thebandit27 Posted December 18, 2008 Posted December 18, 2008 Wrong. I'm just guessing, but I have to believe that three quarters of concessions has to be worth over a million dollars. A loss of that size definitely sends a message. And if he doesn't like that, where is he going to take the team. No city has the money right now to build a new stadium. We are both stuck with each other. Given that the vast majority of concessions sales (see: beer) occur before the game and during the first half (I'd say about 60-70 percent--at least that's how it was when I worked there), that affect will really be minimized. The only crowd that would be effective are those that get beer at halftime, but my semi-educated guess is that those folks aren't the ones that'll be leaving, so tell me again how you're hurting the team? And as to your other point, the economy may be tough on the every man, but the people with billions of dollars aren't feeling it like you and I are. They'll always find a way to invest in proven money-making ventures...don't hang your hat on the economy to save the team from moving.
BillsFan74 Posted December 18, 2008 Posted December 18, 2008 After reviewing the carnage on this website tonight, for the first time, I believe the core fans of this organization have had their collective backs broken! Being the core fans of the team, I think it would be balls move to organize a boycott of the last home game against the Patriots. Collect money and put a one page add in the Buffalo News; a message needs to be sent to our pathetic owner once and for all! Look we are all disappointed at this years results after the 5-1 start. But at the begining of the year all of the experts even the local papers said 8-8 or 9-7 still a young team another year or two away from the playoffs so please don't overreact. We need to improve our division play and learn how to play against a 3-4 defense which is all coaching. So if everybody wants to boycott and get the coach fired I can't really disagree. I'm wearing a paper bag on my head instead, but remember the glass is half full.
SwampD Posted December 18, 2008 Posted December 18, 2008 Given that the vast majority of concessions sales (see: beer) occur before the game and during the first half (I'd say about 60-70 percent--at least that's how it was when I worked there), that affect will really be minimized. The only crowd that would be effective are those that get beer at halftime, but my semi-educated guess is that those folks aren't the ones that'll be leaving, so tell me again how you're hurting the team? And as to your other point, the economy may be tough on the every man, but the people with billions of dollars aren't feeling it like you and I are. They'll always find a way to invest in proven money-making ventures...don't hang your hat on the economy to save the team from moving. Even a 5% loss would make a statement. As to your second point, when was the last time one of those billionaires payed for their own stadium? Even the Yankee's Evil Empire is begging NYC for more money to finish "their" new stadium.
BuffaloBaumer Posted December 18, 2008 Posted December 18, 2008 Look we are all disappointed at this years results after the 5-1 start. But at the begining of the year all of the experts even the local papers said 8-8 or 9-7 still a young team another year or two away from the playoffs so please don't overreact. We need to improve our division play and learn how to play against a 3-4 defense which is all coaching. So if everybody wants to boycott and get the coach fired I can't really disagree. I'm wearing a paper bag on my head instead, but remember the glass is half full. It does not matter what experts thought our record would be, it matters that our record would have been better if we did not have a coach that pulled the rug out from underneath the players feet. Jauron SINGLE HANDEDLY lost a MINIMUM of 2 games for these guys....It's sickening
Movinon Posted December 18, 2008 Posted December 18, 2008 Look we are all disappointed at this years results after the 5-1 start. But at the begining of the year all of the experts even the local papers said 8-8 or 9-7 still a young team another year or two away from the playoffs so please don't overreact. We need to improve our division play and learn how to play against a 3-4 defense which is all coaching. So if everybody wants to boycott and get the coach fired I can't really disagree. I'm wearing a paper bag on my head instead, but remember the glass is half full. Overreact? You have to be kidding me....this team is stuck in mediocrity. We've been a year or two away from the playoffs since 1999.
dickie do-right Posted December 18, 2008 Posted December 18, 2008 After reviewing the carnage on this website tonight, for the first time, I believe the core fans of this organization have had their collective backs broken! Being the core fans of the team, I think it would be balls move to organize a boycott of the last home game against the Patriots. Collect money and put a one page add in the Buffalo News; a message needs to be sent to our pathetic owner once and for all! what a moron !!!
drinkTHEkoolaid Posted December 18, 2008 Posted December 18, 2008 Overreact? You have to be kidding me....this team is stuck in mediocrity. We've been a year or two away from the playoffs since 1999. so true... i am SO SICK AND TIRED of ALWAYS being in a state of eternal rebuilding. im sick of saying "next year is our year" knowing full well they will let me down.... agian....
thebandit27 Posted December 18, 2008 Posted December 18, 2008 Even a 5% loss would make a statement. As to your second point, when was the last time one of those billionaires payed for their own stadium? Even the Yankee's Evil Empire is begging NYC for more money to finish "their" new stadium. Sorry, I made the mistake of assuming that you're aware that Jerry Jones financed almost all of the Cowboys' new $1.1B stadium. And don't say he's the only one that can, since (according to Forbes magazine) there's more billionaires in the United States now than there's ever been in our 200+ year history. The Yankee comparison is apples to oranges; a baseball team's profit margin isn't even close to that of an NFL team. This comparison is especially misplaced when you're talking about a team that spends $200M+ annually in player payrolll alone. No wonder they need money from the City. Also, sports teams routinely have local municipalities contribute tax money to the building of stadiums. This is done because they can share the revenue brought in from the new facility with the municipality, so that it becomes a source of income.
BuffaloBaumer Posted December 18, 2008 Posted December 18, 2008 2 minutes to go in the first quarter...2 minutes!!!! Have your tailgate, speak your voice in the first, then leave..... 2 Minutes
K-9 Posted December 18, 2008 Posted December 18, 2008 After reviewing the carnage on this website tonight, for the first time, I believe the core fans of this organization have had their collective backs broken! Being the core fans of the team, I think it would be balls move to organize a boycott of the last home game against the Patriots. Collect money and put a one page add in the Buffalo News; a message needs to be sent to our pathetic owner once and for all! what a moron !!! Yeah, that'll show 'em! Time to get the pitchforks and shovels and storm the Bastile known as One Bills Drive! GO BILLS!!!
SwampD Posted December 18, 2008 Posted December 18, 2008 Sorry, I made the mistake of assuming that you're aware that Jerry Jones financed almost all of the Cowboys' new $1.1B stadium. And don't say he's the only one that can, since (according to Forbes magazine) there's more billionaires in the United States now than there's ever been in our 200+ year history. The Yankee comparison is apples to oranges; a baseball team's profit margin isn't even close to that of an NFL team. This comparison is especially misplaced when you're talking about a team that spends $200M+ annually in player payrolll alone. No wonder they need money from the City. Also, sports teams routinely have local municipalities contribute tax money to the building of stadiums. This is done because they can share the revenue brought in from the new facility with the municipality, so that it becomes a source of income. That's what I was saying. But what municipality is going to approve tax hikes now. Arlington did it because it's already "Their" Cowboys. They were willing to pay more for their team just like we were for the Bills. I just don't see it happening anywhere else right now. And I'm not sure that I would call getting 325 million dollars from Arlington and another 150 million from the NFL as paying almost all. I think I would call it halvsies.
thebandit27 Posted December 18, 2008 Posted December 18, 2008 That's what I was saying. But what municipality is going to approve tax hikes now. Arlington did it because it's already "Their" Cowboys. They were willing to pay more for their team just like we were for the Bills. I just don't see it happening anywhere else right now. And I'm not sure that I would call getting 325 thousand dollars from Arlington and another 150 thousand from the NFL as paying almost all. I think I would call it halvsies. Do you mean thousand, or million? That's a big difference. Suppose he got 475 million from the NFL and Arlington, he still financed 625 million on his own. Now suppose that any billionaire that wanted an NFL team was willing to do the same, without the help from the NFL. On average, a new stadium costs between $700B and $900B. If a prospective new owner puts up 50% of that, say $450M, the local municipality (let's say in this case, a city) would have to come up with the same amount. Typically, a loan of this variety (i.e. given to a municipality for a public improvement project) would go for about 2 to 2.5% interest. Today, let's assume banks are being tight and say that they'd give it out at 8.5% interest expected a 30-year payback (which is extremely conservative). The annual cost to the city would be about $44.2M. Suppose said city had a population of ~1,000,000 people--which isn't unreasonable for a city that would be in contention for an NFL franchise--and suppose that only half of them pay taxes for one reason or another (age, citizenship, veteran status, etc.). The tax load on each individual taxpayer would be about $88.40 per annum. Or, in other words, a little over $7 per month in taxes for 30 years. Does that make it seem any more feasible?
SwampD Posted December 18, 2008 Posted December 18, 2008 Do you mean thousand, or million? That's a big difference. Suppose he got 475 million from the NFL and Arlington, he still financed 625 million on his own. Now suppose that any billionaire that wanted an NFL team was willing to do the same, without the help from the NFL. On average, a new stadium costs between $700B and $900B. If a prospective new owner puts up 50% of that, say $450M, the local municipality (let's say in this case, a city) would have to come up with the same amount. Typically, a loan of this variety (i.e. given to a municipality for a public improvement project) would go for about 2 to 2.5% interest. Today, let's assume banks are being tight and say that they'd give it out at 8.5% interest expected a 30-year payback (which is extremely conservative). The annual cost to the city would be about $44.2M. Suppose said city had a population of ~1,000,000 people--which isn't unreasonable for a city that would be in contention for an NFL franchise--and suppose that only half of them pay taxes for one reason or another (age, citizenship, veteran status, etc.). The tax load on each individual taxpayer would be about $88.40 per annum. Or, in other words, a little over $7 per month in taxes for 30 years. Does that make it seem any more feasible? Sorry...million, I already fixed that. Now I confused you. I know you meant million as well, not billion. I just don't see it happening because I actually think these are usually paid for with an increase in sales tax.(IIRC Erie county raised it .5% for the Ralph renovations...I don't think that's right but it was something like that) In any event, I just don't care anymore. I'm just tired of this threat being hung over our heads. I feel like a little kid playing with a toy and mom yelling from the other room,"If you boys don't behave then I'm going to come in there and take that toy away." Fans should be allowed to boycott, complain, anything they feel they have to do, without being told,"If that's the way you feel then maybe I'll just take my team where I'm appreciated." You know what, go ahead because I sure don't feel appreciated now.
BuffaloBaumer Posted December 19, 2008 Posted December 19, 2008 2 Minutes to go in the first quarter (I want my 2 dollars)!!!
Pass the Pipe Posted December 19, 2008 Author Posted December 19, 2008 so true... i am SO SICK AND TIRED of ALWAYS being in a state of eternal rebuilding. im sick of saying "next year is our year" knowing full well they will let me down.... agian.... Gentlemen, refer to the Dolphins. A trend is defined as a "general direction taken." The Bills are beyond that, they firmly have a correlation to losing approximating 1, which means direct correlation. Start and end with the front office.
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