SDS Posted November 19, 2008 Posted November 19, 2008 what a dumb post just as dumb as someone claiming that cutting salary on "newly hired" employees in a bloated industry ready to layoff a bazillion people is "making an effort".
pBills Posted November 19, 2008 Posted November 19, 2008 just as dumb as someone claiming that cutting salary on "newly hired" employees in a bloated industry ready to layoff a bazillion people is "making an effort". That move and others SAVES the company billions of dollars. So YES it does help.
John Adams Posted November 19, 2008 Posted November 19, 2008 You guys are so cute together. There is blame to go around. The UAW is insane and though maybe not outdated (I just said that to make you feel better pbills), its demands are. Management has made plenty of mistakes too. Too many brands. Too many dealers. Poor choices of product lines. Both the UAW and management let quality drop into the shitter for 20 years. Even though things are better now, Detroit pays heavily for that failing and will take a long time to win customers back. If I even considered buying American, I have no idea what is good anymore and what is still crap. The CEO's pay means nothing in this mess. Where management screwed up is vision.
pBills Posted November 19, 2008 Posted November 19, 2008 You guys are so cute together. There is blame to go around. The UAW is insane and though maybe not outdated (I just said that to make you feel better pbills), its demands are. Management has made plenty of mistakes too. Too many brands. Too many dealers. Poor choices of product lines. Both the UAW and management let quality drop into the shitter for 20 years. Even though things are better now, Detroit pays heavily for that failing and will take a long time to win customers back. If I even considered buying American, I have no idea what is good anymore and what is still crap. The CEO's pay means nothing in this mess. Where management screwed up is vision. 110% right. And I do feel better now. :-)
Joe Miner Posted November 19, 2008 Posted November 19, 2008 That move and others SAVES the company billions of dollars. So YES it does help. Band Aid on a bullet wound
pBills Posted November 19, 2008 Posted November 19, 2008 Band Aid on a bullet wound It's something... it's a start.
John Adams Posted November 19, 2008 Posted November 19, 2008 110% right. And I do feel better now. :-) Unfortunately, vision has to be shared within the company. At Toyota facilities, "kaizen" is a word mentioned frequently. The word means "continuous improvement" and is a key factor in Toyota quality. Not only does management get this; so do manufacturing workers. Do you think the UAW and Detroit management share a vision like that? No chance.
molson_golden2002 Posted November 19, 2008 Posted November 19, 2008 I think we should bail them out. And then experiement with a government controll board situation. It's worth a try. Just letting them fall can't happen. I notice our southern "friends" with their foreign car companies are trying to kill those American companies. Very interesting and I hope favors are paid back with interest.
IDBillzFan Posted November 19, 2008 Posted November 19, 2008 I think we should bail them out. And then experiement with a government controll board situation. Why do people on the left always think that the answer to the world's problems is to increase the size and involvement of government?
finknottle Posted November 19, 2008 Posted November 19, 2008 It's something... it's a start. A start of many repeated bailouts, you mean. Nobody has addressed what is to me the most obvious point: the burn rate. The big two each went through almost $7 billion in cash last quarter. An impressive turnaround would cut that to $4 billion. If they achieved that overnight, then the extra $25 billion would last 9 months. What then? How do you go from losing $7 billion dollars a quarter to profitibility in 9 months?
finknottle Posted November 19, 2008 Posted November 19, 2008 I think we should bail them out. And then experiement with a government controll board situation. It's worth a try. Just letting them fall can't happen. I notice our southern "friends" with their foreign car companies are trying to kill those American companies. Very interesting and I hope favors are paid back with interest. Because auto workers in the south don't count? Is it because they are in red states?
SDS Posted November 19, 2008 Posted November 19, 2008 How do you go from losing $7 billion dollars a quarter to profitibility in 9 months? You cut the pay of the zero new workers hired in that time frame. That should save BILLIONS... BILLIONS I tell ya!
pBills Posted November 19, 2008 Posted November 19, 2008 You cut the pay of the zero new workers hired in that time frame. That should save BILLIONS... BILLIONS I tell ya! Condescending. Very nice and expected. I guess the one I haven't heard you as you attempt to mock. Is what would you do?
IDBillzFan Posted November 19, 2008 Posted November 19, 2008 Because auto workers in the south don't count? Is it because they are in red states? I think that since UAW worked so hard to get Obama/Biden elected, it's time for UAW and all its members to fall in lock step and start redistributing their wealth. It’s time to be patriotic. Time to jump in, time to be part of the deal, time to help get America out of the rut.
molson_golden2002 Posted November 19, 2008 Posted November 19, 2008 Because auto workers in the south don't count? Is it because they are in red states? If their representatives are going to act in the interest of foreign industrialists then I'd punish them right back.
molson_golden2002 Posted November 19, 2008 Posted November 19, 2008 Why do people on the left always think that the answer to the world's problems is to increase the size and involvement of government? I'm not saying its the answer, but I'm willing to try. It will cost alot if we go the "anti-government" route anyway, so let's try. I realize its a tough up hill fight, but I'd be willing to do it to preserve our industrialbase, jobs and the economy as a whole. There are foreign comapnies out there using southern scum to do their bidding for them and leading the fight to kill jobs in northern states and I think American jobs are worth fight for.
finknottle Posted November 19, 2008 Posted November 19, 2008 If their representatives are going to act in the interest of foreign industrialists then I'd punish them right back. The workers there have not chosen to unionize. Perhaps they felt that that would ultimately help secure their jobs by keeping their companies more competative than, say, GM and Ford. They made the rigjht call. Let's punish them!
finknottle Posted November 19, 2008 Posted November 19, 2008 I'm not saying its the answer, but I'm willing to try. It will cost alot if we go the "anti-government" route anyway, so let's try. I realize its a tough up hill fight, but I'd be willing to do it to preserve our industrialbase, jobs and the economy as a whole. There are foreign comapnies out there using southern scum to do their bidding for them and leading the fight to kill jobs in northern states and I think American jobs are worth fight for. Btw, you would be surprised how many of the 'southern scum' are northern transplants fleeing the failed economic policies of the rustbelt. They know that there will never be an economic future in the states that are burdened by high taxes and high entitlements.
SDS Posted November 19, 2008 Posted November 19, 2008 I'm not saying its the answer, but I'm willing to try. It will cost alot if we go the "anti-government" route anyway, so let's try. I realize its a tough up hill fight, but I'd be willing to do it to preserve our industrialbase, jobs and the economy as a whole. There are foreign comapnies out there using southern scum to do their bidding for them and leading the fight to kill jobs in northern states and I think American jobs are worth fight for. Just to be clear - the fight you are willing to wage is one backed by the coming tax increases on the higher-income earners of America. How noble. as for "southern scum"... you are a real piece of work.
IDBillzFan Posted November 19, 2008 Posted November 19, 2008 Btw, you would be surprised how many of the 'southern scum' are northern transplants fleeing the failed economic policies of the rustbelt. They know that there will never be an economic future in the states that are burdened by high taxes and high entitlements. And it's been that way for years. As a NY Italian living in North Carolina for six years, I could barely go through a month without someone making jokes about yankees and the War of Northern Aggression, etc., with the prevailing hicktown holler being "Yankee Go Home." After a couple of years, I started to realize that if, in fact, all the yankees DID go home, a good part of the south would find itself unemployed, broke, technologically disadvantaged, and very much alone with their one contribution to the world; growing marijuana.
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