in place and if not what they are going to do about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fewell733 Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 As my signature line says I live in Dallas. Listening to Cowgirl fans around the office, at church etc they do not sound much different than Bills fans - pissed off, complaining, blaming a meddling owner, poor coaching decisions, etc. The Cowgirls according to some should have it better (in reality they do not - have not won a playoff game in over 11 years): Cowgirls play in a very wealthy and growing city where idiots will pay outlandish amounts of money to build a stadium and buy tickets in it. Cowgirls have an owner that will throw money at coaches (Jason Garrett for example makes significantly more than Phillips) and at star players (Pacman, T.O., Romo come to mind). Cowgirls have a rich history - yes we all know they have won SB rings Point in all of this is to say there is a very fine line between winning and losing in the NFL - especially on a consistent basis. I believe that the Cheatriots (makes me sick) or maybe Pittsburgh or Tennessee probably represent the best models to follow: Consistency in head coach Front office that identifies and signs good talent through both the draft and FA An awareness of when to let players go (Bledsoe) - especially if you get good draft picks in exchange Proficiency, if not strength, in defense (ranked in top 1/3) A very good QB Good o-line and d-line A couple of star players but none of whom attract unwanted or negative attention Just a few thoughts so if the Bills really want to turn this around they have to figure out if they have any parts of that model in place and if not what they are going to do about it. spot on. Here in DC there is a lot of complaints about the Redskins and Jim Zorn. Their problems actually mirror our own in many ways: First year coordinator on offense, move the ball but have trouble scoring, young promising quarterback, very young receivers, tough division, and a defense that is good but not good enough to steal victories when the offense is really struggling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperKillerRobots Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 It's interesting to think about it this way. The Cowboys even had Parcells in there for a little while and still haven't won in the playoffs for nearly as long as the Bills. I also think that's a good list of commonalities for consistently good or competitive teams. Unfortunately, when you see that list, it really shows why we are in the position that we are in - I don't think we have any of those things currently. The only one that can be fixed quickly (coaching consistency) might be the worst option too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkady Renko Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 The only team with a worse situation for the fans is the Lions and that may not be the case with there being little concern of the Lions leaving Detroit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SageAgainstTheMachine Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 The only team with a worse situation for the fans is the Lions and that may not be the case with there being little concern of the Lions leaving Detroit. Why? There are plenty of teams worse than us right now, and we are far from being the only team to never win a superbowl. What makes us so special? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBill Posted December 10, 2008 Author Share Posted December 10, 2008 Why? There are plenty of teams worse than us right now, and we are far from being the only team to never win a superbowl. What makes us so special? Not many teams play in cities where they are likely to be uprooted and moved to LA or elsewhere. The catch 22 in all of this is that a key to retaining the team is continued fan loyalty as demonstrated through ticket sales. However are we to continue to buy tickets when the team is clearly non-competitive? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBill Posted December 10, 2008 Author Share Posted December 10, 2008 The only team with a worse situation for the fans is the Lions and that may not be the case with there being little concern of the Lions leaving Detroit. Sadly the truth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plenzmd1 Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 Why? There are plenty of teams worse than us right now, and we are far from being the only team to never win a superbowl. What makes us so special? Sage, I am not buying this argument. I say there is one, maybe two teams worse than us right now. I think KC and St Louis are about it in the"they are worse than us department". Do not let those 6 wins fool you, they were the mirage. This 1-7 skid is the real Bills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJ (not THAT RJ) Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 Sage, I am not buying this argument. I say there is one, maybe two teams worse than us right now. I think KC and St Louis are about it in the"they are worse than us department". Do not let those 6 wins fool you, they were the mirage. This 1-7 skid is the real Bills Thank you, Mr. Glass Half-Empty. You are entitled to your opinion, but I think the question of which are the "real Bills" is actually still open, even if things are pretty crappy now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All_Pro_Bills Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 Consistency in head coach Front office that identifies and signs good talent through both the draft and FA An awareness of when to let players go (Bledsoe) - especially if you get good draft picks in exchange Proficiency, if not strength, in defense (ranked in top 1/3) A very good QB Good o-line and d-line A couple of star players but none of whom attract unwanted or negative attention That's a good list and great insight summarizing those attributes. One I'd add is the use of a consistent and repeatable system in building your team and the approach to the game, which eliminates switching philosophies numerous time (e.g. the Steelers have followed basically the same approach for over 30 years). So onto the hard part, doing it. Look at each one of these winning attributes and ask what is keeping the Bills from embracing each of these qualities of a winning organization? For arguments sake I'd say its ownership and front office management failures. Look at coaching talent. Switch Jeff Fisher with Dick Juron and you'd tell yourself with a straight face that the Bills and Titans would both have the same records they have now with their current coach? Some will say funding in small markets vs. big markets is a factor. But I've never seen the results of an external of each NFL teams books so I suspect while a few teams are making an obscene amount of money the rest are doing pretty good too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkady Renko Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 Why? There are plenty of teams worse than us right now, and we are far from being the only team to never win a superbowl. What makes us so special? I say this because of our ongoing playoff futility. Other teams are worse this year, but only the Lions have as long a playoff drought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBill Posted December 10, 2008 Author Share Posted December 10, 2008 Sage, I am not buying this argument. I say there is one, maybe two teams worse than us right now. I think KC and St Louis are about it in the"they are worse than us department". Do not let those 6 wins fool you, they were the mirage. This 1-7 skid is the real Bills This is the most distressing part of the situation as I believe there are arguments either way. One, depends on whether Trent Edwards is really an NFL QB. At times he has shown the ability but too often he has shown the other. Two, I've come around to the idea that even if DJ remains at head coach (I believe Ralph gives him one more season) we must have a new offensive coordinator. Three, I believe we are close on defense - need better DE and linbacker depth. The problem with all of the above is the if Trent Edwards is not an NFL QB we have no depth and no other answers. A new OC has little to work with. I believe Lee Evans is probably a good #2 but not a guy that can carry the load and TE situation is abysmal. O-line - we must find a center. Problem is that I am not sure how all of this gets addressed in one off season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 The only team with a worse situation for the fans is the Lions and that may not be the case with there being little concern of the Lions leaving Detroit. Both franchises are led by woefully inept front offices, with terrible owners. Both have gone without a playoff appearance since 1999. I will say the Lions record of futility is even worse, considering they haven't won a playoff game since 1958. However, the complaints fans in most NFL cities are lodging aren't like ours. They're referring to a player or coach. We're talking about everything from owner to front office to coach to players. Nothing is excluded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plenzmd1 Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 Thank you, Mr. Glass Half-Empty. You are entitled to your opinion, but I think the question of which are the "real Bills" is actually still open, even if things are pretty crappy now. I am usuaully the half full guy, but you have to look at who we beat, who has beat us, and come to a resonable conclusion. Cleveland beat us on our home field. San Fran beat us on our home field. I say Oakalnd beats us if we play there instaed of here. But get ready for this cause here is the half full piece:: So I was thinking today how big a disapointment the Browns are to their fans this year. Everyone saying they underachieved. Well, they had a 2007 schedule similiar to ours this year. They win ten games, but all of their flaws are masked.They do not address major weaknesses. They tank this year because of it. The silver lining we have is that maybe the Bills could have 10 games and snuck into the playoffs with this schedule, but again their flaws would have been hidden. The way this year is ending, they are readily on display and can be addressed long term, therefore making us entrants to the playoffs for more than a one and done type thing(meaning both games and years) . Hows THAT for glass half full Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJ (not THAT RJ) Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 I am usuaully the half full guy, but you have to look at who we beat, who has beat us, and come to a resonable conclusion. Cleveland beat us on our home field. San Fran beat us on our home field. I say Oakalnd beats us if we play there instaed of here. But get ready for this cause here is the half full piece:: So I was thinking today how big a disapointment the Browns are to their fans this year. Everyone saying they underachieved. Well, they had a 2007 schedule similiar to ours this year. They win ten games, but all of their flaws are masked.They do not address major weaknesses. They tank this year because of it. The silver lining we have is that maybe the Bills could have 10 games and snuck into the playoffs with this schedule, but again their flaws would have been hidden. The way this year is ending, they are readily on display and can be addressed long term, therefore making us entrants to the playoffs for more than a one and done type thing(meaning both games and years) . Hows THAT for glass half full Now THAT is a position I can agree with! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 The only team with a worse situation for the fans is the Lions and that may not be the case with there being little concern of the Lions leaving Detroit. I'm with Sage. I was just chatting with my friend from Cincinatti the other day who is a big Bungles fan. He said in the last 19 years they've had 1 winning season. That year they went to playoffs and lost in the first round. Cardinals too up until this year have been a study in futility. I think there are a lot of teams as bad off as us besides Detroit. 49ers have been bad for quite a while. Texans have been in league only six years, but the division they play in, they may never make the playoffs. Saints have had a good run (sortof) lately but were miserable for years on end. Vikings have lost 4 Super Bowls too but haven't been close to one since the 1970s. Cheer up man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tcali Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 I am usuaully the half full guy, but you have to look at who we beat, who has beat us, and come to a resonable conclusion. Cleveland beat us on our home field. San Fran beat us on our home field. I say Oakalnd beats us if we play there instaed of here. But get ready for this cause here is the half full piece:: So I was thinking today how big a disapointment the Browns are to their fans this year. Everyone saying they underachieved. Well, they had a 2007 schedule similiar to ours this year. They win ten games, but all of their flaws are masked.They do not address major weaknesses. They tank this year because of it. The silver lining we have is that maybe the Bills could have 10 games and snuck into the playoffs with this schedule, but again their flaws would have been hidden. The way this year is ending, they are readily on display and can be addressed long term, therefore making us entrants to the playoffs for more than a one and done type thing(meaning both games and years) . Hows THAT for glass half full yeah i agree....this team could have snuck in 10 wins---and then they wouldnt really have addressed the staggering problems ...coulda been very Browns-like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 Here in DC there is a lot of complaints about the Redskins and Jim Zorn. Their problems actually mirror our own in many ways: First year coordinator on offense, move the ball but have trouble scoring, young promising quarterback, very young receivers, tough division, and a defense that is good but not good enough to steal victories when the offense is really struggling. And they had a good start and have now lost 4 out of the last 5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrFishfinder Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 Ths year, how many teams have started 5-1 and then lost 6 of the next 7 games and looked absolutely LOST doing it? At 5-1, just about everyone had the Bills winning the AFC East. They will most likely end up 6-10 after starting 5-1. At least the Lions and Bengals have looked putrid from the start. How can anyone explain or justify this monumental belly flop? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBill Posted December 10, 2008 Author Share Posted December 10, 2008 yeah i agree....this team could have snuck in 10 wins---and then they wouldnt really have addressed the staggering problems ...coulda been very Browns-like. Browns problems likely tied to Anderson going from probowl QB to horrible QB, bad coaching and star players attracting negative attention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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