JP 2006 age 25 vs. TE 2008 age 25

[murra]

Unless you're jsut a fantasy nerd, who cares if Edwards passes for a touchdown or Lynch runs it in??? Either way, we are scoring more points with TE under center.

 

And that ladies and gentlemen is the misconception that plagues these boards. This is news to me that we're scoring more points. Last time I checked we've our last three games offensively have produced 9, 10, and 10 points respectively. But you're right. We're scoring much more with Edwards, and I'm a fantasy nerd. It's shocking for someone living in a fantasy world to think someone else is a fantasy nerd.

[Randy O'Connell]

The post started out that they were both 25. You jumped 2 years for JP to 27. What were his stats at 25?

 

Let me clarify JP is born in 1981 and was 25 in 2006. TE is born in 1983 and is 25.

[Randy O'Connell]

I'm gonna defend myself, as I don't call myself flea. I've been to all the big games in the early 90's I watch all the games brother.

 

The issue is we need a QB who plays with emotion like Kelly or Favre. Edwards does nothing for us, the defensive coordinators around this league have figured him out.

 

At least Losman threw TDS! Trent Edwards in 2008, 7 TDS in 8 complete games. That's terrible.

[MartyBall4Buffalo]

I'm gonna defend myself, as I don't call myself flea. I've been to all the big games in the early 90's I watch all the games brother.

 

The issue is we need a QB who plays with emotion like Kelly or Favre. Edwards does nothing for us, the defensive coordinators around this league have figured him out.

 

At least Losman threw TDS! Trent Edwards in 2008, 7 TDS in 8 complete games. That's terrible.

 

 

first 18 games Losman vs Edwards first "19"

 

 

Losman-

 

452 attempts 251 completions 2838 yards 158ypg 55% completion pct at 6.3 ypa 15 tds 14 ints sacked 56 times 16 fumbles 8 lost. Sacked once every 8 pass attempts

 

 

Just using edwards career stats here, cause it seems kind of pointless to subtract 3 pass atempts in the ariozna game before he got injured

 

Edwards-

 

514 attempts 315 completions 3475 yards 183ypg 61.3% completion pct at 6.8ypa 14 tds 15 ints sacked 32 times 9 fumbles 4 lost. Sacked once every 16 pass attempts.

 

 

Not much difference stat wise. Except the "weaker armed" Edwards has more passing yards more ypg, at a higher ypa avg then mr. rocket arm, and gets sacked significantly less. Again I'm not excusing the last few games. Losing 3 divisional games in a row is killer. I have confidence he'll pick up his game. For a 3rd rd pick he's quite ahead of the curve. There's a lot of areas this team has to improve. I'm waiting another season before saying quarterback is one of them.

[FreakPop]

first 18 games Losman vs Edwards first "19"

 

 

Losman-

 

452 attempts 251 completions 2838 yards 158ypg 55% completion pct at 6.3 ypa 15 tds 14 ints sacked 56 times 16 fumbles 8 lost. Sacked once every 8 pass attempts

 

 

Just using edwards career stats here, cause it seems kind of pointless to subtract 3 pass atempts in the ariozna game before he got injured

 

Edwards-

 

514 attempts 315 completions 3475 yards 183ypg 61.3% completion pct at 6.8ypa 14 tds 15 ints sacked 32 times 9 fumbles 4 lost. Sacked once every 16 pass attempts.

 

 

Not much difference stat wise. Except the "weaker armed" Edwards has more passing yards more ypg, at a higher ypa avg then mr. rocket arm, and gets sacked significantly less. Again I'm not excusing the last few games. Losing 3 divisional games in a row is killer. I have confidence he'll pick up his game. For a 3rd rd pick he's quite ahead of the curve. There's a lot of areas this team has to improve. I'm waiting another season before saying quarterback is one of them.

 

Arguably Trent has had the benefit of a stable coaching staff, better oline, better wr and tight ends where JP did not. That said their numbers are pretty similar. If their numbers are pretty similar and you say Trent is "GOD" and JP blows your just a hypocrite.

[MartyBall4Buffalo]

Arguably Trent has had the benefit of a stable coaching staff, better oline, better wr and tight ends where JP did not. That said their numbers are pretty similar. If their numbers are pretty similar and you say Trent is "GOD" and JP blows your just a hypocrite.

 

other then the oline the situations are about the same. That's pretty questionable, with the apparant lack of a center, and rg. The horrible play of the interior in general. Jp Switched coaches. Edwards switched coordinators. Yes getting a whole new coaching staff is a complete restart from just switching coordinators. The talent level on offense is vastly the same. Evans, Josh Reed, roscoe parrish. The te situtation is not better at all. I dont know where you got that one from. Not much else. The difference from mcgahee-lynch production wise is almost nill. I never once called Edwards "god",or anything close. Never said JP "Blows" either . A poor mans Jake Plummer yes. "Blows" that's stretching it.

[Randy O'Connell]

other then the oline the situations are about the same. That's pretty questionable, with the apparant lack of a center, and rg. The horrible play of the interior in general. Jp Switched coaches. Edwards switched coordinators. Yes getting a whole new coaching staff is a complete restart from just switching coordinators. The talent level on offense is vastly the same. Evans, Josh Reed, roscoe parrish. The te situtation is not better at all. I dont know where you got that one from. Not much else. The difference from mcgahee-lynch production wise is almost nill. I never once called Edwards "god",or anything close. Never said JP "Blows" either . A poor mans Jake Plummer yes. "Blows" that's stretching it.

 

Is Edwards struggling - yes, is he making costly mistakes - yes, is his confidence waning - yes.

 

JP is playing out the final year of his rookie contract. He has nothing to lose, and everything to gain. He's not Brett Favre, nor is he Jake Plumber, he's JP Losman.

 

Most Bills fans don't like him for artificial reasons; I've heard he talks like a black guy and is 1/2 Mexican. He may not have as high of an "IQ" as Edwards, nor possess his mastery of the "possession game", but he did have a better season as a 25 year old if Edwards continues his downward spiral.

 

Why not give JP one last opportunity?

[SageAgainstTheMachine]

Is Edwards struggling - yes, is he making costly mistakes - yes, is his confidence waning - yes.

 

JP is playing out the final year of his rookie contract. He has nothing to lose, and everything to gain. He's not Brett Favre, nor is he Jake Plumber, he's JP Losman.

 

Most Bills fans don't like him for artificial reasons; I've heard he talks like a black guy and is 1/2 Mexican. He may not have as high of an "IQ" as Edwards, nor possess his mastery of the "possession game", but he did have a better season as a 25 year old if Edwards continues his downward spiral.

 

Why not give JP one last opportunity?

 

Have you talked to Edwards? Has he told you his confidence is waning?

 

And yes, Losman has nothing to lose and everything to gain if he is reinstated as a starter. However, Edwards is the QB of the future and he has everything to lose and nothing to gain from the same scenario.

[Adam]

We have scrubs playing center, right guard and right tackle right now. We have a midget punt returner playing Wr, a rookie playing WR and a horrible disappointment at TE that is losing playing time to first and second year guys. ESPN is beginning to talk about Trent's concussion (which I did weeks ago). We have one guy at DE who isn't a total scrub, and he hasn't been able to get on the field in weeks. Forget which QB you think we can win with- neither is going to win anything with the offensive and defensive lines we have.

 

FACT: You lose at the line of scrimmage you probably lose the game, and you don't pull out enough wins to make playoffs.

 

MY OPINION: If you play a young, stud QB with a concussion, you shouldn't be coaching in the NFL or anywhere else for that matter.

[MartyBall4Buffalo]

Is Edwards struggling - yes, is he making costly mistakes - yes, is his confidence waning - yes.

 

JP is playing out the final year of his rookie contract. He has nothing to lose, and everything to gain. He's not Brett Favre, nor is he Jake Plumber, he's JP Losman.

 

Most Bills fans don't like him for artificial reasons; I've heard he talks like a black guy and is 1/2 Mexican. He may not have as high of an "IQ" as Edwards, nor possess his mastery of the "possession game", but he did have a better season as a 25 year old if Edwards continues his downward spiral.

 

Why not give JP one last opportunity?

 

Why are you bringing up stuff like "He's 1/2 mexican or talks like a black guy" and throwing that at me? I never once said those things. Nor do I give a sh--. So please save that.

 

The guy blew his opportunity at the end of 06-07. In 3 of his last 5 games in 06 he struggled pretty bad against the chargers/titans/ravens then carried that over into 07 throughout training camp-preseason and into the first few weeks. Terrible @ home against denver then pitt. Before being injured in the ne game. Then when he was given back the job, and an opportunity to stamp his name on the job. He laid 3 more consecutive eggs against the dolphins/pats/jags. We all know there's talent there. His problem has been a serious lack of consistency, as well as seeing the whole field. He doesn't use the middle of the field well at all, and takes far too many sacks.

 

Why not give JP one last opportunity. Cause odds are pretty good he won't get it done. If this was a team that had a strong running game, with Edwards struggling on his own accord. I'd sorta see the point, and may question it myself. This however is a team with no running game, trying to find it's idenity. You don't make the same mistake the bills have made in the past. You stick with Edwards, and let him sink or swim on his own.

[MartyBall4Buffalo]

We have scrubs playing center, right guard and right tackle right now. We have a midget punt returner playing Wr, a rookie playing WR and a horrible disappointment at TE that is losing playing time to first and second year guys. ESPN is beginning to talk about Trent's concussion (which I did weeks ago). We have one guy at DE who isn't a total scrub, and he hasn't been able to get on the field in weeks. Forget which QB you think we can win with- neither is going to win anything with the offensive and defensive lines we have.

 

FACT: You lose at the line of scrimmage you probably lose the game, and you don't pull out enough wins to make playoffs.

 

MY OPINION: If you play a young, stud QB with a concussion, you shouldn't be coaching in the NFL or anywhere else for that matter.

 

 

I agree with most of this post. I'm not buying the concussion issue. He had arguably his past game after the bye week against the chargers. It's the lack of talent in the trenches that's hurting this team more then anything.

[C.Biscuit97]

And that ladies and gentlemen is the misconception that plagues these boards. This is news to me that we're scoring more points. Last time I checked we've our last three games offensively have produced 9, 10, and 10 points respectively. But you're right. We're scoring much more with Edwards, and I'm a fantasy nerd. It's shocking for someone living in a fantasy world to think someone else is a fantasy nerd.

 

Blah. If you seriously think Losman is better than Edwards, you really know nothing about football. That was the first start TE has ever thrown for 120 yards or fewer in a full start. Guess how many times Losman has accomplish that special number? Try 7 times.

 

Yeah, Losman is the way to go.

[Big Turk]

Here we go again. The problem is Trent clearly has the tools to get much better while JP does not....

[FreakPop]

Why are you bringing up stuff like "He's 1/2 mexican or talks like a black guy" and throwing that at me? I never once said those things. Nor do I give a sh--. So please save that.

 

The guy blew his opportunity at the end of 06-07. In 3 of his last 5 games in 06 he struggled pretty bad against the chargers/titans/ravens then carried that over into 07 throughout training camp-preseason and into the first few weeks. Terrible @ home against denver then pitt. Before being injured in the ne game. Then when he was given back the job, and an opportunity to stamp his name on the job. He laid 3 more consecutive eggs against the dolphins/pats/jags. We all know there's talent there. His problem has been a serious lack of consistency, as well as seeing the whole field. He doesn't use the middle of the field well at all, and takes far too many sacks.

 

Why not give JP one last opportunity. Cause odds are pretty good he won't get it done. If this was a team that had a strong running game, with Edwards struggling on his own accord. I'd sorta see the point, and may question it myself. This however is a team with no running game, trying to find it's idenity. You don't make the same mistake the bills have made in the past. You stick with Edwards, and let him sink or swim on his own.

 

 

Gee could the Chargers, Titans, Ravens, Steelers, Broncos, Jaguars, Patriots, Dolphins defenses have had something to do with it? I mean really, the guy struggled and looked bad against, what all top 10 defenses except the Fins. I mean c'mon Edwards looks good against weak teams and looks terrible against good teams. Edwards is no better than JP, it's just too bad some here refuse to see that.

[murra]

We have scrubs playing center, right guard and right tackle right now. We have a midget punt returner playing Wr, a rookie playing WR and a horrible disappointment at TE that is losing playing time to first and second year guys. ESPN is beginning to talk about Trent's concussion (which I did weeks ago). We have one guy at DE who isn't a total scrub, and he hasn't been able to get on the field in weeks. Forget which QB you think we can win with- neither is going to win anything with the offensive and defensive lines we have.

 

FACT: You lose at the line of scrimmage you probably lose the game, and you don't pull out enough wins to make playoffs.

 

MY OPINION: If you play a young, stud QB with a concussion, you shouldn't be coaching in the NFL or anywhere else for that matter.

 

For the last time, You're a !@#$ing idiot.

 

LINK!

[MartyBall4Buffalo]

Gee could the Chargers, Titans, Ravens, Steelers, Broncos, Jaguars, Patriots, Dolphins defenses have had something to do with it? I mean really, the guy struggled and looked bad against, what all top 10 defenses except the Fins. I mean c'mon Edwards looks good against weak teams and looks terrible against good teams. Edwards is no better than JP, it's just too bad some here refuse to see that.

 

The fact that Losman was already in the league for several years may have something to do with the coaching staffs decision to move on. The difference in stats is not much . I do think the rate of sacks is a big difference. Yes I do think Edwards moves better within the pocket then Losman, as well as seeing the whole field better. You want me to admit he's no better then JP thru their first 18 games. Ok thru their first 18 games. The difference between JP and Trent is nill. Except sacks, and completion pct and yards per attempt. Which Edwards is better. Losman has a stronger arm. Now do you feel better?

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

I agree he probably does have more physical talent, but that hardly makes a good GB. JP likely has more physical talent than Tom Brady too. More heart, no one knows the answer to that one including you! You compare 2006 because in your mind there is something magical about them being the same age so that means something. What relavance that has, I have no idea other than it means he must have joined the Bills at an earlier age than TE. What was JP's second year compared to this year? 8 TD's /8 int played 9 games. The problem with JP is he wasn't improving. Last year prior to him getting hurt he had 97 yards and 154 yards in two games 0 TD, 1 int 6 sacks. I don't recall alot about early last seaosn, but I think by the second game people we calling for JP to be benched.

 

And BTW this is coming from a JP supporter. I'll make the same argument for him as I make now for TE, you need to give the person time. The problem with JP was time didn't help him get better. You could be right about TE, odds are in your favor as there are way more flops at QB than successes. But he needs more than 2 seasons to answer that.

 

Not counting his rookie year JP had three years and showed nothing.. Granted he was jerked around, but there was a reason for it, he was playing terrible. If he were getting 200 yards per game, even meathead wouldn't have yanked him. In the last 2 games he started in early 2005 before getting yanked, he threw for 75 yards in each game and had a rating in the low 30's. So tell me which of TE's games have been anywhere near that poor? In one game that year he had more than 200 yards and that was in the Miami game where he had the three TD's to Evans. Other than that, nothing and he started the 2007 series looking about the same. He had one terrific game last year angaisnt Cinny, then looked terrible again afterwards. You compare him to Eli in 2006, well Eli did have a very good 2007 where as JP again was terrible in the 9 games he did play.

 

Finally what possible good could be gained from giving JP "one last shot" as you suggest? What if he lights it up for the rest of the year? That would be great for him as he'd likely get a decent contract as a free agent, but do you honestly believe he's sign with the Bills after all that's happened? So if he playes great the next two games, do you offer him a 5 year contract then, because you know if he plays out the contract, he's gone. Would you give him a big contract after seeing him play two games as that would likely be the only chance you'd have of signing him and even then I think JP would say no, I'll take my chances playing out the year.

 

 

 

JP Losman has more heart and physical talent than TE ever will. If it wasn't for a cheap Vince Wilfork hit to the knee last year TE wouldn't even be talked about. TE was an experiment, a 3rd rounder with 3rd round talent. Supposedly Bill Walsh said he'd be a good one according to Marv Levy. Let's give our first rounder one last shot, before it's too late. I guarantee ya'll one thing, he won't be afraid. If you were to compare JP Losman's stats to Eli Manning's in 2006 you'd be surprised.

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

You're right, in TE's 2nd year, he doesn't look any better than JP did after 4 years!

 

I argued in 2005 and 2005 that JP, nmeeded more time to develop and I'll make the same argument now for TE. The problem with JP was he never did improve. You could be right about TE, odds are in your favor as there are way more flops at QB than successes. But he needs more than 2 seasons to answer that.

 

Gee could the Chargers, Titans, Ravens, Steelers, Broncos, Jaguars, Patriots, Dolphins defenses have had something to do with it? I mean really, the guy struggled and looked bad against, what all top 10 defenses except the Fins. I mean c'mon Edwards looks good against weak teams and looks terrible against good teams. Edwards is no better than JP, it's just too bad some here refuse to see that.

[deep2evans]

Edwards is no better than JP, it's just too bad some here refuse to see that.

 

What the !@#$? How can you be so willing to just conclude that? Are you saying that I SHOULD recognize this seemingly obvious fact but I refuse to admit it or something? What a huge bunch of bullsh1t. Sorry guy if I want to believe that Trent has the tools to be a great QB. He has started a little over a full season, but we are all stupid by REFUSING to admit that Trent sucks. You truly are an idiot.

[bizell]

Why are you bringing up stuff like "He's 1/2 mexican or talks like a black guy" and throwing that at me? I never once said those things. Nor do I give a sh--. So please save that.

 

The guy blew his opportunity at the end of 06-07. In 3 of his last 5 games in 06 he struggled pretty bad against the chargers/titans/ravens then carried that over into 07 throughout training camp-preseason and into the first few weeks. Terrible @ home against denver then pitt. Before being injured in the ne game. Then when he was given back the job, and an opportunity to stamp his name on the job. He laid 3 more consecutive eggs against the dolphins/pats/jags. We all know there's talent there. His problem has been a serious lack of consistency, as well as seeing the whole field. He doesn't use the middle of the field well at all, and takes far too many sacks.

 

Why not give JP one last opportunity. Cause odds are pretty good he won't get it done. If this was a team that had a strong running game, with Edwards struggling on his own accord. I'd sorta see the point, and may question it myself. This however is a team with no running game, trying to find it's idenity. You don't make the same mistake the bills have made in the past. You stick with Edwards, and let him sink or swim on his own.

 

actually, losman & the bills had a good game against the flaming thumbtacks. that's when robert royal decided to test out his long-striding and snatch defeat from the jaws of victory in a game that we should have won.