ddaryl Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 completely retarded to even bring that up at this point. Rookies can take a year or 2. There are not to many CB's and WR's that light it up their rookie seasons. Anyone calling Hardy, Ellis or McKelvin a bust are typical negative nancy dimwits that roam these boards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cotton Fitzsimmons Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 It's too early to label any of the 3 as a bust, but they've definitely not contributed to the extent that we had, obviously, hoped for. While, in time, they could certainly turn it around, I'd definitely say they've been disappointing. McKelvin, aside from a couple of decent returns here and there, has reminded me more of Chris Watson than anything. He just seems slow and doesn't make people miss. Hardy, we all suspected, would be a project. When we drafted him, I felt like he could turn into a prolific weapon in time, or he could be out of the league in a couple of years. He clearly has a lot to learn about the pro game and needs to refine his route running, but again... that's nothing more than what we expected when we drafted him. Ellis must not be at all ready to play at this level, or obviously he would at least be on the active roster on game day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thoner7 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Everyone is hard on Hardy. Of the three He has proven the most to me. He has shown flashes of what he can do but hasnt come around yet. Wr is tough and he was not in an NFL type system in college. He would have easily scored a TD this week if the ball was thrown 5-8 yards further like it should have been. He got behing the corner and would have easily connected. Secondly on 4-5 plays that I saw, the jets were doubling Hardy on his routes, presumably because of his size/presence. This allowed Parrish and Evans to get open easily on a few routes. I think he will come around just fine. remeber Plaxico had a big "bust" of a rookie season. Mckelvin scares me. He was the 11th player taken, so I expect more. But last game when Whitner was out for a few plays, the coaches but Corner over Mckelvin. Whitner had been moving up to play the nickle corner up untill that point in the game as Youboty was out with injury. This makes me believe that our depth chart at corner is Mcgee, Greer, Youboty, Whitner (with Scott and Simpson at saftey), Corner, Mckelvin. Is Mcelvin that bad? He was not in good position on the handful of TD's he has allowed this year, and has looked even worse is his pursiut angles and tackling. Hardy will be fine, Mckelvin I dont have much hope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deep2evans Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 This way way way way too premature for posts like this. I want to see them all go through a full offseason training as a pro before I even begin to pass judgement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cale Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 It's a completely stupid topic because You can't judge a Rookie in his 1st Year at almost any Position...Comparing McKelvin to Devin Hester? Are You freaking kidding Me? I know some Scouts had lofty expectations of His Kick Return Skills...But anyone with even a bit of common sense is not going to compare McKelvin to Hester...UGH!!! Denny and Kelsey are not Rookies so I have no idea how they got into this topic...Ellis has barely played...Hardy is a WR...Check just about any Rookie WR's numbers in league History and they will not be overly impressive... Have you looked at Eddie Royal, De Sean Jackson and Donnie Avery's numbers recently? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SageAgainstTheMachine Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Have you looked at Eddie Royal, De Sean Jackson and Donnie Avery's numbers recently? Those 3 guys are all small and quick. It's more difficult for a guy like Hardy who has to teach himself to be a solid route runner and possession receiver. It's easier for rookie WRs who just have to burn one CB and then find open field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deep2evans Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Have you looked at Eddie Royal, De Sean Jackson and Donnie Avery's numbers recently? I'm not trying to make excuses for Hardy, but I hope you realize the similarities between those 3 guys you just named. They are speed/slot guys. Guys who can get in and out of breaks quickly, the learning curve is nowhere near as high. They are going to get their yards no matter what because of their world class speed. With that said, it's very unlikely that any of them legit #1 WR written on them because their ceiling is not as high. It's the same reason guys like Evans are able to succeed very early, while players like Plaxico do not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hazed and Amuzed Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 No it's not too early. I usually reserve my judgment on rookies till the 3rd preseason game before I know if their a bust or not but if you want to wait ALLLLL the way to the 8th game I understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cale Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 It's too early to label any of the 3 as a bust, but they've definitely not contributed to the extent that we had, obviously, hoped for. While, in time, they could certainly turn it around, I'd definitely say they've been disappointing. McKelvin, aside from a couple of decent returns here and there, has reminded me more of Chris Watson than anything. He just seems slow and doesn't make people miss. Hardy, we all suspected, would be a project. When we drafted him, I felt like he could turn into a prolific weapon in time, or he could be out of the league in a couple of years. He clearly has a lot to learn about the pro game and needs to refine his route running, but again... that's nothing more than what we expected when we drafted him. Ellis must not be at all ready to play at this level, or obviously he would at least be on the active roster on game day. I know this board is bipolar or schizoid about Peter King. But read the MMQB article today about drafting for the future and winning now. Our front office/scouting has to come through on this. We waited 3 years for Eric Moulds. Bu in today's NFL in a small market team we just don't have that luxury: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writ...eek9/index.html C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mile High Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Check out this guys first two seasons in Buffalo. Link. Glad the coaches didn't give up on him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paup 1995MVP Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 At what point can one expect McKelvin to contribute defensively? At what point should one expect McKelvin to contribute defensively? As a high number one pick, McKelvin should have been contributing from day 1. But the problem is that he played against marginal competition in college. Troy is not the SEC. I think we way overvalued McKelvin just like we way over valued Donte Whitner. Taking Whitner at #8 was a terrible decision. He is far too small to be a major impact player at Safety. He is a good football player, don't get me wrong, but is certainly not a gamechanger. He has the ability of a late 2nd round pick at best. Granted this is hindsite, but taking a 5'9" safety with the 8th pick in the draft makes no sense. My god, I believe even Bob Sanders who is much more physical than Whitner was taken late in the 2nd round. And McCargo was a complete bust. So there are two 1st round wasted picks. McKelvin doesn't look like he has any instincts at CB or KR at this point. Being drafted at #11, he should have had a strong understanding of the game from the first day of camp. As for Hardy and Ellis, they look completely overwhelmed by the pro game. Who is running the scouting dept. on this team. Makes you wonder is it the coaching or the scouting that is leaving our draft picks way behind? Derek Fine did look good yesterday, so lets give Kudos for that pick. Can we please draft some O lineman high next year. PLEASE!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBlackMamba Posted November 3, 2008 Author Share Posted November 3, 2008 As a high number one pick, McKelvin should have been contributing from day 1. But the problem is that he played against marginal competition in college. Troy is not the SEC. I think we way overvalued McKelvin just like we way over valued Donte Whitner. Taking Whitner at #8 was a terrible decision. He is far too small to be a major impact player at Safety. He is a good football player, don't get me wrong, but is certainly not a gamechanger. He has the ability of a late 2nd round pick at best. Granted this is hindsite, but taking a 5'9" safety with the 8th pick in the draft makes no sense. My god, I believe even Bob Sanders who is much more physical than Whitner was taken late in the 2nd round. And McCargo was a complete bust. So there are two 1st round wasted picks. McKelvin doesn't look like he has any instincts at CB or KR at this point. Being drafted at #11, he should have had a strong understanding of the game from the first day of camp. As for Hardy and Ellis, they look completely overwhelmed by the pro game. Who is running the scouting dept. on this team. Makes you wonder is it the coaching or the scouting that is leaving our draft picks way behind? Derek Fine did look good yesterday, so lets give Kudos for that pick. Can we please draft some O lineman high next year. PLEASE!! thank u...i believe i was trying to say that but not obviously i wasnt as extensive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
commish95 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Have you looked at Eddie Royal, De Sean Jackson and Donnie Avery's numbers recently? Yes I have Royal-----has a Veteran QB with a Pass first offense Jackson----Has a Veteran QB with a Pass first offense Avery----Has a Veteran QB with a pass first offense Hardy-----Has a Rookie(yes rookie)qb with a Run style offense and conservative play calling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bills44 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Yes I have Royal-----has a Veteran QB with a Pass first offense Hardy-----Has a Rookie(yes rookie)qb with a Run style offense and conservative play calling. What? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ieatcrayonz Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Hardy-----Has a Rookie(yes rookie)qb with a Run style offense and conservative play calling. Trent is not really a rookie. He is actually more like a college Senior. He was drafted in the THIRD round. If you look at the draft value chart you move up one round a year. That means next year he will be considered a first round rookie. I think they also build in some provision for femininity so he can't really be considered a 2nd year QB until the 9th game of the 2010 season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
busterramsey Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Chris Ellis is terrible! Hardy sucks.......McKelvin, well.......I dont know. Honestly I dont know anymore.... No it's not too early and I agree.. Some say it's too early on McKelvin but apperently Reggie Corner an undersized 4th rounder is higher on the depth chart than the 1st CB taken. Hardy just plain sucks Ellis must be even worse because he was drafted for one thing, to get to the QB and they don't give him a chance. What does that tell ya! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
commish95 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Trent is not really a rookie. He is actually more like a college Senior. He was drafted in the THIRD round. If you look at the draft value chart you move up one round a year. That means next year he will be considered a first round rookie. I think they also build in some provision for femininity so he can't really be considered a 2nd year QB until the 9th game of the 2010 season. Say What? Anyway he is far from being an experience QB like the other 3. That was my point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ieatcrayonz Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Say What? Anyway he is far from being an experience QB like the other 3. That was my point. You said he is a rookie but I pointed out that he was selected in the third round and is girlish. I don't think it is fair to consider him a rookie just yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CosmicBills Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Chris Ellis is terrible! Hardy sucks.......McKelvin, well.......I dont know. Honestly I dont know anymore.... You quit being a fan. Go to your Titans board and leave us alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cale Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Yes I have Royal-----has a Veteran QB with a Pass first offense Jackson----Has a Veteran QB with a Pass first offense Avery----Has a Veteran QB with a pass first offense Hardy-----Has a Rookie(yes rookie)qb with a Run style offense and conservative play calling. Whaaaaattt? So you're saying Hardy would be *more* productive in a system that asks him to do *more*? When thus far he hasn't produced in a system that just asks him to go up and get the ball. Wow! Since when is Edwards rookie? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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