BillsFanM.D. Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 McKelvin...McKelvin....this guy is driving me bonkers. I haven't posted in a while but I had to chime in here. The 'great' returners (see #24) catch the ball and generally pick a straight path to try and get through the first wave of defenders. If they make it through, you (the fan) can't wait for the "cut" to occur and he's off to the races. This is especially true on kickoffs. Worst case scenario is you've gone north/south and picked up as much reasonable yardage as you can. McKelvin seems to be "tip-toeing" after he catches the ball waiting for something to open or as if he's running a sweep. It's pretty rare that a guy actually will turn the corner on a kickoff and not get cut off/tackled. You need to bust it upfield and hope you can pop through. He almost seems scared. I know the above "approach" is a generalization and certainly does not fit every return. Just my few pennies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papargbear Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 McKelvin...McKelvin....this guy is driving me bonkers. I haven't posted in a while but I had to chime in here. The 'great' returners (see #24) catch the ball and generally pick a straight path to try and get through the first wave of defenders. If they make it through, you (the fan) can't wait for the "cut" to occur and he's off to the races. This is especially true on kickoffs. Worst case scenario is you've gone north/south and picked up as much reasonable yardage as you can. McKelvin seems to be "tip-toeing" after he catches the ball waiting for something to open or as if he's running a sweep. It's pretty rare that a guy actually will turn the corner on a kickoff and not get cut off/tackled. You need to bust it upfield and hope you can pop through. He almost seems scared. I know the above "approach" is a generalization and certainly does not fit every return. Just my few pennies. Amen, brother...my thoughts exactly. Maybe they should put Roscoe back there since he only gets a couple of touches on offense anyway... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 The middle collapsed time and again on passing downs. Peters had the blindside sewed up, but I can't especially praise his game because they were unable to run. Peters played very well today. Don't expect fans to admit this, however, particularly after an ugly home divisional loss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 This team is not very deep, and does not have the depth necessary to win despite injuries. It's appalling how thin that team is at LB, S, CB, TE, and WR. I could understand a position here or there, but the downside of C2C is you forego spending on depth. And of course, it maximizes the bottom line as well. The salary cap era is about parity, as we all know. It doesn't mean absolutely you can't find depth in the FA market and draft. Guys like Fred Jackson are the players you need when the inevitable injury occurs. Worse, the absolute reluctance to take a chance on a rookie is strange. Like it or not, draft picks in today's era must play earlier than most coaches would like. But to bench guys because they're young has become a hallmark of this season. Then again, we've got another 3 years of DJ. We all know Ralphie doesn't want to let a guy go before his deal is up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Bill, I am amazed how two people can watch the same game and see something totally different. Props for 3 guys who got run over all day? Sorry. Single coverage on our 6'6" WR? Perfect time to throw to him. Too bad the rookie doesn't know how to fight for a ball. You are wayyyy too generous with the O-line. Every last one of them, including your binky Peters, sucked out loud today. PTR I agree it was a good time to go to Hardy. But, the fault of the play was either on Edwards for a lame assed throw, misread, or both. (The ball had to be thrown high and away, not a short pop fly to the inside.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Adams Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Peters played very well today. Don't expect fans to admit this, however, particularly after an ugly home divisional loss. Be careful. 30 yards rushing, much of it to the left side including -1 yard on 4th and a foot. It's not all Peters's fault but there is hardly a guy on this team who pushes his man downfield on a run play and that includes Peters. Peters did very well pass-blocking as he often does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keepthefaith Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 McKelvin...McKelvin....this guy is driving me bonkers. I haven't posted in a while but I had to chime in here. The 'great' returners (see #24) catch the ball and generally pick a straight path to try and get through the first wave of defenders. If they make it through, you (the fan) can't wait for the "cut" to occur and he's off to the races. This is especially true on kickoffs. Worst case scenario is you've gone north/south and picked up as much reasonable yardage as you can. McKelvin seems to be "tip-toeing" after he catches the ball waiting for something to open or as if he's running a sweep. It's pretty rare that a guy actually will turn the corner on a kickoff and not get cut off/tackled. You need to bust it upfield and hope you can pop through. He almost seems scared. I know the above "approach" is a generalization and certainly does not fit every return. Just my few pennies. He averaged over 25 yards per today. Not bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted November 3, 2008 Author Share Posted November 3, 2008 Again, something needs to be done with our Lines. I dont know how it can be fixed, but our offensive line is simply embarrassing. I do! Jauron can devote a 1st, 3rd, and 4th round pick to it. Then, he can skip a year and devote a 1st and a 4th. In this 3 year year span, he can also bring in countless free agents to see if they can play. You think this will happen? Our DEs had virtually no chance of making a play, let alone contributing in any way, such as forcing a play inside. The middle of our OL was painfully bad. Nobody can fix this but Jauron, and whoever signs the checks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted November 3, 2008 Author Share Posted November 3, 2008 Peters played very well today. Don't expect fans to admit this, however, particularly after an ugly home divisional loss. Dave, when he had the motion penalty, he was loudly booed. This surprised me, whereas I thought that this type of anger was limited to the Senator, who seems to feel deeply wounded, and perhaps a few others. It apparently is not. He was dominant on pass protection. Shaun Ellis is very strong and huge, and on one play, Peters stood him up and knocked him backwards with his hand punch. He handled him on the blind side with ease. Still, even my wife was complaining about the run game, and she knows next to nothing about football. She actually said that if Trent has to pass on every play he will be intercepted. Run blocking is the "easy" part of OL play. The situation defies football logic as I know it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cåblelady Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Dave, when he had the motion penalty, he was loudly booed. He was booed when he ran out of the tunnel. *LOL* Phat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 i was at the game, great tail gate. i agree, our d line is not disruptive enough, our LBs aren't playing great (of course having 3 on IR is a big part of that), and our secondary needs to figure itself out (i think either scott continues to improve or we get a new SS. mcgee and mcloving with youboty as our nickle is the future, and those guys can really play). on o our running has been terrible, we are playing musical backs too much, our o line has flat out sucked for way too many plays this year (with peters falling from best in the afc to maybe top 12) and we still have only one WR. all that said, we lost this week soley due to turnovers. TURNOVERS TURNOVERS TURNOVERS. THAT'S IT. the pick in the jets redzone cost us at least 10 if not 14 total points. the fumble cost us 3 if not 6 points. the failed conversion cost us 3 if not 6. that's 16 to 26 points net differential on turnovers. we lost by just over half the smaller number there. no coach or team is perfect, but all this crying over who should return kicks and how bad our coaches are is really missing the point, we have to take care of the football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keepthefaith Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 i was at the game, great tail gate. i agree, our d line is not disruptive enough, our LBs aren't playing great (of course having 3 on IR is a big part of that), and our secondary needs to figure itself out (i think either scott continues to improve or we get a new SS. mcgee and mcloving with youboty as our nickle is the future, and those guys can really play). on o our running has been terrible, we are playing musical backs too much, our o line has flat out sucked for way too many plays this year (with peters falling from best in the afc to maybe top 12) and we still have only one WR. all that said, we lost this week soley due to turnovers. TURNOVERS TURNOVERS TURNOVERS. THAT'S IT. the pick in the jets redzone cost us at least 10 if not 14 total points. the fumble cost us 3 if not 6 points. the failed conversion cost us 3 if not 6. that's 16 to 26 points net differential on turnovers. we lost by just over half the smaller number there. no coach or team is perfect, but all this crying over who should return kicks and how bad our coaches are is really missing the point, we have to take care of the football. Yup. If you can' run the ball, you turn the ball over, can't put pressure on the opposing QB and can't stop their running game late in the game - you'll lose most of the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordio Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 1) WTF was Jauron thinking when he challenged the reception? There was no chance of the play being overturned, and that was our last timeout. 2) I am not going to start a poll, but how many of you are getting an upset stomach watching Kyle Williams get his ass beat? 3) This might make no sense, but Mckelvin looks bad even when his reurns result in decent yardage. I know that he is young and I am grasping at straws, but it wouldn't be a bad thing to see some production of Jauron's little prodigy. Maybe it's me. 4) Over the years, I have made some not so strong attempts to defend Kelsay. I am here to say that I am sorry about that. He is small, weak and now he is even slow. He isn't good at any phase of his position. 5) Dockery looked like a very average Guard today. Maybe that's what he is, average. Preston was a disgrace. Whittle? At the end of the game I wasn't sure if he was laying there hurt, or he passed out in shock because someone mentioned the possibility of successfully blocking his opponent. 6) When you are outcoached by Mangini (who is a freaking nitwit), you are either second rate, or having a very bad day. You be the judge. In the credit where it's due department, I bet that Jauron looks better at shaking the winning coaches hands than any other head coach in the NFL. He sure has enough practice. 7) No excuses for the picks by Trent. On the first one, they absolutely had to come away with points. On the last one, it was a dumb time to go to Hardy. 8) Jauron will win you some games with his bend but don't break b.s., but chalk up this loss to the Jauron philosophy. Non-impact 1st round defensive backs, and weak lines. 9) Back to Kelsay.....Denney and Kelsay were just so bad today that it hardly mattered at all that they were on the field. There was no chance of them containing their sides. I swear, after one particular play it looked like K. Williams was getting pissed, and he is so-so at best. Good God! 10) OK, the running backs coach needs to teach these guys to hold onto screen passes that are right in their f ing hands. I mean seriously, wtf is going on with this? 11) Kudos to Stroud, Greer and Poz. 12) Two penalties for 12 men on the field? Guilty as charged, but Mangini spent virtually the entire game on the playing field. Does the 12 man rule exclude beached whales? 13) NE is now a must win game. I hope that Jauron can keep this team from quitting after this disgrace. I dont know where to begin. The defense was awfull today. Was Mitchell hurt? Tough to tell at the game but he looked like he was 2 steps behind the play all times. Looking back, it was really shortsighted & pig headed to put Crowell on the IR just to prove a point. If he was able to play & healthy, my guess is he would be our best lb right now. Ellsion sucks. I sat in the upper decks yesterday instead of my usual seats & it is really astounishing how much of a cushion the cbs give the wrs. I mean it is like ringing the dinner bell gift wrapping 10-15 yrd passes to the opposition all day long. The offense. Bill you know me, I have been one of the more outspoken people about Edwards & how good a future I think he has. With that being said, he has sh*t the bed the last 2 weeks. Noway to sugar coat this. The losmanites are correct when they state that if it was losman playing like this the last two weeks, he would of been crucified on this board. With that being said, people need to realize that he has just completed his first season of games. We knew going in that he was going to have some rough outings. As bad as he was, he still threw for 289 yrds, or more yards then losman has thrown in a game in all but 2 of his 31 starts. The other thing is, they are putting everything on Edwards shoulders. No running game, no #2 receiver with reed out. He is in a tough spot right now & until they develope a running game, my guess is he will continue to struggle. No excuse for the 1st int though. Gotta be smarter then that trent. I am not ready to label Hardy a bust since it does take wrs 2-3 yrs generally to be productive. Lynch is looking more & more like he will not see a 2nd contract with the bils I am afraid. Guy is just not a game changer. Big game this week, but I got to be honest, I really can not see this team beating NE in Foxboro. Hopefully I am wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Realist Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 McKelvin returning kicks is the least of this team's problems. In last night's game, John Madden mentioned that OLinemen love to run block, its the part of the game that makes them dominant and in control, our line can't do a damn thing in run blocking. Its almost like they have no heart, no pride. Now the defense, after the Greer TD, you would think they would come out like gamebusters. I thought at that point it was our game. But, no, the defense fell as flat as the OLine. They let Jets go right down the field and put points on the board. Where's the pride? Its almost like they don't even want to be out there. This team is 9-7 at best and out of the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordio Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 I do! Jauron can devote a 1st, 3rd, and 4th round pick to it. Then, he can skip a year and devote a 1st and a 4th. In this 3 year year span, he can also bring in countless free agents to see if they can play. You think this will happen? Our DEs had virtually no chance of making a play, let alone contributing in any way, such as forcing a play inside. The middle of our OL was painfully bad. Nobody can fix this but Jauron, and whoever signs the checks. Bill seriously, you got to stop. For you to say they have neglected the lines is just pure & utter bullsh*t. They brought in Dockery, they brought in Walker & they brought in Fowler. Now you may not be happy with these guys, but they have spent big money on the oline the last few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 McKelvin...McKelvin....this guy is driving me bonkers. I haven't posted in a while but I had to chime in here. The 'great' returners (see #24) catch the ball and generally pick a straight path to try and get through the first wave of defenders. If they make it through, you (the fan) can't wait for the "cut" to occur and he's off to the races. This is especially true on kickoffs. Worst case scenario is you've gone north/south and picked up as much reasonable yardage as you can. McKelvin seems to be "tip-toeing" after he catches the ball waiting for something to open or as if he's running a sweep. It's pretty rare that a guy actually will turn the corner on a kickoff and not get cut off/tackled. You need to bust it upfield and hope you can pop through. He almost seems scared. I know the above "approach" is a generalization and certainly does not fit every return. Just my few pennies. he was better yesterday I think. better is used here as a relative term. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Dave, when he had the motion penalty, he was loudly booed. This surprised me, whereas I thought that this type of anger was limited to the Senator, who seems to feel deeply wounded, and perhaps a few others. It apparently is not. Bill--respect your opinions, but...lately all I hear when reading your posts are those adult voices from peanuts. Closest approximation I can come up with: waaa wa waaaaa wa wa waaa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted November 3, 2008 Author Share Posted November 3, 2008 Bill seriously, you got to stop. For you to say they have neglected the lines is just pure & utter bullsh*t. They brought in Dockery, they brought in Walker & they brought in Fowler. Now you may not be happy with these guys, but they have spent big money on the oline the last few years. Generally speaking, teams need to draft their blockers, although one alternative is to spend 49 million dollars on a Derrick Dockery. Now, Dockery isn't always as bad as he was yesterday, but I don't know how many people he scares either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted November 3, 2008 Author Share Posted November 3, 2008 Bill--respect your opinions, but...lately all I hear when reading your posts are those adult voices from peanuts. Closest approximation I can come up with: waaa wa waaaaa wa wa waaa The weather was nice yesterday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cåblelady Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 The weather was nice yesterday. Kinda. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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