Joe the Plumber...

[blzrul]

Damn, this didn't take long at all. I wonder how long before we find out Joe The Plumber put a gun to his head when he suddenly realized he was stupid enough to pose a solid question to a Presidential candidate.

 

"WE HAVE NO ANSWER FOR OBAMA'S "SPREAD THE WEALTH" COMMENT SOOOOOOOOO?

 

LET'S GET THE PLUMBER!!!!"

 

You guys are absolutely embarrassing yourselves. Freakin' unbelievable.

I don't see anything wrong with the comment. Spreading the wealth around is the way this country runs. The federal government collects taxes...shares it with states...which shares it with local govt/municipalities...is there a problem with that?

 

I live in the Seattle area. My tax dollars here go to build roads and schools for the more sparsely-populated east side of the state. The money is here, but it gets shared over there. I don't have a problem with that.

 

Unfortunately Joe will be pilloried because he was held up by McCain as an example of a poor struggling victim who would be further victimized by Big Bad Barack. This is called "back-firing" and seems to be a hallmark of the McCainiac campaign.

[Lurker]

You guys are absolutely embarrassing yourselves. Freakin' unbelievable.

Damn, you're right. And to think, I was just about to post the Katie Couric transcript....

[IDBillzFan]

Damn, you're right. And to think, I was just about to post the Katie Couric transcript....

 

You don't need Katie Couric, and you surely don't need the plumber, when there are plenty of opportunities to laugh at the very people who are running for office.

 

After all, as Biden says, the bottom line is we need to focus on a three-letter word: J-O-B-S!

 

I am suddenly thinking that the real reason to vote for Obama is because the comedic value of having this dimwit in the #2 chair is just too much to resist.

 

Stand up, Chuck!!!! :lol:

[The Big Cat]

You don't need Katie Couric, and you surely don't need the plumber, when there are plenty of opportunities to laugh at the very people who are running for office.

 

After all, as Biden says, the bottom line is we need to focus on a three-letter word: J-O-B-S!

 

I am suddenly thinking that the real reason to vote for Obama is because the comedic value of having this dimwit in the #2 chair is just too much to resist.

 

Stand up, Chuck!!!! :lol:

 

[Johnny Coli]

Damn, this didn't take long at all. I wonder how long before we find out Joe The Plumber put a gun to his head when he suddenly realized he was stupid enough to pose a solid question to a Presidential candidate.

 

"WE HAVE NO ANSWER FOR OBAMA'S "SPREAD THE WEALTH" COMMENT SOOOOOOOOO?

 

LET'S GET THE PLUMBER!!!!"

 

You guys are absolutely embarrassing yourselves. Freakin' unbelievable.

By using the phrase "have no answer" you're implying that some of us who support Obama would need to spin his "spread the wealth" comment. I don't think that comment, which I wholeheartedly agree with needs to be spun. Furthermore, the only reason Joe the Scab is even a topic of conversation is because, yet again, John McCain trotted someone out there without doing any background check on him only to find out he's not really an average Joe at all.

[IDBillzFan]

I don't see anything wrong with the comment. Spreading the wealth around is the way this country runs. The federal government collects taxes...shares it with states...which shares it with local govt/municipalities...is there a problem with that?

I have a problem with paying MORE taxes simply so it can be given, without accountability, to people who are simply behind me somehow. I have a problem with paying MORE taxes so people who DON'T pay taxes can suddenly get free money, as if that will inspire and motivate them to do something to better themselves. You don't need to be politically inclined to know that when you give free money to a bunch of people, MOST of those people will do nothing but wait for more free money. But I can't expect you to understand that. And that's okay. Once Obama is in office, we'll see how well this plan works out.

[Johnny Coli]

I have a problem with paying MORE taxes simply so it can be given, without accountability, to people who are simply behind me somehow. I have a problem with paying MORE taxes so people who DON'T pay taxes can suddenly get free money, as if that will inspire and motivate them to do something to better themselves. You don't need to be politically inclined to know that when you give free money to a bunch of people, MOST of those people will do nothing but wait for more free money. But I can't expect you to understand that. And that's okay. Once Obama is in office, we'll see how well this plan works out.

I don't know what you claim on your tax returns, but if you are truthfully going to be paying more taxes under Obama's plan than you are now under Bush's, then there really aren't many people who are going to sympathize with your plight.

[Chef Jim]

By using the phrase "have no answer" you're implying that some of us who support Obama would need to spin his "spread the wealth" comment. I don't think that comment, which I wholeheartedly agree with needs to be spun. Furthermore, the only reason Joe the Scab is even a topic of conversation is because, yet again, John McCain trotted someone out there without doing any background check on him only to find out he's not really an average Joe at all.

 

What's there to check? So what if the scenario is just hypothetical? Would not any small business that nets out $250k in income be subject to more in taxes? I thought we were trying to build and support the small business owner, not knock them down. How cares if it's a plumber, dentist, doctor, lawyer, manufacturer they'll all pay more.

[Chef Jim]

I don't know what you claim on your tax returns, but if you are truthfully going to be paying more taxes under Obama's plan than you are now under Bush's, then there really aren't many people who are going to sympathize with your plight.

 

Yeah because us "rich" people ride the gravy train. I'm starting to dig the train thing Marc.

[IDBillzFan]

By using the phrase "have no answer" you're implying that some of us who support Obama would need to spin his "spread the wealth" comment. I don't think that comment, which I wholeheartedly agree with needs to be spun. Furthermore, the only reason Joe the Scab is even a topic of conversation is because, yet again, John McCain trotted someone out there without doing any background check on him only to find out he's not really an average Joe at all.

Joe the scab. !@#$ing unbelievable. Just !@#$ing unbelievable. What the hell has this guy done to you? WHAT?

 

I can't possibly imagine what, in this world, makes someone even think it's a good idea to make such a comment about a guy who did nothing but ask a question.

 

Un!@#$ingbelievable.

 

I don't know what you claim on your tax returns, but if you are truthfully going to be paying more taxes under Obama's plan than you are now under Bush's, then there really aren't many people who are going to sympathize with your plight.

Which is it, huh, Johhny?

 

Make up your mind.

 

A little guy making $40 grand as a plumber is a !@#$ing scab. And the guy making over a quarter million a year is a !@#$ing elitist piece of shiit. Is it really both? Do you honestly believe that? Are you perfectly situated right in the middle? Can you show all of us people who have our own businesses and earn good money how we, too, can reach such a perfect level of mediocrity. You know, that place between the !@#$ing scab and the !@#$ing elitist? How do we get there? What's your secret formula for perfect mediocrity? Because you seem so !@#$ing happy in that little world of yours.

[Johnny Coli]

What's there to check? So what if the scenario is just hypothetical? Would not any small business that nets out $250k in income be subject to more in taxes? I thought we were trying to build and support the small business owner, not knock them down. How cares if it's a plumber, dentist, doctor, lawyer, manufacturer they'll all pay more.

No one is knocking small businesses down. Less than 2% of small businesses will see an increase.

Third, even if you're one of the rare business owners making enough money to be affected by Obama's proposed tax increases, you still won't see a big hike in your tax bill.

 

McCain's claim that Obama "will increase taxes on 50% of small business revenue" - the line he used in the second presidential debate - is incorrect because of how income is taxed.

 

If a business owner falls into the top bracket, that doesn't mean that all of his or her income is taxed at the highest level.

 

For example: If a small-business owner makes $210,000 in taxable income, he edges into the 33% bracket, one of the two top tax rates that Obama would like to raise.

 

But he would pay the higher tax only on the amount that exceeds the cutoff - in 2007, the two top tax rates applied to single filers with income of $160,850 or more and joint filers with income of at least $195,850. As a single filer, this business owner would see his federal taxes increase $1,475 under Obama's plan, which calls for raising the 33% tax rate to 36%.

A guy making a quarter million dollar profit bitching about an extra $1400 tax is pretty obscene.

[The Big Cat]

I have a problem with paying MORE taxes simply so it can be given, without accountability, to people who are simply behind me somehow. I have a problem with paying MORE taxes so people who DON'T pay taxes can suddenly get free money, as if that will inspire and motivate them to do something to better themselves. You don't need to be politically inclined to know that when you give free money to a bunch of people, MOST of those people will do nothing but wait for more free money. But I can't expect you to understand that. And that's okay. Once Obama is in office, we'll see how well this plan works out.

 

You are a cold-hearted, narrow-minded, cynical man. Behind you? BEHIND You? I think you mean BELOW you. Why don't you just come right and say people who "aren't as good as you." Why don't you use someone besides yourself to understand how other people come up in this world?

 

Most of them will just sit, doing nothing, and wait for this free money you vaguely allude to? What exactly is this free money you speak of? No seriously, EXACTLY. Exactly where do you think YOUR money would go under Obama's tax plan? Please tell me.

 

Do you truly believe that Obama (or ANY politican for that matter) seeks to take your precious, hard earned money and drop it in bundles from helicopters into neighborhoods frothing over with alcoholic, crackhead baby makers?

 

You've condescendingly scolded me for my youthful naivete, but honestly, sir, your view of the world is entirely self centered and you are incessantly skeptical of poor people in America, as if you've attained more money than them because they've been reckless and/or irresponsible.

 

You remind of my dad when it comes to matters like these. And I've never had any reservations of calling HIM a jerk.

 

Jerk.

[The Avenger]

I think that the plumber is an issue for a few reasons:

 

1. Although he's being portrayed as your simple "everyman plumber", he's actually not. For any of this tax stuff to come into play he'll have to hit $250K in profits. I don't think that many everyman plumbers clear that type of profit on an anual basis (although judging what my plumber charged me for an emergency call the night before last Thanksgiving I suppose my guy could also make that kind of coin ). In short, the line between small businesses and big businesses is being drawn at $250K in profits (it has to be drawn somewhere), but this particular example is a poor one because if you're not looking at it closely you're likely to think most of your average plumbers (nd by extension, most small business owners) are going to fall into this category.

 

2. It does seem a bit odd that this guy comes out of the woodwork as a precise example of what McCain wants you to focus on just before the debate. How convenient is it that a guy who isn't a licensed plumber (but looks like one), doesn't have concrete plans to buy the business he works for (but makes it sounds like but for Obama he'd be the business owner now), and isn't really an undecided voter (although he certainly portrays that he's open to either candidate), and looks like he's a little guy (although as noted above he wouldn't be that little of he cleared $250K in profits) suddenly comes to light, tailor made for John McCain to use as an example. I'm not willing to say he's a plant or a shill or there's any sort of conspiracy, but it does seem odd at this point and I think it's fair to inquire about how this perfect example suddenly popped into the picture.

[RayFinkle]

Joe doesn't even pay his taxes as evidence by his $1200 TAX LIEN . WTF is he worried about?......This link has been up and down all day. I guess they are experiencing bandwith issues.

[GG]

Hey everyone, let's frame the debate in the way that paints the rich as not paying any taxes. Yeah that works.

 

What is so hard to comprehend that if you're arguing for fairness and equality, you don't need to penalize people who are successful? Envy is a far worse sin than greed.

[DC Tom]

I missed the debate, so don't really know except in general terms what the "Joe the Plumber" issue is really about.

 

 

But if the election has now come down to "Is Joe the Plumber really a plumber?, rather than "Did Joe the Plumber raise a valid point or not?", then we are all well and truly screwed.

 

And I, for one, would like to thank you all for contributing to the national ass-!@#$ing, you stupid *****.

[In-A-Gadda-Levitre]

I have a problem with paying MORE taxes simply so it can be given, without accountability, to people who are simply behind me somehow. I have a problem with paying MORE taxes so people who DON'T pay taxes can suddenly get free money, as if that will inspire and motivate them to do something to better themselves. You don't need to be politically inclined to know that when you give free money to a bunch of people, MOST of those people will do nothing but wait for more free money. But I can't expect you to understand that. And that's okay. Once Obama is in office, we'll see how well this plan works out.

ok, 40% of Americans don't pay any taxes fact and let's assume it's true. We can also assume that the reason they pay no taxes is not because they have expert tax attorneys, but because they make so little money that they fall below the line, right?

 

Now, how'd you like to be one of those people making ~$20K a year and have to pay $50 to fill up their gas tank or $500 to fill their heating oil tank, have to pay for their own health care, etc.? Not that welfare is a good idea, but that's pretty scary when you think about it. Is it so wrong to give them $1,000 or so (I really don't know how much they would get) to help them make ends meet, with funds that are generated mostly by allowing the Bush tax cuts (on the richest Americans) to expire? Yes, some of it will be funded by raising taxes on people making over $250K a year.

[IDBillzFan]

No one is knocking small businesses down. Less than 2% of small businesses will see an increase.

 

A guy making a quarter million dollar profit bitching about an extra $1400 tax is pretty obscene.

But it's MY $1400. I'm the one who took a chance. I'm the one who busted his ass to create a business, hire employees, pay them good salaries, give them a matching 401K, full health care for their entire family and keep that business alive for the past five years. And how dare YOU think that just because someone earns that kind of money that they should simply cough it up and give it to someone without making sure that the people who are getting it are absolutely, positively going to do something GOOD with it. That, to me, is the real obscenity.

 

But hey, !@#$ Joe the scab, anyway, right?

[elegantelliotoffen]

Does anyone really believe that a man who made 40k last year and owes over a grand in past taxes is really on the cusp of buying a company that PROFITS 250K per year?

[The Big Cat]

But it's MY $1400. I'm the one who took a chance. I'm the one who busted his ass to create a business, hire employees, pay them good salaries, give them a matching 401K, full health care for their entire family and keep that business alive for the past five years. And how dare YOU think that just because someone earns that kind of money that they should simply cough it up and give it to someone without making sure that the people who are getting it are absolutely, positively going to do something GOOD with it. That, to me, is the real obscenity.

 

But hey, !@#$ Joe the scab, anyway, right?

 

If you're as wealthy as your purport to be, then that 1400 should be a drop in the bucket.

 

Whereas to someone like me, it would more or less double my bank account. And I don't even need it!