bdelma Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 I'd like to see what Fisher would do with this team! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebug Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 I'd like to see what Fisher would do with this team! For starters he would make sure the refs knew he wanted a challenge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 If you're game planning against Bills, who keeps you up at night? Evans on offense, and it's easy to double him. And then what? Nothing. Same for defense: what player does the opposing offense have to make sure they contain? No one. well, here is where the problems start. Peters was a pro-bowl LT last year. I have a hard time believing he has suddenly turned into a player that sucks. Dockery was one of the best run blocking guards in the NFL with the Redskins---he was called a "road grader" by scouts, which is basically the highest compliment you can give a run blocking guard. Now I am to believe that he suddenly sucks and cannot block at all with the Bills. Lynch spends all day trying to run the ball into a wall of defensive linemen because we can't open any holes for him. Lynch is a top 10 RB in this league, and its actually amazing he gets as many yards as he does, mostly on his own. Jackson is one of the better backup RBs in the NFL. Both are pretty good pass catchers out of the backfield or lined up in the slot. Edwards will be a top flight QB in this league, but is struggling mightily lately because of poor play design, a non-existent running game, and pass protection that seems clueless. Doesn't help that he has played poorly himself at the same time. Evans is a top flight WR and one of the best deep threats in the NFL, when we decide to throw him the ball. Parrish should be uncoverable in the slot--he is not being utilized to his potential, IMHO. Tight ends just suck, no debate there as do our Center-du-jour and Right Guard. Walker played much better last year and I thought was pretty good---this year not so much. Defensively our scheme calls for everyone to drop deep into coverage and not let the opposition get behind you. It basically sucks. We turn playmakers into chase and tacklers, and give them absolutely zero chance to make any type of plays, since all the opponents are catching the ball in front of them, they have no plays on the ball. We line up at corner and play 20 yards off the ball, then can't understand why other teams get first down after first down when they catch the ball and not a defender is in sight. Stroud has done the job we brought him here to do. He has vastly improved our run defense, improving from 4.4 YPC to 3.7 YPC. Today the Pats ran 43 times for 144 yards---3.3 YPC. We held the vaunted duo of Brown and Williams to 1.9 YPC. Teams are not running wild on us at all this year---we have only allowed 6 20 yard runs and 0 40 yard runs. The problem is that we put ourselves in good position at 3rd and 6 and 3rd and 7, then watch as the pass rush is non-existent and the coverage is softer than a pillow, which allows teams to easily convert. Poz, Mitchell, Whitner, Schobel are all above-average players at their positions in the league---some have said Whitner is turning into an all-pro. McGee and Greer are both pretty solid CB's. Saying these players all suck, when all the other national media members are saying they don't and are very talented, just makes you look like you are clueless....plenty of teams every year make the playoffs with a lot less talented roster than we have this year... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tcali Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 right...every year we never have any talent. I can tell you our talent is better than Miami's. I can tell you that its probably better than the Jets. I can tell you that at a lot of positions, its probably better than the Pats too---lets see, they had their backup QB who before this year hadn't started a game since HS, their 5th!!! string RB who shredded us, a secondary that has 0 impact players in it right now with the loss of Harrison, and were without their best LB in Adalius Thomas most of the game today. And yet they still found a way to create matchup problems for the Bills, and the Bills once again did not. That is the same song and dance every week it seems. Bills have the ability to create some really tough matchups on opponents(Parrish on a 3rd CB or safety, Jackson/Lynch on a LB in the slot, Evans on way subpar secondaries---like bottom 5 secondaries 2 of the last 3 weeks in Dolphins and Pats), but never do, while the Bills defense should be able to prevent offenses from completing 50 short passes in a row against us, but never can because they play 20 yards off them and aren't even in the picture half the time when the receivers catch the ball. What makes it worse is this team is actually pretty decent at stopping the run and forcing teams into 3rd and longs. Our special teams should cause matchup problems for teams, but all of a sudden Parrish refuses to return a punt, fair catching everything in sight. Talent is NOT the problem with this team. They have enough talent to certainly play better than they have been. Last year was a team with not enough talent, with 3rd stringers all over the place. Kansas City, Detroit, Oakland, Miami(yes Miami), Rams, Seahawks(mostly due to injuries), 49ers. Those are teams with not enough talent. There is a big difference between just not being good enough and being good enough and playing horrible. We are good enough and are playing horrible, which is what makes it so frustrating. We are coaching horrible. We are coaching scared. We refuse to take any chances. We have no faith in the players in any game situation(3rd and 1 passes, repeatedly punting inside the opponents 40 yard line all day, DB's playing 20 yards off the receivers). We are coaching dumb and not learning anything from previous games. Fewell has had 4 teams do the same thing to us and has watched 4 opposing defenses use various ways to prevent us from doing the same thing to them. Common sense would tell you to look at what they are doing and then implement some things, but I guess that is asking too much. I guess its also asking too much from Schonert to figure out how the opponents are getting so wide open and creating matchup problems for us on defense and to do the same things. Talent is losing games 47-3 like the Rams because you just aren't good enough. Losing 24-0 and gaining 77 total yards in the game is being not good enough like the Raiders last week. Going 1-8 and 0-9 like the Bengals and the Lions and getting blown out in a lot of those games is not being good enough. Lets stop this nonsense the Bills don't have the talent. The talent is there, it needs to be utilized better and the players need to execute better. Is there any doubt that Jeff Fisher or Bill Bellichick could take this same team and be 8-1 or 7-2 with them?? I have none. This coaching staff needs to step up and stop allowing themselves and their players to continue to accept these piss poor performances.... The talent is NOT there on the lines---where it counts. Don't delude yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 Lets stop this nonsense the Bills don't have the talent. The talent is there, it needs to be utilized better and the players need to execute better. Is there any doubt that Jeff Fisher or Bill Bellichick could take this same team and be 8-1 or 7-2 with them?? I have none. This coaching staff needs to step up and stop allowing themselves and their players to continue to accept these piss poor performances.... When DJ's previous HC experience in Chicago is brought up, they cite a lack of talent for him not being more successful. They'll say Jerry Angelo wanted him gone, etc, etc, etc. The reality is, DJ had personnel control those first two seasons and went 6-10 and 5-11. That "magical" 2001 season DJ had was in reality a mirage, considering they went 4-12 and 7-9 for 02 and 03 respectively. DJ has a team with a decent amount of talent. Granted, there are no superstars, but there are some decent players who take the field. Buffalo went 7-9 in 06 and 07. If they finish 7-9, 8-8, or 9-7 this year, it won't matter how much talent took the field. The final result will be remarkably similar to the rebuilding seasons of 06 and 07. And I blame a lack of innovative coaching, a hallmark of DJ's first swing through the HC ranks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 No team has talent left when they are down to 3rd stringers and undrafted free agents. New England has plenty of injuries. Just as many as Buffalo has. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 When DJ's previous HC experience in Chicago is brought up, they cite a lack of talent for him not being more successful. They'll say Jerry Angelo wanted him gone, etc, etc, etc. The reality is, DJ had personnel control those first two seasons and went 6-10 and 5-11. That "magical" 2001 season DJ had was in reality a mirage, considering they went 4-12 and 7-9 for 02 and 03 respectively. People don't like to read that fact. DJ has a team with a decent amount of talent. Granted, there are no superstars, but there are some decent players who take the field. I wonder if the "this team has no talent" people recall the Bills have been drafting near the top of the draft and remember that this is year 3 of a wholesale gutting and rebuild project. Three years is a long time in the modern NFL to put something together. Look how far the Falcons and Redskins have come in a matter of a couple months. Buffalo went 7-9 in 06 and 07. If they finish 7-9, 8-8, or 9-7 this year, it won't matter how much talent took the field. The final result will be remarkably similar to the rebuilding seasons of 06 and 07. And I blame a lack of innovative coaching, a hallmark of DJ's first swing through the HC ranks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 I disagree. We have talent. We have so much talent that we let go of players that become great players for other teams. What we have are coaches that can't coach, especially the O-line. I used to scream about Mouse McNally and his human turnstiles, but he's gone and we are not one lick better. PTR Agreed...Talent is no longer the problem in Buffalo...Clean up the REAL stupid mistakes vs. Miami and NY and this Team could easily be 7-2...This Team is simply ill-prepared vs. well Coached Teams...And the interior lines have flat out underachieved most of the year...But even with that The Bills should be 7-2 right now...So it's impossible for Me to say it's a talent problem any longer...It's a between-the-ears thing starting with the HC and filtering down to the Players... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heels20X6 Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 Lets stop this nonsense the Bills don't have the talent. The talent is there, it needs to be utilized better and the players need to execute better. Is there any doubt that Jeff Fisher or Bill Bellichick could take this same team and be 8-1 or 7-2 with them?? I have none. This coaching staff needs to step up and stop allowing themselves and their players to continue to accept these piss poor performances.... I would like to see any of the pro-Jauron crowd tell me that a better coach like Fisher, Belichek or John Fox would be at 5-4 right now. Our coaching staff is outright embarassing and their terrible coaching is what is derailing this team and stripping it of its identity and confidence. I'd hate to say it, but maybe the Bills need to have a monumental collapse before ol' Mr. Wilson decides he's had enough of Dick Jauron's Small Ball Incorporated™. Sadly, even if the Bills were to finish 5-11, I don't see Ralph absorbing 3 years of his contract. What a horribly bone-headed decision it was to extend this guy. And I hate to say it...but maybe Fairchild wasn't the problem after all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 And I hate to say it...but maybe Fairchild wasn't the problem after all. That game against BYU was a shootout... http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/clubhouse?teamId=36 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 right...every year we never have any talent. I can tell you our talent is better than Miami's. I can tell you that its probably better than the Jets. I can tell you that at a lot of positions, its probably better than the Pats too---lets see, they had their backup QB who before this year hadn't started a game since HS, their 5th!!! string RB who shredded us, a secondary that has 0 impact players in it right now with the loss of Harrison, and were without their best LB in Adalius Thomas most of the game today. And yet they still found a way to create matchup problems for the Bills, and the Bills once again did not. That is the same song and dance every week it seems. Bills have the ability to create some really tough matchups on opponents(Parrish on a 3rd CB or safety, Jackson/Lynch on a LB in the slot, Evans on way subpar secondaries---like bottom 5 secondaries 2 of the last 3 weeks in Dolphins and Pats), but never do, while the Bills defense should be able to prevent offenses from completing 50 short passes in a row against us, but never can because they play 20 yards off them and aren't even in the picture half the time when the receivers catch the ball. What makes it worse is this team is actually pretty decent at stopping the run and forcing teams into 3rd and longs. Our special teams should cause matchup problems for teams, but all of a sudden Parrish refuses to return a punt, fair catching everything in sight. Talent is NOT the problem with this team. They have enough talent to certainly play better than they have been. Last year was a team with not enough talent, with 3rd stringers all over the place. Kansas City, Detroit, Oakland, Miami(yes Miami), Rams, Seahawks(mostly due to injuries), 49ers. Those are teams with not enough talent. There is a big difference between just not being good enough and being good enough and playing horrible. We are good enough and are playing horrible, which is what makes it so frustrating. We are coaching horrible. We are coaching scared. We refuse to take any chances. We have no faith in the players in any game situation(3rd and 1 passes, repeatedly punting inside the opponents 40 yard line all day, DB's playing 20 yards off the receivers). We are coaching dumb and not learning anything from previous games. Fewell has had 4 teams do the same thing to us and has watched 4 opposing defenses use various ways to prevent us from doing the same thing to them. Common sense would tell you to look at what they are doing and then implement some things, but I guess that is asking too much. I guess its also asking too much from Schonert to figure out how the opponents are getting so wide open and creating matchup problems for us on defense and to do the same things. Talent is losing games 47-3 like the Rams because you just aren't good enough. Losing 24-0 and gaining 77 total yards in the game is being not good enough like the Raiders last week. Going 1-8 and 0-9 like the Bengals and the Lions and getting blown out in a lot of those games is not being good enough. Lets stop this nonsense the Bills don't have the talent. The talent is there, it needs to be utilized better and the players need to execute better. Is there any doubt that Jeff Fisher or Bill Bellichick could take this same team and be 8-1 or 7-2 with them?? I have none. This coaching staff needs to step up and stop allowing themselves and their players to continue to accept these piss poor performances.... Good post, but the Jets are definitely more talented than the Bills - better D-line by far, better o-line by far, better QB (at this point), and probably a better RB. Also, Revis is a better CB than anyone on the Bills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truth on hold Posted November 11, 2008 Author Share Posted November 11, 2008 Good post, but the Jets are definitely more talented than the Bills - better D-line by far, better o-line by far, better QB (at this point), and probably a better RB. Also, Revis is a better CB than anyone on the Bills. that's what i'm trying to say. and it's why i've been asking why so many fans thought bills could just show up and beat jets last week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheChimp Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 I do like a good bunch of our players a whole lot, and think that we are in decent shape with many positions on the team, but some of the guys we have paid a great deal of money for are so seriously overrated it isn't funny. And overPAID, by TONS of money. Dockery and Walker need to go or restructure their contracts for far less money. Jason Peters doesn't deserve a single extra dime over what he's getting paid. Schobel and Denney should be shopped for guys who can actually get to the passer. Basically, every position but our Offensive and Defensive Lines are a shambles, and that is, ironically, where a TON of the team's money is concentrated. Seeing what their collective failures are doing to the team this season, it shouldn't be hard for a new coaching staff to see their way to trading or cutting these guys and rebuilding through the draft. Jauron, Fewell, Turk, and their Line Coaches need to go, though. For any of this to happen, they need to be out of here, I think. Especially Jauron. He stinks. And he's getting WORSE as a coach, not better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ans4e64 Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 apparently the Pats still do, cause every year when their 7th and 8th string CB's are starting and they have a 5th string RB piling up 100 yards rushing, they keep on winning.... maybe its just that their coaches know how to coach to their players strengths and limit their players weaknesses better than others... So when players are injured and it comes down to coaching, are you really going to say that Jauron should still win because the one of the best coaches this game has ever seen (Belichick) can win with no one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 So when players are injured and it comes down to coaching, are you really going to say that Jauron should still win because the one of the best coaches this game has ever seen (Belichick) can win with no one? Trying to measure someone against those that are clearly inferior is a pointless waste of time. It's what they do against equal and better competition that really shows their mettle and the progress being made. That's why it is impressive when the Dolphins and Falcons soundly beat teams, any teams, and much less so when the bumbling Bills manage to squeak one out against the Raiders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffOrange Posted November 11, 2008 Share Posted November 11, 2008 You still are misunderstanding your own words. Talent. Equals Potential---how good these players SHOULD be under equal circumstances. Are you saying that Bill Bellichick or Jeff Fisher could take this same Bills team and they still would only be 5-4? I highly, highly doubt it. Talent is not the same as how a player is playing right now. Those are 2 totally different things. You seem to think that talent means if a player sucks right now, he just sucks. I think it depends on how he is being utilized, his level of confidence, and other players on the team. That in no way tells me how talented a player is. If Adrian Petersen is held to 10 yards on 7 carries in a game, does that mean he has no talent because he sucked today---likely because the other team loaded up to stop him? No, it just means their gameplan didn't work today. Right now, we are having way too many days when the Bills gameplans aren't working---probably because they have been the same gameplan for the last 5 weeks.... I agree insomuch as I like Lynch/Jackson better than Jones/Washington under equal circumstances. I'd also call WR a push despite Cotchery being way better than our WR2 since Evans is the only WR on either team that keeps a DC up at night. I also like our Special Teams better. So maybe instead of Jets +4 it's Jets +1, in which case we should've been favored to beat them in our stadium. That we didn't do that has a lot to do with a 92 yard pick 6 which happens less than once per season. I don't think any of this defeats the basic point that a lot of us overrate the talent on this football team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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