Joe McCain's 911 Call

[pBills]

So, if I'm reading your insult correctly, you think that the 40% of Americans, the Americans that do not pay federal income taxes are unmotivated, to use your phrasing?

 

 

YUP

[erynthered]

So, if I'm reading your insult correctly, you think that the 40% of Americans, the Americans that do not pay federal income taxes are unmotivated, to use your phrasing?

 

 

Sarcasm. I guess you havent read other posts of mine where I've said "some" of 40% are unmotivated. So if I'm reading you right you think that all of those 40% are motivated and deserve free money after not paying any federal income tax.

[Johnny Coli]

Sarcasm. I guess you havent read other posts of mine where I've said "some" of 40% are unmotivated. So if I'm reading you right you think that all of those 40% are motivated and deserve free money after not paying any federal income tax.

Yeah, I must have missed that post of yours.

 

And no, of course I don't believe every single person in America is motivated to work. The majority are, though, and by leaving them out of any economic relief package you are ignoring the very people in this country who desperately need that economic relief. Also, you're making vast, uninformed assumptions as to what form that relief will come in. There isn't going to be a truck with federal plates on it driving down the middle of Main Street handing out $100 bills. These people work just as hard as you or me, and they are being hit just as hard during this downturn. They just can't afford to lose as much as you or I can and still survive.

[erynthered]

Yeah, I must have missed that post of yours.

 

And no, of course I don't believe every single person in America is motivated to work. The majority are, though, and by leaving them out of any economic relief package you are ignoring the very people in this country who desperately need that economic relief. Also, you're making vast, uninformed assumptions as to what form that relief will come in. There isn't going to be a truck with federal plates on it driving down the middle of Main Street handing out $100 bills. These people work just as hard as you or me, and they are being hit just as hard during this downturn. They just can't afford to lose as much as you or I can and still survive.

 

I never miss yours. The comic relief is endless.

 

I loved this one " a truck with federal plates on it driving down the middle of Main Street handing out $100 bills".

 

I believe if you could, you'd want the federal Gov to hold everybody's hand while they took them to their Gov appointed job every morning.

 

Come on admit it like a couple of others here have, your a socialist.

 

Vast uninformed assumptions? Christ Dude there's been many many links from many many posters here supporting what "my assumptions" are with regard to giving away money to people who dont pay federal income taxes.

 

Here's one. Though Obama has "changed" his positions on taxes more times than Clinton shoved that Cigar in Monica's kitty.

 

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1223856516...=googlenews_wsj

 

 

There's more on the board. Go look if you feel the need.

[Johnny Coli]

I never miss yours. The comic relief is endless.

 

I loved this one " a truck with federal plates on it driving down the middle of Main Street handing out $100 bills".

 

I believe if you could, you'd want the federal Gov to hold everybody's hand while they took them to their Gov appointed job every morning.

 

Come on admit it like a couple of others here have, your a socialist.

 

Vast uninformed assumptions? Christ Dude there's been many many links from many many posters here supporting what "my assumptions" are with regard to giving away money to people who dont pay federal income taxes.

 

Here's one. Though Obama has "changed" his positions on taxes more times than Clinton shoved that Cigar in Monica's kitty.

 

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1223856516...=googlenews_wsj

 

 

There's more on the board. Go look if you feel the need.

 

Let's take a look at the conditions that have to be met by those lucky enough to be poor in order to get these fabulous perks, for being poor.

 

- A $500 tax credit ($1,000 a couple) to "make work pay" that phases out at income of $75,000 for individuals and $150,000 per couple.

So, the cutoff for not paying any taxes AT ALL for 2008 is $8900. Those lucky enough to be making less than $8900 will get the full $500, and I'm assuming this is phased out as you approach $75k. I'm pretty tempted to quit my high-paying job to join the ranks of these lucky bastards.

 

- A $4,000 tax credit for college tuition.

Those working poor lucky enough to be paying the average yearly tuition for college of $23k (if private) and $6200 (if public) would get a whopping $4000 tax credit. That guy lucky enough to be making $8900 a year can "win the welfare lottery" by also going to, or having a kid in college. If he's smart he'll only send his kid to a public one. Then he'll only be out $2200 bucks after he gets his check. But hey, it's doable because $2200 is only like a quarter of his yearly salary, and he's getting a cool $500 on top for being dirt poor..

 

- A 10% mortgage interest tax credit (on top of the existing mortgage interest deduction and other housing subsidies).

Now we're talking! If he was lucky enough to get a sub-prime loan during the free-wheeling Bush years (and who wouldn't extend a loan to a guy making $8900 a year), then he's got a mortgage he can't afford right now and he's in foreclosure. But if he can sell his hair and blood to somehow scrape by and make his mortgage payments, he'll get 10% back on the interest for the mortgage he can barely pay! Lucky guy!

 

- A "savings" tax credit of 50% up to $1,000.

Like this guy has any savings. ROFL

 

- An expansion of the earned-income tax credit that would allow single workers to receive as much as $555 a year, up from $175 now, and give these workers up to $1,110 if they are paying child support.

Bonus! Another $500 for the guy making $8900. Don't spend that money on food, man! You'll want to put that into a savings account to get another tax credit!

 

- A child care credit of 50% up to $6,000 of expenses a year.

If that guy making $8900 a year is lucky enough to have $12k worth of childcare expenses he'll get a check for $6000! Bonus if he lives in South Dakota, because they prohibit contraceptives! It's better than scratch tickets!

 

- A "clean car" tax credit of up to $7,000 on the purchase of certain vehicles.

All the working poor are gonna buy a Prius!

 

 

Man, you are right, eryn. The working poor are gonna be rolling in cash once Obama is elected!

[SageAgainstTheMachine]

Come on admit it like a couple of others here have, your a socialist.

 

Can I ask why you and the other conservatives here constantly use the word "socialist" as if it's meant to be some sort of insult? It's an economic philosophy shared by many many people throughout the world, but you use it as some sort of swear word. I don't consider myself a socialist, but so what if I did?

 

If somebody is a socialist, they can still love America and its values, they just have a different opinion on how we should go about our economy.

[erynthered]

Let's take a look at the conditions that have to be met by those lucky enough to be poor in order to get these fabulous perks, for being poor.

 

- A $500 tax credit ($1,000 a couple) to "make work pay" that phases out at income of $75,000 for individuals and $150,000 per couple.

So, the cutoff for not paying any taxes AT ALL for 2008 is $8900. Those lucky enough to be making less than $8900 will get the full $500, and I'm assuming this is phased out as you approach $75k. I'm pretty tempted to quit my high-paying job to join the ranks of these lucky bastards.

 

- A $4,000 tax credit for college tuition.

Those working poor lucky enough to be paying the average yearly tuition for college of $23k (if private) and $6200 (if public) would get a whopping $4000 tax credit. That guy lucky enough to be making $8900 a year can "win the welfare lottery" by also going to, or having a kid in college. If he's smart he'll only send his kid to a public one. Then he'll only be out $2200 bucks after he gets his check. But hey, it's doable because $2200 is only like a quarter of his yearly salary, and he's getting a cool $500 on top for being dirt poor..

 

- A 10% mortgage interest tax credit (on top of the existing mortgage interest deduction and other housing subsidies).

Now we're talking! If he was lucky enough to get a sub-prime loan during the free-wheeling Bush years (and who wouldn't extend a loan to a guy making $8900 a year), then he's got a mortgage he can't afford right now and he's in foreclosure. But if he can sell his hair and blood to somehow scrape by and make his mortgage payments, he'll get 10% back on the interest for the mortgage he can barely pay! Lucky guy!

 

- A "savings" tax credit of 50% up to $1,000.

Like this guy has any savings. ROFL

 

- An expansion of the earned-income tax credit that would allow single workers to receive as much as $555 a year, up from $175 now, and give these workers up to $1,110 if they are paying child support.

Bonus! Another $500 for the guy making $8900. Don't spend that money on food, man! You'll want to put that into a savings account to get another tax credit!

 

- A child care credit of 50% up to $6,000 of expenses a year.

If that guy making $8900 a year is lucky enough to have $12k worth of childcare expenses he'll get a check for $6000! Bonus if he lives in South Dakota, because they prohibit contraceptives! It's better than scratch tickets!

 

- A "clean car" tax credit of up to $7,000 on the purchase of certain vehicles.

All the working poor are gonna buy a Prius!

 

 

Man, you are right, eryn. The working poor are gonna be rolling in cash once Obama is elected!

 

 

Nice Post. Nice work.

 

Though with you sarcasm, I'd say you think Obama is not giving them enough? Am I right? Might as well, since our Country has to many people that make to much money, right? Cut that pie deeper Obama, why not. If he lowers that income down to say, maybe 100K, just think of all the things people could get. Hell, They wont have to buy a Prius, the Gov will give them one.

 

Look how freeing money up at Fannie and Freddie worked out for the poor and disadvantaged. Good Job Mr. Government. Let the Gov decide, because they know best, Social Security, medicare, education, you name it. The Gov. is the best to answer for our society ills. You're lock step is quite humorous, Johnny. But it doesn't surprise me. Again thanks for the comedic relief on the rolling in the cash part.

[erynthered]

Can I ask why you and the other conservatives here constantly use the word "socialist" as if it's meant to be some sort of insult? It's an economic philosophy shared by many many people throughout the world, but you use it as some sort of swear word. I don't consider myself a socialist, but so what if I did?

 

If somebody is a socialist, they can still love America and its values, they just have a different opinion on how we should go about our economy.

 

Its an insult to what this Country was founded upon. A free Society. Ask Pasta Joe and EII why they admitted they want/are/cant wait for socialism.

 

 

Also. I really don't think I should be categorized as a conservative.

[SageAgainstTheMachine]

Its an insult to what this Country was founded upon. A free Society. Ask Pasta Joe and EII why they admitted they want/are/cant wait for socialism.

 

 

Also. I really don't think I should be categorized as a conservative.

 

Yes a Free Society, a society where anybody can think, feel, and speak how they want to. And that includes socialists.

[erynthered]

Yes a Free Society, a society where anybody can think, feel, and speak how they want to. And that includes socialists.

 

 

True. So express yourself then. Would you like to see USA became a total Socialistic Country. Speak freely!!

[SageAgainstTheMachine]

True. So express yourself then. Would you like to see USA became a total Socialistic Country. Speak freely!!

 

No I would not. Socialism is one of those theories that looks good on paper, but is impossible to carry out. Somebody always gets greedy and wants a bigger piece of the pie, so socialism cannot work.

 

I DO on the other hand, think that those who are suffering ought to be given aid, and if that requires a small-scale redistribution of wealth, so be it. Maybe those making more than $250,000 a year SHOULDN'T have to pay taxes at a higher percentage, but does it actually hurt them all that much? To me, it's as simple as this. Some people have enough money. Some people don't. The people that don't have enough money need extra help and in an American community where we should all help our fellow man, isn't that enough?

[UBinVA]

Can I ask why you and the other conservatives here constantly use the word "socialist" as if it's meant to be some sort of insult? It's an economic philosophy shared by many many people throughout the world, but you use it as some sort of swear word. I don't consider myself a socialist, but so what if I did?

 

If somebody is a socialist, they can still love America and its values, they just have a different opinion on how we should go about our economy.

 

What is America to you? Please define what America's values are? What do you like about it? How have we become so powerful in such a short time?

 

Socialism: "One step away from Communism"

 

1: any of various economic and political theories advocating collective or governmental ownership and administration of the means of production and distribution of goods

 

2 a: a system of society or group living in which there is no private property b: a system or condition of society in which the means of production are owned and controlled by the state

 

3: a stage of society in Marxist theory transitional between capitalism and communism and distinguished by unequal distribution of goods and pay according to work done

[SageAgainstTheMachine]

What is America to you? Please define what America's values are? What do you like about it? How have we become so powerful in such a short time?

 

Socialism: "One step away from Communism"

 

1: any of various economic and political theories advocating collective or governmental ownership and administration of the means of production and distribution of goods

 

2 a: a system of society or group living in which there is no private property b: a system or condition of society in which the means of production are owned and controlled by the state

 

3: a stage of society in Marxist theory transitional between capitalism and communism and distinguished by unequal distribution of goods and pay according to work done

 

What is America to me? The great yet flawed country in which I live.

 

Please define what America's values are? See the Constitution. All of that. Especially the part about free speech. Notice how it doesn't mention capitalism.

 

How did we become so powerful in such a short period of time? Unethically. See The Louisiana Purchase, The Trail of Tears, American Imperialism, etc.

[erynthered]

No I would not. Socialism is one of those theories that looks good on paper, but is impossible to carry out. Somebody always gets greedy and wants a bigger piece of the pie, so socialism cannot work.

 

I DO on the other hand, think that those who are suffering ought to be given aid, and if that requires a small-scale redistribution of wealth, so be it. Maybe those making more than $250,000 a year SHOULDN'T have to pay taxes at a higher percentage, but does it actually hurt them all that much? To me, it's as simple as this. Some people have enough money. Some people don't. The people that don't have enough money need extra help and in an American community where we should all help our fellow man, isn't that enough?

 

Since the Gov. is so smart. Why dont they look to their own first? Why not cut Gov. waste FIRST? I'll tell you why. BECAUSE THE GOV. IS NOT !@#$ING SMART. I believe if they did nobody would be talking about this issue because there would be plenty of money from wasteful spending to take care of our needy. But lets not look at the Gov, lets look at people who have busted their nuts to get where they are by hard work and take their money. Yeah, that makes sense!! BRILLIANT!!

 

 

 

Disclaimer for the idiots:

I also believe that the needy need to be helped. ONLY the needy. Not the lazy.

[UBinVA]

No I would not. Socialism is one of those theories that looks good on paper, but is impossible to carry out. Somebody always gets greedy and wants a bigger piece of the pie, so socialism cannot work.

 

I DO on the other hand, think that those who are suffering ought to be given aid, and if that requires a small-scale redistribution of wealth, so be it. Maybe those making more than $250,000 a year SHOULDN'T have to pay taxes at a higher percentage, but does it actually hurt them all that much? To me, it's as simple as this. Some people have enough money. Some people don't. The people that don't have enough money need extra help and in an American community where we should all help our fellow man, isn't that enough?

 

What grade are in and why are you not in school?

 

Let me know how you feel when you bust your ass all day to provide for your family, raise four kids, put them all through college, pay 50% of your earnings to the government and yet they want more. If you live in NYC or other high price areas $250K is not rich. It might be in Buffalo but not here in DC, CA, NYC or other urban areas.

 

Plus, most small businesses declare their earnings on individual tax returns which are subject to these higher taxes. So yes, it not only hurts these people, it hurts their business and businesses will not hire more people.

[Johnny Coli]

What is America to you? Please define what America's values are? What do you like about it? How have we become so powerful in such a short time?

 

Socialism: "One step away from Communism"

 

1: any of various economic and political theories advocating collective or governmental ownership and administration of the means of production and distribution of goods

 

2 a: a system of society or group living in which there is no private property b: a system or condition of society in which the means of production are owned and controlled by the state

 

3: a stage of society in Marxist theory transitional between capitalism and communism and distinguished by unequal distribution of goods and pay according to work done

Explain to us, using your cut and pasted definition of socialism, how increasing the taxes of the wealthiest Americans a few percentage points and offering tax breaks to the poor is socialism? The US is already taxing people. The US is already providing tax breaks. How is giving people an incentive to send their kids to college, which they are actually paying for in order to get the credit, or how a person getting 10% credit back on the interest they pay on a mortgage, socialism? I'm looking at your definition there, and I'm looking at the conditions a person must meet in order to get any tax relief that erynthered posted. I don't see it. Not by any stretch of the imagination.

[SageAgainstTheMachine]

What grade are in and why are you not in school?

 

Let me know how you feel when you bust your ass all day to provide for your family, raise four kids, put them all through college, pay 50% of your earnings to the government and yet they want more. If you live in NYC or other high price areas $250K is not rich. It might be in Buffalo but not here in DC, CA, NYC or other urban areas.

 

Plus, most small businesses declare their earnings on individual tax returns which are subject to these higher taxes. So yes, it not only hurts these people, it hurts their business and businesses will not hire more people.

 

Well you raise a good point, because I am 19, but I hope life doesn't make me not an idealist anymore. But I am in college, paying my own tuition ($49,000 a year) and rent, so at the end I'll be up in debt to my eyeballs. Then hopefully my education will end up with me making money. In other words, I intend to be both poor and rich during my lifetime. When I'm poor, I will need a little help. If I'm rich, I will gladly throw money back into the system to assist those in the position I used to be in.

[erynthered]

Since the Gov. is so smart. Why dont they look to their own first? Why not cut Gov. waste FIRST? I'll tell you why. BECAUSE THE GOV. IS NOT !@#$ING SMART. I believe if they did nobody would be talking about this issue because there would be plenty of money from wasteful spending to take care of our needy. But lets not look at the Gov, lets look at people who have busted their nuts to get where they are by hard work and take their money. Yeah, that makes sense!! BRILLIANT!!

 

 

 

Disclaimer for the idiots:

I also believe that the needy need to be helped. ONLY the needy. Not the lazy.

 

Nothing? Nothing? Crickets? Are you kidding me? Potentially over 100 BILLION a year in waste? But yet you Libs want to tax people? Why not look like heroes? Find the waste and spend it on your violin cases. The Repub couldn't do it why don't you?

 

You people are as weak kneed as the others. Pieces of shiit, all of them.

[YellowLinesandArmadillos]

She lives in a mud hut? I didn't realize that...

No, she just kicked her half sister in the shins. Noice, holier than thou judgemental limousine Republicans.

 

Turn your back on the other Americans.

 

I guess from a Cindy McCain's perspective she not only isn't her sister's keeper, she doesn't even acknowledge her existence. Too messy, heck even Palin doesn't even go that far.

[YellowLinesandArmadillos]

What grade are in and why are you not in school?

 

Let me know how you feel when you bust your ass all day to provide for your family, raise four kids, put them all through college, pay 50% of your earnings to the government and yet they want more. If you live in NYC or other high price areas $250K is not rich. It might be in Buffalo but not here in DC, CA, NYC or other urban areas.

 

Plus, most small businesses declare their earnings on individual tax returns which are subject to these higher taxes. So yes, it not only hurts these people, it hurts their business and businesses will not hire more people.

You know you are probably right about this, so why hasn't in the six years of Republican control weren't these issues addressed???? Because they want it more for a campaign issue and the only they really do is support big business in the name of small business... because like the NFIB, they only use the Rhetoric, not the substance.

 

Dems do stupid things too, but right now they are probably more sensitive to small business needs and would be amenable to some constructive ideas. If you want lip service go vote for the Republicans, their actual working definition of small business is very different than the $250,000 figure being thrown about. I spent to much time working in Washington, not to understand who controls these groups including the Chambers and local Chambers are much more supportive of small business than the County and National. Why do you think small non-chamber networking groups are springing up all around.